GNU bug report logs - #12536
24.2.50; Outdated emacs22 icons in repo

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Message #5 received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Marcin Antczak <marcin.antczak <at> neutrico.pl>
To: bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org
Subject: 24.2.50; Outdated emacs22 icons in repo
Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2012 01:02:39 +0200

Could you please remove outdated emacs22 icons from repository?
These icons conflicts with icons distributed in older release
packages and requires additional maintenance from packagers.

These files are:

etc/images/icons/hicolor/16x16/apps/emacs22.png
etc/images/icons/hicolor/24x24/apps/emacs22.png
etc/images/icons/hicolor/32x32/apps/emacs22.png
etc/images/icons/hicolor/48x48/apps/emacs22.png

Please remove them from upstream or disable in Makefile.
(Makefile installs them in usr/share/icons)

It also could be nice to rename them to 'emacs24.png'.


In GNU Emacs 24.2.50.2 (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.4.1)
 of 2012-09-29 on neutrico
Windowing system distributor `The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.11103000
System Description:	Ubuntu 12.04.1 LTS

Configured using:
 `configure '--build=x86_64-linux-gnu' '--prefix=/usr'
 '--includedir=${prefix}/include' '--mandir=${prefix}/share/man'
 '--infodir=${prefix}/share/info' '--sysconfdir=/etc'
 '--localstatedir=/var' '--libexecdir=${prefix}/lib/emacs24'
 '--disable-maintainer-mode' '--disable-dependency-tracking'
 '--program-suffix=.emacs24'
 '--program-transform-name=s/emacs-[0-9.]*//g' '--with-x-toolkit=gtk3'
 '--enable-locallisppath=/etc/emacs24:/etc/emacs:/usr/share/emacs24/site-lisp:/usr/share/emacs/site-lisp:/usr/local/share/emacs24/site-lisp:/usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp'
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Load-path shadows:
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Message #8 received at 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org>
To: Marcin Antczak <marcin.antczak <at> neutrico.pl>
Cc: 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#12536: 24.2.50; Outdated emacs22 icons in repo
Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2012 01:48:09 +0200

Marcin Antczak <marcin.antczak <at> neutrico.pl> writes:

> It also could be nice to rename them to 'emacs24.png'.

That would be wrong, since it's the old icon from Emacs 22.

Andreas.

-- 
Andreas Schwab, schwab <at> linux-m68k.org
GPG Key fingerprint = 58CA 54C7 6D53 942B 1756  01D3 44D5 214B 8276 4ED5
"And now for something completely different."

Message #11 received at 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Marcin Antczak <marcin.antczak <at> neutrico.pl>
To: Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org>
Cc: 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#12536: 24.2.50; Outdated emacs22 icons in repo
Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2012 02:13:21 +0200

[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]

W dniu 29.09.2012 01:48, Andreas Schwab pisze:
> Marcin Antczak <marcin.antczak <at> neutrico.pl> writes:
>
>> It also could be nice to rename them to 'emacs24.png'.
> That would be wrong, since it's the old icon from Emacs 22.
>
Oh! You are right.

I meant not to rename from emacs22.png to emacs24.png.

Sorry.

I meant to remove emacs22.png files.


And then rename remaining emacs.png icons to emacs24.png.

But this would also require to change icon name in emacs.desktop file.

In Debian packages, these (emacs.png) icons are renamed with debian/rules
and then debian uses it's alternatives system to set emacs24
icons as current Emacs icons (if emacs24 is the most recent installed).

[marcin_antczak.vcf (text/x-vcard, attachment)]

Message #14 received at 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Glenn Morris <rgm <at> gnu.org>
To: Marcin Antczak <marcin.antczak <at> neutrico.pl>
Cc: 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org>
Subject: Re: bug#12536: 24.2.50; Outdated emacs22 icons in repo
Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2012 20:46:59 -0400

Marcin Antczak wrote:

> And then rename remaining emacs.png icons to emacs24.png.
>
> But this would also require to change icon name in emacs.desktop file.
>
> In Debian packages, these (emacs.png) icons are renamed with debian/rules
> and then debian uses it's alternatives system to set emacs24
> icons as current Emacs icons (if emacs24 is the most recent installed).

