GNU bug report logs - #25594
25.1.91; TeX input method is missing \sqrt macro

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Message #5 received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Tyler Smith <tyler <at> plantarum.ca>
To: bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org
Subject: 25.1.91; TeX input method is missing \sqrt macro
Date: Tue, 31 Jan 2017 17:36:28 -0500

Hi,

The TeX input method does not provide a translation for the \sqrt macro.
The appropriate symbol, unicode Square Root, is available, and can be
inserted using the obscure name \surd.

Perhaps that's a well-known word to some, but for regular TeX users, it
would be very helpful to have the following rule added to the
(latin-ltx--define-rules ...) form in lisp/leim/quail/latin-ltx.el:

 ("\\sqrt" ?√)

Thanks,

Tyler

In GNU Emacs 25.1.91.1 (x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, X toolkit, Xaw3d scroll
bars)
 of 2017-01-17 built on onottra672626p
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-- 
plantarum.ca

Message #8 received at 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
To: Tyler Smith <tyler <at> plantarum.ca>
Cc: 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#25594: 25.1.91; TeX input method is missing \sqrt macro
Date: Fri, 26 Jul 2019 16:39:03 +0200

Tyler Smith <tyler <at> plantarum.ca> writes:

> The TeX input method does not provide a translation for the \sqrt macro.
> The appropriate symbol, unicode Square Root, is available, and can be
> inserted using the obscure name \surd.
>
> Perhaps that's a well-known word to some, but for regular TeX users, it
> would be very helpful to have the following rule added to the
> (latin-ltx--define-rules ...) form in lisp/leim/quail/latin-ltx.el:
>
>  ("\\sqrt" ?√)

(I'm going through older Emacs bug reports that have received no
response.)

That seems a reasonable thing to add, and it's in patch form below.  But
what makes me hesitate to add it is that there's a commented-out
"\\sqrt[3]" in the file...  Does this mean that this should be
"\\sqrt[2]"?  Why is it commented out in the first place?  Don't
latin-ltx people like squares?  And roots?

So if anybody else who uses this input method could weigh in here, that
would be nice.

diff --git a/lisp/leim/quail/latin-ltx.el b/lisp/leim/quail/latin-ltx.el
index 93b1250a35..aed34d1265 100644
--- a/lisp/leim/quail/latin-ltx.el
+++ b/lisp/leim/quail/latin-ltx.el
@@ -703,6 +703,7 @@
  ("\\ldq" ?\“)
  ("\\rdq" ?\”)
  ("\\defs" ?≙)				; per fuzz/zed
+ ("\\sqrt" ?√)
  ;; ("\\sqrt[3]" ?∛)
  ("\\llbracket" ?\〚) 			; stmaryrd
  ("\\rrbracket" ?\〛)


-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

Message #13 received at 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Stefan Kangas <stefan <at> marxist.se>
To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
Cc: 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Tyler Smith <tyler <at> plantarum.ca>
Subject: Re: bug#25594: 25.1.91; TeX input method is missing \sqrt macro
Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2020 21:14:40 +0100

Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org> writes:

> Tyler Smith <tyler <at> plantarum.ca> writes:
>
>> The TeX input method does not provide a translation for the \sqrt macro.
>> The appropriate symbol, unicode Square Root, is available, and can be
>> inserted using the obscure name \surd.
>>
>> Perhaps that's a well-known word to some, but for regular TeX users, it
>> would be very helpful to have the following rule added to the
>> (latin-ltx--define-rules ...) form in lisp/leim/quail/latin-ltx.el:
>>
>>  ("\\sqrt" ?√)
>
> (I'm going through older Emacs bug reports that have received no
> response.)
>
> That seems a reasonable thing to add, and it's in patch form below.  But
> what makes me hesitate to add it is that there's a commented-out
> "\\sqrt[3]" in the file...  Does this mean that this should be
> "\\sqrt[2]"?  Why is it commented out in the first place?  Don't
> latin-ltx people like squares?  And roots?
>
> So if anybody else who uses this input method could weigh in here, that
> would be nice.

No one has commented within 25 weeks.

AFAIK, TeX has the \sqrt command for a basic square root, and \sqrt[3]
for the cubic root.  That suggests that the proposal is fine (we can
leave the sqrt[3] commented out as is for now IMHO).

