GNU bug report logs - #14044
24.2; Emacs 24 and dead keys in Fedora 18

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Message #5 received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Alexandre Lagüe-Jacques
	<alexandre.laguejacques <at> gmail.com>
To: bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org
Subject: 24.2; Emacs 24 and dead keys in Fedora 18
Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2013 20:47:36 +0100

This bug report will be sent to the Bug-GNU-Emacs mailing list
and the GNU bug tracker at debbugs.gnu.org.  Please check that
the From: line contains a valid email address.  After a delay of up
to one day, you should receive an acknowledgement at that address.

Please write in English if possible, as the Emacs maintainers
usually do not have translators for other languages.

Please describe exactly what actions triggered the bug, and
the precise symptoms of the bug.  If you can, give a recipe
starting from `emacs -Q':

--- BEGIN DESCRIPTION ---
After installing Fedora 18, I've come across an odd problem with Emacs.

I use a Canadian multilingual keyboard. With this keyboard it is
possible to type the characters of every European language based on
the Latin alphabet. Dead keys are very important, as they allow one to
add frequently occurring accent marks to different letters. The
physical layout is here:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/55/KB_Canadian_Multilingual_Standard_comment-fr.svg

When I first ran Emacs after the installation, the dead keys that I
commonly use in French or German were not working. Emacs would display
an error like '<dead-grave> is undefined' when I pressed the dead key
and the subsquent letter was printed without an accent. The Emacs Wiki
provided a partial solution: the addition of the following line to
one's .emacs.
(require 'iso-transl)
(Source: http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/DeadKeys)

Now I deal a lot with central Europe, and this requires me to type
words in languages like Czech or Polish. Interestingly enough, one can
not enter common Czech or Polish accented characters like ą, ę, ż, or
ž, which require a dead key. This produces an error message like
'<S-dead-caron> is undefined'. What doesn't require a dead key -- ł or
Ł for example, works. A further letter common to Polish produced with
a dead accent, ó or Ó, functions.

This implies that the input of non-ISO-8859-1 characters with dead keys
is somehow broken. Remember, I can type letters in French or German that
require dead keys without a problem and the ó or Ó is also used in
Spanish I believe -- all ISO-8859-1. Furthermore, opening files in
Emacs that contain the problem characters, or copying text containing
them into Emacs, functions normally.
--- END DESCRIPTION ---

If Emacs crashed, and you have the Emacs process in the gdb debugger,
please include the output from the following gdb commands:
    `bt full' and `xbacktrace'.
For information about debugging Emacs, please read the file
/usr/share/emacs/24.2/etc/DEBUG.


In GNU Emacs 24.2.1 (x86_64-redhat-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.6.4)
 of 2013-02-02 on buildvm-04.phx2.fedoraproject.org
Windowing system distributor `Fedora Project', version 11.0.11303000
Configured using:
 `configure '--build=x86_64-redhat-linux-gnu'
 '--host=x86_64-redhat-linux-gnu' '--program-prefix='
 '--disable-dependency-tracking' '--prefix=/usr' '--exec-prefix=/usr'
 '--bindir=/usr/bin' '--sbindir=/usr/sbin' '--sysconfdir=/etc'
 '--datadir=/usr/share' '--includedir=/usr/include'
 '--libdir=/usr/lib64' '--libexecdir=/usr/libexec'
 '--localstatedir=/var' '--sharedstatedir=/var/lib'
 '--mandir=/usr/share/man' '--infodir=/usr/share/info' '--with-dbus'
 '--with-gif' '--with-jpeg' '--with-png' '--with-rsvg' '--with-tiff'
 '--with-xft' '--with-xpm' '--with-x-toolkit=gtk3' '--with-gpm=no'
 '--with-wide-int' 'build_alias=x86_64-redhat-linux-gnu'
 'host_alias=x86_64-redhat-linux-gnu' 'CFLAGS=-DMAIL_USE_LOCKF -O2 -g
 -pipe -Wall -Wp,-D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2 -fexceptions -fstack-protector
 --param=ssp-buffer-size=4 -m64 -mtune=generic' 'LDFLAGS=-Wl,-z,relro ''

