GNU logs - #59587, boring messages

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Subject: bug#59587: 28.2; gnus does not retrieve emails sent from another device
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I am not sure whether I sent a similar ticket before or not!

I used to have the following desired behaviour with Gnus: when I send an
email from my phone to someone, gnus pulls this email when it checks the
emails. However, now this behaviour unfortunately is no longer
persistent. Gnus does not pulls an email that was sent from other
devices connected to the same account!



In GNU Emacs 28.2 (build 1, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.24.34, cairo version 1.17.6)
 of 2022-09-12 built on frederik
Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.12101004
System Description: Arch Linux

Configured using:
 'configure --sysconfdir=/etc --prefix=/usr --libexecdir=/usr/lib
 --localstatedir=/var --with-cairo --with-harfbuzz --with-libsystemd
 --with-modules --with-x-toolkit=gtk3 'CFLAGS=-march=x86-64
 -mtune=generic -O2 -pipe -fno-plt -fexceptions -Wp,-D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2
 -Wformat -Werror=format-security -fstack-clash-protection
 -fcf-protection -g -ffile-prefix-map=/build/emacs/src=/usr/src/debug
 -flto=auto' 'LDFLAGS=-Wl,-O1,--sort-common,--as-needed,-z,relro,-z,now
 -flto=auto''

Configured features:
ACL CAIRO DBUS FREETYPE GIF GLIB GMP GNUTLS GPM GSETTINGS HARFBUZZ JPEG
JSON LCMS2 LIBOTF LIBSYSTEMD LIBXML2 M17N_FLT MODULES NOTIFY INOTIFY
PDUMPER PNG RSVG SECCOMP SOUND THREADS TIFF TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS X11 XDBE
XIM XPM GTK3 ZLIB

Important settings:
  value of $LANG: en_US.utf8
  locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix

Major mode: Group

Minor modes in effect:
  global-evil-surround-mode: t
  evil-surround-mode: t
  gnus-topic-mode: t
  helm-descbinds-mode: t
  helm-mode: t
  helm-minibuffer-history-mode: t
  helm-autoresize-mode: t
  helm--remap-mouse-mode: t
  async-bytecomp-package-mode: t
  evil-escape-mode: t
  projectile-mode: t
  gnus-undo-mode: t
  delete-selection-mode: t
  winner-mode: t
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  pupo-mode: t
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  global-undo-tree-mode: t
  spaceline-info-mode: t
  spaceline-helm-mode: t
  save-place-mode: t
  savehist-mode: t
  persp-mode: t
  global-hl-todo-mode: t
  purpose-mode: t
  eyebrowse-mode: t
  global-anzu-mode: t
  anzu-mode: t
  editorconfig-mode: t
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  mouse-wheel-mode: t
  file-name-shadow-mode: t
  global-font-lock-mode: t
  font-lock-mode: t
  auto-composition-mode: t
  auto-encryption-mode: t
  auto-compression-mode: t
  buffer-read-only: t
  column-number-mode: t
  line-number-mode: t
  transient-mark-mode: t

Load-path shadows:
/home/wyousef/.emacs.d/elpa/28.2/develop/load-env-vars-20180511.2210/load-env-vars hides /home/wyousef/.emacs.d/core/libs/forks/load-env-vars
/home/wyousef/.emacs.d/elpa/28.2/develop/spinner-1.7.4/spinner hides /home/wyousef/.emacs.d/core/libs/spinner
/home/wyousef/.emacs.d/elpa/28.2/develop/transient-20221124.2341/transient hides /usr/share/emacs/28.2/lisp/transient
/home/wyousef/.emacs.d/elpa/28.2/develop/hierarchy-20190425.842/hierarchy hides /usr/share/emacs/28.2/lisp/emacs-lisp/hierarchy

