GNU bug report logs - #44578
incompability between preview and hyperref in latex 2020-10-01

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Package: auctex; Reported by: Ulrike Fischer <news3@HIDDEN>; dated Wed, 11 Nov 2020 15:31:03 UTC; Maintainer for auctex is bug-auctex@HIDDEN.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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From: Florent Rougon <f.rougon@HIDDEN>
To: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#45894: Future of EPS (was Re: bug#45894: Bug report for
 preview-latex)
References: <c80e4676-570f-42e8-b99d-cef70221e68b@HIDDEN>
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Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2021 10:50:16 +0200
In-Reply-To: <84459.1630657188@localhost> (Ikumi Keita's message of "Fri, 03
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Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN> wrote:

> How about exporting figures _without_ texts and _adding_ annotation with
> TikZ, as done in the attached example? In this way, no "text
> replacements" are necessary.

The following answers could help with this approach:

  https://tex.stackexchange.com/a/9562/73317
  https://tex.stackexchange.com/a/610027/73317

Regards

-- 
Florent




Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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From: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>
To: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: Future of EPS (was Re: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex)
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--=-=-=
Content-Type: text/plain

>>>>> "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:
> Are you aware of any approach to do these LaTeX text replacements in PDF
> graphics already today?

How about exporting figures _without_ texts and _adding_ annotation with
TikZ, as done in the attached example? In this way, no "text
replacements" are necessary.

Or is it too painful to adjust the position of the texts at LaTeX level,
not at the time of creation of figure?

Regards,
Ikumi Keita


--=-=-=
Content-Type: text/x-tex
Content-Disposition: inline; filename=graphic-annot.tex
Content-Description: sample source

\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{tikz}

\begin{document}
\begin{tikzpicture}
  \node (figure) at (0,0) {\includegraphics[width=10cm]{tiger.pdf}};
  \node at (figure.east) {foo};
  \node at (figure.north west) {\(x^{2}+y^{2}=z^{2}\)};
  \path (figure) ++(-2,-1) node[fill=white] {\Large\(E=mc^{2}\)};
\end{tikzpicture}
\end{document}

%%% Local Variables:
%%% mode: latex
%%% TeX-master: t
%%% End:

--=-=-=
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--=-=-=--




Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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From: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>
To: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: AW: Future of EPS (was Re: bug#45894: Bug report for
 preview-latex)
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>>>>> "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:
> (Well, to be honest, as I am in the middle of preparing a larger document
> and as dozens of graphics are already prepared for pstool replacements, I
> would be in favor of finalizing this single project using the pstool
> approach...)

Old TeX distribution taken from https://www.tug.org/historic/ would
serve for such one-shot purpose, wouldn't it?

Or perhaps eps2pgf[1] might be of help for you. It says:
,----
| The most interesting part of eps2pgf is that it allows you to replace
| text in the EPS figure with arbitrary LaTeX markup. It is in fact an
| alternative to using tools like PSfrag, and it is even compatible with
| PSfrag. See the documentation for more details.
`----

It seems that eps2pgf is a rather old Java application and its
development was abondoned long before. A Japanese user made a Docker
container[2] for easy use of it, but I'm not sure it's really usable.

Regards,
Ikumi Keita

[1]https://texample.net/tikz/examples/eps2pgf/
[2]https://qiita.com/doraTeX/items/7705a6823d165d48979e




Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
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From: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
To: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>
Subject: AW: Future of EPS (was Re: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex)
Thread-Topic: Future of EPS (was Re: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex)
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Dear Ikumi,

first, I would like to thank you for taking the time to reflect the
situation and to give me some insight.

I would be perfectly fine with a purely PDF-based toolchain, and as I =
use
Inkscape as a graphics editor, that would be no problem. My only =
requirement
is the ability to replace text in graphics by LaTeX expressions, which =
is
why I use pstool.

(Well, to be honest, as I am in the middle of preparing a larger =
document
and as dozens of graphics are already prepared for pstool replacements, =
I
would be in favor of finalizing this single project using the pstool
approach...)

Are you aware of any approach to do these LaTeX text replacements in PDF
graphics already today?

I will try the TikZ format in between.

Thanks,
Tobias

-----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht-----
Von: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>=20
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 2. September 2021 09:01
An: Bruckmann, Tobias <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
Cc: 45894 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Betreff: Future of EPS (was Re: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex)

Dear Tobias,

>>>>> "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:
> 6 months ago we had the conversation below, and as Mr. Kastrup decided =

> not to care for the issue without getting paid, I wanted to ask=20
> whether this bug is still on the list of the auctex team.