Important settings:
  value of $LC_ALL: nil
  value of $LC_COLLATE: nil
  value of $LC_CTYPE: fr_CA.UTF8
  value of $LC_MESSAGES: nil
  value of $LC_MONETARY: fr_CA.utf8
  value of $LC_NUMERIC: fr_CA.utf8
  value of $LC_TIME: fr_CA.utf8
  value of $LANG: fr_FR.UTF8
  value of $XMODIFIERS: @im=ibus
  locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix
  default enable-multibyte-characters: t

Major mode: Lisp Interaction

Minor modes in effect:
  show-paren-mode: t
  global-linum-mode: t
  linum-mode: t
  delete-selection-mode: t
  tooltip-mode: t
  mouse-wheel-mode: t
  menu-bar-mode: t
  file-name-shadow-mode: t
  global-font-lock-mode: t
  font-lock-mode: t
  blink-cursor-mode: t
  auto-composition-mode: t
  auto-encryption-mode: t
  auto-compression-mode: t
  column-number-mode: t
  line-number-mode: t
  transient-mark-mode: t

Recent input:
<down-mouse-1> <mouse-1> M-x r e p <tab> o r <tab>
<return>

Recent messages:
Loading /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/site-start.d/desktop-entry-mode-init.el
(source)...done
Loading /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/site-start.d/rpm-spec-mode-init.el
(source)...done
For information about GNU Emacs and the GNU system, type C-h C-a.
Making completion list...

Load-path shadows:

Message #8 received at 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Stefan Monnier <monnier <at> iro.umontreal.ca>
To: Alexandre Lagüe-Jacques
	<alexandre.laguejacques <at> gmail.com>
Cc: 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#14044: 24.2; Emacs 24 and dead keys in Fedora 18
Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2013 13:25:28 -0400

>   value of $LANG: fr_FR.UTF8

Could someone look into why "utf8" locales cause such problems, even
though "utf-8" locales work just fine?


        Stefan

Message #11 received at 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Stefan Monnier <monnier <at> iro.umontreal.ca>
To: Alexandre Lagüe-Jacques
	<alexandre.laguejacques <at> gmail.com>
Cc: 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#14044: 24.2; Emacs 24 and dead keys in Fedora 18
Date: Wed, 24 Apr 2013 15:13:19 -0400

>> value of $LANG: fr_FR.UTF8
> Could someone look into why "utf8" locales cause such problems, even
> though "utf-8" locales work just fine?

For what it's worth I can't reproduce it, here.
I did the following:

    xmodmap -e "keysym Left = dead_grave"
    LANG="fr_CH.UTF8" emacs -Q

and then tried dead-grave followed by e and it inserted "è" just as
it should.  This was on Debian testing.


        Stefan

Message #14 received at 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Tassilo Horn <tsdh <at> gnu.org>
To: Stefan Monnier <monnier <at> iro.umontreal.ca>
Cc: 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Alexandre Lagüe-Jacques
	<alexandre.laguejacques <at> gmail.com>
Subject: Re: bug#14044: 24.2; Emacs 24 and dead keys in Fedora 18
Date: Thu, 25 Apr 2013 20:25:09 +0200

Stefan Monnier <monnier <at> iro.umontreal.ca> writes:

>>> value of $LANG: fr_FR.UTF8
>> Could someone look into why "utf8" locales cause such problems, even
>> though "utf-8" locales work just fine?
>
> For what it's worth I can't reproduce it, here.
> I did the following:
>
>     xmodmap -e "keysym Left = dead_grave"
>     LANG="fr_CH.UTF8" emacs -Q
>
> and then tried dead-grave followed by e and it inserted "è" just as
> it should.  This was on Debian testing.

I also can't insert ` anymore, except with `M-x ucs-insert GRAVE ACCENT
RET'.  Typing ` (which is AltGr+< on my German Dvorak layout) messages
just

  <dead-grave> is undefined

% locale
LANG=en_US.UTF-8
LC_CTYPE="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_NUMERIC="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_TIME="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_COLLATE=C
LC_MONETARY="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_MESSAGES="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_PAPER="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_NAME="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_ADDRESS="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_TELEPHONE="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_MEASUREMENT="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_IDENTIFICATION="en_US.UTF-8"
LC_ALL=

It used to work until one or two months ago.  At that time, I updated to
GNOME 3.6 from 3.4, and thought that would be the culprit.  Hence I
wrote this GNOME bug report:

  https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=691054

The problem only appears if I start GTK emacs from the GNOME dock, or
GNOME run dialog.  When I start it from a GNOME terminal, typing ` works
just fine.