Features:
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vi-tilde-fringe undo-tree diff queue symbol-overlay string-inflection
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powerline-separators color powerline-themes saveplace savehist
restart-emacs desktop frameset server popwin persp-mode org-rich-yank
multi-line multi-line-find multi-line-enter multi-line-decorator
multi-line-respace multi-line-shared shut-up multi-line-cycle
multi-line-candidate journalctl-mode array hl-todo compat compat-macs
geben dbgp window-purpose window-purpose-fixes
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editorconfig-core-handle editorconfig-fnmatch edit-server noutline
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xml helm-easymenu cl drupal/pcomplete tex-site hybrid-mode
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evil-ex shell pcomplete comint ansi-color evil-types evil-macros
evil-repeat evil-states evil-core evil-common windmove calc
calc-loaddefs calc-macs thingatpt rect evil-digraphs evil-vars ring
bind-map info quelpa mm-decode mm-bodies mm-encode lisp-mnt mail-parse
rfc2231 rfc2047 rfc2045 mm-util ietf-drums mail-prsvr help-fns
radix-tree hl-line xt-mouse autorevert filenotify disp-table cl-extra
recentf tree-widget spacemacs-dark-theme spacemacs-common format-spec
finder-inf ido-vertical-mode ido core-spacemacs core-spacebind
core-use-package-ext core-transient-state core-micro-state core-toggle
core-keybindings core-fonts-support core-themes-support
core-display-init core-jump core-release-management core-custom-settings
core-configuration-layer core-progress-bar core-spacemacs-buffer
core-funcs spacemacs-ht inline help-mode warnings package browse-url url
url-proxy url-privacy url-expand url-methods url-history url-cookie
url-domsuf url-util mailcap url-handlers url-parse auth-source cl-seq
password-cache json map url-vars eieio eieio-core eieio-loaddefs epg
rfc6068 epg-config core-command-line core-debug edmacro kmacro derived
core-hooks page-break-lines easy-mmode core-env load-env-vars rx
core-dotspacemacs advice core-customization validate cus-edit pp
cus-load wid-edit seq byte-opt core-emacs-backports core-compilation
pcase bytecomp byte-compile cconv core-dumper subr-x spinner cl-macs gv
cl-loaddefs cl-lib core-load-paths core-versions core-early-funcs
iso-transl tooltip eldoc paren electric uniquify ediff-hook vc-hooks
lisp-float-type elisp-mode mwheel term/x-win x-win term/common-win x-dnd
tool-bar dnd fontset image regexp-opt fringe tabulated-list replace
newcomment text-mode lisp-mode prog-mode register page tab-bar menu-bar
rfn-eshadow isearch easymenu timer select scroll-bar mouse jit-lock
font-lock syntax font-core term/tty-colors frame minibuffer cl-generic
cham georgian utf-8-lang misc-lang vietnamese tibetan thai tai-viet lao
korean japanese eucjp-ms cp51932 hebrew greek romanian slovak czech
european ethiopic indian cyrillic chinese composite emoji-zwj charscript
charprop case-table epa-hook jka-cmpr-hook help simple abbrev obarray
cl-preloaded nadvice button loaddefs faces cus-face macroexp files
window text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env code-pages
mule custom widget hashtable-print-readable backquote threads dbusbind
inotify lcms2 dynamic-setting system-font-setting font-render-setting
cairo move-toolbar gtk x-toolkit x multi-tty make-network-process emacs)

Memory information:
((conses 16 1004030 1250925)
 (symbols 48 67716 4)
 (strings 32 272580 119880)
 (string-bytes 1 14684206)
 (vectors 16 109307)
 (vector-slots 8 2173992 1037912)
 (floats 8 1330 5373)
 (intervals 56 5122 4730)
 (buffers 992 42))

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From: help-debbugs@HIDDEN (GNU bug Tracking System)
To: Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN>
Subject: bug#59587: Acknowledgement (28.2; gnus does not retrieve emails
 sent from another device)
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Message sent to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN, bugs@HIDDEN:

Subject: bug#59587: 28.2; gnus does not retrieve emails sent from another device
Resent-From: Eric Abrahamsen <eric@HIDDEN>
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Cc: 59587 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
From: Eric Abrahamsen <eric@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <87edtq7fui.fsf@HIDDEN>
 (Waleed Yousef's message of "Fri, 25 Nov 2022 15:51:33 -0800")
References: <87edtq7fui.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2022 14:49:36 -0800
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Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN> writes:

> I am not sure whether I sent a similar ticket before or not!
>
> I used to have the following desired behaviour with Gnus: when I send an
> email from my phone to someone, gnus pulls this email when it checks the
> emails. However, now this behaviour unfortunately is no longer
> persistent. Gnus does not pulls an email that was sent from other
> devices connected to the same account!

We'd need a lot more information than this to figure out the problem.
What kind of mail account is this (IMAP, something else?) and how are
you sending emails from your phone? Did the email used to show up in a
"Sent" folder, or where are you expecting them to appear? Is it possible
that Gnus is pulling the emails, but they're marked as read so they
don't display by default?

My first guess is that your phone client used to save outgoing mails,
but has either stopped doing that, or saves them in a different place
now.

Eric

Message sent to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN, bugs@HIDDEN:

Subject: bug#59587: 28.2; gnus does not retrieve emails sent from another device
In-Reply-To: <87edtq7fui.fsf@HIDDEN>
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From: Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN>
References: <87edtq7fui.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <87edtpl4an.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2022 15:47:58 -0800
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Thanks so much for your reply. After I read your reply, I did several experiments and found that the problem does not happen (that is, Gnus pulls the sent messages) if I send from the webmail interface of a pop3 email, e.g., using chrome to send from my gmail account. In that case Gnus will pull the sent email. However, if the email is sent from my iphone (whether IMAP or pop3 account) or even from a webmail interface of an IMAP account, Gnus does not pull the sent email although the email is indeed saved in the sent box (I go online and check).


