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Fri, 14 Feb 2025 09:06:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Fri, 14 Feb 2025 11:06:46 -0600 From: Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <67af6a4d.190a0220.251e62.efc5SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN> References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN> <87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN> <87bk1nuwl3.fsf@HIDDEN> <87jzg8u6tw.fsf@HIDDEN> <86zfp4sqig.fsf@HIDDEN> <875xrmvub2.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikvlj4xr.fsf@HIDDEN> <87ed5fitlq.fsf@HIDDEN> <8734gi3rhb.fsf@HIDDEN> <67ae2a1d.170a0220.29b6ad.f995SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN> <87ldu93gfy.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikpdh9kd.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tcg1fa.fsf@HIDDEN> <67af6a4d.190a0220.251e62.efc5SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2025 11:06:46 -0600 X-Gm-Features: AWEUYZn4q7kKiFXM7O5UFqnEeJXqLeK2SVgfSICWCmdNCf0B0g1aDoLoOBMf9JQ Message-ID: <CADwFkmne2+3POc8P9Wafvf7quztGRthnDeswYmHhvpa2yQajWQ@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle international message reply subject prefixes and insults users To: =?UTF-8?B?QmrDtnJuIEJpZGFy?= <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72442 Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, rpluim@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of te= xt editors" <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> writes: > That's true however the point wasn't that it isn't used but that there > is a point why some programs try to localize the term when many of their > users don't know the Latin abbreviations. Yes, we believe that doing so is fundamentally wrong. It undermines not only interoperability but also cross-language communication. Similarly, we don=E2=80=99t translate example.com to example.f=C3=B6r to "localize" th= e URL for Swedish users. The standard is "Re", and deviating from that is bad and counter-productive. If you disagree, then let's agree to disagree. Meanwhile, I updated the text yet again, and I hope that means that we can now move on to more pressing issues.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
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From: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
In-Reply-To: <86v7tcg1fa.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Fri, 14 Feb
2025 14:23:37 +0200")
References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN>
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<8734gi3rhb.fsf@HIDDEN>
<67ae2a1d.170a0220.29b6ad.f995SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN>
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Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2025 18:06:36 +0200
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Content preview: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: >> From: Björn Bidar
<bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN> >> Cc: rpluim@HIDDEN, 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org >>
Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2025 12:22:52 +0200 >> >> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
writes: >> >> > We could choos [...]
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Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
>> From: Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>
>> Cc: rpluim@HIDDEN, 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2025 12:22:52 +0200
>>=20
>> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
>>=20
>> > We could choose other words, but are we not allowed in general to
>> > express contempt towards silly decisions made out of ignorance?
>>=20
>> The word standards-challanged sounds like ableism.
>
> I don't understand why.
>
> But I was asking a more general question, which you haven't answered.
Because the decision to localize something isn't silly.
>> If I read RFC 5322 correctly it only states:
>>=20
>> "When used in a reply, the field body MAY start with the
>> string "Re: " (an abbreviation of the Latin "in re", meaning "in the
>> matter of")"
>>=20
>> It doesn't say MUST (See section 1.2.1).
>
> Yes, because a reply can simply reuse the original Subject. But I
> don't see how that is relevant.
It's relevant because it says the field body MAY start with Re: (and the
retention rules for it) but doesn't stay other prefixes must not be
used. The issue might be also that before RFC 2822 there wasn't any rule
for how the Subject field should/could look like for replies (RFC 822).
When then non-Latin reply prefixes are already in use before
specification of that RFC it is understandable why some users expect
these prefixes.
>> So there isn't any ignorance but just no use of Latin for the messagge
>> prefix.
>
> The ignorance is not when Re: is not used, the ignorance is when it is
> assumed to be a short for "response", and especially be software
> developers who develop localized MUAs.
>
>> In any case manuals goal should educational, not there to insert
>> off-handed remarks of localization of Latin terms.
>
> I'm asking again: aren't we allowed to express contempt towards
> ignorance? Isn't contempt towards ignorance an important educational
> device?
Towards what ignorance to try make it easier for users to understand the
prefix? While Re: might be easy to guess there's still a point in
translating the term.
But wherever my point was about the remark not any argument behind.=20
>> I think this also related to (info "(standards) GNU Manuals"):
>
> Please report any problems you have with that document to the
> appropriate forum. Here we are discussing only the Emacs manuals, for
> which we are responsible as part of the Emacs project.
