Received: (at 57009) by debbugs.gnu.org; 7 Aug 2022 12:46:40 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Aug 07 08:46:40 2022 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:36139 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1oKfg0-0004j8-Aq for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 07 Aug 2022 08:46:40 -0400 Received: from quimby.gnus.org ([95.216.78.240]:56616) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <larsi@HIDDEN>) id 1oKffx-0004iv-So for 57009 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 07 Aug 2022 08:46:38 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnus.org; s=20200322; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date:References: In-Reply-To:Subject:Cc:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender: Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=010njvpI1qu3oyF7fJjZMKCXvFg7f8cbAka0OI9om8A=; b=CjyK79QxIGgxeM/wp88DtBpCnC 9LubTUqSxgsdEIdUHps+ubHz03AKS7Nf2C5NZxpGvNozgrnvqueHyP55uPk1qNuo7Z16enlQgFBfX i8sutc5/ZcK/NnFWnDAMVGrUAo9qgQcq+qxUi09YzCxVCs0VOgwSZKHt5yVcIwahjomY=; Received: from [84.212.220.105] (helo=joga) by quimby.gnus.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from <larsi@HIDDEN>) id 1oKffo-0006VO-B0; Sun, 07 Aug 2022 14:46:30 +0200 From: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@HIDDEN> To: Alan Mackenzie <acm@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#57009: Obscure doc string of new variable syntax-wholeline-max In-Reply-To: <Yu57a6SH8qAuCz48@ACM> (Alan Mackenzie's message of "Sat, 6 Aug 2022 14:32:11 +0000") References: <Yu2NP/L3rzP075zv@ACM> <877d3l5y4n.fsf@HIDDEN> <Yu57a6SH8qAuCz48@ACM> Date: Sun, 07 Aug 2022 14:46:25 +0200 Message-ID: <871qts43xa.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/29.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "quimby.gnus.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Alan Mackenzie <acm@HIDDEN> writes: > Say the chunk is 64 characters long. Doesn't parse-partial-sexp process > that "as a chunk" anyway? How does one determine where a "chunk" starts > and where it ends? What does "treating a line as a [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 57009 Cc: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>, 57009 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Alan Mackenzie <acm@HIDDEN> writes: > Say the chunk is 64 characters long. Doesn't parse-partial-sexp process > that "as a chunk" anyway? How does one determine where a "chunk" starts > and where it ends? What does "treating a line as a chunk" do that is new > that we didn't do before? I interpret that as saying that the line is split into chunks (of the length the variable says) and processed one after the other. > It is anything but self-evident. It might be by setting the variable to > 0, it might be by setting it to nil, it might be, as you suggest by > setting it to a larger size than you think will occur in practice (i.e. > there's no way to disable it). All these ways are in use in Emacs. Yes, that's true.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#57009; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 57009) by debbugs.gnu.org; 6 Aug 2022 14:32:25 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sat Aug 06 10:32:25 2022 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:35202 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1oKKqn-0004Cy-Ag for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 06 Aug 2022 10:32:25 -0400 Received: from colin.muc.de ([193.149.48.1]:47599 helo=mail.muc.de) by debbugs.gnu.org with smtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <acm@HIDDEN>) id 1oKKqh-0004Cf-Rl for 57009 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 06 Aug 2022 10:32:23 -0400 Received: (qmail 14919 invoked by uid 3782); 6 Aug 2022 14:32:12 -0000 Received: from acm.muc.de (p2e5d57a4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [46.93.87.164]) (using STARTTLS) by colin.muc.de (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Sat, 06 Aug 2022 16:32:11 +0200 Received: (qmail 6862 invoked by uid 1000); 6 Aug 2022 14:32:11 -0000 Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2022 14:32:11 +0000 To: Lars Ingebrigtsen <larsi@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#57009: Obscure doc string of new variable syntax-wholeline-max Message-ID: <Yu57a6SH8qAuCz48@ACM> References: <Yu2NP/L3rzP075zv@ACM> <877d3l5y4n.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <877d3l5y4n.fsf@HIDDEN> X-Submission-Agent: TMDA/1.3.x (Ph3nix) From: Alan Mackenzie <acm@HIDDEN> X-Primary-Address: acm@HIDDEN X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 57009 Cc: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>, 57009 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Hello, Lars. On Sat, Aug 06, 2022 at 14:56:24 +0200, Lars Ingebrigtsen wrote: > Alan Mackenzie <acm@HIDDEN> writes: > > Maximum line length for syntax operations. > > If lines are longer than that, syntax operations will treat them as chunks > > of this size. Misfontification may then occur. > > This is a tradeoff between correctly applying the syntax rules, > > and avoiding major slowdown on pathologically long lines. > > Probably introduced at or before Emacs version 29.1. > > .. There are several bugs here: > > (i) It is not clear what is meant by "syntax operations". These should > > be listed and if necessary, explained. > You mean mention syntax-ppss? Yes, if that is one of the operations involved. Also, if pertinent, parse-partial-sexp, forward-list