GNU bug report logs - #15748
24.3.50; `customize-group': Provide a way to hide/show all values

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Message #5 received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Drew Adams <drew.adams <at> oracle.com>
To: bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org
Subject: 24.3.50; `customize-group': Provide a way to hide/show all values
Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 08:09:37 -0700 (PDT)

This bug was introduced in Emacs 24 (in Emacs 23, at least some
values were shown by default).

To see all option values, a user must now click *each*
`Show Value' link.  Likewise, to hide all, a user must click
*each* `Hide' link.

Please provide buttons to `Show All Values' and `Hide All Values'.
And please add such items to the `Custom' menu-bar menu.


In GNU Emacs 24.3.50.1 (i686-pc-mingw32)
 of 2013-10-19 on LEG570
Bzr revision: 114715 rgm <at> gnu.org-20131019023520-s8mwtib7xcx9e05w
Windowing system distributor `Microsoft Corp.', version 6.1.7601
Configured using:
 `configure --enable-checking 'CFLAGS=-O0 -g3' CPPFLAGS=-DGLYPH_DEBUG=1'

Message #8 received at 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com>
To: 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: 24.3.50;
 `customize-group': Provide a way to hide/show all values  
Date: Sat, 23 Oct 2021 14:49:03 -0400

When exploring new packages I often use customize-group to see what
settings I can change but it defaults to not showing the values and also 
showing only the first line of each docstring requiring me to click on 
"More" for every option.  Having a command to show/hide all values 
would be very convenient in this case.

It would be nice to model this on org-cycle and the new outline-cycle
command so that S-TAB cycles through the various display states of all
options at once.  Such a cycle command should also appear in the 
Custom menu.

Currently <S-tab> is bound to widget-backward in customize buffers but
perhaps it and widget-forward could move to C-c C-n/p or M-n/p
or something else instead.

Howard

Message #11 received at 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
To: Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com>
Cc: 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#15748: 24.3.50; `customize-group': Provide a way to
 hide/show all values
Date: Tue, 10 May 2022 17:48:18 +0200

Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com> writes:

> When exploring new packages I often use customize-group to see what
> settings I can change but it defaults to not showing the values and also 
> showing only the first line of each docstring requiring me to click on 
> "More" for every option.  Having a command to show/hide all values 
> would be very convenient in this case.

I've now added this to Emacs 29 (as custom-toggle-hide-all-variables/`H/).

> It would be nice to model this on org-cycle and the new outline-cycle
> command so that S-TAB cycles through the various display states of all
> options at once.  Such a cycle command should also appear in the 
> Custom menu.
>
> Currently <S-tab> is bound to widget-backward in customize buffers but
> perhaps it and widget-forward could move to C-c C-n/p or M-n/p
> or something else instead.

I don't think we can move the S-<tab> bindings -- we use them all over
the place.  I see the charm of reusing Org bindings here, but it's
unfortunate that they clash with navigation commands common to most
other modes.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

Message #16 received at 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com>
To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
Cc: 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#15748: 24.3.50; `customize-group': Provide a way to hide/show
 all values
Date: Tue, 10 May 2022 12:44:39 -0400

> On May 10, 2022, at 11:48 AM, Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org> wrote:
> 
> Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com> writes:
> 
>> When exploring new packages I often use customize-group to see what
>> settings I can change but it defaults to not showing the values and also 
>> showing only the first line of each docstring requiring me to click on 
>> "More" for every option.  Having a command to show/hide all values 
>> would be very convenient in this case.
> 
> I've now added this to Emacs 29 (as custom-toggle-hide-all-variables/`H/).

That's great, thanks!