This bug is registered in Bug Tracker of AUCTeX:
https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/pkgreport.cgi?which=3Dpkg&data=3Dauctex

So perhaps someone might pick it up and try to resolve it in future;
However, I think that hope is very weak. In my view, the (La)TeX =
ecosystem
is moving rapidly towards PDF centric realm with respect to the graphic
format and EPS is already considered (implicitly) as semi-obsolete. In a
decade, EPS would be totally obsolete as (La)TeX graphic format.

You wrote
> - Most scientific works use vector EPS graphics.
before. If your tool supports only EPS as the format for outputs, my
recommendation is to ask the developer to update it to support other =
format.
If I remember correctly, many scientific tools which consider
interoperability with LaTeX recently supports TikZ code as export =
format. Is
it difficult to do so for your tool?

> The combination of pstool and pdfLaTeX seems to be the most promising=20
> approach to me to join these points in one toolchain.

For the reason described above, I don't think it's promising, at least =
for
usage with (La)TeX.

> So there's no pathway and this toolchain is dead forever?

The answer depends whether the developer of your tool adheres to EPS or =
not,
I think.

Regards,
Ikumi Keita

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Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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From: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>
To: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
Subject: Future of EPS (was Re: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex)
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Comments: In-reply-to "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
 message dated "Wed, 01 Sep 2021 18:43:50 +0000."
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Dear Tobias,

>>>>> "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:
> 6 months ago we had the conversation below, and as Mr. Kastrup decided
> not to care for the issue without getting paid, I wanted to ask
> whether this bug is still on the list of the auctex team.

This bug is registered in Bug Tracker of AUCTeX:
https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/pkgreport.cgi?which=pkg&data=auctex

So perhaps someone might pick it up and try to resolve it in future;
However, I think that hope is very weak. In my view, the (La)TeX
ecosystem is moving rapidly towards PDF centric realm with respect to
the graphic format and EPS is already considered (implicitly) as
semi-obsolete. In a decade, EPS would be totally obsolete as (La)TeX
graphic format.

You wrote
> - Most scientific works use vector EPS graphics.
before. If your tool supports only EPS as the format for outputs, my
recommendation is to ask the developer to update it to support other
format. If I remember correctly, many scientific tools which consider
interoperability with LaTeX recently supports TikZ code as export
format. Is it difficult to do so for your tool?

> The combination of pstool and pdfLaTeX seems to be the most promising
> approach to me to join these points in one toolchain.

For the reason described above, I don't think it's promising, at least
for usage with (La)TeX.

> So there's no pathway and this toolchain is dead forever?

The answer depends whether the developer of your tool adheres to EPS or
not, I think.

Regards,
Ikumi Keita




Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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From: David Kastrup <dak@HIDDEN>
To: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#44578: AW: AW: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
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"Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:

> Dear Ikumi,
>
> 6 months ago we had the conversation below, and as Mr. Kastrup decided not
> to care for the issue without getting paid, I wanted to ask whether this bug
> is still on the list of the auctex team.

Mr Kastrup was not motivated by the entitlement attitude that demanded
he be happy to invest work, time and energy that was more than the
complainant was willing to invest.

And I cannot really say that the continued abuse and entitlement is
doing a particularly swell job of raising motivation.

-- 
David Kastrup




Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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From: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
To: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>
Subject: AW: AW: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
Thread-Topic: AW: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
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Dear Ikumi,

6 months ago we had the conversation below, and as Mr. Kastrup decided =
not
to care for the issue without getting paid, I wanted to ask whether this =
bug
is still on the list of the auctex team.

I had some conversation here
https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/587774/proper-toolchain-for-pdfla=
tex
-and-psfrag-including-hyperref where also Ulrike Fischer commented. She =
also
created a separate burg report here
https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=3D44578

It seems the only proper solution is a fix in the preview package.