Best regards,
Stefan Kangas

>
> diff --git a/lisp/leim/quail/latin-ltx.el b/lisp/leim/quail/latin-ltx.el
> index 93b1250a35..aed34d1265 100644
> --- a/lisp/leim/quail/latin-ltx.el
> +++ b/lisp/leim/quail/latin-ltx.el
> @@ -703,6 +703,7 @@
>   ("\\ldq" ?\“)
>   ("\\rdq" ?\”)
>   ("\\defs" ?≙)				; per fuzz/zed
> + ("\\sqrt" ?√)
>   ;; ("\\sqrt[3]" ?∛)
>   ("\\llbracket" ?\〚) 			; stmaryrd
>   ("\\rrbracket" ?\〛)

Message #16 received at 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: "Tyler Smith" <tyler <at> plantarum.ca>
To: "Stefan Kangas" <stefan <at> marxist.se>, "Lars Ingebrigtsen" <larsi <at> gnus.org>
Cc: 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#25594: 25.1.91; TeX input method is missing \sqrt macro
Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2020 15:39:38 -0500

On Mon, Jan 20, 2020, at 3:14 PM, Stefan Kangas wrote:
> Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org> writes:
> 
> > That seems a reasonable thing to add, and it's in patch form below.  But
> > what makes me hesitate to add it is that there's a commented-out
> > "\\sqrt[3]" in the file...  Does this mean that this should be
> > "\\sqrt[2]"?  Why is it commented out in the first place?  Don't
> > latin-ltx people like squares?  And roots?
> >
> > So if anybody else who uses this input method could weigh in here, that
> > would be nice.
> 
> No one has commented within 25 weeks.
> 
> AFAIK, TeX has the \sqrt command for a basic square root, and \sqrt[3]
> for the cubic root.  That suggests that the proposal is fine (we can
> leave the sqrt[3] commented out as is for now IMHO).

FWIW, `\sqrt[3]` in LaTeX produces the ∛ symbol, so it would appear that line could be uncommented. I don't think there is a Unicode symbol for the square root that includes the `2`, just the 'naked' √. So there wouldn't be any point in adding support for `\sqrt[2]`.

I have no idea why that would have been commented out to begin with, and use cube roots so rarely that it doesn't make much practical difference to me if it is included or not.

Best,

Tyler


> >
> > diff --git a/lisp/leim/quail/latin-ltx.el b/lisp/leim/quail/latin-ltx.el
> > index 93b1250a35..aed34d1265 100644
> > --- a/lisp/leim/quail/latin-ltx.el
> > +++ b/lisp/leim/quail/latin-ltx.el
> > @@ -703,6 +703,7 @@
> >   ("\\ldq" ?\“)
> >   ("\\rdq" ?\”)
> >   ("\\defs" ?≙)				; per fuzz/zed
> > + ("\\sqrt" ?√)
> >   ;; ("\\sqrt[3]" ?∛)
> >   ("\\llbracket" ?\〚) 			; stmaryrd
> >   ("\\rrbracket" ?\〛)
>

Message #19 received at 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: James Cloos <cloos <at> jhcloos.com>
To: "Tyler Smith" <tyler <at> plantarum.ca>
Cc: 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>,
 Stefan Kangas <stefan <at> marxist.se>
Subject: Re: bug#25594: 25.1.91; TeX input method is missing \sqrt macro
Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2020 18:19:17 -0500

>>>>> "TS" == Tyler Smith <tyler <at> plantarum.ca> writes:

TS> I have no idea why that would have been commented out to begin with, and use cube roots so rarely that it doesn't make much practical difference to me if it is included or not.

It seems likely that ∛ was commented to avoid confusion for those
who want to type √.

-JimC
-- 
James Cloos <cloos <at> jhcloos.com>         OpenPGP: 0x997A9F17ED7DAEA6

Message #22 received at 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Stefan Kangas <stefan <at> marxist.se>
To: "Tyler Smith" <tyler <at> plantarum.ca>
Cc: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>, 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#25594: 25.1.91; TeX input method is missing \sqrt macro
Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2020 00:58:12 +0100

"Tyler Smith" <tyler <at> plantarum.ca> writes:

> FWIW, `\sqrt[3]` in LaTeX produces the ∛ symbol, so it would appear that line
> could be uncommented. I don't think there is a Unicode symbol for the square
> root that includes the `2`, just the 'naked' √. So there wouldn't be any point
> in adding support for `\sqrt[2]`.
>
> I have no idea why that would have been commented out to begin with,
> and use cube roots so rarely that it doesn't make much practical
> difference to me if it is included or not.

