Received: (at 60527) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jan 2023 18:37:26 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jan 04 13:37:26 2023 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49592 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1pD8dh-0004EA-Ms for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 13:37:25 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:38018) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1pD8dg-0004Dw-At for 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 13:37:24 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1pD8da-0002jH-4Y; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 13:37:18 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=sERsRw412bMDmyou5BZSZAblZ1pCF7Dy7x2mc152pC8=; b=JEW+jNwCW/Tn 1miDsK8KIft3p7r25O6WUYUusQgW+hKT4onZSTIHw4DPZzWOrBlxb7f2uFK5Xe/NsyMeOHrQyZ/wR lJ9yd3HPxi8uRHb+Pdc77lGX5LonQvldFr9Q5aY+Ivi03Ak1aD8ZiCcVE96vKL49sOjpoU4UrB/v7 k/dNR4wmn93aThDsafyIzwCNLINjk0fH71p1Qu/UrjNbgKZ2epTipDDd8pQo+3uOa+mQ8bGOMaE2/ qy9GnWxsO/54x9pGGAYjQ6RxLT385sTVmT55p/VxUjAyfMI0Kms6W++22hoaQyIM2wCsl5ShoSRmU 6+2484U96QHTQfM29Hm5ig==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1pD8dZ-00046h-64; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 13:37:17 -0500 Date: Wed, 04 Jan 2023 20:37:30 +0200 Message-Id: <83v8lmxi1h.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <0633641c-0fb3-8778-78b2-f9b827ca5b4a@HIDDEN> (message from Dmitry Gutov on Wed, 4 Jan 2023 19:45:45 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#60527: 30.0.50; Typing SPC in a minibuffer with completion References: <jwva62za176.fsf@HIDDEN> <91ec6e18-2748-9b75-ecd5-0c662d3f0bb5@HIDDEN> <83r0wbyo34.fsf@HIDDEN> <8df48efb-9a7e-d5e7-77ff-50731d185f1c@HIDDEN> <83h6x6z792.fsf@HIDDEN> <b541270c-dfaf-c8b5-e923-be961ca5529d@HIDDEN> <835ydmz0dh.fsf@HIDDEN> <0633641c-0fb3-8778-78b2-f9b827ca5b4a@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 60527 Cc: 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2023 19:45:45 +0200 > Cc: 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@HIDDEN > From: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@HIDDEN> > > > I understand that just rebinding SPC is much easier. But we are > > supposed to consider other factors, not just the ease of > > implementation. And I'm not afraid of code that is somewhat inelegant > > and even breaks abstractions, if we provide better, friendlier UI > > which breaks less habits. > > Using proper abstractions is what can lead to predictable, better UI. > And vice versa -- patching through special cases upon special cases > leads to less predictable, worse UI. > > I wasn't talking about the ease of implementation, really. Not necessarily. And let's stop here and agree to disagree about this, okay?
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#60527; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 60527) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jan 2023 18:27:14 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jan 04 13:27:13 2023 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49570 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1pD8Tp-0003vc-He for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 13:27:13 -0500 Received: from stw1.rcdrun.com ([217.170.207.13]:41085) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <bugs@HIDDEN>) id 1pD8Tn-0003uy-W7 for 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 13:27:12 -0500 Received: from localhost ([::ffff:197.239.10.238]) (AUTH: PLAIN admin, TLS: TLS1.3,256bits,ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) by stw1.rcdrun.com with ESMTPSA id 0000000000055D56.0000000063B5C502.00000A7F; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 11:27:14 -0700 Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2023 21:17:35 +0300 From: Jean Louis <bugs@HIDDEN> To: Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#60527: 30.0.50; Typing SPC in a minibuffer with completion Message-ID: <Y7XCv8DMyAUK7Hh9@HIDDEN> References: <jwva62za176.fsf@HIDDEN> <SJ0PR10MB548826FFEE7DED16806A1ABAF3F49@HIDDEN> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <SJ0PR10MB548826FFEE7DED16806A1ABAF3F49@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Mutt/2.2.9+54 (af2080d) (2022-11-21) X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 60527 Cc: "60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org" <60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>, Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) * Drew Adams <drew.adams@HIDDEN> [2023-01-03 23:17]: > FWIW, Icicles removes `SPC' for word completion by > default (since 2005, i.e., nearly the beginning). > It puts word completion on a different key > (`M-SPC', by default). I would prefer this approach, though I don't find completing by word useful. Do you have some example where word by word would be useful? -- Jean Take action in Free Software Foundation campaigns: https://www.fsf.org/campaigns In support of Richard M. Stallman https://stallmansupport.org/
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#60527; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 60527) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jan 2023 18:27:11 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jan 04 13:27:11 2023 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49567 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1pD8Tn-0003vM-6X for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 13:27:11 -0500 Received: from stw1.rcdrun.com ([217.170.207.13]:41085) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <bugs@HIDDEN>) id 1pD8Tk-0003uy-3g for 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 13:27:08 -0500 Received: from localhost ([::ffff:197.239.10.238]) (AUTH: PLAIN admin, TLS: TLS1.3,256bits,ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) by stw1.rcdrun.com with ESMTPSA id 0000000000055D83.0000000063B5C4FE.00000A73; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 11:27:09 -0700 Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2023 21:14:14 +0300 From: Jean Louis <bugs@HIDDEN> To: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#60527: 30.0.50; Typing SPC in a minibuffer with completion Message-ID: <Y7XB9vNKDPyHkDPz@HIDDEN> References: <jwva62za176.fsf@HIDDEN> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <jwva62za176.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Mutt/2.2.9+54 (af2080d) (2022-11-21) X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 60527 Cc: 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) * Stefan Monnier via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> [2023-01-03 22:07]: > I wish the SPC binding to `minibuffer-complete-word` would go because it > makes it hard to type SPC in the minibuffer whenever there's completion. > > Typing a SPC in a "minibuffer with completion" can be needed when the > things we want to complete contains a SPC character (e.g. file names, > which is why we disable that SPC binding when completing file names), > but also when using completion styles like `orderless` which make the > use of a SPC character to specify how to select the > completion candidates. > > So my favorite option is indeed to simply remove this binding. > Those few users who like it and use it (probably long-time users of > Emacs) could easily get it back with: Thanks. It will help in my packages as I have completion which I need to be editable by user, such as header, footer specification and inserting space require knowing how to use `C-q SPC', not a big deal, but it will help in usability. For completion I use TAB, instead of space. Space goes slow word by word, but I did not find use for it yet. -- Jean Take action in Free Software Foundation campaigns: https://www.fsf.org/campaigns In support of Richard M. Stallman https://stallmansupport.org/