Eric Abrahamsen <eric@HIDDEN> writes:

> Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN> writes:
>
>> I am not sure whether I sent a similar ticket before or not!
>>
>> I used to have the following desired behaviour with Gnus: when I send an
>> email from my phone to someone, gnus pulls this email when it checks the
>> emails. However, now this behaviour unfortunately is no longer
>> persistent. Gnus does not pulls an email that was sent from other
>> devices connected to the same account!
>
> We'd need a lot more information than this to figure out the problem.
> What kind of mail account is this (IMAP, something else?) and how are
> you sending emails from your phone? Did the email used to show up in a
> "Sent" folder, or where are you expecting them to appear? Is it possible
> that Gnus is pulling the emails, but they're marked as read so they
> don't display by default?
>
> My first guess is that your phone client used to save outgoing mails,
> but has either stopped doing that, or saves them in a different place
> now.
>
> Eric

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From: Eric Abrahamsen <eric@HIDDEN>
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Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN> writes:

> Thanks so much for your reply. After I read your reply, I did several
> experiments and found that the problem does not happen (that is, Gnus
> pulls the sent messages) if I send from the webmail interface of a
> pop3 email, e.g., using chrome to send from my gmail account. In that
> case Gnus will pull the sent email. However, if the email is sent from
> my iphone (whether IMAP or pop3 account) or even from a webmail
> interface of an IMAP account, Gnus does not pull the sent email
> although the email is indeed saved in the sent box (I go online and
> check).

This still isn't enough information to help you. How is Gnus fetching
mail for this account? Is it an nnimap backend, or some other mail
backend using a mail source?

Message sent to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN, bugs@HIDDEN:

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From: Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN>
References: <87edtq7fui.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <87edtpl4an.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <874jug0ztd.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <871qpjm7vt.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Thu, 01 Dec 2022 09:16:54 -0800
In-Reply-To: <871qpjm7vt.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eric Abrahamsen's message of
 "Thu, 01 Dec 2022 08:00:22 -0800")
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Thanks again for your time,

I have four emails, three are pop3 and one is imap. I am using nnml. This is my gnus.el part:

```
(setq mail-sources `(
		                 (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
			                    :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
			                    :port 995
			                    :stream ssl)
		                 (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
			                    :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
			                    :port 995
			                    :stream ssl)
		                 (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
			                    :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
			                    :port 995
			                    :stream ssl)
		                 (imap :server "mail.uvic.ca"
		       	              :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
		       	              :port 993
		       	              :stream ssl
			                    )
		                 )
      gnus-select-method '(nntp "news.gnus.org")
      gnus-secondary-select-methods '((nnml ""))

      user-mail-address "wyousef@HIDDEN"
      user-full-name "Waleed Yousef"
      send-mail-function		'smtpmail-send-it
      message-send-mail-function	'smtpmail-send-it
      smtpmail-smtp-server		"smtp.gmail.com"
      smtpmail-smtp-service             '587
)
```

Another piece of information is that I am using spacemacs, which I do not think it will make any difference as its maintainers confirmed to me that they did not change anything with gnus


Thanks so much.

Eric Abrahamsen <eric@HIDDEN> writes:

> Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN> writes:
>
>> Thanks so much for your reply. After I read your reply, I did several
>> experiments and found that the problem does not happen (that is, Gnus
>> pulls the sent messages) if I send from the webmail interface of a
>> pop3 email, e.g., using chrome to send from my gmail account. In that
>> case Gnus will pull the sent email. However, if the email is sent from
>> my iphone (whether IMAP or pop3 account) or even from a webmail
>> interface of an IMAP account, Gnus does not pull the sent email
>> although the email is indeed saved in the sent box (I go online and
>> check).
>
> This still isn't enough information to help you. How is Gnus fetching
> mail for this account? Is it an nnimap backend, or some other mail
> backend using a mail source?

Message sent to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN, bugs@HIDDEN:

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One more piece of clue: I installed outlook on my iphone to experiment with,=
 as a replacement of =E2=80=9CMail app=E2=80=9D of iphone. The same problem e=
xist, i.e., when I send an email with outlook, gnus does not fetch it.=20

> On Dec 1, 2022, at 9:16 AM, Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN> wrote:
>=20
> =EF=BB=BF
> Thanks again for your time,
>=20
> I have four emails, three are pop3 and one is imap. I am using nnml. This i=
s my gnus.el part:
>=20
> ```
> (setq mail-sources `(
>                         (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
>                                :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>                                :port 995
>                                :stream ssl)
>                         (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
>                                :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>                                :port 995
>                                :stream ssl)
>                         (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
>                                :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>                                :port 995
>                                :stream ssl)
>                         (imap :server "mail.uvic.ca"
>                                 :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>                                 :port 993
>                                 :stream ssl
>                                )
>                         )
>      gnus-select-method '(nntp "news.gnus.org")
>      gnus-secondary-select-methods '((nnml ""))
>=20
>      user-mail-address "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>      user-full-name "Waleed Yousef"
>      send-mail-function        'smtpmail-send-it
>      message-send-mail-function    'smtpmail-send-it
>      smtpmail-smtp-server        "smtp.gmail.com"
>      smtpmail-smtp-service             '587
> )
> ```
>=20
> Another piece of information is that I am using spacemacs, which I do not t=
hink it will make any difference as its maintainers confirmed to me that the=
y did not change anything with gnus
>=20
>=20
> Thanks so much.
>=20
> Eric Abrahamsen <eric@HIDDEN> writes:
>=20
>> Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN> writes:
>>=20
>>> Thanks so much for your reply. After I read your reply, I did several
>>> experiments and found that the problem does not happen (that is, Gnus
>>> pulls the sent messages) if I send from the webmail interface of a
>>> pop3 email, e.g., using chrome to send from my gmail account. In that
>>> case Gnus will pull the sent email. However, if the email is sent from
>>> my iphone (whether IMAP or pop3 account) or even from a webmail
>>> interface of an IMAP account, Gnus does not pull the sent email
>>> although the email is indeed saved in the sent box (I go online and
>>> check).
>>=20
>> This still isn't enough information to help you. How is Gnus fetching
>> mail for this account? Is it an nnimap backend, or some other mail
>> backend using a mail source?

