Received: (at 18590) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 Apr 2022 00:37:37 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Apr 12 20:37:37 2022 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50723 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1neR0r-00025s-1o for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 12 Apr 2022 20:37:37 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:52370) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <larsi@HIDDEN>) id 1neR0o-00025X-Sp for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 12 Apr 2022 20:37:35 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:Date: References:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=gNG5Jq9yM+iqn5Jj9ynQKIBoPaCPyOBgDkMkbAneFMM=; b=aN8iloovkMXRrXRQMETaPlCvP5 Ul1L8UjkKfog7y155/PkU+tibmKaSOScmmb/DAmkWV2W46SJ2Pc1TPz/0XBhN5YD/MSVkbt76t2YR UkuITFaDeL7XT3rteMU7ivwoErKEeG8y6uWygtZpGXqdTRWJNe2TEaZAP5cYlR9KBHIo=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=xo) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from <larsi@HIDDEN>) id 1neR0g-0005tM-83; Wed, 13 Apr 2022 02:37:28 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@HIDDEN> To: nljlistbox2@HIDDEN (N. Jackson) Subject: Re: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection References: <87k34li7ex.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2022 02:37:25 +0200 In-Reply-To: <87k34li7ex.fsf@HIDDEN> (N. Jackson's message of "Tue, 30 Sep 2014 10:07:02 -0300") Message-ID: <87o815stru.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: nljlistbox2@HIDDEN (N. Jackson) writes: > After highlighting/selecting text in a window, scrolling the window > vertically with the scroll bar or with the mouse moves the selection so > that text intentionally selected is no longer selected [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 18590 Cc: 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Po Lu <luangruo@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) nljlistbox2@HIDDEN (N. Jackson) writes: > After highlighting/selecting text in a window, scrolling the window > vertically with the scroll bar or with the mouse moves the selection so > that text intentionally selected is no longer selected. > > To reproduce: > > 1. emacs -Q > > 2. Open a file "longer" than the window such as the Emacs README file. E.g. C-x f R E A D M E > > 3. C-x h ; Select all the text in the window. > > 4. Scroll the window with the scroll bar or the mouse. > > Expected behaviour: > > The text that is selected/highlighted remains selected/highlighted. > > Observed behaviour: > > The selection changes as the window is scrolled up and down. (I'm going through old bug reports that unfortunately weren't resolved at the time.) This behaviour is still present in Emacs 29, and is due to Emacs always keeping point visible in the window, and the region being the area between point and mark. I remember Po Lu doing some work at allowing point to be outside the window, which would fix this issue, I think? But I forget what the state of that work is, so I've added Lu to the CC's; perhaps he has some comments. -- (domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.) bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 1 Oct 2014 15:02:10 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Oct 01 11:02:10 2014 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:57547 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1XZLPt-0000bI-O5 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 11:02:10 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.92]:32797) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <drew.adams@HIDDEN>) id 1XZLPq-0000bA-Lr for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 11:02:07 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from <drew.adams@HIDDEN>) id 1XZLPg-00063Q-66 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 11:02:06 -0400 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.8 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50 autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::11]:34336) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from <drew.adams@HIDDEN>) id 1XZLPg-00063K-4A for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 11:01:56 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:34470) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from <drew.adams@HIDDEN>) id 1XZLPW-0002y8-TM for bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 11:01:56 -0400 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from <drew.adams@HIDDEN>) id 1XZLPN-0005xg-Si for bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 11:01:46 -0400 Received: from moderators.individual.net ([130.133.4.7]:52070) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from <drew.adams@HIDDEN>) id 1XZLPN-0005xc-Nf for bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 11:01:37 -0400 Received: from aserp1040.oracle.com ([141.146.126.69]) by moderators.individual.net (Exim 4.82) for gnu-emacs-bug@HIDDEN with esmtp (envelope-from <drew.adams@HIDDEN>) id <1XZLPM-001UqX-QT>; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 17:01:37 +0200 Received: from ucsinet22.oracle.com (ucsinet22.oracle.com [156.151.31.94]) by aserp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id s91ExAvI013071 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Wed, 1 Oct 2014 14:59:11 GMT Received: from userz7022.oracle.com (userz7022.oracle.com [156.151.31.86]) by ucsinet22.oracle.com (8.14.5+Sun/8.14.5) with ESMTP id s91Ex9EQ021376 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 1 Oct 2014 14:59:10 GMT Received: from abhmp0011.oracle.com (abhmp0011.oracle.com [141.146.116.17]) by userz7022.oracle.com (8.14.5+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id s91Ex8t0021331; Wed, 1 Oct 2014 14:59:09 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <c82435e9-edd4-465c-a977-e09ec0fda1a6@default> Date: Wed, 1 Oct 2014 07:59:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN> To: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>, Alan Mackenzie <acm@HIDDEN> Subject: RE: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection References: <87k34li7ex.fsf@HIDDEN> <83ppedkwrs.fsf@HIDDEN> <mailman.10089.1412098998.1147.bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> <m0gvj3$vql$1@HIDDEN> <jwvbnpvyhut.fsf-monnier+emacsbugs@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <jwvbnpvyhut.fsf-monnier+emacsbugs@HIDDEN> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.8.2 (807160) [OL 12.0.6691.5000 (x86)] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Source-IP: ucsinet22.oracle.com [156.151.31.94] X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.4.x-2.6.x [generic] X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::11 X-Spam-Score: -4.0 (----) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit Cc: gnu-emacs-bug@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -4.0 (----) > Similarly, we could add a command that does "Move point back to the > position it had before we started scrolling", which would provide > some of the behavior that N. Jackson is requesting. As Eli said, "That's for the OP to tell." But I don't think N. Jackson is asking that point be moved back to the position it had before scrolling (the buffer beginning, in his use case). I think he is asking that the region not lose its other end, i.e., that it extend back to the buffer beginning, from the scrolled-to position. I think he is OK with point remaining at the scrolled position, but he wants the region to extend back to bob. Scrolling should extend (or reduce) one end of the region, but it should not affect the other end. I think the right behavior is what I suggested: If the region is active then swap point and mark before scrolling, if scrolling is in the direction away from point and toward mark. Have scrolling extend (or reduce, if scrolling toward point and away from mark) the region, but have it keep the other end of the original region. It would have to be kept as mark, of course, since scrolling moves the point end of the region. That is just what is done by mouse-3 too... But "That's for the OP to tell."
