GNU bug report logs - #53305
29.0.50; Echo keystrokes without delay

Previous Next

To add a comment to this bug, you must first unarchive it, by sending
a message to control AT debbugs.gnu.org, with unarchive 53305 in the body.
You can then email your comments to 53305 AT debbugs.gnu.org in the normal way.

Toggle the display of automated, internal messages from the tracker.

Message #5 received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Rudolf Adamkovič <salutis <at> me.com>
To: bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org
Subject: 29.0.50; Echo keystrokes without delay
Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2022 17:19:02 +0100

Today, I set my Emacs to echo unfinished commands without a delay:

(setq-default echo-keystrokes 1e-6)

I experienced some problems along the way: (1) The variable name does
not include the word "delay", making it hard to find; (2) I could not
figure out how to disable the delay without providing a number of
seconds; (3) When I press C-x C-g repeatedly, the C-x part flashes a
bit.

Does (3) have anything to do with the "1e-6" hack?  Ideally, I would
want Emacs to have no delay and also no "redraw glitches".

I also wonder, does Emacs have the default 1-second delay to save
bandwidth or something like that?  I ask because the default makes it
harder to learn Emacs for inexperienced computer users.  I base my claim
on causal observations of my children; they often wait for the echo
area, unsure about their "unfinished commands".

Note: If the Emacs core team considers all of the above "features" and
not "bugs", feel free to close this bug report.

Rudy


In GNU Emacs 29.0.50 (build 10, x86_64-apple-darwin21.2.0, NS appkit-2113.20 Version 12.1 (Build 21C52))
 of 2022-01-11 built on Workstation.local
Repository revision: 18dac472553e6cd1102b644c2175012e12215c18
Repository branch: master
Windowing system distributor 'Apple', version 10.3.2113
System Description:  macOS 12.1

Configured using:
 'configure --with-json --with-xwidgets --with-native-compilation'

Configured features:
ACL DBUS GIF GLIB GMP GNUTLS JPEG JSON LCMS2 LIBXML2 MODULES NATIVE_COMP
NOTIFY KQUEUE NS PDUMPER PNG RSVG SQLITE3 THREADS TIFF
TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS WEBP XIM XWIDGETS ZLIB

Important settings:
  value of $LC_ALL: en_US.UTF-8
  locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix

Major mode: Org-Agenda Week Ddl Grid Habit

Minor modes in effect:
  pdf-occur-global-minor-mode: t
  telega-root-auto-fill-mode: t
  telega-active-locations-mode: t
  telega-patrons-mode: t
  telega-mode-line-mode: t
  global-git-commit-mode: t
  magit-auto-revert-mode: t
  hl-line-mode: t
  TeX-PDF-mode: t
  shell-dirtrack-mode: t
  corfu-global-mode: t
  corfu-mode: t
  vertico-mouse-mode: t
  vertico-mode: t
  marginalia-mode: t
  global-diff-hl-mode: t
  yas-global-mode: t
  yas-minor-mode: t
  global-hl-todo-mode: t
  global-subword-mode: t
  subword-mode: t
  save-place-mode: t
  global-auto-revert-mode: t
  delete-selection-mode: t
  savehist-mode: t
  tooltip-mode: t
  global-eldoc-mode: t
  show-paren-mode: t
  electric-indent-mode: t
  mouse-wheel-mode: t
  menu-bar-mode: t
  file-name-shadow-mode: t
  global-font-lock-mode: t
  auto-composition-mode: t
  auto-encryption-mode: t
  auto-compression-mode: t
  buffer-read-only: t
  line-number-mode: t
  transient-mark-mode: t

Load-path shadows:
/Users/salutis/.emacs.d/elpa/transient-20220112.1305/transient hides /Users/salutis/src/emacs/nextstep/Emacs.app/Contents/Resources/lisp/transient