and friends, syntax-propertize, .... > > (ii) It is not clear what it means for a "syntax operation" to treat a > > line "as a chunk". This should be explained. > It's saying that it's processing the line chunk-wise. I think that's > pretty clear? If it's clear to you, please explain in a way that's clear to me. :-) Say the chunk is 64 characters long. Doesn't parse-partial-sexp process that "as a chunk" anyway? How does one determine where a "chunk" starts and where it ends? What does "treating a line as a chunk" do that is new that we didn't do before? > > (iii) "Misfontification" may well occur, but what about other bad effects > > of ignoring correct syntax? Don't they deserve a mention? > Do they? They might, it depends how clear the rest of an amended text makes things. For example, will C-M-n still work? > > (iv) There is no mention of a mechanism to disable this "chunking" > > effect, whatever it might be. If there is one, it should be > > documented, if there's not, this should be stated. > That seems self-evident -- you increase the size? It is anything but self-evident. It might be by setting the variable to 0, it might be by setting it to nil, it might be, as you suggest by setting it to a larger size than you think will occur in practice (i.e. there's no way to disable it). All these ways are in use in Emacs. > There doesn't really seem to be much to alter here to me, but perhaps > others have other opinions; adding Stefan to the CCs. As matters stand, I'd have to read the source code to work out what this variable is for. I don't think I should have to. -- Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#57009; Package emacs.
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The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see @@CONTACT_ADDRESS@@ for details. Content preview: Alan Mackenzie <acm@HIDDEN> writes: > Maximum line length for syntax operations. > If lines are longer than that, syntax operations will treat them as chunks > of this size. Misfontification may then occur. > This is a tradeoff between [...] Content analysis details: (-2.9 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP 0.0 TVD_RCVD_IP Message was received from an IP address -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 57009 Cc: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>, 57009 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Alan Mackenzie <acm@HIDDEN> writes: > Maximum line length for syntax operations. > If lines are longer than that, syntax operations will treat them as chunks > of this size. Misfontification may then occur. > This is a tradeoff between correctly applying the syntax rules, > and avoiding major slowdown on pathologically long lines. > > Probably introduced at or before Emacs version 29.1. > > .. There are several bugs here: > (i) It is not clear what is meant by "syntax operations". These should > be listed and if necessary, explained. You mean mention syntax-ppss? > (ii) It is not clear what it means for a "syntax operation" to treat a > line "as a chunk". This should be explained. It's saying that it's processing the line chunk-wise. I think that's pretty clear? > (iii) "Misfontification" may well occur, but what about other bad effects > of ignoring correct syntax? Don't they deserve a mention? Do they? > (iv) There is no mention of a mechanism to disable this "chunking" > effect, whatever it might be. If there is one, it should be > documented, if there's not, this should be stated. That seems self-evident -- you increase the size? There doesn't really seem to be much to alter here to me, but perhaps others have other opinions; adding Stefan to the CCs.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#57009; Package emacs.
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Subject: Obscure doc string of new variable syntax-wholeline-max
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Hello, Emacs.
I came across the variable syntax-wholeline-max in reading a new bug
archive. Its doc string, in full, is:
syntax-wholeline-max is a variable defined in `syntax.el'.
Its value is 10000
Maximum line length for syntax operations.
If lines are longer than that, syntax operations will treat them as chunks
of this size. Misfontification may then occur.
This is a tradeoff between correctly applying the syntax rules,
and avoiding major slowdown on pathologically long lines.
Probably introduced at or before Emacs version 29.1.
.. There are several bugs here:
(i) It is not clear what is meant by "syntax operations". These should
be listed and if necessary, explained.
(ii) It is not clear what it means for a "syntax operation" to treat a
line "as a chunk". This should be explained.
(iii) "Misfontification" may well occur, but what about other bad effects
of ignoring correct syntax? Don't they deserve a mention?
(iv) There is no mention of a mechanism to disable this "chunking"
effect, whatever it might be. If there is one, it should be
documented, if there's not, this should be stated.
I'm not asking for an explanation of these things. I can look up the
source code and work it out. I'm asking them to be fixed so that other
people don't also have to read the source code.
--
Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).
Alan Mackenzie <acm@HIDDEN>:bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN.
Full text available.bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#57009; Package emacs.
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