Thanks for a short comment,
Tobias

-----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht-----
Von: Bruckmann, Tobias=20
Gesendet: Montag, 1. M=E4rz 2021 10:14
An: 'David Kastrup' <dak@HIDDEN>
Cc: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>; 45894 <at> debbugs.gnu.org;
44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Betreff: AW: AW: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex

> -----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: David Kastrup <dak@HIDDEN>
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 25. Februar 2021 14:10
> An: Bruckmann, Tobias <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
> Cc: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>; 45894 <at> debbugs.gnu.org;
> 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Betreff: Re: AW: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
>=20
> "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:
>=20
> > Dear David,
> >
> > this is a good question. I didn't want to push
>=20
> Not?
>=20
No. I just asked whether there is a chance that this gets a fix. You
mentioned that you are not seeing a chance to fix it due to conflicts
between Hyperref and LaTeX internals, and I wanted to know if this means =
the
toolchain I described is dead, despite its relevance for scientific =
authors.
If you confirm this, I will have to change my toolchain. Or look for =
other
people who stumble across the same issue and who are maybe able to fix =
it.=20

> > but just point out the relevance of the issue, believing that you =
feel
> > a personal appreciation (and/or certain responsibility) for a code =
you
> > officially maintain.
> >
> > If I had the expertise to fix the code on my own, I would not have
> > spent the time to find and bother you, but better invest it to =
produce
> > the solution and propose it to you.
> >
> > If you ask for money - that could be a problem. I have no idea on =
the
> > time needed to find the problem, to fix and to test it. Hiring a
> > professional is probably beyond my budget as I am just an academics.
> > As such, I am volunteering as well in multiple matters, trying to
> > improve things - so I think when it comes to projects driven by
> > enthusiastism, I share your engagement, but I don't think that a
> > spirit of needing individual payments will lead to a better future =
for
> > open source projects.
>=20
> I thought so.  I've invested decades of my time in Free Software, =
living
below
> minimum wage, with the obvious consequences for my personal future.  =
All
> that buys you is people thinking they are entitled to it and argue you
should do
> more for them.
>=20
> There are times when this motivational framework does not work all =
that
well
> for me.

I understand. But look, Free Software in its core concept was always =
driven
by enthusiasts who enjoy spending their leisure time in creating =
software
together. I agree, this implies that no one can push you. Now you join
the project and try to enforce a business model. I know how it feels if =
a
business plan fails, but you cannot blame the Free Software model, =
driven by
people doing things for themselves and others because of ... fun.

Note, I did not ask a company to implement an extra software feature for =
me,
but I asked the voluntary maintainers to give a comment on chances for a =
bug
fix.=20

Don't get me wrong, but on my side it feels like you turned the Free
Software maintainer position into a sales platform for your service.
Establishing a functionality in Free Software, letting people rely on it =
and
then(!) ask for money for bugfixes does not feel fair for me: If you =
intend
to make money
with software (which is absolutely reasonable), then create a product, =
put a
price tag on it and advertise. Then customers might buy it for a price =
they
know in advance, and the sum of their payments will pay your bills. This =
is
what commercial programmers do.

If you decide to create and advertise commercial LaTeX packages,
I totally might be amongst your customers if they simplify my work.=20

LaTeX
would probably take advantage from such entrepreneur initiatives, just =
like
Linux. But - please - don=92t change the rules during the game...

Tobias

>=20
> --
> David Kastrup

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Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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From: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
To: David Kastrup <dak@HIDDEN>
Subject: AW: AW: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
Thread-Topic: AW: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
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> -----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: David Kastrup <dak@HIDDEN>
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 25. Februar 2021 14:10
> An: Bruckmann, Tobias <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
> Cc: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>; 45894 <at> debbugs.gnu.org;
> 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Betreff: Re: AW: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
>=20
> "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:
>=20
> > Dear David,
> >
> > this is a good question. I didn't want to push
>=20
> Not?
>=20
No. I just asked whether there is a chance that this gets a fix. You
mentioned that you are not seeing a chance to fix it due to conflicts
between Hyperref and LaTeX internals, and I wanted to know if this means =
the
toolchain I described is dead, despite its relevance for scientific =
authors.
If you confirm this, I will have to change my toolchain. Or look for =
other
people who stumble across the same issue and who are maybe able to fix =
it.=20

> > but just point out the relevance of the issue, believing that you =
feel
> > a personal appreciation (and/or certain responsibility) for a code =
you
> > officially maintain.
> >
> > If I had the expertise to fix the code on my own, I would not have
> > spent the time to find and bother you, but better invest it to =
produce
> > the solution and propose it to you.
> >
> > If you ask for money - that could be a problem. I have no idea on =
the
> > time needed to find the problem, to fix and to test it. Hiring a
> > professional is probably beyond my budget as I am just an academics.
> > As such, I am volunteering as well in multiple matters, trying to
> > improve things - so I think when it comes to projects driven by
> > enthusiastism, I share your engagement, but I don't think that a
> > spirit of needing individual payments will lead to a better future =
for
> > open source projects.
>=20
> I thought so.  I've invested decades of my time in Free Software, =
living
below
> minimum wage, with the obvious consequences for my personal future.  =
All
> that buys you is people thinking they are entitled to it and argue you
should do
> more for them.
>=20
> There are times when this motivational framework does not work all =
that
well
> for me.