Message sent to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN, bugs@HIDDEN:

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Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN> writes:

> One more piece of clue: I installed outlook on my iphone to experiment wi=
th, as a replacement of =E2=80=9CMail app=E2=80=9D of iphone. The same prob=
lem exist, i.e., when I send an email with outlook, gnus does not fetch it.=
=20

Can you confirm that the Outlook app saves your sent message in the app?
What's the name of the folder the send mail is saved to?

My guess is that the account in question is the one you're using as an
imap mail source. When you use imap as a mail source, Gnus will only
fetch mails from the folders named in the :mailbox setting, which
defaults to "INBOX". So I'm guessing that the mail is being saved into
"Sent" or something like that, but Gnus does not fetch mail from there.

If it's true that this is the imap account, then try changing the
mail-source definition to:

(imap :server "mail.uvic.ca"
      :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
      :port 993
      :stream ssl
      :mailbox ("INBOX" "Sent")
      )

Replacing "Sent" with whatever the actual name of the sent mail folder
is.

Alternately (and in my mind preferably), access the imap account using a
full nnimap server backend. Then you'll see everything, and get two-way
sync.

Eric

>> On Dec 1, 2022, at 9:16 AM, Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN> wrote:
>>=20
>> =EF=BB=BF
>> Thanks again for your time,
>>=20
>> I have four emails, three are pop3 and one is imap. I am using nnml. Thi=
s is my gnus.el part:
>>=20
>> ```
>> (setq mail-sources `(
>>                         (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
>>                                :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>>                                :port 995
>>                                :stream ssl)
>>                         (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
>>                                :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>>                                :port 995
>>                                :stream ssl)
>>                         (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
>>                                :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>>                                :port 995
>>                                :stream ssl)
>>                         (imap :server "mail.uvic.ca"
>>                                 :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>>                                 :port 993
>>                                 :stream ssl
>>                                )
>>                         )
>>      gnus-select-method '(nntp "news.gnus.org")
>>      gnus-secondary-select-methods '((nnml ""))
>>=20
>>      user-mail-address "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>>      user-full-name "Waleed Yousef"
>>      send-mail-function        'smtpmail-send-it
>>      message-send-mail-function    'smtpmail-send-it
>>      smtpmail-smtp-server        "smtp.gmail.com"
>>      smtpmail-smtp-service             '587
>> )
>> ```
>>=20
>> Another piece of information is that I am using spacemacs, which I do no=
t think it will make any difference as its maintainers confirmed to me that=
 they did not change anything with gnus
>>=20
>>=20
>> Thanks so much.
>>=20
>> Eric Abrahamsen <eric@HIDDEN> writes:
>>=20
>>> Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN> writes:
>>>=20
>>>> Thanks so much for your reply. After I read your reply, I did several
>>>> experiments and found that the problem does not happen (that is, Gnus
>>>> pulls the sent messages) if I send from the webmail interface of a
>>>> pop3 email, e.g., using chrome to send from my gmail account. In that
>>>> case Gnus will pull the sent email. However, if the email is sent from
>>>> my iphone (whether IMAP or pop3 account) or even from a webmail
>>>> interface of an IMAP account, Gnus does not pull the sent email
>>>> although the email is indeed saved in the sent box (I go online and
>>>> check).
>>>=20
>>> This still isn't enough information to help you. How is Gnus fetching
>>> mail for this account? Is it an nnimap backend, or some other mail
>>> backend using a mail source?

Message sent to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN, bugs@HIDDEN:

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From: Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN>
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Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2022 16:17:15 -0800
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Thanks so much.

In fact, this problem happens even with pop3 emails. When I send an email, u=
sing a pop account, either from Outlook or Mail (both are apps on iphone), t=
he email is saved in the app and I can see it on the webmail in the folder s=
ent, but Gnus cannot fetch the email. However, if I send from the webmail Gn=
us fetches it!!