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
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From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
To: Alan Mackenzie <acm@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection
Message-ID: <jwvbnpvyhut.fsf-monnier+emacsbugs@HIDDEN>
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Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2014 10:42:39 -0400
In-Reply-To: <m0gvj3$vql$1@HIDDEN> (Alan Mackenzie's message of "Wed,
1 Oct 2014 13:29:07 +0000 (UTC)")
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> Suppose you've scrolled the window so that point is no longer in it, and
> you now want to set point to somewhere now visible; how are you going to
> do it?
You use the special new key-binding which says "Move point to a visible
spot in the window".
Similarly, we could add a command that does "Move point back to the
position it had before we started scrolling", which would provide some
of the behavior that N. Jackson is requesting.
Stefan
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
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Subject: Re: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection
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N. Jackson <nljlistbox2@HIDDEN> wrote:
> At 11:28 -0300 on Tuesday 2014-09-30, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>> Yes, there's a good reason: a selection in Emacs is always between
>> point and the mark, and when scrolling causes it to go off the
>> displayed portion of the buffer, Emacs moves point to bring it back
>> into view, which changes the selected portion of the text.
> Hmm... I see. But why does point need to be visible?
> It makes sense to me for a program to scroll the window to keep point in
> view when the user moves point; but it doesn't make sense to me for a
> program to move point when the user scrolls the window.
Suppose you've scrolled the window so that point is no longer in it, and
you now want to set point to somewhere now visible; how are you going to
do it? How are you going to indicate the place to put point? Nearly all
commands which work at a specific position do so at point. Your answer is
going to be "click with the mouse". But Emacs, as a fundamental design
feature, works on mouse-less systems.
> After all, point is the locus of the user's interaction with the
> contents of the buffer; presumably if they want to move that locus
> somewhere else, the user will move point explicitly. It makes little
> sense for the program to move point in this case -- even if it happens
> to have correctly read the mind of the user and the user really was
> scrolling the window with the intention of moving point, the program has
> no way of guessing in which column and row the user was going to put it,
> so it can essentially never do the right thing.
When I scroll a window, I always want point in that window, so that I
can easily start editing things there, etc.. In the instances when I want
to go back, I set mark first before scrolling, or scroll with a command
that itself sets the mark.
> Anyway, if point must be moved, please can it be put back automatically
> where it belongs when the user scrolls the window back and point's
> correct location is once again in view? Consider this a wishlist request.
> I'd also like to have typing, or any command involving point, scroll the
> window so that the correct location of point comes into view and then act on
> point where it belongs rather than where Emacs has "randomly" moved it.
That is a "feature" I most hate with so many GUI editing programs. I have
scrolled a buffer somewhere to look at things, and absent-mindedly start
typing, or even worse touch an arrow key, or something - then BANG!!!! my
entire mental context is explosively wiped out, scrolling the buffer back
to point and leaving me no way to go back to where I was looking at.
> Of course this would have to be an optional behaviour, something like a
> (setq point-follows-window nil). Consider it as second wishlist request?
I'm glad you said that. ;-)
> Thanks.
> Regards,
> N. Jackson.
--
Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
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From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
To: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection
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Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 15:22:25 -0400
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Sep 2014 19:56:04 +0200")
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> I addressed some of these issues here:
> https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2008-02/msg01892.html
Sounds like a good candidate for GNU ELPA.
Stefan
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
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From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
To: nljlistbox2@HIDDEN (N. Jackson)
Subject: Re: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection
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>> Yes, there's a good reason: a selection in Emacs is always between
>> point and the mark, and when scrolling causes it to go off the
>> displayed portion of the buffer, Emacs moves point to bring it back
>> into view, which changes the selected portion of the text.
> Hmm... I see. But why does point need to be visible?