It would not be appropriate for Emacs to rename the icons to "emacs24",
because Emacs does not install itself under the name "emacs24". That is
a Debian thing. I don't think eg Fedora does that (?), they just provide
"emacs" packages.

Also, in the same way, when Emacs was Emacs 22, the icons were called
just "emacs", not "emacs22", so there is no name clash in terms of files
distributed by Emacs. I suppose the emacs22 icons could be renamed to
emacs_old. They were provided for people who preferred the older icon
style, buy I wonder if anyone has ever actually used them, so maybe they
should just go...


Maybe to do this properly the icons and desktop file should obey
configure's --program-transform-name option?


The rest is just idle speculation:

I wonder if there is much value in providing emacs23 and emacs24 packages.
Emacs 23 is not supported upstream any more. If you don't want a newer
version you can just not upgrade it. How many other Debian packages are
provided in "versioned" form? Eg I can't install iceweasel-10 and
iceweasel-15, just iceweasel. How did Emacs end up in this state? We do
try quite hard to ensure new releases are stable...

Message #17 received at 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Marcin Antczak <marcin.antczak <at> neutrico.pl>
To: Glenn Morris <rgm <at> gnu.org>
Cc: 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org>
Subject: Re: bug#12536: 24.2.50; Outdated emacs22 icons in repo
Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2012 02:55:21 +0200

[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]

W dniu 29.09.2012 02:46, Glenn Morris pisze:
> Marcin Antczak wrote:
>
>> And then rename remaining emacs.png icons to emacs24.png.
>>
>> But this would also require to change icon name in emacs.desktop file.
>>
>> In Debian packages, these (emacs.png) icons are renamed with debian/rules
>> and then debian uses it's alternatives system to set emacs24
>> icons as current Emacs icons (if emacs24 is the most recent installed).
> It would not be appropriate for Emacs to rename the icons to "emacs24",
> because Emacs does not install itself under the name "emacs24". That is
> a Debian thing. I don't think eg Fedora does that (?), they just provide
> "emacs" packages.
>
> Also, in the same way, when Emacs was Emacs 22, the icons were called
> just "emacs", not "emacs22", so there is no name clash in terms of files
> distributed by Emacs. I suppose the emacs22 icons could be renamed to
> emacs_old. They were provided for people who preferred the older icon
> style, buy I wonder if anyone has ever actually used them, so maybe they
> should just go...
>
>
> Maybe to do this properly the icons and desktop file should obey
> configure's --program-transform-name option?
>
>
> The rest is just idle speculation:
>
> I wonder if there is much value in providing emacs23 and emacs24 packages.
> Emacs 23 is not supported upstream any more. If you don't want a newer
> version you can just not upgrade it. How many other Debian packages are
> provided in "versioned" form? Eg I can't install iceweasel-10 and
> iceweasel-15, just iceweasel. How did Emacs end up in this state? We do
> try quite hard to ensure new releases are stable...

1. I agree 100% that emacs22.png files should go...

2. My proposal about rename from emacs.png to emacs24.png was optional.
You are right that it's not Emacs thing to package. So, it's ok for me 
to keep them as emacs.png

3. Speaking about --program-transform-name - that's also another bug.

I'm using this option and --program-suffix to package Emacs 24 for 
Debian/Ubuntu.
I deploy emacs-24.2.x binary as just emacs24 and other binaries as for 
example: emacsclient.emacs24

And bug is that also man pages should follow these options. Now I need 
to rename emacs.1 to emacs24.1 and emacsclient.1 to 
emacsclient.emacs24.1 to make Lintian happy.

[marcin_antczak.vcf (text/x-vcard, attachment)]

Message #20 received at 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Glenn Morris <rgm <at> gnu.org>
To: Marcin Antczak <marcin.antczak <at> neutrico.pl>
Cc: 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org>
Subject: Re: bug#12536: 24.2.50; Outdated emacs22 icons in repo
Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2012 20:59:04 -0400

Marcin Antczak wrote:

> And bug is that also man pages should follow these options. Now I need
> to rename emacs.1 to emacs24.1 and emacsclient.1 to
> emacsclient.emacs24.1 to make Lintian happy.