There's a similar problem with Emacs on *BSD:

  http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.os.netbsd.devel.pkgsrc.user/16230

That could be solved by fixing some X config files.  However, on my
Gentoo GNU/Linux system, the file

  /usr/share/X11/locale/en_US.UTF-8/XI18N_OBJS

doesn't contain the line that's supposed to be changed by the patch
floating in that thread.

I'm happy to provide any further information that's needed.  Not being
able to type ` is really a pain in the ass. ;-)

Bye,
Tassilo

Message #17 received at 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org>
To: Tassilo Horn <tsdh <at> gnu.org>
Cc: 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Alexandre Lagüe-Jacques
	<alexandre.laguejacques <at> gmail.com>,
	Stefan Monnier <monnier <at> iro.umontreal.ca>
Subject: Re: bug#14044: 24.2; Emacs 24 and dead keys in Fedora 18
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2013 10:58:22 +0200

Tassilo Horn <tsdh <at> gnu.org> writes:

> I also can't insert ` anymore, except with `M-x ucs-insert GRAVE ACCENT
> RET'.  Typing ` (which is AltGr+< on my German Dvorak layout) messages
> just
>
>   <dead-grave> is undefined

Your keyboard is misconfigured.  Your X server should have a compose
rule that composes the dead_grave keysym with the following key, so that
Emacs doesn't see the dead_grave keysym at all (provided the composition
was sucessful).  At the very least the sequence <dead_grave> <space>
or <dead_grave> <dead_grave> should produce the <grave> keysym.

Andreas.

-- 
Andreas Schwab, schwab <at> linux-m68k.org
GPG Key fingerprint = 58CA 54C7 6D53 942B 1756  01D3 44D5 214B 8276 4ED5
"And now for something completely different."

Message #20 received at 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Tassilo Horn <tsdh <at> gnu.org>
To: Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org>
Cc: 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Alexandre Lagüe-Jacques
	<alexandre.laguejacques <at> gmail.com>,
	Stefan Monnier <monnier <at> iro.umontreal.ca>
Subject: Re: bug#14044: 24.2; Emacs 24 and dead keys in Fedora 18
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2013 12:15:46 +0200

Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org> writes:

>> I also can't insert ` anymore, except with `M-x ucs-insert GRAVE
>> ACCENT RET'.  Typing ` (which is AltGr+< on my German Dvorak layout)
>> messages just
>>
>>   <dead-grave> is undefined
>
> Your keyboard is misconfigured.

Any hints how to diagnose the problem?  I don't have any custom
configurations for the X server at all, except this one:

,----[ /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/99-my-keyboard.conf ]
| Section "InputClass"
|     Identifier "Default Keyboard"
|     MatchIsKeyboard  "on"
|     Driver "evdev"
| 
|     Option "XkbLayout"  "de"
|     Option "XkbVariant" "dvorak"
|     Option "XkbModel"   "evdev"
|     Option "XkbRules"   "evdev"
|     Option "XKbOptions" "ctrl:nocaps"
| EndSection
`----

I haven't touched that file for years, and as said, it used to work.

> Your X server should have a compose rule that composes the dead_grave
> keysym with the following key, so that Emacs doesn't see the
> dead_grave keysym at all (provided the composition was sucessful).  At
> the very least the sequence <dead_grave> <space> or <dead_grave>
> <dead_grave> should produce the <grave> keysym.

Hm, what's happening is actually quite different depending on
application.

- Any GNOME3 GTK+3 application, or GTK+2 applications like GIMP: I can
  insert a ` by typing AltGr+< twice, or AltGr+< SPACE.

- Qt4 apps: Typing just AltGr+< immediately inserts a `, so no
  composition here.

- xterm: I can't insert ` at all.  Typing AltGr+< twice or AltGr+< SPACE
  seems to be ignored.

Like with Emacs, I can "fix" xterm by simply starting it from a GNOME
terminal.  Then typing AltGr+< has the same composing behavior as in
GNOME3 applications.

Oh, interestingly, I can also make Qt4 apps using the composing behavior
by starting them from a gnome-terminal...