I used manual mentioned above as reference.=20
>> Remember that the audience for a GNU manual (and other GNU
>> documentation) is global, and that it will be used for years, maybe
>> decades. This means that the reader could have very different cultural
>> reference points. Decades from now, all but old folks will have very
>> different cultural reference points; many things that "everyone knows
>> about" today may be mostly forgotten.
>>=20
>> For this reason, try to avoid writing in a way that depends on
>> cultural reference points for proper understanding, or that refers to
>> them in ways that would impede reading for someone that doesn't
>> recognize them.
>
> There's no "Latin culture" nowadays, so cultural references are not
> relevant here. Latin is part of a general cross-culture educational
> level, and it's IMO reasonable to expect people using email to know
> where it came from, especially if they are designing and coding MUAs.
I am not talking about Latin as in the culture but the use a auxiliary
language inside the local language. Not every Latin term is used as
cross cultural term, if Latin is used at all in the specific local
language varies.
> Won't you expect a person who writes scientific papers to know what
> "Cf." or "QED" mean?
For English scientific papers sure. For German or Finnish not so much.
Finnish isn't my native language so my knowledge is limited, however for
German the use of Latin abbreviations is rare.
>> >> I don't think insulting or judging user who don't use English
>> >> as their native language is a good thing.
>> >
>> > As the text says, "res" is Latin, not English. So this has nothing to
>> > do with native English speakers.
>>=20
>> Those who use English might want to use "Re:" based on the Latin "res"
>> but that doesn't mean everyone else uses this Latin based abbreviation.
>> So just because it's custom in the English speaking world doesn't mean
>> it's done everywhere else.
>
> "Re:" is used in many non-English locales, so it is definitely NOT
> English-specific.
That's true however the point wasn't that it isn't used but that there
is a point why some programs try to localize the term when many of their
users don't know the Latin abbreviations.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
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Fri, 14 Feb 2025 07:03:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Fri, 14 Feb 2025 07:03:13 -0800 From: Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <87v7tc22df.fsf@HIDDEN> References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN> <87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN> <87bk1nuwl3.fsf@HIDDEN> <87jzg8u6tw.fsf@HIDDEN> <86zfp4sqig.fsf@HIDDEN> <875xrmvub2.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikvlj4xr.fsf@HIDDEN> <87ed5fitlq.fsf@HIDDEN> <8734gi3rhb.fsf@HIDDEN> <67ae2a1d.170a0220.29b6ad.f995SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN> <87ldu93gfy.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikpdh9kd.fsf@HIDDEN> <67af197f.df0a0220.290c03.7e93SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN> <87v7tc22df.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2025 07:03:13 -0800 X-Gm-Features: AWEUYZn6ESI2bjy0ZvYXSRr-lJXhmu0OAxZ0y9bJcMgkFqZl3KZCBSfVa2FGmmA Message-ID: <CADwFkmmwLYvhP+YSZCVXJBwZCEbuM4-v-bGE64kDTkrhgQNLAA@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle international message reply subject prefixes and insults users To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>, =?UTF-8?B?QmrDtnJuIEJpZGFy?= <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72442 Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> writes: >>>>>> On Fri, 14 Feb 2025 12:22:52 +0200, Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@th= aodan.de> said: > > Bj=C3=B6rn> The word standards-challanged sounds like ableism. > > OK, we can put back "illiterate nincompoops" then. +1
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
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Fri, 14 Feb 2025 07:01:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from 753933720722 named unknown by gmailapi.google.com with HTTPREST; Fri, 14 Feb 2025 09:01:16 -0600 From: Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <67af19df.050a0220.2e03cf.0769SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN> References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN> <87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN> <87bk1nuwl3.fsf@HIDDEN> <87jzg8u6tw.fsf@HIDDEN> <86zfp4sqig.fsf@HIDDEN> <875xrmvub2.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikvlj4xr.fsf@HIDDEN> <87ed5fitlq.fsf@HIDDEN> <8734gi3rhb.fsf@HIDDEN> <67ae2a1d.170a0220.29b6ad.f995SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN> <87ldu93gfy.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikpdh9kd.fsf@HIDDEN> <67af19df.050a0220.2e03cf.0769SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2025 09:01:16 -0600 X-Gm-Features: AWEUYZlclkzv48v-QegckHlfs88JmxdrxAGdrUAhHSycys3qptyR1ZQJWx1oH8Y Message-ID: <CADwFkmkgWgO1pAnGJKkX-7AKNQc6Z_ZOwGEsYEhMahHSiGjSyw@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle international message reply subject prefixes and insults users To: =?UTF-8?B?QmrDtnJuIEJpZGFy?= <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72442 Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, rpluim@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of te= xt editors" <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> writes: > If I read RFC 5322 correctly it only states: > > "When used in a reply, the field body MAY start with the > string "Re: " (an abbreviation of the Latin "in re", meaning "in the > matter of")" > > It doesn't say MUST (See section 1.2.1). Not every email is a reply, so having a MUST would be strange. It also doesn't say that it MAY start with "Sv: " or similar.