Features:
(shadow bbdb-message mail-extr two-column magit-ediff ediff ediff-merg
ediff-mult ediff-wind ediff-diff ediff-help ediff-init ediff-util
cl-print magit-extras pdf-sync pdf-annot pdf-outline pdf-links
pdf-history pdf-occur ibuf-ext ibuffer ibuffer-loaddefs tablist
tablist-filter semantic/wisent/comp semantic/wisent
semantic/wisent/wisent semantic/util-modes semantic/util semantic
semantic/tag semantic/lex semantic/fw mode-local cedet pdf-isearch
pdf-misc pdf-tools pdf-view pdf-cache pdf-info pdf-util pdf-macs rect
tabify elfeed-link elfeed-show elfeed-search elfeed-csv elfeed
elfeed-curl elfeed-log xml-query elfeed-db elfeed-lib org-capture
telega-obsolete telega telega-tdlib-events telega-webpage
visual-fill-column telega-root telega-info telega-chat telega-modes
telega-company telega-user telega-notifications telega-voip telega-msg
telega-tme telega-sticker telega-i18n telega-vvnote bindat telega-ffplay
telega-media telega-sort telega-filter telega-ins telega-folders
telega-inline telega-tdlib telega-util rainbow-identifiers telega-server
telega-core telega-customize emacsbug sendmail view flyspell-correct
latexenc consult-imenu mhtml-mode css-mode js sgml-mode facemenu ox-org
org-duration org-pomodoro alert log4e notifications gntp org-timer
tramp-cmds ess-r-mode ess-r-flymake ess-r-xref ess-trns ess-r-package
ess-r-completion ess-roxy ess-r-syntax ess-rd hideshow ess-s-lang
ess-help ess-mode ess-inf ess-tracebug ess ess-utils ess-custom cus-edit
cus-start cus-load vterm tramp tramp-loaddefs trampver tramp-integration
files-x tramp-compat term ehelp vterm-module term/xterm xterm
network-stream nsm emms-player-mpd emms-url tq emms-player-simple
emms-browser sort emms-playlist-sort emms-last-played emms-volume
emms-volume-sndioctl emms-volume-mixerctl emms-volume-pulse
emms-volume-amixer emms-playlist-mode emms-source-playlist
emms-source-file locate emms-cache emms-info emms-later-do emms
emms-compat notmuch notmuch-tree notmuch-jump notmuch-hello notmuch-show
notmuch-print notmuch-crypto notmuch-mua notmuch-message notmuch-draft
notmuch-maildir-fcc notmuch-address notmuch-company notmuch-parser
notmuch-wash coolj notmuch-query goto-addr icalendar notmuch-tag
notmuch-lib notmuch-version notmuch-compat eglot array jsonrpc ert debug
pcase swift-mode swift-mode-imenu swift-mode-repl
swift-mode-beginning-of-defun swift-mode-font-lock
swift-mode-standard-types swift-mode-indent swift-mode-lexer conf-mode
magit-bookmark magit-submodule magit-obsolete magit-blame magit-stash
magit-reflog magit-bisect magit-push magit-pull magit-fetch magit-clone
magit-remote magit-commit magit-sequence magit-notes magit-worktree
magit-tag magit-merge magit-branch magit-reset magit-files magit-refs
magit-status magit magit-repos magit-apply magit-wip magit-log
which-func magit-diff smerge-mode diff git-commit log-edit add-log
magit-core magit-autorevert magit-margin magit-transient magit-process
with-editor server magit-mode transient magit-git magit-section
magit-utils cal-move pulse color bug-reference consult-xref xref
embark-consult embark org-archive sh-script smie executable ox-md ox-odt
rng-loc rng-uri rng-parse rng-match rng-dt rng-util rng-pttrn nxml-parse
nxml-ns nxml-enc xmltok nxml-util ox-latex ox-icalendar ox-html table
ox-ascii ox-publish ox citar-org oc-csl citeproc citeproc-itemgetters
citeproc-biblatex citeproc-bibtex citeproc-cite citeproc-subbibs
citeproc-sort citeproc-name citeproc-formatters citeproc-number rst
citeproc-proc citeproc-disamb citeproc-itemdata
citeproc-generic-elements citeproc-macro citeproc-choose citeproc-date
citeproc-context citeproc-prange citeproc-style citeproc-locale
citeproc-term citeproc-rt citeproc-lib citeproc-s let-alist queue org-id
citar parsebib citar-file vc-mtn vc-hg vc-bzr vc-src vc-sccs vc-svn
vc-cvs vc-rcs consult-vertico consult recentf tree-widget bookmark
holidays hol-loaddefs diary-lib diary-loaddefs cal-iso face-remap
org-habit org-agenda org-refile pp helpful imenu trace edebug backtrace
info-look f elisp-refs s dash yaml-mode misearch multi-isearch dired-aux
hl-line dired-x preview tex-buf font-latex latex latex-flymake
flymake-proc flymake project tex-ispell tex-style tex crm texmathp
tex-mode compile shell vc-git ffap flyspell ispell image-file
image-converter org-element avl-tree generator disp-table ol-eww eww xdg
url-queue thingatpt mm-url ol-rmail ol-mhe ol-irc ol-info ol-gnus
nnselect gnus-search eieio-opt speedbar ezimage dframe gnus-art mm-uu
mml2015 mm-view mml-smime smime dig gnus-sum shr pixel-fill kinsoku svg
dom gnus-group gnus-undo gnus-start gnus-dbus dbus xml gnus-cloud nnimap
nnmail mail-source utf7 netrc nnoo parse-time gnus-spec gnus-int
gnus-range message yank-media rmc puny rfc822 mml mml-sec epa derived
epg rfc6068 epg-config mm-decode mm-bodies mm-encode mail-parse rfc2231
rfc2047 rfc2045 ietf-drums mailabbrev gmm-utils mailheader gnus-win gnus
nnheader gnus-util text-property-search mail-utils mm-util mail-prsvr
wid-edit ol-docview doc-view jka-compr image-mode exif ls-lisp dired
dired-loaddefs ol-bibtex ol-bbdb ol-w3m ol-doi org-link-doi char-fold
orderless cursor-sensor paredit edmacro kmacro
display-fill-column-indicator bbdb bbdb-site timezone
modus-vivendi-theme modus-operandi-theme modus-themes corfu
vertico-mouse vertico marginalia pdf-loader diff-hl log-view pcvs-util
vc-dir ewoc vc vc-dispatcher diff-mode diminish yasnippet hl-todo
finder-inf fortune lingua-franca ob-sqlite ob-sql ob-C cc-mode cc-fonts
cc-guess cc-menus cc-cmds cc-styles cc-align cc-engine cc-vars cc-defs
ob-R org-clock cap-words superword subword saveplace autorevert
filenotify comp comp-cstr warnings delsel savehist cl-extra org ob
ob-tangle ob-ref ob-lob ob-table ob-exp org-macro org-footnote org-src
ob-comint org-pcomplete pcomplete comint ansi-color org-list org-faces
org-entities noutline outline easy-mmode org-version ob-emacs-lisp
ob-core ob-eval org-table oc-basic bibtex iso8601 time-date ol rx
org-keys oc org-compat advice org-macs org-loaddefs format-spec
find-func cal-menu calendar cal-loaddefs tex-site geiser-impl help-fns
radix-tree help-mode geiser-custom geiser-base ring info package
browse-url url url-proxy url-privacy url-expand url-methods url-history
url-cookie url-domsuf url-util mailcap url-handlers url-parse
auth-source cl-seq eieio eieio-core cl-macs eieio-loaddefs
password-cache json map url-vars seq gv subr-x byte-opt bytecomp
byte-compile cconv cl-loaddefs cl-lib iso-transl tooltip eldoc paren
electric uniquify ediff-hook vc-hooks lisp-float-type elisp-mode mwheel
term/ns-win ns-win ucs-normalize mule-util term/common-win tool-bar dnd
fontset image regexp-opt fringe tabulated-list replace newcomment
text-mode lisp-mode prog-mode register page tab-bar menu-bar rfn-eshadow
isearch easymenu timer select scroll-bar mouse jit-lock font-lock syntax
font-core term/tty-colors frame minibuffer cl-generic cham georgian
utf-8-lang misc-lang vietnamese tibetan thai tai-viet lao korean
japanese eucjp-ms cp51932 hebrew greek romanian slovak czech european
ethiopic indian cyrillic chinese composite emoji-zwj charscript charprop
case-table epa-hook jka-cmpr-hook help simple abbrev obarray
cl-preloaded nadvice button loaddefs faces cus-face macroexp files
window text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env code-pages
mule custom widget keymap hashtable-print-readable backquote threads
xwidget-internal dbusbind kqueue cocoa ns lcms2 multi-tty
make-network-process native-compile emacs)