A design decision. As mentioned in
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/9616623/ctrl-up-down-style-scrolling-in-emacs/9807039#9807039,
the behavior you expect could be implemented, but nobody bothered to do
so yet.
Stefan
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 18590) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Sep 2014 17:59:49 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Sep 30 13:59:49 2014 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56584 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1XZ1iG-0002iH-ID for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:59:49 -0400 Received: from mtaout20.012.net.il ([80.179.55.166]:37962) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1XZ1iD-0002i6-Kx for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:59:46 -0400 Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout20.012.net.il by a-mtaout20.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0NCQ00F006N2AB00@HIDDEN> for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:59:43 +0300 (IDT) Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([87.69.4.28]) by a-mtaout20.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0NCQ00F7P7BHFB00@HIDDEN>; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:59:42 +0300 (IDT) Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:59:36 +0300 From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection In-reply-to: <87ppedf1iw.fsf@HIDDEN> X-012-Sender: halo1@HIDDEN To: nljlistbox2@HIDDEN (N. Jackson) Message-id: <83zjdhj8fr.fsf@HIDDEN> References: <87k34li7ex.fsf@HIDDEN> <83ppedkwrs.fsf@HIDDEN> <87ppedf1iw.fsf@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 18590 Cc: 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) > From: nljlistbox2@HIDDEN (N. Jackson) > Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 14:42:31 -0300 > > At 11:28 -0300 on Tuesday 2014-09-30, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > > Yes, there's a good reason: a selection in Emacs is always between > > point and the mark, and when scrolling causes it to go off the > > displayed portion of the buffer, Emacs moves point to bring it back > > into view, which changes the selected portion of the text. > > Hmm... I see. But why does point need to be visible? Emacs always keeps point visible, it's one of the cornerstones of its display engine. > It makes sense to me for a program to scroll the window to keep point in > view when the user moves point; but it doesn't make sense to me for a > program to move point when the user scrolls the window. Others will disagree. It should be possible to implement a mode where point doesn't have to be in view, but doing so will require non-trivial changes. Patches welcome. > Anyway, if point must be moved, please can it be put back automatically > where it belongs when the user scrolls the window back and point's > correct location is once again in view? Consider this a wishlist request. Try customizing scroll-preserve-screen-position. > I'd also like to have typing, or any command involving point, scroll the > window so that the correct location of point comes into view and then act on > point where it belongs rather than where Emacs has "randomly" moved it. > Of course this would have to be an optional behaviour, something like a > (setq point-follows-window nil). Consider it as second wishlist request? You can have that today if you type "C-SPC" before scrolling. Then typing "C-x C-x" after scrolling will get you back where you started.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 18590) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Sep 2014 17:56:15 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Sep 30 13:56:15 2014 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56580 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1XZ1eo-0002cx-IW for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:56:15 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.15]:62412) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <rudalics@HIDDEN>) id 1XZ1ek-0002cm-Pk for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:56:12 -0400 Received: from [178.190.167.139] ([178.190.167.139]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx002) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0MCtql-1XPupu1Xm7-009l3b; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 19:56:09 +0200 Message-ID: <542AEEB4.3050109@HIDDEN> Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 19:56:04 +0200 From: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "N. Jackson" <nljlistbox2@HIDDEN>, 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection References: <87k34li7ex.fsf@HIDDEN> <83ppedkwrs.fsf@HIDDEN> <87ppedf1iw.fsf@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <87ppedf1iw.fsf@HIDDEN> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:JYh8+zMUb32ZJM8EYI2I7yFtV4vOipMtR64RGQu6UZVBTaqv/pf jIXpcK8kzLX8J0oMaELbqNQwPmm3hfBCUF00xfk7836ehTUo9Y60rr3FzYw0W23MzQ9XRNW RrVm/1E3+WMOr1O+9yJC0nAT6SQ2kEr5U1nyOX8+RUEqgYU8Uki/AeHZ2EHf26NbPR6KXhF N3xJiQt3t6H9jNVsLu3Nw== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1; X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 18590 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) > Anyway, if point must be moved, please can it be put back automatically > where it belongs when the user scrolls the window back and point's > correct location is once again in view? Consider this a wishlist request. > > I'd also like to have typing, or any command involving point, scroll the > window so that the correct location of point comes into view and then act on > point where it belongs rather than where Emacs has "randomly" moved it. > Of course this would have to be an optional behaviour, something like a > (setq point-follows-window nil). Consider it as second wishlist request? I addressed some of these issues here: https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2008-02/msg01892.html martin