I understand. But look, Free Software in its core concept was always =
driven
by enthusiasts who enjoy spending their leisure time in creating =
software
together. I agree, this implies that no one can push you. Now you join
the project and try to enforce a business model. I know how it feels if =
a
business plan fails, but you cannot blame the Free Software model, =
driven by
people doing things for themselves and others because of ... fun.

Note, I did not ask a company to implement an extra software feature for =
me,
but I asked the voluntary maintainers to give a comment on chances for a =
bug
fix.=20

Don't get me wrong, but on my side it feels like you turned the Free
Software maintainer position into a sales platform for your service.
Establishing a functionality in Free Software, letting people rely on it =
and
then(!) ask for money for bugfixes does not feel fair for me: If you =
intend
to make money
with software (which is absolutely reasonable), then create a product, =
put a
price tag on it and advertise. Then customers might buy it for a price =
they
know in advance, and the sum of their payments will pay your bills. This =
is
what commercial programmers do.

If you decide to create and advertise commercial LaTeX packages,
I totally might be amongst your customers if they simplify my work.=20

LaTeX
would probably take advantage from such entrepreneur initiatives, just =
like
Linux. But - please - don=92t change the rules during the game...

Tobias

>=20
> --
> David Kastrup

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------=_NextPart_000_0053_01D70E83.8A2CDEA0--




Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 44578) by debbugs.gnu.org; 25 Feb 2021 13:10:32 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Thu Feb 25 08:10:32 2021
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From: David Kastrup <dak@HIDDEN>
To: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: AW: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
References: <c80e4676-570f-42e8-b99d-cef70221e68b@HIDDEN>
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2021 14:10:17 +0100
In-Reply-To: <c80e4676-570f-42e8-b99d-cef70221e68b@HIDDEN> (Tobias
 Bruckmann's message of "Thu, 25 Feb 2021 06:44:24 +0000")
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"Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:

> Dear David,
>
> this is a good question. I didn't want to push

Not?

> but just point out the relevance of the issue, believing that you feel
> a personal appreciation (and/or certain responsibility) for a code you
> officially maintain.
>
> If I had the expertise to fix the code on my own, I would not have
> spent the time to find and bother you, but better invest it to produce
> the solution and propose it to you.
>
> If you ask for money - that could be a problem. I have no idea on the
> time needed to find the problem, to fix and to test it. Hiring a
> professional is probably beyond my budget as I am just an
> academics. As such, I am volunteering as well in multiple matters,
> trying to improve things - so I think when it comes to projects driven
> by enthusiastism, I share your engagement, but I don't think that a
> spirit of needing individual payments will lead to a better future for
> open source projects.

I thought so.  I've invested decades of my time in Free Software, living
below minimum wage, with the obvious consequences for my personal
future.  All that buys you is people thinking they are entitled to it
and argue you should do more for them.

There are times when this motivational framework does not work all that
well for me.

-- 
David Kastrup




Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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From: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
To: David Kastrup <dak@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: AW: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
Thread-Topic: AW: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
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Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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From: David Kastrup <dak@HIDDEN>
To: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: AW: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
References: <e59f32f7db864189a56f3b8656bb83f9@HIDDEN>
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Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2021 00:57:50 +0100
In-Reply-To: <6bdc0c3cfa434368b3feff3ae703f080@HIDDEN> (Tobias Bruckmann's
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"Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:

> Hi Ikumi, David
>
> this is a bad situation. I am quite surprised I am the first (and only?) one
> to stumble across this:
> - Most scientific works use vector EPS graphics. psfrag is extremely popular
> in this field.
> - Most works are published in PDF
> - You can't get around hyperref
>
> The combination of pstool and pdfLaTeX seems to be the most promising
> approach to me to join these points in one toolchain. Living with an old
> version might work for some months, but this can't be the future.
>
> So there's no pathway and this toolchain is dead forever?
>
> Thanks for your appreciated comment,

So what are you willing to invest to avert the catastrophe?  In terms of
procuring code or paying for the time of those who do?