And what about the info pages, which are far more important from our
point of view? (Right, "non-free", so not your problem. ;) )

I don't see how to solve this kind of thing. We can't rename emacs.info
to emacs24.info etc without breaking all the links between manuals.

Message #23 received at 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Glenn Morris <rgm <at> gnu.org>
To: Marcin Antczak <marcin.antczak <at> neutrico.pl>
Cc: 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org>
Subject: Re: bug#12536: 24.2.50; Outdated emacs22 icons in repo
Date: Sun, 30 Sep 2012 20:31:46 -0400

Glenn Morris wrote:

> I suppose the emacs22 icons could be renamed to emacs_old.

Although that doesn't help you either, if Emacs 24 and Emacs 25 both
include them. You would have to rename them to emacs24_old and
emacs25_old. :)

Isn't installing under a separate prefix a better solution to the desire
to have multiple Emacs versions installed? Then you just have a command
to select which version you want, and add the relevant directories to
PATH, MANPATH, INFOPATH.

Message #26 received at 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Marcin Antczak <marcin.antczak <at> neutrico.pl>
To: Glenn Morris <rgm <at> gnu.org>
Cc: 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org>
Subject: Re: bug#12536: 24.2.50; Outdated emacs22 icons in repo
Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2012 02:50:33 +0200

[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]

W dniu 01.10.2012 02:31, Glenn Morris pisze:
> Glenn Morris wrote:
>
>> I suppose the emacs22 icons could be renamed to emacs_old.
> Although that doesn't help you either, if Emacs 24 and Emacs 25 both
> include them. You would have to rename them to emacs24_old and
> emacs25_old. :)
>
> Isn't installing under a separate prefix a better solution to the desire
> to have multiple Emacs versions installed? Then you just have a command
> to select which version you want, and add the relevant directories to
> PATH, MANPATH, INFOPATH.
Thing is that in debian packages you cannot have the same files in 
different packages.

So, if we got emacs22 package - it has to contain icons renamed to 
emacs22.png
For emacs23 - icons renamed to emacs23.png

And then debian can use it's alternatives system to choose which one 
should act as emacs.png (symlinks).

True mess begins when upstream source named emacs23 still contains icons 
like emacs22.png. At this situation maintainer has to fix debian/rules 
or patch makefiles to avoid conflicts. This is time consuming and 
unnecessary.

There is no reason to keep outdated icons in current release in my opinion.
emacs22.png files should end life in emacs22.tar.

[marcin_antczak.vcf (text/x-vcard, attachment)]

Message #29 received at 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Chong Yidong <cyd <at> gnu.org>
To: Marcin Antczak <marcin.antczak <at> neutrico.pl>
Cc: Glenn Morris <rgm <at> gnu.org>, 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org,
	Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org>
Subject: Re: bug#12536: 24.2.50; Outdated emacs22 icons in repo
Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2012 11:19:51 +0800

Marcin Antczak <marcin.antczak <at> neutrico.pl> writes:

> There is no reason to keep outdated icons in current release in my
> opinion.

I don't see the point of keeping them around, either.  I removed them in
trunk.

The rest of the packaging issues discussed in this thread are Debian
specific, and as far as I can tell it's not relevant to this list.

Message #34 received at 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Glenn Morris <rgm <at> gnu.org>
To: Chong Yidong <cyd <at> gnu.org>
Cc: 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#12536: 24.2.50; Outdated emacs22 icons in repo
Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2012 14:01:04 -0400

Chong Yidong wrote:

> The rest of the packaging issues discussed in this thread are Debian
> specific, and as far as I can tell it's not relevant to this list.

I think there is a (minor) Emacs issue as to how much configure's
--program-transform-name should affect. Currently it only affects the
Emacs and lib-src binaries.

http://www.gnu.org/savannah-checkouts/gnu/autoconf/manual/autoconf-2.69/html_node/Transformation-Rules.html

says:

    Whether to do the transformations on documentation files (Texinfo or
    man) is a tricky question; there seems to be no perfect answer, due
    to the several reasons for name transforming. Documentation is not
    usually particular to a specific architecture, and Texinfo files do
    not conflict with system documentation. But they might conflict with
    earlier versions of the same files, and man pages sometimes do
    conflict with system documentation. As a compromise, it is probably
    best to do name transformations on man pages but not on Texinfo
    manuals.

which seems sensible to me.