Memory information:
((conses 16 1892200 240090)
 (symbols 48 98896 6)
 (strings 32 460671 104583)
 (string-bytes 1 14565513)
 (vectors 16 143664)
 (vector-slots 8 3745252 227117)
 (floats 8 12939 689)
 (intervals 56 56594 6639)
 (buffers 992 96))

-- 
"Programming reliably --- must be an activity of an undeniably mathematical nature […] You see, mathematics is about thinking, and doing mathematics is always trying to think as well as possible." -- Edsger W. Dijkstra (1981)

Rudolf Adamkovič <salutis <at> me.com> [he/him]
Studenohorská 25
84103 Bratislava
Slovakia

Message #8 received at 53305 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi <at> gnus.org>
To: Rudolf Adamkovič <salutis <at> me.com>
Cc: 53305 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#53305: 29.0.50; Echo keystrokes without delay
Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2022 12:58:28 +0100

Rudolf Adamkovič <salutis <at> me.com> writes:

> Today, I set my Emacs to echo unfinished commands without a delay:
>
> (setq-default echo-keystrokes 1e-6)
>
> I experienced some problems along the way: (1) The variable name does
> not include the word "delay", making it hard to find;

Well, it does more than control the delay -- it also allows switching
the echoing off, so I think the name's OK.

> (2) I could not
> figure out how to disable the delay without providing a number of
> seconds; (3) When I press C-x C-g repeatedly, the C-x part flashes a
> bit.
>
> Does (3) have anything to do with the "1e-6" hack?  Ideally, I would
> want Emacs to have no delay and also no "redraw glitches".

Yes, it sets up a delay, and if your redisplay is too fast, the clearing
and re-drawing will be noticeable.  (I can't reproduce it on Debian.)

> I also wonder, does Emacs have the default 1-second delay to save
> bandwidth or something like that?  I ask because the default makes it
> harder to learn Emacs for inexperienced computer users.  I base my claim
> on causal observations of my children; they often wait for the echo
> area, unsure about their "unfinished commands".

No, the delay is because many people find echoing the unfinished
keystroke to be disturbing.

So I think everything here basically works as designed, and I'm closing
this bug report.

-- 
(domestic pets only, the antidote for overdose, milk.)
   bloggy blog: http://lars.ingebrigtsen.no

Previous Next

GNU bug tracking system
Copyright (C) 1999 Darren O. Benham, 1997,2003 nCipher Corporation Ltd, 1994-97 Ian Jackson.