-- 
David Kastrup




Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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From: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
To: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>
Subject: AW: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
Thread-Topic: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
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Hi Ikumi, David

this is a bad situation. I am quite surprised I am the first (and only?) =
one
to stumble across this:
- Most scientific works use vector EPS graphics. psfrag is extremely =
popular
in this field.
- Most works are published in PDF
- You can't get around hyperref

The combination of pstool and pdfLaTeX seems to be the most promising
approach to me to join these points in one toolchain. Living with an old
version might work for some months, but this can't be the future.

So there's no pathway and this toolchain is dead forever?

Thanks for your appreciated comment,
Tobias

-----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht-----
Von: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>=20
Gesendet: Sonntag, 14. Februar 2021 20:32
An: Bruckmann, Tobias <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
Cc: dak@HIDDEN; 45894 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Betreff: Re: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex

Hi Tobias,

>>>>> "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:
> I am not sure whether the status of my bug report:
> Is there any chance this will be resolved, or is it only of minor
relevance?

I'm sorry to say this, but I can't help. It requires mature knowledge =
about
TeX programming and Postscript language to deal with this issue. I have
neither one.

As I told before, I'd just recomend to keep an old TeX distribution
separately to typeset your documents. That's only workaround I can think =
of.

Best regards,
Ikumi Keita

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From: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>
To: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
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Hi Tobias,

>>>>> "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:
> I am not sure whether the status of my bug report:
> Is there any chance this will be resolved, or is it only of minor relevance?

I'm sorry to say this, but I can't help. It requires mature knowledge
about TeX programming and Postscript language to deal with this issue. I
have neither one.

As I told before, I'd just recomend to keep an old TeX distribution
separately to typeset your documents. That's only workaround I can think
of.

Best regards,
Ikumi Keita




Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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From: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
To: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>, "dak@HIDDEN" <dak@HIDDEN>
Subject: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
Thread-Topic: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
Thread-Index: AdbrXmdpVMEHj6CLRlylXEoogaxaSABLu6CAABBdaiAFh3XWwA==
Date: Sun, 14 Feb 2021 16:17:12 +0000
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Dear all,

I am not sure whether the status of my bug report:
Is there any chance this will be resolved, or is it only of minor =
relevance?

I would be grateful for any quick comment...

Thanks and best wishes,
Tobias

-----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht-----
Von: Bruckmann, Tobias=20
Gesendet: Sonntag, 17. Januar 2021 13:47
An: 'Ikumi Keita' <ikumi@HIDDEN>; dak@HIDDEN
Cc: 45894 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Betreff: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex

Thanks!=20
Please let me know in case I can support the clarification of the bug.

-----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht-----
Von: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>=20
Gesendet: Sonntag, 17. Januar 2021 06:58
An: dak@HIDDEN
Cc: Bruckmann, Tobias <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>; =
45894 <at> debbugs.gnu.org;
44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Betreff: Re: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex

Hi David,

Could you please take care of bug#44578[1], reported by Ulrike Fischer?
It seems that that bug is responsible for bug#45894, skimming over the
correspondence between Tobias and Ulrike[2].

In addition, the following simple document fails at preview-latex when
TeX-PDF-mode is nil and preview-image-type is `png', although I'm not =
sure
whether this is related or not. (The two math fragments "\(a\)" and =
"\(b\)"
both don't render as images but instead "Do not enter" signs appear =
beside
them.)

In summary, it seems that latex+dvips+gs has low compatibility with
preview.sty by recent changes in LaTeX core.

Best regards,
Ikumi Keita

----------------------------------------------------------------------
\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{tikz}

\begin{document}

\begin{itemize}
\item \(a\)
\item \(b\)
\end{itemize}

% pdflatex+pdf2dsc+gs OK
% latex+dvipng        OK
% latex+dvips+gs      NG

\end{document}

%%% Local Variables:
%%% mode: latex
%%% TeX-master: t
%%% End:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

[1] https://debbugs.gnu.org/44578
[2]
https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/570404/pdflatex-fails-on-pstool-w=
hen
-hyperref-is-included

>>>>> "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:
> Dear Sir or Madam,
> I reported a bug on github, and the maintainers advised me to inform=20
> the authors of preview-latex:

>  <https://github.com/latex3/hyperref/issues/166> pdfLaTeX fails on=20
> pstool when hyperref is included =B7 Issue #166 =B7 latex3/hyperref=20
> (github.com). The original bug report, a minimum example and all=20
> needed files are posted there.