BTW, I now see that √ is already available under the name \surd, but
this seems to have caused at least some user confusion.[1]  It's not
really something I would think to try, either.

I don't see any problem with uncommenting \sqrt[3] as well.

Best regards,
Stefan Kangas

Footnotes:
[1]  https://emacs.stackexchange.com/questions/30324/how-to-make-all-special-symbols-available-in-org-latex

Message #25 received at 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
To: Stefan Kangas <stefan <at> marxist.se>
Cc: 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Tyler Smith <tyler <at> plantarum.ca>
Subject: Re: bug#25594: 25.1.91; TeX input method is missing \sqrt macro
Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2020 14:51:47 +0100

Stefan Kangas <stefan <at> marxist.se> writes:

> I don't see any problem with uncommenting \sqrt[3] as well.

I don't think we can have both \sqrt and \sqrt[3] in this input method?
Granted, I don't know much about input methods, but I thought this meant
that if you typed \sqrt then you'd get √ immediately.  That's why I
wondered whether the method should be \sqrt[2] to get √, so that you
could get both √ and ∛.

If I've misunderstood and you can continue to write [3] after getting √
to get ∛, then I have no objection to adding \sqrt.  :-)

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

Message #28 received at 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Stefan Kangas <stefan <at> marxist.se>
To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
Cc: 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Tyler Smith <tyler <at> plantarum.ca>
Subject: Re: bug#25594: 25.1.91; TeX input method is missing \sqrt macro
Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2020 15:07:06 +0100

Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org> writes:

> I don't think we can have both \sqrt and \sqrt[3] in this input method?
> Granted, I don't know much about input methods, but I thought this meant
> that if you typed \sqrt then you'd get √ immediately.  That's why I
> wondered whether the method should be \sqrt[2] to get √, so that you
> could get both √ and ∛.

I was concerned about that too at first, but when testing learned that
you can have both.  It will show you √ after typing "\sqrt", but it
still shows that the completion can continue in the minibuffer.  You
can then just enter "[3]" to replace the √ with ∛.

To be honest, the only surprise here was how smooth and intuitive it
all was.  You should give it a try.  :-)

Best regards,
Stefan Kangas

Message #31 received at 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
To: Stefan Kangas <stefan <at> marxist.se>
Cc: 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Tyler Smith <tyler <at> plantarum.ca>
Subject: Re: bug#25594: 25.1.91; TeX input method is missing \sqrt macro
Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2020 15:16:43 +0100

Stefan Kangas <stefan <at> marxist.se> writes:

> I was concerned about that too at first, but when testing learned that
> you can have both.  It will show you √ after typing "\sqrt", but it
> still shows that the completion can continue in the minibuffer.  You
> can then just enter "[3]" to replace the √ with ∛.

Oh, cool!

> To be honest, the only surprise here was how smooth and intuitive it
> all was.  You should give it a try.  :-)

:-)

I'll apply the patch, then.  (And un-comment the [3].)

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

Message #38 received at 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Mattias Engdegård <mattiase <at> acm.org>
To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>, Stefan Kangas <stefan <at> marxist.se>,
 Tyler Smith <tyler <at> plantarum.ca>
Cc: 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: bug#25594: 25.1.91; TeX input method is missing \sqrt macro
Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2020 16:43:25 +0100

Might as well add \sqrt[4] as ∜ for completeness. That's how far Unicode goes.

Message #41 received at 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
To: Mattias Engdegård <mattiase <at> acm.org>
Cc: 25594 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Stefan Kangas <stefan <at> marxist.se>,
 Tyler Smith <tyler <at> plantarum.ca>
Subject: Re: bug#25594: 25.1.91; TeX input method is missing \sqrt macro
Date: Wed, 22 Jan 2020 16:47:35 +0100

Mattias Engdegård <mattiase <at> acm.org> writes:

> Might as well add \sqrt[4] as ∜ for completeness. That's how far Unicode goes.

Makes sense.  I've now done so on the trunk.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

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