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 72442) by debbugs.gnu.org; 14 Feb 2025 12:23:50 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Fri Feb 14 07:23:50 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47424 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tiujW-0003ap-7P for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 14 Feb 2025 07:23:50 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:51540) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tiujR-0003aO-FN for 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 14 Feb 2025 07:23:48 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tiujL-0003NA-Fm; Fri, 14 Feb 2025 07:23:39 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=JZfMG7q27UvHIB/44hB9JwKLfmHkSrGSuodrDyswdsg=; b=n6jZ15uWrpArVMbHbUAS 8GWLlPY/JPplsEnlbdP+sf7jXLkRaH0rEmXwVUKtJ04m10ohck5lNk2EF5OdQumEiDKz73o3qE+Vz KR1hPsHXEBPtGQhupMSf6OU0djPaJCcmxeRN67MyjgUQsKG9pQFGNyakikEie9Fn4y07DDHj4YIcY M6hKtjIqqxhCsN/M7h+z6uRkObBjB0Jl7tgMk6UiZP0kf1sEtaEzJwNXRa4E27F+VUpAbTykWdLK6 VU6B3z3pDv3PUxRrtxn88Iew0LN3DdUfPff76rHKSqrqGOtMGUtRthRBr4XRGvHxCiKAmlkVuIpqG 2rVQCvfFSR2Yvg==; Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2025 14:23:37 +0200 Message-Id: <86v7tcg1fa.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <87wmdsddvn.fsf@> (message from =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar on Fri, 14 Feb 2025 12:22:52 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle international message reply subject prefixes and insults users References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN> <87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN> <87bk1nuwl3.fsf@HIDDEN> <87jzg8u6tw.fsf@HIDDEN> <86zfp4sqig.fsf@HIDDEN> <875xrmvub2.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikvlj4xr.fsf@HIDDEN> <87ed5fitlq.fsf@HIDDEN> <8734gi3rhb.fsf@HIDDEN> <67ae2a1d.170a0220.29b6ad.f995SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN> <87ldu93gfy.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikpdh9kd.fsf@HIDDEN> <87wmdsddvn.fsf@> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72442 Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, rpluim@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Björn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN> > Cc: rpluim@HIDDEN, 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2025 12:22:52 +0200 > > Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: > > > We could choose other words, but are we not allowed in general to > > express contempt towards silly decisions made out of ignorance? > > The word standards-challanged sounds like ableism. I don't understand why. But I was asking a more general question, which you haven't answered. > If I read RFC 5322 correctly it only states: > > "When used in a reply, the field body MAY start with the > string "Re: " (an abbreviation of the Latin "in re", meaning "in the > matter of")" > > It doesn't say MUST (See section 1.2.1). Yes, because a reply can simply reuse the original Subject. But I don't see how that is relevant. > So there isn't any ignorance but just no use of Latin for the messagge > prefix. The ignorance is not when Re: is not used, the ignorance is when it is assumed to be a short for "response", and especially be software developers who develop localized MUAs. > In any case manuals goal should educational, not there to insert > off-handed remarks of localization of Latin terms. I'm asking again: aren't we allowed to express contempt towards ignorance? Isn't contempt towards ignorance an important educational device? > I think this also related to (info "(standards) GNU Manuals"): Please report any problems you have with that document to the appropriate forum. Here we are discussing only the Emacs manuals, for which we are responsible as part of the Emacs project. > Remember that the audience for a GNU manual (and other GNU > documentation) is global, and that it will be used for years, maybe > decades. This means that the reader could have very different cultural > reference points. Decades from now, all but old folks will have very > different cultural reference points; many things that "everyone knows > about" today may be mostly forgotten. > > For this reason, try to avoid writing in a way that depends on > cultural reference points for proper understanding, or that refers to > them in ways that would impede reading for someone that doesn't > recognize them. There's no "Latin culture" nowadays, so cultural references are not relevant here. Latin is part of a general cross-culture educational level, and it's IMO reasonable to expect people using email to know where it came from, especially if they are designing and coding MUAs. Won't you expect a person who writes scientific papers to know what "Cf." or "QED" mean? > >> I don't think insulting or judging user who don't use English > >> as their native language is a good thing. > > > > As the text says, "res" is Latin, not English. So this has nothing to > > do with native English speakers. > > Those who use English might want to use "Re:" based on the Latin "res" > but that doesn't mean everyone else uses this Latin based abbreviation. > So just because it's custom in the English speaking world doesn't mean > it's done everywhere else. "Re:" is used in many non-English locales, so it is definitely NOT English-specific.