So, in both cases the email is saved to the folder sent of the pop account!!=


> On Dec 6, 2022, at 4:10 PM, Eric Abrahamsen <eric@HIDDEN> wrot=
e:
>=20
> =EF=BB=BFWaleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN> writes:
>=20
>> One more piece of clue: I installed outlook on my iphone to experiment wi=
th, as a replacement of =E2=80=9CMail app=E2=80=9D of iphone. The same probl=
em exist, i.e., when I send an email with outlook, gnus does not fetch it.=20=

>=20
> Can you confirm that the Outlook app saves your sent message in the app?
> What's the name of the folder the send mail is saved to?
>=20
> My guess is that the account in question is the one you're using as an
> imap mail source. When you use imap as a mail source, Gnus will only
> fetch mails from the folders named in the :mailbox setting, which
> defaults to "INBOX". So I'm guessing that the mail is being saved into
> "Sent" or something like that, but Gnus does not fetch mail from there.
>=20
> If it's true that this is the imap account, then try changing the
> mail-source definition to:
>=20
> (imap :server "mail.uvic.ca"
>      :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>      :port 993
>      :stream ssl
>      :mailbox ("INBOX" "Sent")
>      )
>=20
> Replacing "Sent" with whatever the actual name of the sent mail folder
> is.
>=20
> Alternately (and in my mind preferably), access the imap account using a
> full nnimap server backend. Then you'll see everything, and get two-way
> sync.
>=20
> Eric
>=20
>>>> On Dec 1, 2022, at 9:16 AM, Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN> wrote:
>>>=20
>>> =EF=BB=BF
>>> Thanks again for your time,
>>>=20
>>> I have four emails, three are pop3 and one is imap. I am using nnml. Thi=
s is my gnus.el part:
>>>=20
>>> ```
>>> (setq mail-sources `(
>>>                        (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
>>>                               :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>>>                               :port 995
>>>                               :stream ssl)
>>>                        (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
>>>                               :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>>>                               :port 995
>>>                               :stream ssl)
>>>                        (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
>>>                               :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>>>                               :port 995
>>>                               :stream ssl)
>>>                        (imap :server "mail.uvic.ca"
>>>                                :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>>>                                :port 993
>>>                                :stream ssl
>>>                               )
>>>                        )
>>>     gnus-select-method '(nntp "news.gnus.org")
>>>     gnus-secondary-select-methods '((nnml ""))
>>>=20
>>>     user-mail-address "wyousef@HIDDEN"
>>>     user-full-name "Waleed Yousef"
>>>     send-mail-function        'smtpmail-send-it
>>>     message-send-mail-function    'smtpmail-send-it
>>>     smtpmail-smtp-server        "smtp.gmail.com"
>>>     smtpmail-smtp-service             '587
>>> )
>>> ```
>>>=20
>>> Another piece of information is that I am using spacemacs, which I do no=
t think it will make any difference as its maintainers confirmed to me that t=
hey did not change anything with gnus
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>> Thanks so much.
>>>=20
>>> Eric Abrahamsen <eric@HIDDEN> writes:
>>>=20
>>>> Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN> writes:
>>>>=20
>>>>> Thanks so much for your reply. After I read your reply, I did several
>>>>> experiments and found that the problem does not happen (that is, Gnus
>>>>> pulls the sent messages) if I send from the webmail interface of a
>>>>> pop3 email, e.g., using chrome to send from my gmail account. In that
>>>>> case Gnus will pull the sent email. However, if the email is sent from=

>>>>> my iphone (whether IMAP or pop3 account) or even from a webmail
>>>>> interface of an IMAP account, Gnus does not pull the sent email
>>>>> although the email is indeed saved in the sent box (I go online and
>>>>> check).
>>>>=20
>>>> This still isn't enough information to help you. How is Gnus fetching
>>>> mail for this account? Is it an nnimap backend, or some other mail
>>>> backend using a mail source?

Message sent to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN, bugs@HIDDEN:

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Subject: bug#59587: 28.2; gnus does not retrieve emails sent from another device
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On 12/06/22 16:17 PM, Waleed Yousef wrote:
> Thanks so much.
>
> In fact, this problem happens even with pop3 emails. When I send an
> email, using a pop account, either from Outlook or Mail (both are apps
> on iphone), the email is saved in the app and I can see it on the
> webmail in the folder sent, but Gnus cannot fetch the email. However,
> if I send from the webmail Gnus fetches it!!
>
> So, in both cases the email is saved to the folder sent of the pop account!!

Do the sent messages have the same marks (both marked as read, anything
else) regardless of whether you send them from the app or from webmail?

And you have the sent mail folder in Gnus, but it only contains messages
that were sent via the webmail, not the messages sent via the app?

I'm running out of ideas, I'm afraid...

Eric

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Thanks so much for your patience,

Yes, the app (whether it is Outlook or Mail app of iphone) saves the
mail to the "Sent" folder within the app itself, and I find it in the
folder "Sent" on the webmail. In both cases (whether I send from the app
or the webmail) I see the message in the "Sent" folder on the webmail
marked as read. I tried to mark it as unread, hoping that Gnus will
fetch it, with no success.

For gnus, yes, I receive all messages sent via webmail not the messages
sent via the app!

I am really puzzled about this!

