GNU bug report logs - #28048
26.0.50; behaviour of C-h f semantic-mode

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Message #5 received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Mark Oteiza <mvoteiza <at> udel.edu>
To: bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org
Subject: 26.0.50; behaviour of C-h f semantic-mode
Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 10:42:43 -0400

Hi,

From -Q:

1. C-f sem TAB

For information about GNU Emacs and the GNU system, type C-h C-a.
*Warning* default value of <<no-type>> tokens changed to QUERY, was NULL_TOKEN
*Warning* default value of <<no-type>> tokens changed to TRUE, was QUERY
*Warning* default value of <<no-type>> tokens changed to FALSE, was TRUE
Shell native completion is disabled, using fallback
Quit

The penultimate message was from a python process being started.

In GNU Emacs 26.0.50 (build 1, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, X toolkit, Xaw scroll bars)
 of 2017-08-10 built on logos
Repository revision: 81656add8117e8d1b7faab18b330d0706462b433

Message #8 received at 28048 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Glenn Morris <rgm <at> gnu.org>
To: Mark Oteiza <mvoteiza <at> udel.edu>
Cc: 28048 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#28048: 26.0.50; behaviour of C-h f semantic-mode
Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 11:51:02 -0400

Mark Oteiza wrote:

> 1. C-f sem TAB
>
> For information about GNU Emacs and the GNU system, type C-h C-a.
> *Warning* default value of <<no-type>> tokens changed to QUERY, was NULL_TOKEN
> *Warning* default value of <<no-type>> tokens changed to TRUE, was QUERY
> *Warning* default value of <<no-type>> tokens changed to FALSE, was TRUE

These 3 warnings are https://debbugs.gnu.org/14524

> Shell native completion is disabled, using fallback
> Quit

Anyway, what exactly is the complaint?
C-h f now uses the definition-prefixes feature to try and load libraries
where needed, and loading libraries may do anything.

Message #11 received at 28048 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Mark Oteiza <mvoteiza <at> udel.edu>
To: Glenn Morris <rgm <at> gnu.org>
Cc: 28048 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#28048: 26.0.50; behaviour of C-h f semantic-mode
Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 12:22:00 -0400

Glenn Morris <rgm <at> gnu.org> writes:

> Mark Oteiza wrote:
>
>> 1. C-f sem TAB
>>
>> For information about GNU Emacs and the GNU system, type C-h C-a.
>> *Warning* default value of <<no-type>> tokens changed to QUERY, was NULL_TOKEN
>> *Warning* default value of <<no-type>> tokens changed to TRUE, was QUERY
>> *Warning* default value of <<no-type>> tokens changed to FALSE, was TRUE
>
> These 3 warnings are https://debbugs.gnu.org/14524
>
>> Shell native completion is disabled, using fallback
>> Quit
>
> Anyway, what exactly is the complaint?
> C-h f now uses the definition-prefixes feature to try and load libraries
> where needed, and loading libraries may do anything.

I suppose the complaint is that "loading" semantic (or whatever happens
to get loaded when trying to get help on the semantic-mode function) is
invoking a python process.  Either some library starts the process when
loaded, or… well I don't know what's going on.

Is there a bug associated with the new C-h f behaviour?  Loading
libraries unexpectedly sounds bad.

Tangentially, the python warning is <https://debbugs.gnu.org/22897>, and
either something got broken again or this never actually got fixed.

Message #14 received at 28048 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: npostavs <at> users.sourceforge.net
To: Mark Oteiza <mvoteiza <at> udel.edu>
Cc: Glenn Morris <rgm <at> gnu.org>, 28048 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#28048: 26.0.50; behaviour of C-h f semantic-mode
Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2017 21:47:17 -0400

Mark Oteiza <mvoteiza <at> udel.edu> writes:

> I suppose the complaint is that "loading" semantic (or whatever happens
> to get loaded when trying to get help on the semantic-mode function) is
> invoking a python process.  Either some library starts the process when
> loaded, or… well I don't know what's going on.

I can confirm the "*Warning* default value of <<no-type>> tokens
changed..." messages.

I do not get the "Shell native completion is disabled, using fallback"
message, and furthermore, evaluating (featurep 'python) afterwards gives
nil.

> Is there a bug associated with the new C-h f behaviour?

No, it was introduced on emacs-devel, see [1] and followups.

[1]: http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2016-05/msg00441.html

> Tangentially, the python warning is <https://debbugs.gnu.org/22897>, and
> either something got broken again or this never actually got fixed.

When I do M-x run-python native completion is enabled with no problem.
Perhaps you should open a new bug with details about your python setup.

Message #17 received at 28048 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Glenn Morris <rgm <at> gnu.org>
To: Mark Oteiza <mvoteiza <at> udel.edu>
Cc: 28048 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#28048: 26.0.50; behaviour of C-h f semantic-mode
Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2017 13:42:06 -0400

Mark Oteiza wrote:

> I suppose the complaint is that "loading" semantic (or whatever happens
> to get loaded when trying to get help on the semantic-mode function) is
> invoking a python process.

emacs -Q -l lisp/cedet/semantic/wisent/python.el

starts a python process due to semantic-python-get-system-include-path
and its use of python-shell-internal-send-string. Doesn't seem like a
bug to me?

> Is there a bug associated with the new C-h f behaviour? 

I don't know, is there? ;)

>  Loading libraries unexpectedly sounds bad.

I think you'll have to give more details, because obviously someone
(Stefan) thought this was a desirable feature.

(The C-h f aspect does seem under-explained in NEWS, but that's par for
the course. And IIUC it cannot be disabled, unlike the older feature
controlled by help-enable-auto-load.)

Message #20 received at 28048 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Glenn Morris <rgm <at> gnu.org>
To: Mark Oteiza <mvoteiza <at> udel.edu>
Cc: 28048 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#28048: 26.0.50; behaviour of C-h f semantic-mode
Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2017 13:46:27 -0400

Glenn Morris wrote:

>> Is there a bug associated with the new C-h f behaviour? 
>
> I don't know, is there? ;)

Oh, sorry: I thought you were being philosophical, but I guess you meant
is there an existing report. :)

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