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#60527; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 60527) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jan 2023 17:45:55 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jan 04 12:45:55 2023 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49505 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1pD7pq-0002m8-Kt for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 12:45:55 -0500 Received: from mail-ej1-f49.google.com ([209.85.218.49]:46689) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <raaahh@HIDDEN>) id 1pD7pp-0002lv-CP for 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 12:45:54 -0500 Received: by mail-ej1-f49.google.com with SMTP id fy8so20434187ejc.13 for <60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 09:45:53 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:in-reply-to:from:references:cc:to :content-language:subject:user-agent:mime-version:date:message-id :sender:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=XOpa3ZqSzNESQRKEp30giOoMM6RBXLr7g83/QKGCCn0=; b=XOYPqT9N+6M6pXTmYrQbZI4Yiqz+lBFzQ9KBd8n2BXLS8dsp7+0EEF0Uj7b1O7ewXQ vKFniQYnoViJkxAX6BfZ0peikkXdJrjMQnzWR9kYAvjWOy5Ki6eKR29wTAjomvUvJ6Fc jCChT3kq1+q8lE245FX8JJyVSBzYTXVch5Si8aZw1uchutZ+TOm25tiCqkpZtsg8Op4t NCE06lXC4vFWUIxeThhoMPKE21uLaMOic3yjGx3zeRYTu7PWhUWqLsEdJMMcEq6Slaia zJtcOmnVhQYVkn+46DC3K1DK1McX9MY1fcYBQIIPWcUGYsRhAG8DwZXYUpN8Ncr8WylI JXmA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:in-reply-to:from:references:cc:to :content-language:subject:user-agent:mime-version:date:message-id :sender:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=XOpa3ZqSzNESQRKEp30giOoMM6RBXLr7g83/QKGCCn0=; b=iuo0353EHVKBg2OFWcpNk5zDPU1l96xlWcCFyu4yNHdHdz2t97br8SCJkobxi4jM4M LMjg3aBN0OVb1nYbdGTAMKOkdtqHFrrzyTmD8KMARtFQrWU6A2HcwPHxnGsrkN2ZMbU3 JZPw/fYaXaSXbhZRS3/tY8/WAu8xULW/11CWhUz9a6drpAeqigEsloC+ZNKWFOtXufXD go2fsqItocdyiu6VjjohqRbiA47K0+pY+NvhMltMQN3v4s6KmN0g1ZsT1Ef8Sjj8cLh7 j6D5DLmdHV/ZfdGhZq6QYWLITvUhek+KM6fCqqIXlTSTZLlivWLBFO8XlSxZEO9wf6Bq P0Ng== X-Gm-Message-State: AFqh2kondKvx4frB3VNvsbtwgwwis5BV58DHSZEDCYwauyLMiro3YrJ/ 2G0RtozJFBrm2tUYNxA3rNc= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AMrXdXtXfVhuqMAIZtL4qLfSVPciZAkMO4tgwUwN3h/M9nctAspGdegAAqxxUCxrFfIP3yOrWQ67Rg== X-Received: by 2002:a17:907:3445:b0:7ad:c5b7:1c79 with SMTP id ac5-20020a170907344500b007adc5b71c79mr35038809ejc.45.1672854347641; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 09:45:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.0.2] ([46.251.119.176]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id x11-20020a170906b08b00b007806c1474e1sm15469203ejy.127.2023.01.04.09.45.46 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 04 Jan 2023 09:45:47 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <0633641c-0fb3-8778-78b2-f9b827ca5b4a@HIDDEN> Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2023 19:45:45 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.4.2 Subject: Re: bug#60527: 30.0.50; Typing SPC in a minibuffer with completion Content-Language: en-US To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> References: <jwva62za176.fsf@HIDDEN> <91ec6e18-2748-9b75-ecd5-0c662d3f0bb5@HIDDEN> <83r0wbyo34.fsf@HIDDEN> <8df48efb-9a7e-d5e7-77ff-50731d185f1c@HIDDEN> <83h6x6z792.fsf@HIDDEN> <b541270c-dfaf-c8b5-e923-be961ca5529d@HIDDEN> <835ydmz0dh.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <835ydmz0dh.fsf@HIDDEN> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: -0.9 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 60527 Cc: 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.9 (-) On 04/01/2023 19:16, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2023 19:00:44 +0200 >> Cc:60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org,monnier@HIDDEN >> From: Dmitry Gutov<dgutov@HIDDEN> >> >> On 04/01/2023 16:47, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >>> I didn't say I'm against any change in this behavior. Stefan proposed >>> at least two alternatives that produce basically the same user-facing >>> behavior when SPC is supposed to be interpreted verbatim, so they come >>> very close to the alternative that you like better, but still stop >>> short of breaking someone's muscle memory. >> The first alternative provides sometimes the same, and sometimes >> different behavior. In particular, when there are valid completions, >> "SPC" would still perform completion -- something that I don't think >> many users expect. Especially novices. >> >> The second alternative is even more involved, requiring >> 'completing-read' callers to decide in advance whether the users will >> want to have SPC insert SPC or perform completion. That's still odd and >> seems like crossing the proper abstraction layers. The caller might not >> know the collection contains spaces. And this approach can break >> established muscle memory just the same, as soon as enough callers start >> to make this choice. > I understand that just rebinding SPC is much easier. But we are > supposed to consider other factors, not just the ease of > implementation. And I'm not afraid of code that is somewhat inelegant > and even breaks abstractions, if we provide better, friendlier UI > which breaks less habits. Using proper abstractions is what can lead to predictable, better UI. And vice versa -- patching through special cases upon special cases leads to less predictable, worse UI. I wasn't talking about the ease of implementation, really. > Many Emacs's abstractions leak from many > holes anyway. That's more of a problem for a UI which is used in many, many places and in different contexts.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#60527; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 60527) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jan 2023 17:16:14 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jan 04 12:16:13 2023 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49484 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1pD7N1-0001qk-3t for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 12:16:13 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:46888) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1pD7My-0001q1-2z for 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 12:16:04 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1pD7Ms-0003f2-Lz; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 12:15:58 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=nMPbLn4BvsJXopBWKA9g5gan1piSL94IuTGea6ZweMo=; b=LWMbhiQhgXWl K3UrLY7fvVOZWu16CLXhgA78Uy4CLOvlLpb5VXxWcVb4blHJ023/BBWS+c6YRprsgpkn/4S80bh56 HnRvoKzjz3ugTlJ5517sGP2piskgfeqJSYFBlQnKzL9yBuJXlB1CvkzELrnNxbt0zCgpuUMUc8opZ rgl5oyrUiZC7y5GDf9vQbhzvxUybfvuorgbu00XMnO+3+zrn+38hkSvaZboa8Bc46F3DWRITz7Z3b 90ACCQmfjE4fiPPYClOJqZuasoO809zwO1nt1ZQ1r+/KXsxgJZNwTT4aKxJoCcWDz2tL4T8jv5unq t2lG62fmoMzDEEqOr5SEOA==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1pD7Mr-0003pb-LH; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 12:15:58 -0500 Date: Wed, 04 Jan 2023 19:16:10 +0200 Message-Id: <835ydmz0dh.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <b541270c-dfaf-c8b5-e923-be961ca5529d@HIDDEN> (message from Dmitry Gutov on Wed, 4 Jan 2023 19:00:44 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#60527: 30.0.50; Typing SPC in a minibuffer with completion References: <jwva62za176.fsf@HIDDEN> <91ec6e18-2748-9b75-ecd5-0c662d3f0bb5@HIDDEN> <83r0wbyo34.fsf@HIDDEN> <8df48efb-9a7e-d5e7-77ff-50731d185f1c@HIDDEN> <83h6x6z792.fsf@HIDDEN> <b541270c-dfaf-c8b5-e923-be961ca5529d@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 60527 Cc: 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2023 19:00:44 +0200 > Cc: 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@HIDDEN > From: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@HIDDEN> > > On 04/01/2023 16:47, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > I didn't say I'm against any change in this behavior. Stefan proposed > > at least two alternatives that produce basically the same user-facing > > behavior when SPC is supposed to be interpreted verbatim, so they come > > very close to the alternative that you like better, but still stop > > short of breaking someone's muscle memory. > > The first alternative provides sometimes the same, and sometimes > different behavior. In particular, when there are valid completions, > "SPC" would still perform completion -- something that I don't think > many users expect. Especially novices. > > The second alternative is even more involved, requiring > 'completing-read' callers to decide in advance whether the users will > want to have SPC insert SPC or perform completion. That's still odd and > seems like crossing the proper abstraction layers. The caller might not > know the collection contains spaces. And this approach can break > established muscle memory just the same, as soon as enough callers start > to make this choice. I understand that just rebinding SPC is much easier. But we are supposed to consider other factors, not just the ease of implementation. And I'm not afraid of code that is somewhat inelegant and even breaks abstractions, if we provide better, friendlier UI which breaks less habits. Many Emacs's abstractions leak from many holes anyway.