Eric Abrahamsen <eric@HIDDEN> writes:

> On 12/06/22 16:17 PM, Waleed Yousef wrote:
>> Thanks so much.
>>
>> In fact, this problem happens even with pop3 emails. When I send an
>> email, using a pop account, either from Outlook or Mail (both are apps
>> on iphone), the email is saved in the app and I can see it on the
>> webmail in the folder sent, but Gnus cannot fetch the email. However,
>> if I send from the webmail Gnus fetches it!!
>>
>> So, in both cases the email is saved to the folder sent of the pop account!!
>
> Do the sent messages have the same marks (both marked as read, anything
> else) regardless of whether you send them from the app or from webmail?
>
> And you have the sent mail folder in Gnus, but it only contains messages
> that were sent via the webmail, not the messages sent via the app?
>
> I'm running out of ideas, I'm afraid...
>
> Eric

Message sent to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN, bugs@HIDDEN:

X-Loop: help-debbugs@HIDDEN
Subject: bug#59587: 28.2; gnus does not retrieve emails sent from another device
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From: Andreas Schwab <schwab@HIDDEN>
References: <871qpcnkei.fsf@HIDDEN>
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X-Yow: With this weapon I can expose fictional characters and bring about
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Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2022 11:41:49 +0100
In-Reply-To: <678239C5-1643-452B-ACEC-1C4F2CE4BCBC@HIDDEN> (Waleed Yousef's
 message of "Tue, 6 Dec 2022 16:17:15 -0800")
Message-ID: <87bkoc270y.fsf@HIDDEN>
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 Content preview:  By default, Gnus only fetches UNSEEN (and UNDELETED) mails, 
 so make sure the sending MUA does not mark the sent mail as SEEN. -- Andreas
 Schwab, schwab@HIDDEN GPG Key fingerprint = 7578 EB47 D4E5 4D69 2510
 2552 DF73 E780 A9DA AEC1 "And now for something completely different." 
 Content analysis details:   (4.5 points, 10.0 required)
 pts rule name              description
 ---- ---------------------- --------------------------------------------------
 0.0 SPF_HELO_NONE          SPF: HELO does not publish an SPF Record
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 [62.216.205.205 listed in dnsbl.sorbs.net]
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 Content preview:  By default, Gnus only fetches UNSEEN (and UNDELETED) mails,
    so make sure the sending MUA does not mark the sent mail as SEEN. -- Andreas
    Schwab, schwab@HIDDEN GPG Key fingerprint = 7578 EB47 D4E5 4D69 2510
    2552 DF73 E780 A9DA AEC1 "And now for something completely different." 
 
 Content analysis details:   (3.5 points, 10.0 required)
 
  pts rule name              description
 ---- ---------------------- --------------------------------------------------
  2.5 RCVD_IN_SORBS_HTTP     RBL: SORBS: sender is open HTTP proxy server
                             [62.216.205.205 listed in dnsbl.sorbs.net]
  2.4 RCVD_IN_SORBS_SOCKS    RBL: SORBS: sender is open SOCKS proxy
                             server
 -0.7 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW      RBL: Sender listed at https://www.dnswl.org/,
                             low trust
                             [212.18.0.9 listed in list.dnswl.org]
 -0.0 RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3      RBL: Good reputation (+3)
                             [212.18.0.9 listed in wl.mailspike.net]
  0.0 SPF_HELO_NONE          SPF: HELO does not publish an SPF Record
  0.2 HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS From and EnvelopeFrom 2nd level
                             mail domains are different
 -0.0 SPF_PASS               SPF: sender matches SPF record
 -0.0 RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL      Mailspike good senders
 -1.0 MAILING_LIST_MULTI     Multiple indicators imply a widely-seen list
                             manager

By default, Gnus only fetches UNSEEN (and UNDELETED) mails, so make sure
the sending MUA does not mark the sent mail as SEEN.

-- 
Andreas Schwab, schwab@HIDDEN
GPG Key fingerprint = 7578 EB47 D4E5 4D69 2510  2552 DF73 E780 A9DA AEC1
"And now for something completely different."

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I meant by =E2=80=9Cread=E2=80=9D its colour on the webmail after sending  i=
s faint not bold. Both (the email sent by the app and the email sent by webm=
ail) appear faint on the webmail after sending; however, Gnus fetches only t=
he one sent by the webmail.=20

Do you suggest another criterion, than colour, to check the status of the se=
nt email whether it is SEEN or UNSEEN.

> On Dec 9, 2022, at 2:41 AM, Andreas Schwab <schwab@HIDDEN> wrote:
>=20
> =EF=BB=BFBy default, Gnus only fetches UNSEEN (and UNDELETED) mails, so ma=
ke sure
> the sending MUA does not mark the sent mail as SEEN.
>=20
> --=20
> Andreas Schwab, schwab@HIDDEN
> GPG Key fingerprint =3D 7578 EB47 D4E5 4D69 2510  2552 DF73 E780 A9DA AEC1=

> "And now for something completely different."

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On 12/09/22 11:41 AM, Andreas Schwab wrote:
> By default, Gnus only fetches UNSEEN (and UNDELETED) mails, so make sure
> the sending MUA does not mark the sent mail as SEEN.