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 18590) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Sep 2014 17:44:13 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Sep 30 13:44:13 2014 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56576 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1XZ1TA-00016i-FT for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:44:12 -0400 Received: from mtaout29.012.net.il ([80.179.55.185]:60413) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1XZ1T7-00016W-8h for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:44:10 -0400 Received: from conversion-daemon.mtaout29.012.net.il by mtaout29.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0NCQ00K0067W4700@HIDDEN> for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:43:28 +0300 (IDT) Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([87.69.4.28]) by mtaout29.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0NCQ00AUJ6KG3TA0@HIDDEN>; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:43:28 +0300 (IDT) Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:44:01 +0300 From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection In-reply-to: <468a4b88-6b7f-460c-8f14-50e7f494224a@default> X-012-Sender: halo1@HIDDEN To: Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN> Message-id: <8338b9knq6.fsf@HIDDEN> References: <69d7a976-96b7-49c6-bb96-e69f2fa8c93e@default> <83fvf9ktwd.fsf@HIDDEN> <4a1fd296-dc2f-4fb3-a854-0b4acea62f72@default> <8361g5kpqb.fsf@HIDDEN> <468a4b88-6b7f-460c-8f14-50e7f494224a@default> X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 18590 Cc: 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, nljlistbox2@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) > Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 10:10:42 -0700 (PDT) > From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN> > Cc: nljlistbox2@HIDDEN, 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > > But point moves when you scroll, so the selected portion of text > > changes. The OP wanted the selection to remain unchanged on both > > ends (at least that's my understanding of the report). > > Did you see the behavior I suggested might be an improvement? > I think it might respond to what the OP was expecting. That's for the OP to tell.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 18590) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Sep 2014 17:42:44 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Sep 30 13:42:44 2014 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56572 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1XZ1Rj-00014H-GX for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:42:43 -0400 Received: from mail-ie0-f179.google.com ([209.85.223.179]:64919) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <nljlistbox2@HIDDEN>) id 1XZ1Rh-000148-3M for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:42:41 -0400 Received: by mail-ie0-f179.google.com with SMTP id ar1so73359iec.24 for <18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 10:42:40 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=from:to:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id:user-agent :mime-version:content-type; bh=uq4Hie8eujsSxK5QsNdDFti/91yhWvDw05/yFSlByhs=; b=VReLyHF9+ySeIHgtmlpS97shzHftT2Pz4E0j5WhdmhdJMgZALaiJX+PmzKXeqljQH+ 21f5LpR4EwPpnhX2hazpuOIQhTjfU43fUf3uENkKOEmrdpb36+Venc5yvMZYNZCuUBTR 07gl0NtKWrcVyIww7UnB+KIUfyhZtEedf1J56ezhxcfxPQnyfhOWnXKY3YTHMwusbjF5 25IOYC9IN/wjYLyKjIW3Jv+fCpIfSkF/TIcWqH9d/xCr/RgmDe8cZ+ucswk/lWgmERSl Rwrw88eDvdW4Rrg9N+2TLv8Cj9QXWGpTWuiXSs+zT6DkxBY8fL16vAViGNV3i/fPD0bU x5Xw== X-Received: by 10.50.26.66 with SMTP id j2mr10481577igg.45.1412098960072; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 10:42:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from moondust.localdomain.nodomain.none (66-46-90-198.dedicated.allstream.net. [66.46.90.198]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id e7sm13564633igi.18.2014.09.30.10.42.36 for <18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org> (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 30 Sep 2014 10:42:38 -0700 (PDT) From: nljlistbox2@HIDDEN (N. Jackson) To: 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection References: <87k34li7ex.fsf@HIDDEN> <83ppedkwrs.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 14:42:31 -0300 In-Reply-To: <83ppedkwrs.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Tue, 30 Sep 2014 17:28:39 +0300") Message-ID: <87ppedf1iw.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3.93 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -0.4 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 18590 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -0.4 (/) At 11:28 -0300 on Tuesday 2014-09-30, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > Yes, there's a good reason: a selection in Emacs is always between > point and the mark, and when scrolling causes it to go off the > displayed portion of the buffer, Emacs moves point to bring it back > into view, which changes the selected portion of the text. Hmm... I see. But why does point need to be visible? It makes sense to me for a program to scroll the window to keep point in view when the user moves point; but it doesn't make sense to me for a program to move point when the user scrolls the window. After all, point is the locus of the user's interaction with the contents of the buffer; presumably if they want to move that locus somewhere else, the user will move point explicitly. It makes little sense for the program to move point in this case -- even if it happens to have correctly read the mind of the user and the user really was scrolling the window with the intention of moving point, the program has no way of guessing in which column and row the user was going to put it, so it can essentially never do the right thing. Anyway, if point must be moved, please can it be put back automatically where it belongs when the user scrolls the window back and point's correct location is once again in view? Consider this a wishlist request. I'd also like to have typing, or any command involving point, scroll the window so that the correct location of point comes into view and then act on point where it belongs rather than where Emacs has "randomly" moved it. Of course this would have to be an optional behaviour, something like a (setq point-follows-window nil). Consider it as second wishlist request? Thanks. Regards, N. Jackson.