GNU bug report logs - #18836
25.0.50; `insert-directory' barfs on nonexistent file, but not for `ls-lisp-insert-directory'

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Package: emacs; Severity: minor; Reported by: Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN>; dated Sat, 25 Oct 2014 19:57:01 UTC; Maintainer for emacs is bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN.

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From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@HIDDEN>
In-reply-to: <874majm6a5.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Sat, 
 30 Apr 2016 18:05:06 +0200)
Subject: Re: bug#18836: 25.0.50;
 `insert-directory' barfs on nonexistent file, but not for
 `ls-lisp-insert-directory'
References: <f7e93777-9e03-4430-8550-6a3fbd5d5ea0@default>
 <8760uzp2lo.fsf@HIDDEN> <831t5np0kw.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <87vb2zm75p.fsf@HIDDEN> <83vb2znldj.fsf@HIDDEN> <874majm6a5.fsf@HIDDEN>
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> From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@HIDDEN>
> Cc: 18836 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 18:05:06 +0200
> 
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
> 
> >> From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@HIDDEN>
> >> Cc: 18836 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> >> Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 17:46:10 +0200
> >> 
> >> >> I have no opinion on that, but: What on Earth is that function (and all
> >> >> its adjacent functions) doing in files.el?
> >> >
> >> > Where else would you like them to be?
> >> 
> >> In dired.el.
> >
> > Dired isn't preloaded.
> 
> But does anything other than dired use it?  I see that other packages
> (like ange-ftp) instrument it...  it that the reason it's in files.el?

Yes.  Also, ls-lisp.




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From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#18836: 25.0.50;
 `insert-directory' barfs on nonexistent file, but not for
 `ls-lisp-insert-directory'
References: <f7e93777-9e03-4430-8550-6a3fbd5d5ea0@default>
 <8760uzp2lo.fsf@HIDDEN> <831t5np0kw.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <87vb2zm75p.fsf@HIDDEN> <83vb2znldj.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 18:05:06 +0200
In-Reply-To: <83vb2znldj.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 30 Apr
 2016 18:53:44 +0300")
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Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:

>> From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@HIDDEN>
>> Cc: 18836 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 17:46:10 +0200
>> 
>> >> I have no opinion on that, but: What on Earth is that function (and all
>> >> its adjacent functions) doing in files.el?
>> >
>> > Where else would you like them to be?
>> 
>> In dired.el.
>
> Dired isn't preloaded.

But does anything other than dired use it?  I see that other packages
(like ange-ftp) instrument it...  it that the reason it's in files.el?

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#18836; Package emacs. Full text available.

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From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@HIDDEN>
In-reply-to: <87vb2zm75p.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Sat, 
 30 Apr 2016 17:46:10 +0200)
Subject: Re: bug#18836: 25.0.50;
 `insert-directory' barfs on nonexistent file, but not for
 `ls-lisp-insert-directory'
References: <f7e93777-9e03-4430-8550-6a3fbd5d5ea0@default>
 <8760uzp2lo.fsf@HIDDEN> <831t5np0kw.fsf@HIDDEN> <87vb2zm75p.fsf@HIDDEN>
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> From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@HIDDEN>
> Cc: 18836 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 17:46:10 +0200
> 
> >> I have no opinion on that, but: What on Earth is that function (and all
> >> its adjacent functions) doing in files.el?
> >
> > Where else would you like them to be?
> 
> In dired.el.

Dired isn't preloaded.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#18836; Package emacs. Full text available.

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From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#18836: 25.0.50;
 `insert-directory' barfs on nonexistent file, but not for
 `ls-lisp-insert-directory'
References: <f7e93777-9e03-4430-8550-6a3fbd5d5ea0@default>
 <8760uzp2lo.fsf@HIDDEN> <831t5np0kw.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 17:46:10 +0200
In-Reply-To: <831t5np0kw.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 30 Apr
 2016 18:39:59 +0300")
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Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:

>> From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@HIDDEN>
>> Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 16:56:19 +0200
>> Cc: 18836 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> 
>> > Would it be possible to make vanilla `insert-directory' more tolerant,
>> > i.e., make it act like `ls-lisp-insert-directory', in this respect?
>> 
>> I have no opinion on that, but: What on Earth is that function (and all
>> its adjacent functions) doing in files.el?
>
> Where else would you like them to be?