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#60527; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 60527) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jan 2023 17:00:56 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jan 04 12:00:56 2023 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49469 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1pD78J-0001TV-Sk for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 12:00:56 -0500 Received: from mail-ej1-f44.google.com ([209.85.218.44]:37733) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <raaahh@HIDDEN>) id 1pD78G-0001TE-Mi for 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 12:00:53 -0500 Received: by mail-ej1-f44.google.com with SMTP id ud5so84227566ejc.4 for <60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 09:00:52 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:in-reply-to:from:references:cc:to :content-language:subject:user-agent:mime-version:date:message-id :sender:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=KrhemSZibPzYsemtfnsyd7hn7f5dVvDLkv7HvRTe6zQ=; b=hgYonzx+w087WZ7vsl5biHkYZMbkxi1JsOcARBaq2CONewRPiY9bxFyx+gdQBpgT9Q Oa2tXJ8RPS7jssO845BzAcySS93F5xXdC+AkrZ+DFrq9BZiq6z6J5vKcsFWLZYZtBq7f RkMLvg2sGRZTmVqUX3uspSQ4ffBl+4nIO2fOxpYuB/mblbyRSuGcWDZLA6g3c6Mkzs09 77cNnvdbhpJyBHi4YDLWQCWDHMsG9/W8cnEtv29BoCQhZy/u5eS78XoNyysWG1B/Z6U+ qMRG5gUHAyTonnshJ3FaH8ZXIRophFDaX0GENUmSUSQrI9NUHnfzguJNjpBOIX8ejUwY MqOA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:in-reply-to:from:references:cc:to :content-language:subject:user-agent:mime-version:date:message-id :sender:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=KrhemSZibPzYsemtfnsyd7hn7f5dVvDLkv7HvRTe6zQ=; b=ldyEZe2RYAEK2vx92MMNAcmSGI5gfm0J6EjGVSz2v3MZKRn0LCTa3eKt1FSbgZt+sQ 9U9Go4eyzWcwMPyHFQjMHw3I/n8+lA0n+f6YTFxShBl3neHyJ7E33QcXbfdBVH/2rSE+ sOBkjoYhRIVmIOQeOHCA/1BdqRB/bCTMbV50W7sCg/eSowROs/vqTdfGy3FE1ly33OoG /p7/2I0/SuYZpTS+VRQMSUQPBjqyHVvLOEnoxE80fB6d7SqqeXP4hjbE0umMPye0wRuk uOVWButRF4aFV1Gfrc2/AQMc96Mszu6vcQKiaTRIiPLkaT304etMaMte6kIWGhMOnamQ AXrg== X-Gm-Message-State: AFqh2krUxLDMZk35LA842+FTk5JKx27cN9w1ovqqzrrTF8NqpRmyziur OvYUnLThaQlK2sMDiJ45bsk= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AMrXdXufTZ/oDUCnfmluB2flePIZYTMqVb9o7OD50zyzZkihsz6hJIbHiczisCbCO7dMwMQzoQlyyw== X-Received: by 2002:a17:907:c717:b0:7c1:ad6:638a with SMTP id ty23-20020a170907c71700b007c10ad6638amr44660559ejc.17.1672851646682; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 09:00:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.0.2] ([46.251.119.176]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id j1-20020a17090623e100b00770812e2394sm15311072ejg.160.2023.01.04.09.00.45 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 04 Jan 2023 09:00:46 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <b541270c-dfaf-c8b5-e923-be961ca5529d@HIDDEN> Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2023 19:00:44 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.4.2 Subject: Re: bug#60527: 30.0.50; Typing SPC in a minibuffer with completion Content-Language: en-US To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> References: <jwva62za176.fsf@HIDDEN> <91ec6e18-2748-9b75-ecd5-0c662d3f0bb5@HIDDEN> <83r0wbyo34.fsf@HIDDEN> <8df48efb-9a7e-d5e7-77ff-50731d185f1c@HIDDEN> <83h6x6z792.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <83h6x6z792.fsf@HIDDEN> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: -0.9 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 60527 Cc: 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.9 (-) On 04/01/2023 16:47, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2023 14:05:37 +0200 >> Cc: 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@HIDDEN >> From: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@HIDDEN> >> >> On 04/01/2023 05:29, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >>> My preference is for the more-compatible alternatives. It is >>> notoriously non-trivial to figure out minibuffer bindings, so >>> expecting users to do the above is not very friendly. >> >> It's the same for the users who are bothered by this behavior: I stumble >> over it with certain regularity, but still haven't disabled the SPC >> binding in my init script. > > I didn't say I'm against any change in this behavior. Stefan proposed > at least two alternatives that produce basically the same user-facing > behavior when SPC is supposed to be interpreted verbatim, so they come > very close to the alternative that you like better, but still stop > short of breaking someone's muscle memory. The first alternative provides sometimes the same, and sometimes different behavior. In particular, when there are valid completions, "SPC" would still perform completion -- something that I don't think many users expect. Especially novices. The second alternative is even more involved, requiring 'completing-read' callers to decide in advance whether the users will want to have SPC insert SPC or perform completion. That's still odd and seems like crossing the proper abstraction layers. The caller might not know the collection contains spaces. And this approach can break established muscle memory just the same, as soon as enough callers start to make this choice.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#60527; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 60527) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jan 2023 14:47:33 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jan 04 09:47:33 2023 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48054 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1pD53F-0005tL-8h for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 09:47:33 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:50660) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1pD53D-0005t9-Ih for 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 09:47:32 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1pD537-0003CT-Ff; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 09:47:25 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=cY9kyxp7iGynmVwA2dQXhAuwB8YiWUveLZERI2EVXZA=; b=ZN8ZI5Mt67Cw OYm7jMQGVslKFntnJCza0+/BEf1HQbSdoKe6KhoZsWeSacAPgnCxc546BaFqzQbNSANfFwEXNKkJK 1p7fFIJSAXlLEPgT3QuFiYE5tLHhrJYe2IPH/5+4+Iteub6RMT6DRE9a1wKQvNeD/MiNl3HfvMIOj 4voWdINXH5ldDMxTmoN2ulyMJiwFZRw8nInuAEb7+cr2J7N205msBZkx3BuNfHfT1edao8Zf8SBsl v/sD+LdZuizYhyzPh9u2NgyuA/zl3KI1bZFAiWR6guPIGz8PBgv5TDJwNd7EzGduljKABoz1XI3mS oyu3zS6jE60G6WMhv2PqWA==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1pD536-00025J-SH; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 09:47:25 -0500 Date: Wed, 04 Jan 2023 16:47:37 +0200 Message-Id: <83h6x6z792.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <8df48efb-9a7e-d5e7-77ff-50731d185f1c@HIDDEN> (message from Dmitry Gutov on Wed, 4 Jan 2023 14:05:37 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#60527: 30.0.50; Typing SPC in a minibuffer with completion References: <jwva62za176.fsf@HIDDEN> <91ec6e18-2748-9b75-ecd5-0c662d3f0bb5@HIDDEN> <83r0wbyo34.fsf@HIDDEN> <8df48efb-9a7e-d5e7-77ff-50731d185f1c@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 60527 Cc: 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2023 14:05:37 +0200 > Cc: 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@HIDDEN > From: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@HIDDEN> > > On 04/01/2023 05:29, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > My preference is for the more-compatible alternatives. It is > > notoriously non-trivial to figure out minibuffer bindings, so > > expecting users to do the above is not very friendly. > > It's the same for the users who are bothered by this behavior: I stumble > over it with certain regularity, but still haven't disabled the SPC > binding in my init script. I didn't say I'm against any change in this behavior. Stefan proposed at least two alternatives that produce basically the same user-facing behavior when SPC is supposed to be interpreted verbatim, so they come very close to the alternative that you like better, but still stop short of breaking someone's muscle memory. > Those those dislike the change, however, will read the necessary > invocation in NEWS. I think you greatly overestimate the number of people who read NEWS, even when they have some reason to look up a specific change there.