I guess it must also affect the installed etc/images/icons/hicolor
files, and etc/emacs.desktop, if they are to function.

Message #37 received at 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: David De La Harpe Golden <david <at> harpegolden.net>
To: Glenn Morris <rgm <at> gnu.org>
Cc: 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Marcin Antczak <marcin.antczak <at> neutrico.pl>,
	Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org>
Subject: Re: bug#12536: 24.2.50; Outdated emacs22 icons in repo
Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2012 01:49:03 +0100

On 29/09/12 01:46, Glenn Morris wrote:


> They were provided for people who preferred the older icon
> style, buy I wonder if anyone has ever actually used them, so maybe they
> should just go...

Well, I've used the emacs22 icon since the change, but I suppose I am 
fully capable of keeping my own copy if I want it.  Or I could use the 
new emacs icon if I just changed iceweasel etc. instead, just so long as
I don't have to juggle quite so many blue crystal spheres, grumble...

Message #40 received at 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Glenn Morris <rgm <at> gnu.org>
To: David De La Harpe Golden <david <at> harpegolden.net>
Cc: 12536 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#12536: 24.2.50; Outdated emacs22 icons in repo
Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2012 19:57:39 -0400

David De La Harpe Golden wrote:

> Well, I've used the emacs22 icon since the change, but I suppose I am
> fully capable of keeping my own copy if I want it. Or I could use the
> new emacs icon if I just changed iceweasel etc. instead, just so long
> as I don't have to juggle quite so many blue crystal spheres,
> grumble...

 It's trivial (one-line patch) to put back the emacs22 icons, just not
 install them.
 It's only fractionally less trivial (three-line patch) to also allow
 choice of icon at install time:


*** Makefile.in	2012-10-15 21:57:20 +0000
--- Makefile.in	2012-10-15 23:54:13 +0000
***************
*** 631,636 ****
--- 631,640 ----
  	done
  
  ## Install those items from etc/ that need to end up elsewhere.
+ 
+ ## Choose "emacs" or "emacs22" at installation time.
+ ## Note: emacs22 does not have all the resolutions.
+ EMACS_ICON=emacs
  install-etc:
  	umask 022; ${MKDIR_P} $(DESTDIR)${desktopdir}
  	dest=`echo emacs | sed '$(TRANSFORM)'`; \
***************
*** 645,653 ****
  	for dir in */*/apps */*/mimetypes; do \
  	  [ -d $${dir} ] || continue ; \
  	  ( cd $${thisdir}; ${MKDIR_P} $(DESTDIR)${icondir}/$${dir} ) ; \
! 	  for icon in $${dir}/*.*; do \
  	    [ -r $${icon} ] || continue ; \
! 	    dest=`echo "$${icon}" | sed -e 's|.*/||' -e '$(TRANSFORM)'` ; \
  	    ( cd $${thisdir}; \
  	      ${INSTALL_DATA} ${iconsrcdir}/$${icon} $(DESTDIR)${icondir}/$${dir}/$${dest} ) \
  	    || exit 1; \
--- 649,657 ----
  	for dir in */*/apps */*/mimetypes; do \
  	  [ -d $${dir} ] || continue ; \
  	  ( cd $${thisdir}; ${MKDIR_P} $(DESTDIR)${icondir}/$${dir} ) ; \
! 	  for icon in $${dir}/${EMACS_ICON}[.-]*; do \
  	    [ -r $${icon} ] || continue ; \
! 	    dest=`echo "$${icon}" | sed -e 's|.*/||' -e 's/$(EMACS_ICON)/emacs/' -e '$(TRANSFORM)'` ; \
  	    ( cd $${thisdir}; \
  	      ${INSTALL_DATA} ${iconsrcdir}/$${icon} $(DESTDIR)${icondir}/$${dir}/$${dest} ) \
  	    || exit 1; \

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