Thanks, Andreas, I was hoping it might be something like this.

Waleed, can you see what marks are set on the sent mail? SEEN is
distinct from READ. You can also change the config for your imap mail
source, adding

:predicate "1:*"

see the "Mail Source Specifiers" section of the manual. That only
applies to imap mail sources, though.

Message sent to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN, bugs@HIDDEN:

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From: Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN>
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Amazing!

I just added added what you have suggested (:predicate "1:*") to the
imap account I have; it fetched more than thousand emails, including
those sent today. So, it is working now for imap. However, how can I do
it for pop? The strange thing is that it was working until just weeks or
months ago; what happened!!

Just for your information, I will re-share my mail source settings:

```

		                 (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
			                    :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
			                    :port 995
			                    :stream ssl
                          :leave non-nil)
		                 (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
			                    :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
			                    :port 995
			                    :stream ssl
                          :leave non-nil)
		                 (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
			                    :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
			                    :port 995
			                    :stream ssl
                          :leave non-nil)
		                 (imap :server "mail.uvic.ca"
		       	               :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
		       	               :port 993
                           :predicate "1:*"
		      	               :stream ssl
                           :mailbox ("inbox" "sent items")
                           :fetchflag "\\Seen"
			                     )
```

Eric Abrahamsen <eric@HIDDEN> writes:

> On 12/09/22 11:41 AM, Andreas Schwab wrote:
>> By default, Gnus only fetches UNSEEN (and UNDELETED) mails, so make sure
>> the sending MUA does not mark the sent mail as SEEN.
>
> Thanks, Andreas, I was hoping it might be something like this.
>
> Waleed, can you see what marks are set on the sent mail? SEEN is
> distinct from READ. You can also change the config for your imap mail
> source, adding
>
> :predicate "1:*"
>
> see the "Mail Source Specifiers" section of the manual. That only
> applies to imap mail sources, though.

Message sent to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN, bugs@HIDDEN:

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From: Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN>
References: <871qpcnkei.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <678239C5-1643-452B-ACEC-1C4F2CE4BCBC@HIDDEN> <87bkoc270y.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <878rjg37o0.fsf@HIDDEN> <874ju41rv4.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2022 08:28:44 -0800
In-Reply-To: <874ju41rv4.fsf@HIDDEN> (Waleed Yousef's message of "Fri, 09
 Dec 2022 08:09:19 -0800")
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Oh; but for the imap account Gnus keeps fetching all the emails again
and again! I have to remove this :predicate "1:*"


Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN> writes:

> Amazing!
>
> I just added added what you have suggested (:predicate "1:*") to the
> imap account I have; it fetched more than thousand emails, including
> those sent today. So, it is working now for imap. However, how can I do
> it for pop? The strange thing is that it was working until just weeks or
> months ago; what happened!!
>
> Just for your information, I will re-share my mail source settings:
>
> ```
>
> 		                 (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
> 			                    :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
> 			                    :port 995
> 			                    :stream ssl
>                           :leave non-nil)
> 		                 (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
> 			                    :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
> 			                    :port 995
> 			                    :stream ssl
>                           :leave non-nil)
> 		                 (pop :server "pop.gmail.com"
> 			                    :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
> 			                    :port 995
> 			                    :stream ssl
>                           :leave non-nil)
> 		                 (imap :server "mail.uvic.ca"
> 		       	               :user "wyousef@HIDDEN"
> 		       	               :port 993
>                            :predicate "1:*"
> 		      	               :stream ssl
>                            :mailbox ("inbox" "sent items")
>                            :fetchflag "\\Seen"
> 			                     )
> ```
>
> Eric Abrahamsen <eric@HIDDEN> writes:
>
>> On 12/09/22 11:41 AM, Andreas Schwab wrote:
>>> By default, Gnus only fetches UNSEEN (and UNDELETED) mails, so make sure
>>> the sending MUA does not mark the sent mail as SEEN.
>>
>> Thanks, Andreas, I was hoping it might be something like this.
>>
>> Waleed, can you see what marks are set on the sent mail? SEEN is
>> distinct from READ. You can also change the config for your imap mail
>> source, adding
>>
>> :predicate "1:*"
>>
>> see the "Mail Source Specifiers" section of the manual. That only
>> applies to imap mail sources, though.

Message sent to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN, bugs@HIDDEN:

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From: Eric Abrahamsen <eric@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <87v8mkr16r.fsf@HIDDEN> (Waleed Yousef's message of "Fri, 09
 Dec 2022 08:28:44 -0800")
References: <871qpcnkei.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <678239C5-1643-452B-ACEC-1C4F2CE4BCBC@HIDDEN>
 <87bkoc270y.fsf@HIDDEN> <878rjg37o0.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <874ju41rv4.fsf@HIDDEN> <87v8mkr16r.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2022 08:46:50 -0800
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Waleed Yousef <wyousef@HIDDEN> writes:

> Oh; but for the imap account Gnus keeps fetching all the emails again
> and again! I have to remove this :predicate "1:*"

You'll have to play with matching :predicate and :fetchflag configs. The
:predicate can target flags (the default appears to be "UNSEEN
UNDELETED") and then :fetchflag can set a flag that will be filtered out
by subsequent fetches.