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#60527; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 60527) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jan 2023 12:05:49 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jan 04 07:05:49 2023 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47869 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1pD2Wi-0007xI-O3 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 07:05:48 -0500 Received: from mail-ej1-f54.google.com ([209.85.218.54]:37423) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <raaahh@HIDDEN>) id 1pD2Wg-0007x5-Gh for 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 07:05:46 -0500 Received: by mail-ej1-f54.google.com with SMTP id ud5so82135841ejc.4 for <60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 04:05:46 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:in-reply-to:from:content-language :references:cc:to:subject:user-agent:mime-version:date:message-id :sender:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=Kb/fLHeg54IbRXRDnBDJ9UOltnYNUgMn6HaaZ8795kM=; b=ERYFNrxjvrzpMQszeJ76/jUjem9LFV5DFY4hp/q26HcEaLoN16Uhye0qQdr5bzPpFH tlcPJKxwjRRaFv2nOqer5GSquceuf3zi+vrbGFMLhIBws7PdiwR0eWhaoIyKIRjL2TQK aRQ+xDrLeg4GG/sH5GaDo8a7/5yBOs20RPzq0dhlPdSUVSSTdo/IWna6sVt+YskZhcrt G6QSMJilLCbesMD6BnNKcELnnLdV8g+5Nz7z13+/g8FOg3M4iHEDPRg6VS+u8F/A2BKF vdMFwTrbomhHz10Ui2mx+1zZdgFwR529mZZ1KgNshD1GxQrR3kbGT+qUYNRab+hO4LWX 7GJw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:in-reply-to:from:content-language :references:cc:to:subject:user-agent:mime-version:date:message-id :sender:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=Kb/fLHeg54IbRXRDnBDJ9UOltnYNUgMn6HaaZ8795kM=; b=F7Uri2W6Uh7jM46CW72V/FImONsWVs8+DAaAM0ugxIIJn21fn4AH/o70dZGyT/SZn5 8NwKQWSZkYGZ96DoH4UhCbKSbRoVfj0o5iVAKdy2GRA9WuvEGPsmWZYRubM+tHKARMZb MI5VQluF0o+LAdL6KCnkcZtCbC4YxydiFDu9nU5A1wBIL/pwi8mFfm+L/baQvFDph++l MrJrPP4fhDpbo+omRWNft9B6PYUkgvPMvEa6wGvuEseiSUOxWM0WStUkCyhT7oYQseMs J4lq8A95f2yhQHNHAx6JA2m6KgJwfiG+NLVK4DIpYGl6I5seM592r3zA4OTPEqGjF7jH u+Ag== X-Gm-Message-State: AFqh2krvCja8BiYC/IFB3XZvqaeFVJ/+E70lLmp+XxB/5XvmrwEgq1vM vbW9SuecxW1IWvxZLNSFfZA= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AMrXdXueb17WChFXdLg8PS762g45Bxeb9ufqvtfSWF2zPGsw81jUt2gHiq/nZa5hXyX4pagHk6yjxA== X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:22d2:b0:7fc:3787:243d with SMTP id q18-20020a17090622d200b007fc3787243dmr43192956eja.53.1672833940521; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 04:05:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.0.2] ([46.251.119.176]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id m9-20020a1709062ac900b007c0d41736c0sm15152716eje.39.2023.01.04.04.05.39 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 04 Jan 2023 04:05:39 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <8df48efb-9a7e-d5e7-77ff-50731d185f1c@HIDDEN> Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2023 14:05:37 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.4.2 Subject: Re: bug#60527: 30.0.50; Typing SPC in a minibuffer with completion To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> References: <jwva62za176.fsf@HIDDEN> <91ec6e18-2748-9b75-ecd5-0c662d3f0bb5@HIDDEN> <83r0wbyo34.fsf@HIDDEN> Content-Language: en-US From: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <83r0wbyo34.fsf@HIDDEN> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: -0.9 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 60527 Cc: 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.9 (-) On 04/01/2023 05:29, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > My preference is for the more-compatible alternatives. It is > notoriously non-trivial to figure out minibuffer bindings, so > expecting users to do the above is not very friendly. It's the same for the users who are bothered by this behavior: I stumble over it with certain regularity, but still haven't disabled the SPC binding in my init script. Those those dislike the change, however, will read the necessary invocation in NEWS.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#60527; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 60527) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jan 2023 07:09:13 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jan 04 02:09:13 2023 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47428 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1pCxtg-0003jq-S4 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 02:09:13 -0500 Received: from mail-wr1-f52.google.com ([209.85.221.52]:42678) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <kevin.legouguec@HIDDEN>) id 1pCxte-0003ja-HT for 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 04 Jan 2023 02:09:11 -0500 Received: by mail-wr1-f52.google.com with SMTP id t15so23177772wro.9 for <60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Tue, 03 Jan 2023 23:09:10 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date :references:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=ukqJGRL1vDympwuWJbyYDgx9w2vUVYYKUS1w1fnG5Sw=; b=JaTWPBLRQruWhFNkPC5QcaH4OgALnjj+Q+NoGNoxa88MJ2SRaHF2o/PZWnvJBduL9o WxJR7KbFeSp5pG9IEx5s26YDoEBxrAWaJ+jJuODYMGJZpfATvRLzM8rVuU6Aes55R8sp hzsUk6DU9SnVkVXUBt6A+Qam7FFVojNFm03RA+3FT/xzR2uz6oKh9QVXRQAIf1KTxhY4 JR72TJs86fn+gRSzhtrxJpMNIqdihIMxfvPVd5TcK/DvFXEyLU7v7UWAkDFX2j6CRREW tLrmvmKfMc6mykSfjEdOtEG9tEg6W06WHcW7upsiZMfXJxkNZ2JL4lgApk618VR/ljFz 4q5A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date :references:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from :to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=ukqJGRL1vDympwuWJbyYDgx9w2vUVYYKUS1w1fnG5Sw=; b=yv9F09YTGVqhsRUzIdr07TdaC4hNUbJka7M/JuzuYp9is0f8jFEjb7EV6SENsCBs0R 4ByWppjlPRnU3sYi5435RryGJl5fleTA4+dbt1SHXDqrScVCXOpwZU0eZi+YTd7mj7QW moFeVRSWPwdAeqXq+35DzhJpvZuwML03JKpsBsH8dV2NhduAe7JwKl0PQwWzT2/qxcRd fnGrpOi8yQy+s0wvzhv8TIZdFnT2ba5ec0VYzCq/f8ghQVc4K/CndLkUav9lfPNOvcJR jrTTY24WsZHP0LYITpLmHgrrG2TTd9Ogie6R0k4jGek3p1X130leQF/0rhpu3GIj7IZd DfvA== X-Gm-Message-State: AFqh2kp0apRPUbCZy1BiVxcU8Z23rUeUMFhZW6OQWcLoEgrEtSVsjz5h a3TEptlJj2Hzi5J8rvO7i62fetqbr08= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AMrXdXvA1ExJLT5uXlYe3koMHwHrcpaEozlZATtlF3dC26FcaKVkIF7J758k0Kw9MeJnm6M99ufTGg== X-Received: by 2002:a5d:610a:0:b0:27a:cc74:977d with SMTP id v10-20020a5d610a000000b0027acc74977dmr20840985wrt.4.1672816144521; Tue, 03 Jan 2023 23:09:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from amdahl30 ([2a01:e0a:253:fe0:2ef0:5dff:fed2:7b49]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id d11-20020adffd8b000000b00236545edc91sm32874691wrr.76.2023.01.03.23.09.03 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Tue, 03 Jan 2023 23:09:04 -0800 (PST) From: =?utf-8?Q?K=C3=A9vin_Le_Gouguec?= <kevin.legouguec@HIDDEN> To: 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org Subject: Re: bug#60527: 30.0.50; Typing SPC in a minibuffer with completion In-Reply-To: <jwva62za176.fsf@HIDDEN> (Stefan Monnier via's message of "Tue, 03 Jan 2023 14:05:17 -0500") References: <jwva62za176.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Wed, 04 Jan 2023 08:09:03 +0100 Message-ID: <87bkne22uo.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 60527 Cc: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Stefan Monnier via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> writes: > Yet another option would be to let callers of `completing-read` indicate > that it's likely the users will sometimes want to type a SPC character > for this specific minibuffer input (i.e. `completing-read` would then > use a map like `minibuffer-local-filename-completion-map`). Thinking out loud, not sure how reasonable that idea is: something akin to the *-completion-ignore-case options? E.g. *-completion-literal-spc? (Or *-completion-literal-keys) > Currently packages which want to use `completing-read` to let the users > enter a string that will often contain spaces are reduced the either > telling their users "Add this `define-key` thingy in your .emacs because > the defaults suck" or having to use a `minibuffer-with-setup-hook` > workaround that forcefully rebinds SPC during that minibuffer session, > which may be the wrong thing to do if SPC was binding to something else > than `minibuffer-complete-word`. With the suggestion above, packages could define their own *-completion-whatever-its-named option, that may default to letting SPC self-insert; like ebdb defining its own ebdb-completion-ignore-case that defaults to t. Users could then set those options, and possibly set a bare defvar =C3=A0 la completion-ignore-case for those who feel very strongly that SPC has no business completing. (Full disclosure: I find SPC completion somewhat useful, especially for Lisp symbols, because pounding on SPC is much, much easier than reaching for hyphens on AZERTY)