Howard

Message #19 received at 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
Cc: hmelman <at> gmail.com, 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#15748: 24.3.50;
 `customize-group': Provide a way to hide/show all values
Date: Tue, 10 May 2022 20:04:24 +0300

> Cc: 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
> Date: Tue, 10 May 2022 17:48:18 +0200
> 
> Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com> writes:
> 
> > When exploring new packages I often use customize-group to see what
> > settings I can change but it defaults to not showing the values and also 
> > showing only the first line of each docstring requiring me to click on 
> > "More" for every option.  Having a command to show/hide all values 
> > would be very convenient in this case.
> 
> I've now added this to Emacs 29 (as custom-toggle-hide-all-variables/`H/).

Thanks, but can we have some documentation about its usage?  For
starters, in which buffers it is supposed to be used, and how?  I
thought this was for the buffer created by customize-group, but there
it seems I can use 'H' only once: after that one time, which reveals
all the variables, any subsequent 'H' press says "Invalid widget type"
and does nothing.  (I used the buffer created for the 'display' group,
in case it matters.)

'H' does toggle in a buffer created by customize-variable, but is that
the intent?

I tried to understand whether I did something wrong by reading the doc
string of the new command, but it didn't add anything to my
understanding; it doesn't even say which "widgets" is it talking
about.

I think we need to improve the user documentation of this new feature.

Message #22 received at 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Drew Adams <drew.adams <at> oracle.com>
To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>, Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com>
Cc: "15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org" <15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
Subject: RE: [External] : bug#15748: 24.3.50; `customize-group': Provide a way
 to hide/show all values
Date: Tue, 10 May 2022 17:15:55 +0000

> Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com> writes:
> 
> > When exploring new packages I often use customize-group to see what
> > settings I can change but it defaults to not showing the values and
> also
> > showing only the first line of each docstring requiring me to click
> on
> > "More" for every option.  Having a command to show/hide all values
> > would be very convenient in this case.
> 
> I've now added this to Emacs 29 (as custom-toggle-hide-all-
> variables/`H/).
> 
> > It would be nice to model this on org-cycle and the new outline-cycle
> > command so that S-TAB cycles through the various display states of
> all
> > options at once.  Such a cycle command should also appear in the
> > Custom menu.
> >
> > Currently <S-tab> is bound to widget-backward in customize buffers
> but
> > perhaps it and widget-forward could move to C-c C-n/p or M-n/p
> > or something else instead.
> 
> I don't think we can move the S-<tab> bindings -- we use them all over
> the place.  I see the charm of reusing Org bindings here, but it's
> unfortunate that they clash with navigation commands common to most
> other modes.

You didn't reply to the OP in your closing message.
Instead, you replied to an extraneous enhancement
request inserted in the thread.  That should have
been a separate bug #.

This report isn't an enhancement request to add Org
or outline keys.  This is about showing/hiding all.
The bug was introduced in Emacs 24.

Message #25 received at 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Juri Linkov <juri <at> linkov.net>
To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
Cc: Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com>, 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#15748: 24.3.50; `customize-group': Provide a way to
 hide/show all values
Date: Wed, 11 May 2022 10:05:29 +0300

>> When exploring new packages I often use customize-group to see what
>> settings I can change but it defaults to not showing the values and also
>> showing only the first line of each docstring requiring me to click on
>> "More" for every option.  Having a command to show/hide all values
>> would be very convenient in this case.
>
> I've now added this to Emacs 29 (as custom-toggle-hide-all-variables/`H/).

`H' on a group with subgroups gives on the subgroup widget:

Debugger entered--Lisp error: (error "Invalid widget type")
  error("Invalid widget type")
  custom-toggle-hide-variable((...))
  custom-toggle-hide-all-variables()
  funcall-interactively(custom-toggle-hide-all-variables)
  command-execute(custom-toggle-hide-all-variables)

>> It would be nice to model this on org-cycle and the new outline-cycle
>> command so that S-TAB cycles through the various display states of all
>> options at once.  Such a cycle command should also appear in the
>> Custom menu.
>>
>> Currently <S-tab> is bound to widget-backward in customize buffers but
>> perhaps it and widget-forward could move to C-c C-n/p or M-n/p
>> or something else instead.
>
> I don't think we can move the S-<tab> bindings -- we use them all over
> the place.  I see the charm of reusing Org bindings here, but it's
> unfortunate that they clash with navigation commands common to most
> other modes.