In dired.el.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#18836; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 18836 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@HIDDEN>
In-reply-to: <8760uzp2lo.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Lars Ingebrigtsen on Sat, 
 30 Apr 2016 16:56:19 +0200)
Subject: Re: bug#18836: 25.0.50;
 `insert-directory' barfs on nonexistent file, but not for
 `ls-lisp-insert-directory'
References: <f7e93777-9e03-4430-8550-6a3fbd5d5ea0@default>
 <8760uzp2lo.fsf@HIDDEN>
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> From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@HIDDEN>
> Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 16:56:19 +0200
> Cc: 18836 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> > Would it be possible to make vanilla `insert-directory' more tolerant,
> > i.e., make it act like `ls-lisp-insert-directory', in this respect?
> 
> I have no opinion on that, but: What on Earth is that function (and all
> its adjacent functions) doing in files.el?

Where else would you like them to be?

> (insert-directory "." "-l")
> =>
> drwxrwxr-x 22 larsi larsi 4096 april 30 16:49 .
> 
> This doesn't seem like a very ... useful general function.

Then how come dired.el calls it?




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From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@HIDDEN>
To: Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#18836: 25.0.50;
 `insert-directory' barfs on nonexistent file, but not for
 `ls-lisp-insert-directory'
References: <f7e93777-9e03-4430-8550-6a3fbd5d5ea0@default>
Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2016 16:56:19 +0200
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Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN> writes:

> Would it be possible to make vanilla `insert-directory' more tolerant,
> i.e., make it act like `ls-lisp-insert-directory', in this respect?

I have no opinion on that, but: What on Earth is that function (and all
its adjacent functions) doing in files.el?

(insert-directory "." "-l")
=>
drwxrwxr-x 22 larsi larsi 4096 april 30 16:49 .

This doesn't seem like a very ... useful general function.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#18836; Package emacs. Full text available.

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From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN>
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Subject: 25.0.50; `insert-directory' barfs on nonexistent file, but not for
 `ls-lisp-insert-directory'
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It seems that at least on some platforms (e.g. GNU/Linux), if you give
an explicit list of files and dirs to `dired', to list (which you do by
passing a cons as argument DIRNAME), the command fails with an error:
(file-error "Reading directory"
            "no such file or directory"
            "/usr/foo/no-such-file.txt")

No such error is raised on platforms that use `ls-lisp'.

This non-`ls-lisp' behavior is not as friendly as it could be, and not
as friendly as the `ls-lisp-insert-directory' behavior, which simply
displays a message and then calls `ding':
(message "%s: doesn't exist or is inaccessible" file)

Would it be possible to make vanilla `insert-directory' more tolerant,
i.e., make it act like `ls-lisp-insert-directory', in this respect?
Failing to access a single file should not prevent listing the others,
if this can be handled properly.  But maybe it's not feasible; dunno.

[FWIW, I would even prefer to see the file or dir listed in the Dired
buffer, even if it does not (yet) exist.  Let user attempts to actually
access it raise an error, and let no error be raised if the file is
created after creating the Dired buffer but before the user tries to
access the file.]

In GNU Emacs 25.0.50.1 (i686-pc-mingw32)
 of 2014-10-20 on LEG570
Bzr revision: 118168 rgm@HIDDEN
Windowing system distributor `Microsoft Corp.', version 6.1.7601
Configured using:
 `configure --enable-checking=3Dyes,glyphs CPPFLAGS=3D-DGLYPH_DEBUG=3D1'




Acknowledgement sent to Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN>:
New bug report received and forwarded. Copy sent to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN. Full text available.
Report forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#18836; Package emacs. Full text available.
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