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#60527; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 60527) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Jan 2023 03:29:20 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jan 03 22:29:20 2023 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47245 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1pCuSt-0005yL-NU for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 03 Jan 2023 22:29:20 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:44298) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1pCuSr-0005y6-Ed for 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 03 Jan 2023 22:29:18 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1pCuSl-0001Jd-9D; Tue, 03 Jan 2023 22:29:11 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=YffhOLD46PhDgZRVa5Op8k5HAkgoih/gUg64w4wEnAg=; b=MrVbgDC0sl/E /XbbxRNvT/UJY8xcGX3dEbs8sNZcnKs7CMVmw3HXe8pJbIBrVa0AYfCpxtzqcgbldJQ+jDN7/72Xi QlHFbZHQ6t9BK5Im7PAfIguWas+LWv61qgnmkRxEh3la99M2lxSIxVbI0nyHgKzMNKfDa/xxLcLd5 X7ycFvgcS5SFdtMzqyDkhgMks+So9BhTyKpxToIaJiUK2y3FWoUqRGn1trdA28otlco6xoLZBMIbb d66i+Sg4625eUihzr7AhxBilwSAAVmxjq/y8pGcgalf3il2CCFxGXXWQbnFcu9y2bPTSoPmf68h8Z 4bzFm3dWwuLliYTazoAHfQ==; Received: from [87.69.77.57] (helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1pCuSk-0005km-8M; Tue, 03 Jan 2023 22:29:10 -0500 Date: Wed, 04 Jan 2023 05:29:19 +0200 Message-Id: <83r0wbyo34.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <91ec6e18-2748-9b75-ecd5-0c662d3f0bb5@HIDDEN> (message from Dmitry Gutov on Wed, 4 Jan 2023 00:50:10 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#60527: 30.0.50; Typing SPC in a minibuffer with completion References: <jwva62za176.fsf@HIDDEN> <91ec6e18-2748-9b75-ecd5-0c662d3f0bb5@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 60527 Cc: 60527 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, monnier@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2023 00:50:10 +0200 > From: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@HIDDEN> > > On 03/01/2023 21:05, Stefan Monnier via Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the > Swiss army knife of text editors wrote: > > So my favorite option is indeed to simply remove this binding. > > Those few users who like it and use it (probably long-time users of > > Emacs) could easily get it back with: > > > > (define-key minibuffer-local-completion-map > > " " 'minibuffer-complete-word) > > Yes, please. My preference is for the more-compatible alternatives. It is notoriously non-trivial to figure out minibuffer bindings, so expecting users to do the above is not very friendly.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#60527; Package emacs.
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bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#60527; Package emacs.
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Finally. Bravo - bonne initiative ! > Typing a SPC in a "minibuffer with completion" can be needed when the > things we want to complete contains a SPC character (e.g. file names, > which is why we disable that SPC binding when completing file names), > but also when using completion styles like `orderless` which make the > use of a SPC character to specify how to select the > completion candidates. >=20 > So my favorite option is indeed to simply remove this binding. > Those few users who like it and use it (probably long-time users of > Emacs) could easily get it back with: >=20 > (define-key minibuffer-local-completion-map > " " 'minibuffer-complete-word) >=20 > Another option is to change `minibuffer-complete-word` so that instead > of beeping "No match", it inserts a SPC when there's no completion and > `require-match` is nil (after checking that the command was invoked via > SPC). >=20 > Yet another option would be to let callers of `completing-read` indicate > that it's likely the users will sometimes want to type a SPC character > for this specific minibuffer input (i.e. `completing-read` would then > use a map like `minibuffer-local-filename-completion-map`). >=20 > Currently packages which want to use `completing-read` to let the users > enter a string that will often contain spaces are reduced the either > telling their users "Add this `define-key` thingy in your .emacs because > the defaults suck" or having to use a `minibuffer-with-setup-hook` > workaround that forcefully rebinds SPC during that minibuffer session, > which may be the wrong thing to do if SPC was binding to something else > than `minibuffer-complete-word`. > Both of those options are undesirable, IMO. We should instead improve > the defaults to make such recommendations and workarounds unnecessary. FWIW, Icicles removes `SPC' for word completion by default (since 2005, i.e., nearly the beginning). It puts word completion on a different key (`M-SPC', by default). ____ icicle-word-completion-keys is a variable defined in `icicles-opt.el'. Its value is ([(meta 32)]) Documentation: Key sequences to use for minibuffer prefix word completion. A list of values that each has the same form as a key-sequence argument to `define-key'. It is a list mainly in order to accommodate different keyboards. Because file names, in particular, can contain spaces, some people prefer such a key sequence to be non-printable, such as `M-SPC'. This is the default value in Icicles. But because the spacebar is such a convenient key to hit, other people prefer to use `SPC' for word completion, and to insert a space some other way. The usual way to do that is via `C-q SPC', but command `icicle-insert-a-space' is provided for convenience. You can bind this to `M-SPC', for instance, in `minibuffer-local-completion-map', `minibuffer-local-completion-map', and `minibuffer-local-must-match-map'. You can customize this variable. ____
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#60527; Package emacs.
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From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
To: bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN
Subject: 30.0.50; Typing SPC in a minibuffer with completion
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Package: Emacs
Version: 30.0.50
I wish the SPC binding to `minibuffer-complete-word` would go because it
makes it hard to type SPC in the minibuffer whenever there's completion.
Typing a SPC in a "minibuffer with completion" can be needed when the
things we want to complete contains a SPC character (e.g. file names,
which is why we disable that SPC binding when completing file names),
but also when using completion styles like `orderless` which make the
use of a SPC character to specify how to select the
completion candidates.
So my favorite option is indeed to simply remove this binding.
Those few users who like it and use it (probably long-time users of
Emacs) could easily get it back with:
(define-key minibuffer-local-completion-map
" " 'minibuffer-complete-word)
Another option is to change `minibuffer-complete-word` so that instead
of beeping "No match", it inserts a SPC when there's no completion and
`require-match` is nil (after checking that the command was invoked via
SPC).
Yet another option would be to let callers of `completing-read` indicate
that it's likely the users will sometimes want to type a SPC character
for this specific minibuffer input (i.e. `completing-read` would then
use a map like `minibuffer-local-filename-completion-map`).
Currently packages which want to use `completing-read` to let the users
enter a string that will often contain spaces are reduced the either
telling their users "Add this `define-key` thingy in your .emacs because
the defaults suck" or having to use a `minibuffer-with-setup-hook`
workaround that forcefully rebinds SPC during that minibuffer session,
which may be the wrong thing to do if SPC was binding to something else
than `minibuffer-complete-word`.
Both of those options are undesirable, IMO. We should instead improve
the defaults to make such recommendations and workarounds unnecessary.