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 18590) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Sep 2014 17:10:48 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Sep 30 13:10:48 2014 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56544 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1XZ0wq-0000HX-47 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:10:48 -0400 Received: from userp1040.oracle.com ([156.151.31.81]:41404) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <drew.adams@HIDDEN>) id 1XZ0wn-0000HM-G9 for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:10:46 -0400 Received: from ucsinet21.oracle.com (ucsinet21.oracle.com [156.151.31.93]) by userp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id s8UHAisQ022235 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Sep 2014 17:10:44 GMT Received: from aserz7021.oracle.com (aserz7021.oracle.com [141.146.126.230]) by ucsinet21.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id s8UHAgts023358 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 30 Sep 2014 17:10:43 GMT Received: from abhmp0013.oracle.com (abhmp0013.oracle.com [141.146.116.19]) by aserz7021.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id s8UHAgwZ003660; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 17:10:42 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <468a4b88-6b7f-460c-8f14-50e7f494224a@default> Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 10:10:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN> Subject: RE: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection References: <<69d7a976-96b7-49c6-bb96-e69f2fa8c93e@default>> <<83fvf9ktwd.fsf@HIDDEN>> <<4a1fd296-dc2f-4fb3-a854-0b4acea62f72@default>> <<8361g5kpqb.fsf@HIDDEN>> In-Reply-To: <<8361g5kpqb.fsf@HIDDEN>> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.8.2 (807160) [OL 12.0.6691.5000 (x86)] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Source-IP: ucsinet21.oracle.com [156.151.31.93] X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 18590 Cc: 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, nljlistbox2@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) > But point moves when you scroll, so the selected portion of text > changes. The OP wanted the selection to remain unchanged on both > ends (at least that's my understanding of the report). Did you see the behavior I suggested might be an improvement? I think it might respond to what the OP was expecting. There might be a downside to what I suggested - haven't thought much about it. But I do think it responds to the gotcha that has bitten me and I think is biting the OP. You have something selected. Scrolling gives you the (mistaken) impression that you are only enlarging that selection. Consider what mouse-3 does after you have selected some text as somewhat of an analogy. It does not matter which end of the initially selected text point is at. When you click mouse-3 outside the region, the region is extended to the click position. Similarly, if you click inside the region, it is reduced to the click position. And the other end of the initially selected region is not changed - regardless of whether point or mark was at that end. That is more or less what my suggest was for scrolling: have it extend (or reduce, if scrolling toward point and away from mark) the region, but have it keep the other end of the original region. It would have to be kept as mark, of course, since scrolling moves the point end of the region. That is just what is done by mouse-3 too: it moves point to the click position and puts mark at the far end of the region (which position does not change).
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 18590) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Sep 2014 17:00:54 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Sep 30 13:00:54 2014 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56539 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1XZ0nG-0008Up-3X for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:00:54 -0400 Received: from mtaout25.012.net.il ([80.179.55.181]:32979) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1XZ0nD-0008Ud-I8 for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 13:00:52 -0400 Received: from conversion-daemon.mtaout25.012.net.il by mtaout25.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0NCQ003004257700@HIDDEN> for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 19:55:57 +0300 (IDT) Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([87.69.4.28]) by mtaout25.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0NCQ00OX54D8G440@HIDDEN>; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 19:55:57 +0300 (IDT) Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 20:00:44 +0300 From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection In-reply-to: <4a1fd296-dc2f-4fb3-a854-0b4acea62f72@default> X-012-Sender: halo1@HIDDEN To: Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN> Message-id: <8361g5kpqb.fsf@HIDDEN> References: <69d7a976-96b7-49c6-bb96-e69f2fa8c93e@default> <83fvf9ktwd.fsf@HIDDEN> <4a1fd296-dc2f-4fb3-a854-0b4acea62f72@default> X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 18590 Cc: 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, nljlistbox2@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) > Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 09:43:05 -0700 (PDT) > From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN> > Cc: nljlistbox2@HIDDEN, 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > > > And if I select a bit of text and then use the mouse wheel to > > > scroll the window I don't see the problem either. > > > > You don't use Emacs, if you don't see the problem. > > C-SPC C-5 C-f > Then scroll using the mouse wheel. Then C-x C-x. The region is from > point back to the mark. But point moves when you scroll, so the selected portion of text changes. The OP wanted the selection to remain unchanged on both ends (at least that's my understanding of the report). > Or press mouse-1, drag it a few chars, and release mouse-1. Then > scroll using the mouse wheel. Again, C-x C-x selects from the new > point back to the mouse-drag starting position "From the _NEW_ point", exactly. Ergo, the selection changed on one end. > All of these are what I meant by not seeing the problem with > mouse-wheel window scrolling. We have different notions of "the problem".