If it's possible to find such a regexp that matches the heading
of every variable section, then outline-minor-mode could be enabled
to bind these keys only on headings.

Message #28 received at 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
Cc: hmelman <at> gmail.com, 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#15748: 24.3.50; `customize-group': Provide a way to
 hide/show all values
Date: Wed, 11 May 2022 13:44:20 +0200

Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:

> Thanks, but can we have some documentation about its usage?  For
> starters, in which buffers it is supposed to be used, and how?  I
> thought this was for the buffer created by customize-group, but there
> it seems I can use 'H' only once: after that one time, which reveals
> all the variables, any subsequent 'H' press says "Invalid widget type"
> and does nothing.  (I used the buffer created for the 'display' group,
> in case it matters.)

Yes, it matters -- I was testing in a group with a different widget
selection, so I didn't see this bug.  Now fixed on the trunk.

> 'H' does toggle in a buffer created by customize-variable, but is that
> the intent?

Sure, why not?

> I tried to understand whether I did something wrong by reading the doc
> string of the new command, but it didn't add anything to my
> understanding; it doesn't even say which "widgets" is it talking
> about.
>
> I think we need to improve the user documentation of this new feature.

It just toggles the visibility, like that arrow thing.  I don't know
what further can be said.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

Message #31 received at 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
To: Juri Linkov <juri <at> linkov.net>
Cc: Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com>, 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#15748: 24.3.50; `customize-group': Provide a way to
 hide/show all values
Date: Wed, 11 May 2022 13:45:36 +0200

Juri Linkov <juri <at> linkov.net> writes:

> `H' on a group with subgroups gives on the subgroup widget:
>
> Debugger entered--Lisp error: (error "Invalid widget type")
>   error("Invalid widget type")
>   custom-toggle-hide-variable((...))
>   custom-toggle-hide-all-variables()
>   funcall-interactively(custom-toggle-hide-all-variables)
>   command-execute(custom-toggle-hide-all-variables)

Now fixed.

>> I don't think we can move the S-<tab> bindings -- we use them all over
>> the place.  I see the charm of reusing Org bindings here, but it's
>> unfortunate that they clash with navigation commands common to most
>> other modes.
>
> If it's possible to find such a regexp that matches the heading
> of every variable section, then outline-minor-mode could be enabled
> to bind these keys only on headings.

It's possible, but it's even more confusing to have these navigation
commands do something completely different at certain points in the
buffer.  Navigation should be easy and predictable. 

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

Message #34 received at 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
Cc: hmelman <at> gmail.com, 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#15748: 24.3.50; `customize-group': Provide a way to
 hide/show all values
Date: Wed, 11 May 2022 16:49:42 +0300

> From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
> Cc: hmelman <at> gmail.com,  15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Wed, 11 May 2022 13:44:20 +0200
> 
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:
> 
> > Thanks, but can we have some documentation about its usage?  For
> > starters, in which buffers it is supposed to be used, and how?  I
> > thought this was for the buffer created by customize-group, but there
> > it seems I can use 'H' only once: after that one time, which reveals
> > all the variables, any subsequent 'H' press says "Invalid widget type"
> > and does nothing.  (I used the buffer created for the 'display' group,
> > in case it matters.)
> 
> Yes, it matters -- I was testing in a group with a different widget
> selection, so I didn't see this bug.  Now fixed on the trunk.

It now works in "*Customize Group*" buffers I tried, but the problem
is still there in some other similar cases.  For example, try

  M-x customize-apropos RET window RET

In the resulting buffer, the second 'H' still gets the same Invalid
widget error.  The same happens in a buffer created by
customize-faces.

