GNU bug report logs - #25174
C-h v some keymap now gives some numbers instead of the familiar bindings

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Message #5 received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: 積丹尼 Dan Jacobson <jidanni <at> jidanni.org>
To: bug-gnu-emacs <bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org>
Subject: C-h v some keymap now gives some numbers instead of the familiar
 bindings
Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2016 02:17:27 +0800

C-h v some keymap now gives some numbers instead of the familiar bindings.

flyspell-mode-map is a variable defined in ‘flyspell.el’.
Its value is (keymap
 (3 keymap
    (36 . flyspell-correct-word-before-point))
 (67108910 . flyspell-auto-correct-word)
 (67108908 . flyspell-goto-next-error)
 (67108923 . flyspell-auto-correct-previous-word)
 (27 keymap
     (9 . flyspell-auto-correct-word)))


  This variable may be risky if used as a file-local variable.

Documentation:
Minor mode keymap for Flyspell mode--for the whole buffer.

emacs-version "25.1.1"

Message #8 received at 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: npostavs <at> users.sourceforge.net
To: 積丹尼 Dan Jacobson <jidanni <at> jidanni.org>
Cc: 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#25174: C-h v some keymap now gives some numbers instead of
 the familiar bindings
Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2016 23:03:27 -0500

積丹尼 Dan Jacobson <jidanni <at> jidanni.org> writes:

> C-h v some keymap now gives some numbers instead of the familiar
> bindings.

What do you mean by "now"?  It seems to be consistent to as far back as
23.4.

Message #11 received at 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: 積丹尼 Dan Jacobson <jidanni <at> jidanni.org>
To: npostavs <at> users.sourceforge.net
Cc: 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#25174: C-h v some keymap now gives some numbers instead of
 the familiar bindings
Date: Tue, 13 Dec 2016 13:58:03 +0800

Well it's bad.

Message #14 received at 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
To: 積丹尼 Dan Jacobson <jidanni <at> jidanni.org>
Cc: 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs <at> users.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: bug#25174: C-h v some keymap now gives some numbers instead of
 the familiar bindings
Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2019 21:42:38 +0200

積丹尼 Dan Jacobson <jidanni <at> jidanni.org> writes:

> Well it's bad.

That's the value of the keymap variable, so I don't see anything to fix here.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

Message #21 received at 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen <at> web.de>
To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
Cc: npostavs <at> users.sourceforge.net, 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org,
 積丹尼 Dan Jacobson <jidanni <at> jidanni.org>
Subject: Re: bug#25174: C-h v some keymap now gives some numbers instead of
 the familiar bindings
Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2019 22:09:36 +0200

Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org> writes:

> That's the value of the keymap variable, so I don't see anything to
> fix here.

But I think the report is about how this value is being printed.
67108908 is not that...informative.

I guess one could teach cl-print to produce a more human readable syntax
for keymaps.  That could also be useful for M-:.

Michael.

Message #24 received at 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
To: Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen <at> web.de>
Cc: npostavs <at> users.sourceforge.net, 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org,
 積丹尼 Dan Jacobson <jidanni <at> jidanni.org>
Subject: Re: bug#25174: C-h v some keymap now gives some numbers instead of
 the familiar bindings
Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2019 22:12:07 +0200

Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen <at> web.de> writes:

> Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org> writes:
>
>> That's the value of the keymap variable, so I don't see anything to
>> fix here.
>
> But I think the report is about how this value is being printed.
> 67108908 is not that...informative.
>
> I guess one could teach cl-print to produce a more human readable syntax
> for keymaps.  That could also be useful for M-:.

A keymap is just a list (or vector); C-h v should display it as is.

If a user wants a readable output, there's `C-h b' etc.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

Message #27 received at 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen <at> web.de>
To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
Cc: npostavs <at> users.sourceforge.net, 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org,
 積丹尼 Dan Jacobson <jidanni <at> jidanni.org>
Subject: Re: bug#25174: C-h v some keymap now gives some numbers instead of
 the familiar bindings
Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2019 10:31:02 +0200

Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org> writes:

> A keymap is just a list (or vector); C-h v should display it as is.

It would display it "as is", it would just use a syntax like e.g. ?t
instead of 166.  How would that be problematic?

Michael.

Message #30 received at 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
To: Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen <at> web.de>
Cc: npostavs <at> users.sourceforge.net, 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org,
 積丹尼 Dan Jacobson <jidanni <at> jidanni.org>
Subject: Re: bug#25174: C-h v some keymap now gives some numbers instead of
 the familiar bindings
Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2019 03:31:41 +0200

Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen <at> web.de> writes:

> Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org> writes:
>
>> A keymap is just a list (or vector); C-h v should display it as is.
>
> It would display it "as is", it would just use a syntax like e.g. ?t
> instead of 166.  How would that be problematic?

I think it just sounds a bit confusing.  Would users believe that ?t is
something else than 166 just in a keymap context?  And no matter how you
display the keymap in `C-h v', it's going to be pretty incomprehensible.

But there's also a parallel bug report about adding a describe-keymap
command that'll display the keymap in a more sensible fashion (not as a
list/vector at all), and that's probably going to be merged.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

Message #33 received at 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen <at> web.de>
To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
Cc: npostavs <at> users.sourceforge.net, 25174 <at> debbugs.gnu.org,
 積丹尼 Dan Jacobson <jidanni <at> jidanni.org>
Subject: Re: bug#25174: C-h v some keymap now gives some numbers instead of
 the familiar bindings
Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2019 10:56:01 +0200

Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org> writes:

> Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen <at> web.de> writes:
>
> > Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org> writes:
> >
> >> A keymap is just a list (or vector); C-h v should display it as is.
> >
> > It would display it "as is", it would just use a syntax like e.g. ?t
> > instead of 166.  How would that be problematic?
>
> I think it just sounds a bit confusing.  Would users believe that ?t is
> something else than 166 just in a keymap context?

Why would they?  This char syntax is widely used.

> And no matter how you display the keymap in `C-h v', it's going to be
> pretty incomprehensible.

We have just very different opinions here I think.

Michael.

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