Stefan
In GNU Emacs 30.0.50 (build 2, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, X toolkit, cairo
version 1.16.0, Xaw3d scroll bars) of 2023-01-01 built on pastel
Repository revision: a1dce171667209f9dc5b63fd1cf9a067d8ab419a
Repository branch: work
Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.12011000
System Description: Debian GNU/Linux 11 (bullseye)
Configured using:
'configure -C --enable-checking --enable-check-lisp-object-type --with-modules --with-cairo --with-tiff=ifavailable
'CFLAGS=-Wall -g3 -Og -Wno-pointer-sign'
PKG_CONFIG_PATH=/home/monnier/lib/pkgconfig'
Configured features:
CAIRO DBUS FREETYPE GIF GLIB GMP GNUTLS GPM GSETTINGS HARFBUZZ JPEG JSON
LIBSELINUX LIBXML2 MODULES NOTIFY INOTIFY PDUMPER PNG RSVG SECCOMP SOUND
THREADS TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS TREE_SITTER WEBP X11 XAW3D XDBE XIM XINPUT2
XPM LUCID ZLIB
Important settings:
value of $LANG: fr_CH.UTF-8
locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix
Major mode: InactiveMinibuffer
Minor modes in effect:
server-mode: t
electric-pair-mode: t
global-reveal-mode: t
reveal-mode: t
auto-insert-mode: t
savehist-mode: t
minibuffer-electric-default-mode: t
global-compact-docstrings-mode: t
global-corfu-mode: t
url-handler-mode: t
global-eldoc-mode: t
show-paren-mode: t
electric-indent-mode: t
mouse-wheel-mode: t
global-prettify-symbols-mode: t
file-name-shadow-mode: t
global-font-lock-mode: t
font-lock-mode: t
line-number-mode: t
transient-mark-mode: t
auto-composition-mode: t
auto-encryption-mode: t
auto-compression-mode: t
Load-path shadows:
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/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-sqlite hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-mysql/emacsql-sqlite
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/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-sqlite-module hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-mysql/emacsql-sqlite-module
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-psql hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite/emacsql-psql
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-mysql hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite/emacsql-mysql
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/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-sqlite-builtin hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite/emacsql-sqlite-builtin
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-sqlite hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite/emacsql-sqlite
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-compiler hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite/emacsql-compiler
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-sqlite-module hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite/emacsql-sqlite-module
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/notmuch/notmuch-autoloads hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/notmuch/emacs/notmuch-autoloads
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/magit/magit-autoloads hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/magit/lisp/magit-autoloads
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/magit/git-commit-autoloads hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/magit/lisp/git-commit-autoloads
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/magit/magit-pkg hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/magit/lisp/magit-pkg
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/magit/magit-section-autoloads hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/magit/lisp/magit-section-autoloads
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/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/pdf-tools/pdf-tools-autoloads hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/pdf-tools/lisp/pdf-tools-autoloads
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/geiser-kawa/geiser-kawa-autoloads hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/geiser-kawa/elisp/geiser-kawa-autoloads
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/with-editor/with-editor-autoloads hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/with-editor/lisp/with-editor-autoloads
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/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-psql/emacsql
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-sqlite-builtin hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-psql/emacsql-sqlite-builtin
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-sqlite hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-psql/emacsql-sqlite
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/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-sqlite-module hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-psql/emacsql-sqlite-module
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-psql hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql/emacsql-psql
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-mysql hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql/emacsql-mysql
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-pg hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql/emacsql-pg
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/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-sqlite hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql/emacsql-sqlite
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-compiler hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql/emacsql-compiler
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql-sqlite-builtin/emacsql-sqlite-module hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/emacsql/emacsql-sqlite-module
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/flx-ido/flx-ido hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/flx/flx-ido
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/flx-ido/flx hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/flx/flx
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/mastodon/mastodon-autoloads hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/mastodon/lisp/mastodon-autoloads
/home/monnier/src/emacs/elpa/packages/bbdb/bbdb-autoloads hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/elpa/packages/bbdb/lisp/bbdb-autoloads
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/home/monnier/src/emacs/elpa/packages/use-package/bind-key hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/elpa/packages/bind-key/bind-key
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/home/monnier/src/emacs/elpa/packages/use-package/bind-key hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/work/lisp/use-package/bind-key
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/home/monnier/src/emacs/elpa/packages/use-package/use-package hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/work/lisp/use-package/use-package
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/home/monnier/src/emacs/elpa/packages/eglot/eglot hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/work/lisp/progmodes/eglot
/home/monnier/src/emacs/elpa/packages/csharp-mode/csharp-mode hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/work/lisp/progmodes/csharp-mode
/home/monnier/src/emacs/nongnu/packages/lua-mode/lua-mode hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/work/lisp/progmodes/lua-mode
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/home/monnier/src/emacs/elpa/packages/cl-generic/cl-generic hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/work/lisp/emacs-lisp/cl-generic
/home/monnier/.emacs.d/elpa/hyperbole-8.0.0/set hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/work/lisp/emacs-lisp/set
/home/monnier/src/emacs/elpa/packages/nadvice/nadvice hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/work/lisp/emacs-lisp/nadvice
/home/monnier/src/emacs/elpa/packages/seq/seq hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/work/lisp/emacs-lisp/seq