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 18590) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Sep 2014 16:43:16 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Sep 30 12:43:16 2014 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56519 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1XZ0WB-00083u-SE for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 12:43:16 -0400 Received: from aserp1040.oracle.com ([141.146.126.69]:22008) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <drew.adams@HIDDEN>) id 1XZ0W7-00083g-6D for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 12:43:12 -0400 Received: from ucsinet22.oracle.com (ucsinet22.oracle.com [156.151.31.94]) by aserp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id s8UGh8oH025174 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Sep 2014 16:43:09 GMT Received: from userz7021.oracle.com (userz7021.oracle.com [156.151.31.85]) by ucsinet22.oracle.com (8.14.5+Sun/8.14.5) with ESMTP id s8UGh6SK025331 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 30 Sep 2014 16:43:07 GMT Received: from abhmp0013.oracle.com (abhmp0013.oracle.com [141.146.116.19]) by userz7021.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id s8UGh6K3010800; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 16:43:06 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <4a1fd296-dc2f-4fb3-a854-0b4acea62f72@default> Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 09:43:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Subject: RE: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection References: <<69d7a976-96b7-49c6-bb96-e69f2fa8c93e@default>> <<83fvf9ktwd.fsf@HIDDEN>> In-Reply-To: <<83fvf9ktwd.fsf@HIDDEN>> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.8.2 (807160) [OL 12.0.6691.5000 (x86)] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Source-IP: ucsinet22.oracle.com [156.151.31.94] X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 18590 Cc: 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, nljlistbox2@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) > > The same thing does not happen if you select with the mouse (e.g. > > drag the selection past the window bottom. >=20 > Of course it does: dragging the mouse moves point. What I said is that loss of the starting position, as one end of the region, does not occur. You can use `C-x C-x' to select the region between the new point (where the mouse dragged to) and the starting position of the drag. The fact that the window scrolled during the drag does not affect this region. Which is as it should be. > > And it does not happen if you set mark and then use C-v to move > > past the window bottom. >=20 > Only point must be in the view; the mark might be outside of it, as > you well know. Yes. And both mouse dragging and C-SPC set the mark (which they should). > > And if I select a bit of text and then use the mouse wheel to > > scroll the window I don't see the problem either. >=20 > You don't use Emacs, if you don't see the problem. C-SPC C-5 C-f Then scroll using the mouse wheel. Then C-x C-x. The region is from point back to the mark. As it should be. Or press mouse-1, drag it a few chars, and release mouse-1. Then scroll using the mouse wheel. Again, C-x C-x selects from the new point back to the mouse-drag starting position - because mouse drag sets mark. Again, the behavior is as it should be. Or S-right a few times, to select a few chars. Then scroll using the mouse wheel. Again, C-x C-x selects from the new point back to where you first used S-right (the mark). Again, the behavior is as it should be. All of these are what I meant by not seeing the problem with mouse-wheel window scrolling. What did you mean by it? All of these behaviors are similar. I thought, but I guess now that I was mistaken, that I saw the following, different behavior for the scroll bar: Select some text (using any method) and then scroll using the vertical scroll bar. I thought I saw that the region was kept active (and point was of course moved to follow the window scrolling, as it should be), but the other end of the active region changed from its original beginning to the new window start position. So C-x C-x lost the original region start and was now between the new point (from scrolling) and the window-start position. I could have sworn that I observed that (including this morning), but I cannot seem to repro it now. So I guess scroll-bar scrolling is not problematic either. Sorry for that noise. --- Actually, now that I think more about it, I think the seeming gotcha is this, and it corresponds to the OP report wrt C-x h. Because scrolling moves point, if the direction of scrolling is toward the mark (away from point) then the original position is lost, and you cannot recuperate it. This is logical, but it can seem unnatural. E.g.: Double-click the opening or closing paren of a defun. That puts point at the end of the selected defun. C-x C-x to put point at the beginning (for whatever reason). Now scroll down. Scrolling moves point, of course. Visually, you can (mistakenly) think that the region is being extended _from the original point_, past the mark, to the scroll position (new point). Of course this is not the case - the region is always between the mark and (the new) point. It can seem unnatural because (a) the defun was selected initially, (b) scrolling visibly extends the region, and (c) the other (mark) end of the region is no longer on the screen, so you do not see that the region no longer includes the initially selected defun. I don't know whether it might make sense for scrolling to first either deactivate the region or swap point and mark (if it keeps the region active). If it deactivated the region the same "problem" would be present, but at least you would not see the region being extended and mistakenly assume that it was being extended from the farthest position from the scroll direction (i.e. from point). Am I being clear? Maybe put it this way: With some text selected (and the region active), regardless of which end of the region point is, the region would be kept active (as now), but point would first be swapped with mark, whenever the scrolling direction was toward mark (away from point). What this would amount to is trying to compensate for possibly forgetting to use C-x C-x to swap point and mark _before_ scrolling.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 18590) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Sep 2014 15:30:58 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Sep 30 11:30:58 2014 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56472 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1XYzOD-0004zn-Bz for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 11:30:57 -0400 Received: from mtaout21.012.net.il ([80.179.55.169]:64508) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1XYzO7-0004za-0s for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 11:30:55 -0400 Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout21.012.net.il by a-mtaout21.