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From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
To: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
In-Reply-To: <67af197f.df0a0220.290c03.7e93SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN>
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>>>>> On Fri, 14 Feb 2025 12:22:52 +0200, Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@tha=
odan.de> said:
Bj=C3=B6rn> The word standards-challanged sounds like ableism.
OK, we can put back "illiterate nincompoops" then.
Robert
--=20
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
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From: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
In-Reply-To: <86ikpdh9kd.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Thu, 13 Feb
2025 22:30:10 +0200")
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Date: Fri, 14 Feb 2025 12:22:52 +0200
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Content preview: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: >> From: Björn Bidar
<bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN> >> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2025 20:04:16 +0200 >> >> Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
writes: >> >> > [...]
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Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
>> From: Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>
>> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2025 20:04:16 +0200
>>=20
>> Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> writes:
>>=20
>> >>>>>> On Thu, 13 Feb 2025 19:21:32 +0200, Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar <bjorn.bidar=
@thaodan.de> said:
>> >
>> > Bj=C3=B6rn> The message manual is still tell insulting users and/o=
r is inaccurate now:
>> >
>> > >> =E2=80=98message-subject-re-regexp=E2=80=99
>> > >> Responses to messages have subjects that start with =E2=80=98Re=
: =E2=80=99. This
>> > >> is _not_ an abbreviation of the English word =E2=80=9Cresponse=
=E2=80=9D, but it
>> > >> comes from the Latin =E2=80=9Cres=E2=80=9D, and means =E2=80=9C=
in the matter of=E2=80=9D. Some
>> > >> illiterate nincompoops have failed to grasp this fact, and have
>> > >> =E2=80=9Cinternationalized=E2=80=9D their software to use abomi=
nations like =E2=80=98Aw: =E2=80=99
>> > >> (=E2=80=9Cantwort=E2=80=9D) or =E2=80=98Sv: =E2=80=99 (=E2=80=
=9Csvar=E2=80=9D) instead, which is meaningless and
>> > >> evil. However, you may have to deal with users that use these =
evil
>> > >> tools, in which case you may set this variable to a regexp that
>> > >> matches these prefixes. Myself, I just throw away non-compliant
>> > >> mail.
>> >
>> > Bj=C3=B6rn> (info "(message) Message Headers")
>> >
>> > That text is slightly different now, but I=CA=BCm not going to bowdler=
ize
>> > it further.
>>=20
>> standards-challenged? The voicing is still passive aggressive. I think
>> it should be enough to say some users might fail to understand or
>> misunderstand. Even better could be to just drop the drop the offhanded
>> comment.
>
> We could choose other words, but are we not allowed in general to
> express contempt towards silly decisions made out of ignorance?
The word standards-challanged sounds like ableism.
If I read RFC 5322 correctly it only states:
"When used in a reply, the field body MAY start with the
string "Re: " (an abbreviation of the Latin "in re", meaning "in the
matter of")"
It doesn't say MUST (See section 1.2.1).
So there isn't any ignorance but just no use of Latin for the messagge
prefix. In any case manuals goal should educational, not there to insert
off-handed remarks of localization of Latin terms. I think this also
related to (info "(standards) GNU Manuals"):
Remember that the audience for a GNU manual (and other GNU
documentation) is global, and that it will be used for years, maybe
decades. This means that the reader could have very different cultural
reference points. Decades from now, all but old folks will have very
different cultural reference points; many things that "everyone knows
about" today may be mostly forgotten.
For this reason, try to avoid writing in a way that depends on
cultural reference points for proper understanding, or that refers to
them in ways that would impede reading for someone that doesn't
recognize them.