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/home/monnier/src/emacs/elpa/packages/crisp/crisp hides /home/monnier/src/emacs/work/lisp/obsolete/crisp
Features:
(shadow sort mail-extr emacsbug rect cl-print debug backtrace mule-util
autorevert org-eldoc org-element org-persist org-id org-refile avl-tree
generator oc-basic ol-eww eww xdg url-queue mm-url ol-rmail ol-mhe
ol-irc ol-info ol-gnus nnselect gnus-art mm-uu mml2015 mm-view mml-smime
smime gnutls dig gnus-sum shr pixel-fill kinsoku url-file svg dom
gnus-group gnus-undo gnus-start gnus-dbus dbus xml gnus-cloud nnimap
nnmail mail-source utf7 nnoo parse-time gnus-spec gnus-int gnus-range
gnus-win gnus nnheader range wid-edit ol-docview doc-view filenotify
jka-compr image-mode exif ol-bibtex bibtex iso8601 ol-bbdb ol-w3m ol-doi
org-link-doi org ob ob-tangle ob-ref ob-lob ob-table ob-exp org-macro
org-src ob-comint org-pcomplete drupal/pcomplete pcomplete org-list
org-footnote org-faces org-entities ob-emacs-lisp ob-core ob-eval
org-cycle org-table org-keys oc org-loaddefs find-func cal-menu calendar
cal-loaddefs gitignore-mode conf-mode vc-fossil vc-backup vc-hg vc-bzr
vc-src vc-sccs vc-svn vc-cvs vc-rcs vc-got log-edit message sendmail
yank-media puny dired dired-loaddefs rfc822 mml mml-sec epa derived epg
rfc6068 epg-config gnus-util mm-decode mm-bodies mm-encode mail-parse
rfc2231 rfc2047 rfc2045 mm-util ietf-drums mail-prsvr mailabbrev
mail-utils gmm-utils mailheader vc-annotate vc-dir ewoc whitespace
executable copyright dabbrev shortdoc help-fns radix-tree smerge-mode
diff add-log log-view pcvs-util vc misearch multi-isearch vc-git
diff-mode easy-mmode vc-dispatcher filecache bug-reference raku-detect
server cl-extra time-date flymake-proc flymake project compile
text-property-search comint ansi-osc ansi-color ring noutline outline
flyspell ispell checkdoc lisp-mnt thingatpt help-mode elec-pair reveal
autoinsert savehist minibuf-eldef disp-table compact-docstrings corfu
undo-fu-autoloads inkpot-theme-autoloads keycast-autoloads
rubocop-autoloads pcmpl-args-autoloads undo-fu-session-autoloads
camera-autoloads bash-completion-autoloads flymake-popon-autoloads
drupal-mode-autoloads org-superstar-autoloads apache-mode-autoloads
dart-mode-autoloads lua-mode-autoloads evil-goggles-autoloads
monokai-theme-autoloads cyberpunk-theme-autoloads mpv-autoloads
highlight-parentheses-autoloads minibar-autoloads
multiple-cursors-autoloads dockerfile-mode-autoloads
symbol-overlay-autoloads diff-ansi-autoloads eat-autoloads
free-keys-autoloads evil-anzu-autoloads anzu-autoloads tuareg-autoloads
caml-autoloads jinja2-mode-autoloads pcre2el-autoloads paredit-autoloads
apropospriate-theme-autoloads shellcop-autoloads racket-mode-autoloads
pacmacs-autoloads gnuplot-autoloads stylus-mode-autoloads
spell-fu-autoloads nginx-mode-autoloads material-theme-autoloads
el-mock-autoloads raku-mode-autoloads denote-refs-autoloads
arduino-mode-autoloads ede/auto eieio-base guru-mode-autoloads
vc-fossil-autoloads jade-mode-autoloads zig-mode-autoloads
subatomic-theme-autoloads orgit-autoloads evil-nerd-commenter-autoloads
typescript-mode-autoloads why-this-autoloads
emacsql-sqlite-builtin-autoloads iwindow-autoloads workroom-autoloads
gnu-indent-autoloads buttercup-autoloads evil-numbers-autoloads
emacsql-mysql-autoloads git-modes-autoloads
with-simulated-input-autoloads evil-indent-plus-autoloads
jabber-autoloads emacsql-sqlite-autoloads alect-themes-autoloads
geiser-chicken-autoloads sly-autoloads gruvbox-theme-autoloads
vcomplete-autoloads editorconfig-autoloads devhelp-autoloads
auto-dim-other-buffers-autoloads org-journal-autoloads elpher-autoloads
coffee-mode-autoloads blow-autoloads scala-mode-autoloads
ample-theme-autoloads htmlize-autoloads meow-autoloads
graphql-mode-autoloads wgrep-autoloads markdown-mode-autoloads
inf-clojure-autoloads yasnippet-snippets-autoloads autothemer-autoloads
moe-theme-autoloads evil-visualstar-autoloads gc-buffers-autoloads
org-auto-tangle-autoloads gnu-apl-mode-autoloads geiser-mit-autoloads
zenburn-theme-autoloads afternoon-theme-autoloads org-mime-autoloads
xkcd-autoloads xah-fly-keys-autoloads testcover-mark-line-autoloads
geiser-stklos-autoloads proof-general-autoloads proof-site
proof-autoloads flx-ido-autoloads lorem-ipsum-autoloads
webpaste-autoloads evil-args-autoloads org-present-autoloads
org-drill-autoloads julia-mode-autoloads corfu-terminal-autoloads
cycle-at-point-autoloads gotham-theme-autoloads
tangotango-theme-autoloads telephone-line-autoloads
geiser-gambit-autoloads d-mode-autoloads ws-butler-autoloads
nasm-mode-autoloads spacemacs-theme-autoloads opam-switch-mode-autoloads
boxquote-autoloads org-tree-slide-autoloads projectile-autoloads
nix-mode-autoloads swift-mode-autoloads ujelly-theme-autoloads
geiser-gauche-autoloads swsw-autoloads idle-highlight-mode-autoloads
flymake-kondor-autoloads hl-block-mode-autoloads web-mode-autoloads
j-mode-autoloads notmuch-autoloads inf-ruby-autoloads
anti-zenburn-theme-autoloads evil-exchange-autoloads hl-column-autoloads
haskell-mode-autoloads geiser-guile-autoloads popon-autoloads
evil-lisp-state-autoloads better-jumper-autoloads annotate-autoloads
doc-show-inline-autoloads gruber-darker-theme-autoloads
tablist-autoloads rainbow-delimiters-autoloads mentor-autoloads
xml-rpc-autoloads textile-mode-autoloads bison-mode-autoloads
rfc-mode-autoloads geiser-chibi-autoloads sass-mode-autoloads
haml-mode-autoloads systemd-autoloads rust-mode-autoloads
elixir-mode-autoloads writegood-mode-autoloads cdlatex-autoloads
haskell-tng-mode-autoloads geiser-kawa-autoloads cider-autoloads
parseedn-autoloads parseclj-autoloads yaml-mode-autoloads
evil-matchit-autoloads oblivion-theme-autoloads recomplete-autoloads
forth-mode-autoloads engine-mode-autoloads scroll-on-jump-autoloads
geiser-chez-autoloads sesman-autoloads geiser-racket-autoloads
geiser-autoloads helm-autoloads popup-autoloads helm-core-autoloads
scroll-on-drag-autoloads toc-org-autoloads subed-autoloads
prescient-autoloads focus-autoloads edit-indirect-autoloads
sweeprolog-autoloads visual-fill-column-autoloads emacsql-psql-autoloads
emacsql-autoloads go-mode-autoloads dracula-theme-autoloads
solarized-theme-autoloads slime-autoloads macrostep-autoloads
kotlin-mode-autoloads flx-autoloads smartparens-autoloads
evil-iedit-state-autoloads iedit-autoloads evil-autoloads
goto-chg-autoloads crux-autoloads bind-map-autoloads
clojure-mode-autoloads idris-mode-autoloads prop-menu-autoloads
mastodon-autoloads ement-autoloads gnugo-autoloads detached-autoloads
wconf-autoloads json-mode-autoloads ada-ref-man-autoloads
memory-usage-autoloads rich-minority-autoloads
capf-autosuggest-autoloads rt-liberation-autoloads bbdb-autoloads
auto-correct-autoloads tramp-nspawn-autoloads
yasnippet-classic-snippets-autoloads elisp-benchmarks-autoloads
luwak-autoloads gnus-mock-autoloads fontaine-autoloads vdiff-autoloads
omn-mode-autoloads osc-autoloads pspp-mode-autoloads hcel-autoloads
mines-autoloads comint-mime-autoloads tiny-autoloads phps-mode-autoloads
sql-indent-autoloads ascii-art-to-unicode-autoloads agitate-autoloads
vc-hgcmd-autoloads wpuzzle-autoloads nameless-autoloads
gle-mode-autoloads crdt-autoloads perl-doc-autoloads
ahungry-theme-autoloads nano-modeline-autoloads dired-du-autoloads
adjust-parens-autoloads dired-git-info-autoloads polymode-autoloads
pyim-basedict-autoloads sxhkdrc-mode-autoloads repology-autoloads
ace-window-autoloads easy-escape-autoloads org-notify-autoloads
flymake-proselint-autoloads yasnippet-autoloads elsa-autoloads
org-translate-autoloads highlight-escape-sequences-autoloads
lmc-autoloads counsel-autoloads landmark-autoloads diffview-autoloads
validate-autoloads muse-autoloads sql-smie-autoloads
code-cells-autoloads jgraph-mode-autoloads multishell-autoloads
wcheck-mode-autoloads gcmh-autoloads marginalia-autoloads
dts-mode-autoloads ediprolog-autoloads paced-autoloads exwm-autoloads
devdocs-autoloads sokoban-autoloads valign-autoloads rnc-mode-autoloads
el-search-autoloads stream-autoloads sml-mode-autoloads