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0NCQ005000E8XU00@HIDDEN> for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 18:30:48 +0300 (IDT) Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([87.69.4.28]) by a-mtaout21.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0NCQ005M40FCWW10@HIDDEN>; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 18:30:48 +0300 (IDT) Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 18:30:42 +0300 From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection In-reply-to: <69d7a976-96b7-49c6-bb96-e69f2fa8c93e@default> X-012-Sender: halo1@HIDDEN To: Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN> Message-id: <83fvf9ktwd.fsf@HIDDEN> References: <69d7a976-96b7-49c6-bb96-e69f2fa8c93e@default> X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 18590 Cc: 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, nljlistbox2@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) > Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 08:06:48 -0700 (PDT) > From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN> > Cc: 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > The same thing does not happen if you select with the mouse (e.g. > drag the selection past the window bottom. Of course it does: dragging the mouse moves point. > And it does not happen if you set mark and then use C-v to move past > the window bottom. Only point must be in the view; the mark might be outside of it, as you well know. > And if I select a bit of text and then use the mouse wheel to > scroll the window I don't see the problem either. You don't use Emacs, if you don't see the problem.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 18590) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Sep 2014 15:07:00 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Sep 30 11:07:00 2014 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56458 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1XYz11-0004Nu-0z for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 11:06:59 -0400 Received: from aserp1040.oracle.com ([141.146.126.69]:23988) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <drew.adams@HIDDEN>) id 1XYz0v-0004Nb-Ul for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 11:06:54 -0400 Received: from acsinet21.oracle.com (acsinet21.oracle.com [141.146.126.237]) by aserp1040.oracle.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.2) with ESMTP id s8UF6qoH013827 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 30 Sep 2014 15:06:53 GMT Received: from userz7022.oracle.com (userz7022.oracle.com [156.151.31.86]) by acsinet21.oracle.com (8.14.4+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id s8UF6pj3020204 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 30 Sep 2014 15:06:51 GMT Received: from abhmp0013.oracle.com (abhmp0013.oracle.com [141.146.116.19]) by userz7022.oracle.com (8.14.5+Sun/8.14.4) with ESMTP id s8UF6nZ7008443; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 15:06:50 GMT MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <69d7a976-96b7-49c6-bb96-e69f2fa8c93e@default> Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 08:06:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, "N. Jackson" <nljlistbox2@HIDDEN> Subject: RE: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection References: <<87k34li7ex.fsf@HIDDEN>> <<83ppedkwrs.fsf@HIDDEN>> In-Reply-To: <<83ppedkwrs.fsf@HIDDEN>> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.8.2 (807160) [OL 12.0.6691.5000 (x86)] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Source-IP: acsinet21.oracle.com [141.146.126.237] X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 18590 Cc: 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.0 (---) > > 4. Scroll the window with the scroll bar or the mouse. > > The selection changes as the window is scrolled up and down. >=20 > Yes, there's a good reason: a selection in Emacs is always between > point and the mark, and when scrolling causes it to go off the > displayed portion of the buffer, Emacs moves point to bring it back > into view, which changes the selected portion of the text. Yes, it's well known. But IMO not ideal behavior. The same thing does not happen if you select with the mouse (e.g. drag the selection past the window bottom. And it does not happen if you set mark and then use C-v to move past the window bottom. The problem is not that point is kept in the window - that is desirable. The point is the lack of a mark at the other end, so the selected text shrinks (that's not really a problem, since what is no longer selected is off-screen anyway), and you cannot use C-x C-x to get back the region you had. That loss of the original region is the problem. With the other methods I just mentioned, you can use C-x C-x to get the region back. I see the problem only when the scroll bar is used. Not sure what the OP meant by "or with the mouse". Perhaps he meant a window-scrolling mouse. I don't see the problem when I drag the selection using the mouse, at least. And if I select a bit of text and then use the mouse wheel to scroll the window I don't see the problem either. In that case, the scrolling immediately deselects the text, unlike the case when I use the scroll bar.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 18590) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Sep 2014 14:28:50 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Sep 30 10:28:50 2014 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56451 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1XYyQ5-0003S0-Ej for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 10:28:49 -0400 Received: from mtaout22.012.net.il ([80.179.55.172]:58840) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1XYyQ2-0003Rq-LO for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 10:28:47 -0400 Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout22.012.net.il by a-mtaout22.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0NCP00L00XETPY00@HIDDEN> for 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 17:28:45 +0300 (IDT) Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([87.69.4.28]) by a-mtaout22.