GNU bug report logs - #38519
minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode with enable-recursive-minibuffers

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Package: emacs;

Reported by: Juri Linkov <juri <at> linkov.net>

Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2019 02:55:01 UTC

Severity: normal

Done: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>

Bug is archived. No further changes may be made.

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Report forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org:
bug#38519; Package emacs. (Sun, 08 Dec 2019 02:55:01 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Acknowledgement sent to Juri Linkov <juri <at> linkov.net>:
New bug report received and forwarded. Copy sent to bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org. (Sun, 08 Dec 2019 02:55:02 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #5 received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Juri Linkov <juri <at> linkov.net>
To: bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org
Subject: minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode with enable-recursive-minibuffers
Date: Sun, 08 Dec 2019 01:27:29 +0200
A recent discussion about enable-recursive-minibuffers reminded
that minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode should be enabled when
enable-recursive-minibuffers is non-nil.  It's unusable
without the depth indication that is more error-prone.

It simultaneously enabling minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode
after enable-recursive-minibuffers becomes non-nil is not easy
to implement, then at least these two should mention each other
in the manual.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org:
bug#38519; Package emacs. (Sun, 08 Dec 2019 17:01:02 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #8 received at 38519 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Drew Adams <drew.adams <at> oracle.com>
To: Juri Linkov <juri <at> linkov.net>, 38519 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: RE: bug#38519: minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode with
 enable-recursive-minibuffers
Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2019 09:00:32 -0800 (PST)
> A recent discussion about enable-recursive-minibuffers reminded
> that minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode should be enabled when
> enable-recursive-minibuffers is non-nil.  It's unusable
> without the depth indication that is more error-prone.
> 
> It simultaneously enabling minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode
> after enable-recursive-minibuffers becomes non-nil is not easy
> to implement, then at least these two should mention each other
> in the manual.

It's a good question.

1. I agree that the docs should mention each other.
And the doc strings already do that:

`C-h v enable-recursive-minibuffers' says:
  Also see `minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode',
  which may be handy if this variable is non-nil.

`C-h f minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode' says:
  This is only useful if
  `enable-recursive-minibuffers' is non-nil.

But this hasn't yet been done in the manuals:
(elisp) `Recursive Mini' and (emacs) `Minibuffer
Edit' cover `enable-recursive-minibuffers', but
`minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode' is mentioned
nowhere, so far.

2. I agree that `minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode'
is useful when `enable-recursive-minibuffers'
is non-nil (generally and only).

3. I think I disagree that there should be
some kind of hard coupling between the two,
which would prevent users from getting
`enable-recursive-minibuffers' without
`minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode'.

It would be OK to automatically turn OFF
`minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode' when
`enable-recursive-minibuffers' is nil.  But
that's not necessary (it has no effect), so
it's not useful.

I don't think we should turn `m-d-i-m' ON
systematically when `e-r-m' is non-nil.  
That might be OK as a default behavior, but
we shouldn't impose it in a hard-coded way,
so that users have no recourse.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org:
bug#38519; Package emacs. (Sun, 08 Dec 2019 22:57:02 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #11 received at 38519 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Juri Linkov <juri <at> linkov.net>
To: Drew Adams <drew.adams <at> oracle.com>
Cc: 38519 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#38519: minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode with
 enable-recursive-minibuffers
Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2019 00:48:33 +0200
> 1. I agree that the docs should mention each other.
> And the doc strings already do that:
>
> `C-h v enable-recursive-minibuffers' says:
>   Also see `minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode',
>   which may be handy if this variable is non-nil.
>
> `C-h f minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode' says:
>   This is only useful if
>   `enable-recursive-minibuffers' is non-nil.
>
> But this hasn't yet been done in the manuals:
> (elisp) `Recursive Mini' and (emacs) `Minibuffer
> Edit' cover `enable-recursive-minibuffers', but
> `minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode' is mentioned
> nowhere, so far.

So I added mention of `minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode' to
(emacs) `Minibuffer Edit'.  Not sure about
(elisp) `Recursive Mini', probably not needed in (elisp).

> 2. I agree that `minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode'
> is useful when `enable-recursive-minibuffers'
> is non-nil (generally and only).
>
> 3. I think I disagree that there should be
> some kind of hard coupling between the two,
> which would prevent users from getting
> `enable-recursive-minibuffers' without
> `minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode'.
>
> It would be OK to automatically turn OFF
> `minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode' when
> `enable-recursive-minibuffers' is nil.  But
> that's not necessary (it has no effect), so
> it's not useful.

Actually turning `m-d-i-m' OFF when `e-r-m' is nil
is not needed because `m-d-i-m' has no visual effect
when `e-r-m' is nil - there is nothing to show
as an indication of the recursive minibuffer
when recursive minibuffers are not enabled.

> I don't think we should turn `m-d-i-m' ON
> systematically when `e-r-m' is non-nil.
> That might be OK as a default behavior, but
> we shouldn't impose it in a hard-coded way,
> so that users have no recourse.

If turning `m-d-i-m' ON when `e-r-m' is non-nil
will be the default behavior, then users could
easily to turn `m-d-i-m' OFF.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org:
bug#38519; Package emacs. (Mon, 14 Jun 2021 14:35:02 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

Message #14 received at 38519 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
To: Juri Linkov <juri <at> linkov.net>
Cc: Drew Adams <drew.adams <at> oracle.com>, 38519 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#38519: minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode with
 enable-recursive-minibuffers
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 2021 16:34:42 +0200
Juri Linkov <juri <at> linkov.net> writes:

>> But this hasn't yet been done in the manuals:
>> (elisp) `Recursive Mini' and (emacs) `Minibuffer
>> Edit' cover `enable-recursive-minibuffers', but
>> `minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode' is mentioned
>> nowhere, so far.
>
> So I added mention of `minibuffer-depth-indicate-mode' to
> (emacs) `Minibuffer Edit'.  Not sure about
> (elisp) `Recursive Mini', probably not needed in (elisp).

If I understand correctly, this should be a sufficient fix here, so I'm
closing this bug report.  If I misunderstood, please respond to the
debbugs address and we'll reopen.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no




bug closed, send any further explanations to 38519 <at> debbugs.gnu.org and Juri Linkov <juri <at> linkov.net> Request was from Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org> to control <at> debbugs.gnu.org. (Mon, 14 Jun 2021 14:35:02 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

bug archived. Request was from Debbugs Internal Request <help-debbugs <at> gnu.org> to internal_control <at> debbugs.gnu.org. (Tue, 13 Jul 2021 11:24:05 GMT) Full text and rfc822 format available.

This bug report was last modified 2 years and 258 days ago.

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