The pop mail source doesn't have an equivalent predicate, and I assume
it would just fetch everything.

Nothing has changed with mail sources or fetching in the past several
months...

Message sent to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN, bugs@HIDDEN:

X-Loop: help-debbugs@HIDDEN
Subject: bug#59587: 28.2; gnus does not retrieve emails sent from another device
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From: Andreas Schwab <schwab@HIDDEN>
References: <871qpcnkei.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <678239C5-1643-452B-ACEC-1C4F2CE4BCBC@HIDDEN>
 <87bkoc270y.fsf@HIDDEN> <878rjg37o0.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <874ju41rv4.fsf@HIDDEN> <87v8mkr16r.fsf@HIDDEN>
X-Yow: Why are these athletic shoe salesmen following me??
Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2022 17:49:05 +0100
In-Reply-To: <87v8mkr16r.fsf@HIDDEN> (Waleed Yousef's message of "Fri, 09
 Dec 2022 08:28:44 -0800")
Message-ID: <875yek1q0u.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/28.2 (gnu/linux)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
X-Spam-Score: 4.5 (++++)
X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "debbugs.gnu.org",
 has NOT identified this incoming email as spam.  The original
 message has been attached to this so you can view it or label
 similar future email.  If you have any questions, see
 the administrator of that system for details.
 Content preview:  If the IMAP server allows setting arbitrary keywords, you
 can use that to mark the downloaded mails. :predicate "UNKEYWORD gnus-fetched"
 :fetchflag "gnus-fetched \\Seen" -- Andreas Schwab, schwab@HIDDEN
 GPG Key fingerprint = 7578 EB47 D4E5 4D69 2510 2552 DF73 E780 A9DA AEC1 "And
 now for something completely different." 
 Content analysis details:   (4.5 points, 10.0 required)
 pts rule name              description
 ---- ---------------------- --------------------------------------------------
 2.5 RCVD_IN_SORBS_HTTP     RBL: SORBS: sender is open HTTP proxy server
 [62.216.205.205 listed in dnsbl.sorbs.net]
 2.4 RCVD_IN_SORBS_SOCKS    RBL: SORBS: sender is open SOCKS proxy
 server
 0.0 SPF_HELO_NONE          SPF: HELO does not publish an SPF Record
 -0.7 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW      RBL: Sender listed at https://www.dnswl.org/,
 low trust [212.18.0.9 listed in list.dnswl.org]
 -0.0 RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3      RBL: Good reputation (+3)
 [212.18.0.9 listed in wl.mailspike.net]
 0.2 HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS From and EnvelopeFrom 2nd level
 mail domains are different
 -0.0 SPF_PASS               SPF: sender matches SPF record
 -0.0 RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL      Mailspike good senders
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 Content preview:  If the IMAP server allows setting arbitrary keywords, you
   can use that to mark the downloaded mails. :predicate "UNKEYWORD gnus-fetched"
    :fetchflag "gnus-fetched \\Seen" -- Andreas Schwab, schwab@HIDDEN
    GPG Key fingerprint = 7578 EB47 D4E5 4D69 2510 2552 DF73 E780 A9DA AEC1 "And
    now for something completely different." 
 
 Content analysis details:   (3.5 points, 10.0 required)
 
  pts rule name              description
 ---- ---------------------- --------------------------------------------------
  2.5 RCVD_IN_SORBS_HTTP     RBL: SORBS: sender is open HTTP proxy server
                             [62.216.205.205 listed in dnsbl.sorbs.net]
  2.4 RCVD_IN_SORBS_SOCKS    RBL: SORBS: sender is open SOCKS proxy
                             server
 -0.7 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW      RBL: Sender listed at https://www.dnswl.org/,
                             low trust
                             [212.18.0.9 listed in list.dnswl.org]
 -0.0 RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3      RBL: Good reputation (+3)
                             [212.18.0.9 listed in wl.mailspike.net]
  0.0 SPF_HELO_NONE          SPF: HELO does not publish an SPF Record
  0.2 HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS From and EnvelopeFrom 2nd level
                             mail domains are different
 -0.0 SPF_PASS               SPF: sender matches SPF record
 -0.0 RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL      Mailspike good senders
 -1.0 MAILING_LIST_MULTI     Multiple indicators imply a widely-seen list
                             manager

If the IMAP server allows setting arbitrary keywords, you can use that
to mark the downloaded mails.

              :predicate "UNKEYWORD gnus-fetched"
              :fetchflag "gnus-fetched \\Seen"

-- 
Andreas Schwab, schwab@HIDDEN
GPG Key fingerprint = 7578 EB47 D4E5 4D69 2510  2552 DF73 E780 A9DA AEC1
"And now for something completely different."

Last modified: Fri, 9 Dec 2022 17:00:02 UTC

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