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0NCP00LPPXJWLQ10@HIDDEN>; Tue, 30 Sep 2014 17:28:45 +0300 (IDT) Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 17:28:39 +0300 From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#18590: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection In-reply-to: <87k34li7ex.fsf@HIDDEN> X-012-Sender: halo1@HIDDEN To: nljlistbox2@HIDDEN (N. Jackson) Message-id: <83ppedkwrs.fsf@HIDDEN> References: <87k34li7ex.fsf@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 18590 Cc: 18590 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) > From: nljlistbox2@HIDDEN (N. Jackson) > Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 10:07:02 -0300 > > 1. emacs -Q > > 2. Open a file "longer" than the window such as the Emacs README file. E.g. C-x f R E A D M E > > 3. C-x h ; Select all the text in the window. > > 4. Scroll the window with the scroll bar or the mouse. > > Expected behaviour: > > The text that is selected/highlighted remains selected/highlighted. > > Observed behaviour: > > The selection changes as the window is scrolled up and down. > > === > > Note 1: This also happens when the selected text was selected by holding > down the shift key and using the arrow keys to extend the selection, or > if the text is selected with the mouse. > > Note 2: When a smaller region is selected, the selection is sometimes > lost entirely after it is scrolled off the top or bottom of the window > and then scrolled back in to view. > > Note 3: I see the same (or similar) behaviour in Emacs 24.3.1 (which is > the oldest version I have on this system), but that does not make it > correct. Is this bizarre behaviour intended? It seems that if the user > makes a selection, Emacs should not change their selection without good > reason; is there a good reason? Yes, there's a good reason: a selection in Emacs is always between point and the mark, and when scrolling causes it to go off the displayed portion of the buffer, Emacs moves point to bring it back into view, which changes the selected portion of the text.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
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[134.190.134.124]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id h19sm7452864qge.13.2014.09.30.06.07.03 for <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 30 Sep 2014 06:07:04 -0700 (PDT) From: nljlistbox2@HIDDEN (N. Jackson) To: bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN Subject: 24.3.93; Scrolling changes/forgets selection Date: Tue, 30 Sep 2014 10:07:02 -0300 Message-ID: <87k34li7ex.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/24.3.93 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::11 X-Spam-Score: -3.8 (---) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.8 (---) After highlighting/selecting text in a window, scrolling the window vertically with the scroll bar or with the mouse moves the selection so that text intentionally selected is no longer selected. To reproduce: 1. emacs -Q 2. Open a file "longer" than the window such as the Emacs README file. E.g.= C-x f R E A D M E 3. C-x h ; Select all the text in the window. 4. Scroll the window with the scroll bar or the mouse. Expected behaviour: The text that is selected/highlighted remains selected/highlighted. Observed behaviour: The selection changes as the window is scrolled up and down. =3D=3D=3D Note 1: This also happens when the selected text was selected by holding down the shift key and using the arrow keys to extend the selection, or if the text is selected with the mouse. Note 2: When a smaller region is selected, the selection is sometimes lost entirely after it is scrolled off the top or bottom of the window and then scrolled back in to view. Note 3: I see the same (or similar) behaviour in Emacs 24.3.1 (which is the oldest version I have on this system), but that does not make it correct. Is this bizarre behaviour intended? It seems that if the user makes a selection, Emacs should not change their selection without good reason; is there a good reason? In GNU Emacs 24.3.93.1 (x86_64-unknown-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.8.8) of 2014-08-18 on moondust Windowing system distributor `Fedora Project', version 11.0.11404000 System Description: Fedora release 19 (Schr=C3=B6dinger=E2=80=99s Cat) Configured using: `configure --prefix=3D/home/nlj/local/ 'CFLAGS=3D-O0 -g3 -ggdb'' Important settings: value of $LC_MONETARY: en_DK.utf8 value of $LC_NUMERIC: en_DK.utf8 value of $LC_TIME: en_DK.utf8 value of $LANG: en_CA.utf8 value of $XMODIFIERS: @im=3Dibus locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix Major mode: Fundamental Minor modes in effect: tooltip-mode: t electric-indent-mode: t mouse-wheel-mode: t tool-bar-mode: t menu-bar-mode: t file-name-shadow-mode: t global-font-lock-mode: t font-lock-mode: t blink-cursor-mode: t auto-composition-mode: t auto-encryption-mode: t auto-compression-mode: t line-number-mode: t transient-mark-mode: t Recent input: <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> C-g <C-home> <C-end> C-x h <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1>=20 <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <mouse-1> <help-echo> <help-echo>=20 <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo>=20 <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo>=20 <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo>=20 <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo>=20 <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo>=20 <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo> <help-echo>=20 <help-echo> <help-echo> <menu-bar> <help-menu> <se nd-emacs-bug-report> Recent messages: For information about GNU Emacs and the GNU system, type C-h C-a. Making completion list... README has auto save data; consider M-x recover-this-file Mark set [2 times] byte-code: Beginning of buffer [2 times] Quit Mark set [2 times] Quit Load-path shadows: None found. Features: (shadow sort gnus-util mail-extr emacsbug message format-spec rfc822 mml mml-sec mm-decode mm-bodies mm-encode mail-parse rfc2231 mailabbrev gmm-utils mailheader sendmail rfc2047 rfc2045 ietf-drums mm-util help-fns mail-prsvr mail-utils help-mode easymenu time-date tooltip electric uniquify ediff-hook vc-hooks lisp-float-type mwheel x-win x-dnd tool-bar dnd fontset image regexp-opt fringe tabulated-list newcomment lisp-mode prog-mode register page menu-bar rfn-eshadow timer select scroll-bar mouse jit-lock font-lock syntax facemenu font-core frame cham georgian utf-8-lang misc-lang vietnamese tibetan thai tai-viet lao korean japanese hebrew greek romanian slovak czech european ethiopic indian cyrillic chinese case-table epa-hook jka-cmpr-hook help simple abbrev minibuffer nadvice loaddefs button faces cus-face macroexp files text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env code-pages mule custom widget hashtable-print-readable backquote make-network-process dbusbind gfilenotify dynamic-setting system-font-setting font-render-setting move-toolbar gtk x-toolkit x multi-tty emacs) Memory information: ((conses 16 75209 7674) (symbols 48 17706 0) (miscs 40 82 139) (strings 32 9413 4196) (string-bytes 1 268665) (vectors 16 9048) (vector-slots 8 386144 15091) (floats 8 64 369) (intervals 56 282 22) (buffers 960 13) (heap 1024 27655 1006))
nljlistbox2@HIDDEN (N. Jackson):bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN.
Full text available.bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#18590; Package emacs.
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