> I would be absolutely willing to support the clarification of the =
issue.
> Please inform me how to formally submit the bug report.

> Thanks and best wishes,

> Tobias Bruckmann

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Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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From: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>
To: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
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Hi Tobias,

>>>>> "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:
> is there anything I can do from user side? I am no programmer, but let me
> know in case I can help.

All I can think of is to keep an old TeX distribution separately from
the latest one.
You can obtain old distributions from https://www.tug.org/historic/ .

Regards,
Ikumi Keita




Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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From: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
To: David Kastrup <dak@HIDDEN>
Subject: AW: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
Thread-Topic: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
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Dear all,

is there anything I can do from user side? I am no programmer, but let =
me
know in case I can help.

Will there be some bug tracking to follow any debugging process?

Thanks and best wishes,
Tobias

-----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht-----
Von: David Kastrup <dak@HIDDEN>=20
Gesendet: Sonntag, 17. Januar 2021 13:59
An: Bruckmann, Tobias <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
Cc: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>; 45894 <at> debbugs.gnu.org;
44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Betreff: Re: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex


Frankly, I have a problem seeing a sensible fix for "Hyperref chose to =
mess
with LaTeX internals in its own exclusive way incompatible with anybody =
else
trying to change behavior, even when done in the exactly same manner, =
but
will likely change doing this to a different way soon".


"Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:

> Thanks!=20
> Please let me know in case I can support the clarification of the bug.
>
> -----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>
> Gesendet: Sonntag, 17. Januar 2021 06:58
> An: dak@HIDDEN
> Cc: Bruckmann, Tobias <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>;=20
> 45894 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Betreff: Re: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
>
> Hi David,
>
> Could you please take care of bug#44578[1], reported by Ulrike =
Fischer?
> It seems that that bug is responsible for bug#45894, skimming over the =

> correspondence between Tobias and Ulrike[2].
>
> In addition, the following simple document fails at preview-latex when =

> TeX-PDF-mode is nil and preview-image-type is `png', although I'm not=20
> sure whether this is related or not. (The two math fragments "\(a\)" =
and
"\(b\)"
> both don't render as images but instead "Do not enter" signs appear=20
> beside
> them.)
>
> In summary, it seems that latex+dvips+gs has low compatibility with=20
> preview.sty by recent changes in LaTeX core.
>
> Best regards,
> Ikumi Keita
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> \documentclass{article}
> \usepackage{tikz}
>
> \begin{document}
>
> \begin{itemize}
> \item \(a\)
> \item \(b\)
> \end{itemize}
>
> % pdflatex+pdf2dsc+gs OK
> % latex+dvipng        OK
> % latex+dvips+gs      NG
>
> \end{document}
>
> %%% Local Variables:
> %%% mode: latex
> %%% TeX-master: t
> %%% End:
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> [1] https://debbugs.gnu.org/44578
> [2]
> https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/570404/pdflatex-fails-on-pstoo
> l-when
> -hyperref-is-included
>
>>>>>> "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:
>> Dear Sir or Madam,
>> I reported a bug on github, and the maintainers advised me to inform=20
>> the authors of preview-latex:
>
>>  <https://github.com/latex3/hyperref/issues/166> pdfLaTeX fails on=20
>> pstool when hyperref is included =B7 Issue #166 =B7 latex3/hyperref=20
>> (github.com). The original bug report, a minimum example and all=20
>> needed files are posted there.
>
>> I would be absolutely willing to support the clarification of the =
issue.
>> Please inform me how to formally submit the bug report.
>
>> Thanks and best wishes,
>
>> Tobias Bruckmann
>

--
David Kastrup

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Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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From: David Kastrup <dak@HIDDEN>
To: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
References: <e59f32f7db864189a56f3b8656bb83f9@HIDDEN>
 <58489.1610863083@localhost>
 <c68c00f423fb4af59b2b9da62777aa38@HIDDEN>
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2021 13:58:35 +0100
In-Reply-To: <c68c00f423fb4af59b2b9da62777aa38@HIDDEN> (Tobias Bruckmann's
 message of "Sun, 17 Jan 2021 12:47:23 +0000")
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Frankly, I have a problem seeing a sensible fix for "Hyperref chose to
mess with LaTeX internals in its own exclusive way incompatible with
anybody else trying to change behavior, even when done in the exactly
same manner, but will likely change doing this to a different way soon".


"Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:

> Thanks!=20
> Please let me know in case I can support the clarification of the bug.
>
> -----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>=20
> Gesendet: Sonntag, 17. Januar 2021 06:58
> An: dak@HIDDEN
> Cc: Bruckmann, Tobias <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>; 45894@HIDDEN=
g;
> 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Betreff: Re: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
>
> Hi David,
>
> Could you please take care of bug#44578[1], reported by Ulrike Fischer?
> It seems that that bug is responsible for bug#45894, skimming over the
> correspondence between Tobias and Ulrike[2].
>
> In addition, the following simple document fails at preview-latex when
> TeX-PDF-mode is nil and preview-image-type is `png', although I'm not sure
> whether this is related or not. (The two math fragments "\(a\)" and "\(b\=
)"
> both don't render as images but instead "Do not enter" signs appear beside
> them.)
>
> In summary, it seems that latex+dvips+gs has low compatibility with
> preview.sty by recent changes in LaTeX core.
>
> Best regards,
> Ikumi Keita
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> \documentclass{article}
> \usepackage{tikz}
>
> \begin{document}
>
> \begin{itemize}
> \item \(a\)
> \item \(b\)
> \end{itemize}
>
> % pdflatex+pdf2dsc+gs OK
> % latex+dvipng        OK
> % latex+dvips+gs      NG
>
> \end{document}
>
> %%% Local Variables:
> %%% mode: latex
> %%% TeX-master: t
> %%% End:
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> [1] https://debbugs.gnu.org/44578
> [2]
> https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/570404/pdflatex-fails-on-pstool-w=
hen
> -hyperref-is-included
>
>>>>>> "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:
>> Dear Sir or Madam,
>> I reported a bug on github, and the maintainers advised me to inform=20
>> the authors of preview-latex:
>
>>  <https://github.com/latex3/hyperref/issues/166> pdfLaTeX fails on=20
>> pstool when hyperref is included =B7 Issue #166 =B7 latex3/hyperref=20
>> (github.com). The original bug report, a minimum example and all=20
>> needed files are posted there.
>
>> I would be absolutely willing to support the clarification of the issue.
>> Please inform me how to formally submit the bug report.
>
>> Thanks and best wishes,
>
>> Tobias Bruckmann
>

--=20
David Kastrup




Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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From: "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
To: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>, "dak@HIDDEN" <dak@HIDDEN>
Subject: AW: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
Thread-Topic: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
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Thanks!=20
Please let me know in case I can support the clarification of the bug.

-----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht-----
Von: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>=20
Gesendet: Sonntag, 17. Januar 2021 06:58
An: dak@HIDDEN
Cc: Bruckmann, Tobias <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>; =
45894 <at> debbugs.gnu.org;
44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Betreff: Re: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex

Hi David,

Could you please take care of bug#44578[1], reported by Ulrike Fischer?
It seems that that bug is responsible for bug#45894, skimming over the
correspondence between Tobias and Ulrike[2].

In addition, the following simple document fails at preview-latex when
TeX-PDF-mode is nil and preview-image-type is `png', although I'm not =
sure
whether this is related or not. (The two math fragments "\(a\)" and =
"\(b\)"
both don't render as images but instead "Do not enter" signs appear =
beside
them.)

In summary, it seems that latex+dvips+gs has low compatibility with
preview.sty by recent changes in LaTeX core.

Best regards,
Ikumi Keita

----------------------------------------------------------------------
\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{tikz}

\begin{document}

\begin{itemize}
\item \(a\)
\item \(b\)
\end{itemize}

% pdflatex+pdf2dsc+gs OK
% latex+dvipng        OK
% latex+dvips+gs      NG

\end{document}

%%% Local Variables:
%%% mode: latex
%%% TeX-master: t
%%% End:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

[1] https://debbugs.gnu.org/44578
[2]
https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/570404/pdflatex-fails-on-pstool-w=
hen
-hyperref-is-included

>>>>> "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:
> Dear Sir or Madam,
> I reported a bug on github, and the maintainers advised me to inform=20
> the authors of preview-latex:

>  <https://github.com/latex3/hyperref/issues/166> pdfLaTeX fails on=20
> pstool when hyperref is included =B7 Issue #166 =B7 latex3/hyperref=20
> (github.com). The original bug report, a minimum example and all=20
> needed files are posted there.

> I would be absolutely willing to support the clarification of the =
issue.
> Please inform me how to formally submit the bug report.