Bye,
Tassilo

Message #23 received at 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Tassilo Horn <tsdh <at> gnu.org>
To: Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org>
Cc: 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Alexandre Lagüe-Jacques
	<alexandre.laguejacques <at> gmail.com>
Subject: Re: bug#14044: 24.2; Emacs 24 and dead keys in Fedora 18
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2013 12:25:25 +0200

Tassilo Horn <tsdh <at> gnu.org> writes:

> - Any GNOME3 GTK+3 application, or GTK+2 applications like GIMP: I can
>   insert a ` by typing AltGr+< twice, or AltGr+< SPACE.
>
> - Qt4 apps: Typing just AltGr+< immediately inserts a `, so no
>   composition here.
>
> - xterm: I can't insert ` at all.  Typing AltGr+< twice or AltGr+< SPACE
>   seems to be ignored.
>
> Like with Emacs, I can "fix" xterm by simply starting it from a GNOME
> terminal.  Then typing AltGr+< has the same composing behavior as in
> GNOME3 applications.

That was wrong: I can "fix" xterm this way, but not Emacs.  Even when I
start it from a gnome-terminal, I still only get

  <dead-grave> is undefined

when pressing AltGr+<.

Bye,
Tassilo

Message #26 received at 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Tassilo Horn <tsdh <at> gnu.org>
To: Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org>
Cc: 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Alexandre Lagüe-Jacques
	<alexandre.laguejacques <at> gmail.com>
Subject: Re: bug#14044: 24.2; Emacs 24 and dead keys in Fedora 18
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2013 15:53:57 +0200

Hi again,

I've fixed the issue in my case.  The culprit was this new input method
framework ibus used by GNOME 3.6.  After deinstalling that, dead keys
work consistently again through all applications with the same behavior.

Bye,
Tassilo

Message #29 received at 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: James Cloos <cloos <at> jhcloos.com>
To: 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Cc: Alexandre Lagüe-Jacques
	<alexandre.laguejacques <at> gmail.com>, Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org>,
	Tassilo Horn <tsdh <at> gnu.org>
Subject: Re: bug#14044: 24.2; Emacs 24 and dead keys in Fedora 18
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2013 16:36:46 -0400

>>>>> "AS" == Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org> writes:

AS> Tassilo Horn <tsdh <at> gnu.org> writes:
>> I also can't insert ` anymore, except with `M-x ucs-insert GRAVE ACCENT
>> RET'.  Typing ` (which is AltGr+< on my German Dvorak layout) messages
>> just
>> 
>> <dead-grave> is undefined

AS> Your keyboard is misconfigured.  Your X server should have a compose
AS> rule that composes the dead_grave keysym

If one uses the gtk compile of Emacs; then it may be Gnome's input
rules rather than X11's.  (I don't use gtk Emacs, but my tests show
that other gtk apps use the gtk/gnome IMs even when compiled without
libgnome or other gnome-specific support libs.)

-JimC
-- 
James Cloos <cloos <at> jhcloos.com>         OpenPGP: 1024D/ED7DAEA6

Message #32 received at 14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Jan Djärv <jan.h.d <at> swipnet.se>
To: James Cloos <cloos <at> jhcloos.com>
Cc: "14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org" <14044 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>,
	Alexandre Lagüe-Jacques
	<alexandre.laguejacques <at> gmail.com>, Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org>,
	Tassilo Horn <tsdh <at> gnu.org>
Subject: Re: bug#14044: 24.2; Emacs 24 and dead keys in Fedora 18
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2013 23:28:19 +0200

Hello. 

26 apr 2013 kl. 22:36 skrev James Cloos <cloos <at> jhcloos.com>:

>>>>>> "AS" == Andreas Schwab <schwab <at> linux-m68k.org> writes:
> 
> AS> Tassilo Horn <tsdh <at> gnu.org> writes:
>>> I also can't insert ` anymore, except with `M-x ucs-insert GRAVE ACCENT
>>> RET'.  Typing ` (which is AltGr+< on my German Dvorak layout) messages
>>> just
>>> 
>>> <dead-grave> is undefined
> 
> AS> Your keyboard is misconfigured.  Your X server should have a compose
> AS> rule that composes the dead_grave keysym
> 
> If one uses the gtk compile of Emacs; then it may be Gnome's input
> rules rather than X11's.  (I don't use gtk Emacs, but my tests show
> that other gtk apps use the gtk/gnome IMs even when compiled without
> libgnome or other gnome-specific support libs.)

Gtk+ has its own input processing, but Emacs does not use it. Emacs compiled for X11, regardless of toolkit use the same code, raw Xlib or Xim.

    Jan D. 

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