Also, what about "M-x customize-browse"?  The buffer looks
differently, but don't we want 'H' to do the same there?

> > I tried to understand whether I did something wrong by reading the doc
> > string of the new command, but it didn't add anything to my
> > understanding; it doesn't even say which "widgets" is it talking
> > about.
> >
> > I think we need to improve the user documentation of this new feature.
> 
> It just toggles the visibility, like that arrow thing.  I don't know
> what further can be said.

I've now made the doc string more detailed.

Message #37 received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com>
To: bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#15748: 24.3.50;
 `customize-group': Provide a way to hide/show all values
Date: Wed, 11 May 2022 11:02:27 -0400

Drew Adams <drew.adams <at> oracle.com> writes:

>> Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com> writes:
>> 
>> > When exploring new packages I often use customize-group to see what
>> > settings I can change but it defaults to not showing the values and also
>> > showing only the first line of each docstring requiring me to click on
>> > "More" for every option.  Having a command to show/hide all values
>> > would be very convenient in this case.
>> 
>> I've now added this to Emacs 29 (as custom-toggle-hide-all-
>> variables/`H/).
>> 
>
> You didn't reply to the OP in your closing message.
> Instead, you replied to an extraneous enhancement
> request inserted in the thread.  That should have
> been a separate bug #.
>
> This report isn't an enhancement request to add Org
> or outline keys.  This is about showing/hiding all.
> The bug was introduced in Emacs 24.

The original bug asked for buttons in the buffer to show and
hide all.  I agree that if custom-toggle-hide-all-variables
works in all these various *customize* buffers that a button
added to the section "Operate on all settings in this buffer:"
that called this command would be a good thing.

-- 

Howard

Message #40 received at 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
To: Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com>
Cc: 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#15748: 24.3.50; `customize-group': Provide a way to
 hide/show all values
Date: Wed, 11 May 2022 17:12:36 +0200

Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com> writes:

> The original bug asked for buttons in the buffer to show and
> hide all.  I agree that if custom-toggle-hide-all-variables
> works in all these various *customize* buffers that a button
> added to the section "Operate on all settings in this buffer:"
> that called this command would be a good thing.

I think the Customize buffers are messy enough as they are, so I don't
want to add a visible button for this.  `H' is handier anyway.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

Message #43 received at 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
Cc: hmelman <at> gmail.com, 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#15748: 24.3.50; `customize-group': Provide a way to
 hide/show all values
Date: Thu, 12 May 2022 02:28:24 +0200

Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:

> It now works in "*Customize Group*" buffers I tried, but the problem
> is still there in some other similar cases.  For example, try
>
>   M-x customize-apropos RET window RET
>
> In the resulting buffer, the second 'H' still gets the same Invalid
> widget error.  The same happens in a buffer created by
> customize-faces.

I was apparently calling the wrong interface function; now adjusted.

> Also, what about "M-x customize-browse"?  The buffer looks
> differently, but don't we want 'H' to do the same there?

Probably not.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

Message #46 received at 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
Cc: hmelman <at> gmail.com, 15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#15748: 24.3.50; `customize-group': Provide a way to
 hide/show all values
Date: Thu, 12 May 2022 09:40:43 +0300

> From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
> Cc: hmelman <at> gmail.com,  15748 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Thu, 12 May 2022 02:28:24 +0200
> 
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:
> 
> > It now works in "*Customize Group*" buffers I tried, but the problem
> > is still there in some other similar cases.  For example, try
> >
> >   M-x customize-apropos RET window RET
> >
> > In the resulting buffer, the second 'H' still gets the same Invalid
> > widget error.  The same happens in a buffer created by
> > customize-faces.
> 
> I was apparently calling the wrong interface function; now adjusted.

Thanks.

For some reason, 'H' to expand the settings is much slower than 'H' to
hide the expansions, even in buffers that are not very large.  Not
sure we care about this.

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