GNU bug report logs - #63563
29.0.91; package.el should not install unselected packages

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Message #5 received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Jimmy Yuen Ho Wong <wyuenho <at> gmail.com>
To: bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org
Subject: 29.0.91; package.el should not install unselected packages
Date: Thu, 18 May 2023 03:10:23 +0100

Reproduction:

1. M-x list-packages
2. Press x on a line
3. Observer in the echo area package.el is now asking the user to
whether to install the package.

Expectation:

If the user has not pressed i to select the package for installation,
package.el should not ask the user to confirm anything. There's no
action to execute. This is unexpected dwim behavior.

Message #8 received at 63563 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: Jimmy Yuen Ho Wong <wyuenho <at> gmail.com>
Cc: 63563 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#63563: 29.0.91;
 package.el should not install unselected packages
Date: Thu, 18 May 2023 08:45:40 +0300

tags 63563 notabug
thanks

> From: Jimmy Yuen Ho Wong <wyuenho <at> gmail.com>
> Date: Thu, 18 May 2023 03:10:23 +0100
> 
> 1. M-x list-packages
> 2. Press x on a line
> 3. Observer in the echo area package.el is now asking the user to
> whether to install the package.
> 
> Expectation:
> 
> If the user has not pressed i to select the package for installation,
> package.el should not ask the user to confirm anything. There's no
> action to execute. This is unexpected dwim behavior.

From the Emacs manual:

  ‘x’
       Download and install all packages marked with ‘i’, and their
       dependencies; also, delete all packages marked with ‘d’
       (‘package-menu-execute’).  This also removes the marks.  If no
       packages are marked, this command will install the package under
       point (if it isn’t installed already), or delete the package under
       point (if it’s already installed).

The doc string says similar stuff:

  If no packages are marked, the action taken depends on the state
  of the package under point.  If it’s not already installed, this
  command will install the package, and if it’s installed, it will
  delete the package.

So this is documented behavior.  This is not a bug, but a feature.

Message #13 received at 63563 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Philip Kaludercic <philipk <at> posteo.net>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
Cc: 63563 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Jimmy Yuen Ho Wong <wyuenho <at> gmail.com>
Subject: Re: bug#63563: 29.0.91; package.el should not install unselected
 packages
Date: Thu, 18 May 2023 19:53:52 +0000

Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:

> tags 63563 notabug
> thanks
>
>> From: Jimmy Yuen Ho Wong <wyuenho <at> gmail.com>
>> Date: Thu, 18 May 2023 03:10:23 +0100
>> 
>> 1. M-x list-packages
>> 2. Press x on a line
>> 3. Observer in the echo area package.el is now asking the user to
>> whether to install the package.
>> 
>> Expectation:
>> 
>> If the user has not pressed i to select the package for installation,
>> package.el should not ask the user to confirm anything. There's no
>> action to execute. This is unexpected dwim behavior.
>
>>From the Emacs manual:
>
>   ‘x’
>        Download and install all packages marked with ‘i’, and their
>        dependencies; also, delete all packages marked with ‘d’
>        (‘package-menu-execute’).  This also removes the marks.  If no
>        packages are marked, this command will install the package under
>        point (if it isn’t installed already), or delete the package under
>        point (if it’s already installed).
>
> The doc string says similar stuff:
>
>   If no packages are marked, the action taken depends on the state
>   of the package under point.  If it’s not already installed, this
>   command will install the package, and if it’s installed, it will
>   delete the package.
>
> So this is documented behavior.  This is not a bug, but a feature.

That being said, I am not a fan of this DWIM-ish behaviour either.

Message #16 received at 63563 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Jimmy Yuen Ho Wong <wyuenho <at> gmail.com>
To: Philip Kaludercic <philipk <at> posteo.net>
Cc: 63563 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
Subject: Re: bug#63563: 29.0.91;
 package.el should not install unselected packages
Date: Mon, 29 May 2023 01:51:11 +0100

[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]

Is this new behavior no one asked for configurable? Over the many years
I've been using package.el, I've built in muscle memory. After M-x
list-packages, when the packages buffer is done refreshing, I immediately
press U and x without looking. With the new behavior, when there's
no upgrades, I'd be installing the first package at point. Doing that a
couple of times will mean I'll have a couple of extra packages I don't want
installed.

Jimmy


On Thu, May 18, 2023 at 8:53 PM Philip Kaludercic <philipk <at> posteo.net>
wrote:

> Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:
>
> > tags 63563 notabug
> > thanks
> >
> >> From: Jimmy Yuen Ho Wong <wyuenho <at> gmail.com>
> >> Date: Thu, 18 May 2023 03:10:23 +0100
> >>
> >> 1. M-x list-packages
> >> 2. Press x on a line
> >> 3. Observer in the echo area package.el is now asking the user to
> >> whether to install the package.
> >>
> >> Expectation:
> >>
> >> If the user has not pressed i to select the package for installation,
> >> package.el should not ask the user to confirm anything. There's no
> >> action to execute. This is unexpected dwim behavior.
> >
> >>From the Emacs manual:
> >
> >   ‘x’
> >        Download and install all packages marked with ‘i’, and their
> >        dependencies; also, delete all packages marked with ‘d’
> >        (‘package-menu-execute’).  This also removes the marks.  If no
> >        packages are marked, this command will install the package under
> >        point (if it isn’t installed already), or delete the package under
> >        point (if it’s already installed).
> >
> > The doc string says similar stuff:
> >
> >   If no packages are marked, the action taken depends on the state
> >   of the package under point.  If it’s not already installed, this
> >   command will install the package, and if it’s installed, it will
> >   delete the package.
> >
> > So this is documented behavior.  This is not a bug, but a feature.
>
> That being said, I am not a fan of this DWIM-ish behaviour either.
>