> Thanks and best wishes,

> Tobias Bruckmann

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------=_NextPart_000_018E_01D6ECD7.467B5560--




Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at 44578 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 44578) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 Jan 2021 05:58:19 +0000
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From: Ikumi Keita <ikumi@HIDDEN>
To: dak@HIDDEN
Subject: Re: bug#45894: Bug report for preview-latex
In-reply-to: <e59f32f7db864189a56f3b8656bb83f9@HIDDEN>
References: <e59f32f7db864189a56f3b8656bb83f9@HIDDEN>
Comments: In-reply-to "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN>
 message dated "Fri, 15 Jan 2021 16:52:29 +0000."
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 Content preview:  Hi David, Could you please take care of bug#44578[1],
 reported
 by Ulrike Fischer? It seems that that bug is responsible for bug#45894,
 skimming
 over the correspondence between Tobias and Ulrike[2]. In addition,
 the following
 simple document fails at preview-latex when TeX-PDF-mode is nil and
 preview-image-type
 is `png', although I'm not sure whether this is related or not. (The two
 math fragment [...] 
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Hi David,

Could you please take care of bug#44578[1], reported by Ulrike Fischer?
It seems that that bug is responsible for bug#45894, skimming over the
correspondence between Tobias and Ulrike[2].

In addition, the following simple document fails at preview-latex when
TeX-PDF-mode is nil and preview-image-type is `png', although I'm not
sure whether this is related or not. (The two math fragments "\(a\)" and
"\(b\)" both don't render as images but instead "Do not enter" signs
appear beside them.)

In summary, it seems that latex+dvips+gs has low compatibility with
preview.sty by recent changes in LaTeX core.

Best regards,
Ikumi Keita

----------------------------------------------------------------------
\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{tikz}

\begin{document}

\begin{itemize}
\item \(a\)
\item \(b\)
\end{itemize}

% pdflatex+pdf2dsc+gs OK
% latex+dvipng        OK
% latex+dvips+gs      NG

\end{document}

%%% Local Variables:
%%% mode: latex
%%% TeX-master: t
%%% End:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

[1] https://debbugs.gnu.org/44578
[2] https://tex.stackexchange.com/questions/570404/pdflatex-fails-on-pstool=
-when-hyperref-is-included

>>>>> "Bruckmann, Tobias" <tobias.bruckmann@HIDDEN> writes:
> Dear Sir or Madam,
> I reported a bug on github, and the maintainers advised me to inform the
> authors of preview-latex:

>  <https://github.com/latex3/hyperref/issues/166> pdfLaTeX fails on pstool
> when hyperref is included =B7 Issue #166 =B7 latex3/hyperref (github.com)=
. The
> original bug report, a minimum example and all needed files are posted
> there.

> I would be absolutely willing to support the clarification of the issue.
> Please inform me how to formally submit the bug report.

> Thanks and best wishes,

> Tobias Bruckmann




Information forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.

Message received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


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Date: Wed, 11 Nov 2020 16:16:56 +0100
From: Ulrike Fischer <news3@HIDDEN>
Message-ID: <549009634.20201111161656@HIDDEN>
To: bug-auctex@HIDDEN
Subject: incompability between preview and hyperref in latex 2020-10-01
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Hello,

the following document works fine with older latex but fails with=20
latex 2020-10-01 when compile with latex-dvips-ps2pdf:

\documentclass{article}

\usepackage [active,tightpage]{preview}
\usepackage{hyperref}

\makeatletter
%\ifPreview
% \let\Hy@FirstPageHook\relax
% \let\Hy@EveryPageAnchor\relax
%\fi
\makeatother

\begin {document}
\showoutput
\begin {preview}
abc
\end {preview}
\end {document}

latex + dvips compiles fine, but ps2pdf errors:
Error: /typecheck in --div--
Operand stack:
   1   0   0.0016874   -0.000881703   a   65781.8
  =20

The problem is the postscript code inserted by hyperref with the two
commands in the commented part of the example: due to the changes in
the latex shipout code, the code is inserted even if preview is
active and ghostscript doesn't like it.=20

For now it if probably easiest to disable the hooks as shown,
but the code in hyperref will at some time switch to the new latex=20
hooks and then perhaps some other solution is needed.=20

--=20
Mit freundlichen Gr=FC=DFen
Ulrike Fischer





Acknowledgement sent to Ulrike Fischer <news3@HIDDEN>:
New bug report received and forwarded. Copy sent to bug-auctex@HIDDEN. Full text available.
Report forwarded to bug-auctex@HIDDEN:
bug#44578; Package auctex. Full text available.
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