scanner-autoloads djvu-autoloads expand-region-autoloads
poke-mode-autoloads org-modern-autoloads
gnu-elpa-keyring-update-autoloads minimap-autoloads plz-autoloads
sql-beeline-autoloads cycle-quotes-autoloads lin-autoloads
buffer-expose-autoloads midi-kbd-autoloads isearch-mb-autoloads
eglot-autoloads f90-interface-browser-autoloads emacspeak-autoloads
xclip-autoloads brief-autoloads company-math-autoloads
dbus-codegen-autoloads csv-mode-autoloads chess-autoloads
svg-tag-mode-autoloads visual-filename-abbrev-autoloads mct-autoloads
rcirc-menu-autoloads beacon-autoloads org-remark-autoloads
aggressive-indent-autoloads ack-autoloads arbitools-autoloads
shelisp-autoloads gpr-query-autoloads ob-haxe-autoloads
ebdb-i18n-chn-autoloads vlf-autoloads enwc-autoloads
system-packages-autoloads docbook-autoloads notmuch-indicator-autoloads
num3-mode-autoloads notes-mode-autoloads trinary-autoloads
temp-buffer-browse-autoloads scroll-restore-autoloads
html5-schema-autoloads math-symbol-lists-autoloads poke-autoloads
gnu-elpa-autoloads gnu-elpa-features vcl-mode-autoloads
jarchive-autoloads guess-language-autoloads oauth2-autoloads
svg-clock-autoloads org-real-autoloads ol rx org-fold org-fold-core
org-compat org-version org-macs format-spec inspector-autoloads
treeview-autoloads uni-confusables-autoloads register-list-autoloads
excorporate-autoloads url-http-ntlm-autoloads url-auth
ada-mode-autoloads fsm-autoloads pq-autoloads multi-mode-autoloads
ftable-autoloads crisp-autoloads captain-autoloads cursory-autoloads
realgud-node-debug-autoloads diminish-autoloads org-edna-autoloads
aumix-mode-autoloads parsec-autoloads coterm-autoloads
uniquify-files-autoloads cape-autoloads minibuffer-header-autoloads
advice-patch-autoloads org-contacts-autoloads sed-mode-autoloads
poker-autoloads wrap-search-autoloads sisu-mode-autoloads
sketch-mode-autoloads quarter-plane-autoloads markchars-autoloads
setup-autoloads engrave-faces-autoloads pinentry-autoloads
sotlisp-autoloads ggtags-autoloads gtags-mode-autoloads
hiddenquote-autoloads which-key-autoloads minibuffer-line-autoloads
epoch-view-autoloads disk-usage-autoloads rmsbolt-autoloads
debbugs-autoloads standard-themes-autoloads vc-got-autoloads
ivy-hydra-autoloads hydra-autoloads blist-autoloads ilist-autoloads
timerfunctions-autoloads spinner-autoloads smart-yank-autoloads
transcribe-autoloads ssh-deploy-autoloads path-iterator-autoloads
all-autoloads nano-agenda-autoloads electric-spacing-autoloads
tramp-theme-autoloads relint-autoloads slime-volleyball-autoloads
ergoemacs-mode-autoloads on-screen-autoloads nlinum-autoloads
bug-hunter-autoloads org-transclusion-autoloads nhexl-mode-autoloads
auto-overlays-autoloads jumpc-autoloads zones-autoloads
shell-quasiquote-autoloads nano-theme-autoloads realgud-lldb-autoloads
boxy-headlines-autoloads zuul-autoloads tempel-autoloads
delight-autoloads darkroom-autoloads cobol-mode-autoloads
visual-fill-autoloads diff-hl-autoloads ampc-autoloads
ivy-posframe-autoloads pyim-autoloads xr-autoloads frog-menu-autoloads
taxy-magit-section-autoloads taxy-autoloads smalltalk-mode-autoloads
prefixed-core-autoloads lentic-server-autoloads lentic-autoloads
logos-autoloads dismal-autoloads gited-autoloads sql-cassandra-autoloads
kind-icon-autoloads tomelr-autoloads windower-autoloads
parser-generator-autoloads javaimp-autoloads triples-autoloads
realgud-trepan-ni-autoloads async-autoloads finder-inf
orgalist-autoloads compact-docstrings-autoloads altcaps-autoloads
tmr-autoloads bluetooth-autoloads dash-autoloads peg-autoloads
rcirc-color-autoloads objed-autoloads flylisp-autoloads
dict-tree-autoloads undo-tree-autoloads xpm-autoloads denote-autoloads
realgud-ipdb-autoloads vcard-autoloads lex-autoloads cpio-mode-autoloads
vertico-posframe-autoloads kmb-autoloads gnome-c-style-autoloads
websocket-autoloads wisitoken-grammar-mode-autoloads mmm-mode-autoloads
topspace-autoloads realgud-jdb-autoloads rainbow-mode-autoloads
js2-mode-autoloads ioccur-autoloads osm-autoloads
boxy-headings-autoloads shell-command+-autoloads url-scgi-autoloads
rbit-autoloads vertico-autoloads company-statistics-autoloads
sm-c-mode-autoloads gpr-mode-autoloads gnat-compiler-autoloads
wisi-autoloads web-server-autoloads swiper-autoloads trie-autoloads
heap-autoloads tNFA-autoloads queue-autoloads vigenere-autoloads
package-fixes-autoloads toc-mode-autoloads ebdb-gnorb-autoloads cl-seq
gnorb-autoloads ivy-explorer-autoloads buffer-env-autoloads
vc-backup-autoloads satchel-autoloads xelb-autoloads
cl-generic-autoloads easy-kill-autoloads csharp-mode-autoloads
aircon-theme-autoloads loccur-autoloads aggressive-completion-autoloads
webfeeder-autoloads boxy-autoloads nftables-mode-autoloads
consult-recoll-autoloads bnf-mode-autoloads pabbrev-autoloads
leaf-autoloads adaptive-wrap-autoloads doc-toc-autoloads ztree-autoloads
use-package-autoloads bind-key-autoloads gpastel-autoloads
cpupower-autoloads ef-themes-autoloads transient-cycles-autoloads
vundo-autoloads pulsar-autoloads context-coloring-autoloads
caps-lock-autoloads persist-autoloads realgud-node-inspect-autoloads
realgud-autoloads test-simple-autoloads loc-changes-autoloads
eldoc-eval-autoloads psgml-autoloads frame-tabs-autoloads
myers-autoloads eev-autoloads names-autoloads kiwix-autoloads
request-autoloads greenbar-autoloads rec-mode-autoloads
shen-mode-autoloads greader-autoloads orderless-autoloads
graphql-autoloads load-relative-autoloads emms-autoloads
iterators-autoloads load-dir-autoloads clipboard-collector-autoloads
hook-helpers-autoloads other-frame-window-autoloads
company-ebdb-autoloads info ebdb-autoloads company-autoloads
assess-autoloads m-buffer-autoloads seq-autoloads ivy-avy-autoloads
avy-autoloads ivy-autoloads corfu-doc-autoloads corfu-autoloads
posframe-autoloads filladapt-autoloads svg-lib-autoloads metar-autoloads
cl-lib-autoloads lv-autoloads embark-consult-autoloads consult-autoloads
compat-autoloads nadvice-autoloads embark-autoloads windresize-autoloads
ess-autoloads ustar-withsub-autoloads rudel-autoloads rudel-backend
warnings icons package browse-url url url-proxy url-privacy url-expand
url-methods url-history url-cookie generate-lisp-file url-domsuf
url-util mailcap url-handlers url-parse auth-source eieio eieio-core
cl-macs gv pcase password-cache json subr-x map byte-opt bytecomp
byte-compile url-vars cl-loaddefs cl-lib rmc iso-transl tooltip cconv
eldoc paren electric uniquify ediff-hook vc-hooks lisp-float-type
elisp-mode mwheel term/x-win x-win term/common-win x-dnd tool-bar dnd
fontset image regexp-opt fringe tabulated-list replace newcomment
text-mode lisp-mode prog-mode register page tab-bar menu-bar rfn-eshadow
isearch easymenu timer select scroll-bar mouse jit-lock font-lock syntax
font-core term/tty-colors frame minibuffer nadvice seq simple cl-generic
indonesian philippine cham georgian utf-8-lang misc-lang vietnamese
tibetan thai tai-viet lao korean japanese eucjp-ms cp51932 hebrew greek
romanian slovak czech european ethiopic indian cyrillic chinese
composite emoji-zwj charscript charprop case-table epa-hook
jka-cmpr-hook help abbrev obarray button loaddefs theme-loaddefs
oclosure cl-preloaded faces cus-face macroexp files window
text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env code-pages mule
custom widget keymap hashtable-print-readable backquote threads dbusbind
inotify dynamic-setting system-font-setting font-render-setting cairo
x-toolkit xinput2 x multi-tty make-network-process emacs)
Memory information:
((conses 16 446004 226855) (symbols 48 32264 176) (strings 32 139470 29573)
(string-bytes 1 4602266) (vectors 16 70511) (vector-slots 8 1801395 281279)
(floats 8 514 350) (intervals 56 20148 0) (buffers 984 43))
Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>:bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN.
Full text available.bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#60527; Package emacs.
Full text available.
GNU bug tracking system
Copyright (C) 1999 Darren O. Benham,
1997 nCipher Corporation Ltd,
1994-97 Ian Jackson.