[Message part 2 (text/html, inline)]

Message #19 received at 63563 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: Jimmy Yuen Ho Wong <wyuenho <at> gmail.com>
Cc: 63563 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, philipk <at> posteo.net
Subject: Re: bug#63563: 29.0.91;
 package.el should not install unselected packages
Date: Mon, 29 May 2023 16:47:55 +0300

> From: Jimmy Yuen Ho Wong <wyuenho <at> gmail.com>
> Date: Mon, 29 May 2023 01:51:11 +0100
> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>, 63563 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> Is this new behavior no one asked for configurable? Over the many years I've been using package.el,
> I've built in muscle memory. After M-x list-packages, when the packages buffer is done refreshing, I
> immediately press U and x without looking. With the new behavior, when there's no upgrades, I'd be
> installing the first package at point. Doing that a couple of times will mean I'll have a couple of extra
> packages I don't want installed.

It turns out this behavior is new in Emacs 29, see bug#40457 and NEWS.
Since the new behavior is incompatible with the old one, I have now
added a new user option, package-menu-use-current-if-no-marks, to get
back the old behavior, and mentioned it in NEWS.  You can now
customize that option to a nil value to get what you want.

Message #22 received at 63563 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Jimmy Wong <wyuenho <at> gmail.com>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
Cc: 63563 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, philipk <at> posteo.net
Subject: Re: bug#63563: 29.0.91; package.el should not install
 unselected packages
Date: Mon, 29 May 2023 14:57:45 +0100

[Message part 1 (text/plain, inline)]

Thank you so much!
On 29 May 2023 at 2:47 PM +0100, Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>, wrote:
> > From: Jimmy Yuen Ho Wong <wyuenho <at> gmail.com>
> > Date: Mon, 29 May 2023 01:51:11 +0100
> > Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>, 63563 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> >
> > Is this new behavior no one asked for configurable? Over the many years I've been using package.el,
> > I've built in muscle memory. After M-x list-packages, when the packages buffer is done refreshing, I
> > immediately press U and x without looking. With the new behavior, when there's no upgrades, I'd be
> > installing the first package at point. Doing that a couple of times will mean I'll have a couple of extra
> > packages I don't want installed.
>
> It turns out this behavior is new in Emacs 29, see bug#40457 and NEWS.
> Since the new behavior is incompatible with the old one, I have now
> added a new user option, package-menu-use-current-if-no-marks, to get
> back the old behavior, and mentioned it in NEWS. You can now
> customize that option to a nil value to get what you want.

[Message part 2 (text/html, inline)]

Message #27 received at 63563-done <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: Jimmy Wong <wyuenho <at> gmail.com>
Cc: 63563-done <at> debbugs.gnu.org, philipk <at> posteo.net
Subject: Re: bug#63563: 29.0.91; package.el should not install
 unselected packages
Date: Mon, 29 May 2023 17:00:13 +0300

> Date: Mon, 29 May 2023 14:57:45 +0100
> From: Jimmy Wong <wyuenho <at> gmail.com>
> Cc: philipk <at> posteo.net, 63563 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> Thank you so much!

Thanks, I take it that you have tried using this new option, and you
are satisfied.  So I'm closing this bug.

Message #30 received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com>
To: bug-gnu-emacs <at> gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#63563: 29.0.91;
 package.el should not install unselected packages
Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2023 12:36:28 -0400

Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:

> It turns out this behavior is new in Emacs 29, see bug#40457 and NEWS.
> Since the new behavior is incompatible with the old one, I have now
> added a new user option, package-menu-use-current-if-no-marks, to get
> back the old behavior, and mentioned it in NEWS.  You can now
> customize that option to a nil value to get what you want.

Should the default value of
package-menu-use-current-if-no-marks be nil?

That would follow the convention of old behavior being
unchanged unless the user does something to enable the new
behavior.

-- 

Howard

Message #33 received at 63563 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org>
To: Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com>
Cc: 63563 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#63563: 29.0.91;
 package.el should not install unselected packages
Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2023 21:30:09 +0300

> From: Howard Melman <hmelman <at> gmail.com>
> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2023 12:36:28 -0400
> 
> 
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz <at> gnu.org> writes:
> 
> > It turns out this behavior is new in Emacs 29, see bug#40457 and NEWS.
> > Since the new behavior is incompatible with the old one, I have now
> > added a new user option, package-menu-use-current-if-no-marks, to get
> > back the old behavior, and mentioned it in NEWS.  You can now
> > customize that option to a nil value to get what you want.
> 
> Should the default value of
> package-menu-use-current-if-no-marks be nil?
> 
> That would follow the convention of old behavior being
> unchanged unless the user does something to enable the new
> behavior.

The discussion about that should have happened a year ago, when this
change was made.  Since it haven't, we cannot just undo what's been
done a year ago and didn't receive any complaints until now.  Sorry,
we will have to make do with at least the possibility to go back to
the old behavior.

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