In this context there is nothing impeding directly but certainly
distracts from the purpose of the manual and makes it looks like it's ok
to just drop answers which not use the Latin prefix although that's
perfectly ok, even if the applicable RFC 5322 is the deciding factor.=20
>> I don't think insulting or judging user who don't use English
>> as their native language is a good thing.
>
> As the text says, "res" is Latin, not English. So this has nothing to
> do with native English speakers.
Those who use English might want to use "Re:" based on the Latin "res"
but that doesn't mean everyone else uses this Latin based abbreviation.
So just because it's custom in the English speaking world doesn't mean
it's done everywhere else.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 72442) by debbugs.gnu.org; 13 Feb 2025 20:30:24 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Thu Feb 13 15:30:24 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:45631 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1tifqp-0000Cl-Oi for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 13 Feb 2025 15:30:24 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:43444) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tifqn-0000BD-DI for 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 13 Feb 2025 15:30:22 -0500 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tifqh-0006N8-Ho; Thu, 13 Feb 2025 15:30:15 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=fGYF1LuQDZQrXALjbwXHIKTZRc4YiqPB8V5H6bVx0H4=; b=T7wP++V26TBtjfePJQiE XEo5iW2GnuA0fwk5FTIDrtkYUlOxupJAbHiFERC+fUZujMM5KebjygFa5v22gDD3DjwFqYOG8RMdw dTKKPyesGuYU/Qe9UgLMYXxIUMPgKkju8UYnQZ5k3uLA8V0q8+aKI0jtLpqZ+xjnFHt5nwWGS/AGz GUkYZgv6mRNXqrdu3STjVH3qs/1WdRlEQDAbQItBxjMcdsk1hd4iaWULQag6W11PqmKuE+VbCPPLS Kd4Z/njSjVMxaSjp74Defv2uKGyNC+Q1l/HJFFor5uL4ETFM5QMK9vHT4RAZA36PXEXGUMEVYox63 Pxj+Bxk+2QMSSA==; Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2025 22:30:10 +0200 Message-Id: <86ikpdh9kd.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <87a5apen6n.fsf@> (message from =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar on Thu, 13 Feb 2025 20:04:16 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle international message reply subject prefixes and insults users References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN> <87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN> <87bk1nuwl3.fsf@HIDDEN> <87jzg8u6tw.fsf@HIDDEN> <86zfp4sqig.fsf@HIDDEN> <875xrmvub2.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikvlj4xr.fsf@HIDDEN> <87ed5fitlq.fsf@HIDDEN> <8734gi3rhb.fsf@HIDDEN> <67ae2a1d.170a0220.29b6ad.f995SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN> <87ldu93gfy.fsf@HIDDEN> <87a5apen6n.fsf@> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72442 Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, rpluim@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Björn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN> > Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2025 20:04:16 +0200 > > Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> writes: > > >>>>>> On Thu, 13 Feb 2025 19:21:32 +0200, Björn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN> said: > > > > Björn> The message manual is still tell insulting users and/or is inaccurate now: > > > > >> ‘message-subject-re-regexp’ > > >> Responses to messages have subjects that start with ‘Re: ’. This > > >> is _not_ an abbreviation of the English word “response”, but it > > >> comes from the Latin “res”, and means “in the matter of”. Some > > >> illiterate nincompoops have failed to grasp this fact, and have > > >> “internationalized” their software to use abominations like ‘Aw: ’ > > >> (“antwort”) or ‘Sv: ’ (“svar”) instead, which is meaningless and > > >> evil. However, you may have to deal with users that use these evil > > >> tools, in which case you may set this variable to a regexp that > > >> matches these prefixes. Myself, I just throw away non-compliant > > >> mail. > > > > Björn> (info "(message) Message Headers") > > > > That text is slightly different now, but Iʼm not going to bowdlerize > > it further. > > standards-challenged? The voicing is still passive aggressive. I think > it should be enough to say some users might fail to understand or > misunderstand. Even better could be to just drop the drop the offhanded > comment. We could choose other words, but are we not allowed in general to express contempt towards silly decisions made out of ignorance? > I don't think insulting or judging user who don't use English > as their native language is a good thing. As the text says, "res" is Latin, not English. So this has nothing to do with native English speakers.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
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From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
To: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
In-Reply-To: <67ae3422.df0a0220.3f5f8.ebf3SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN>
References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87bk1nuwl3.fsf@HIDDEN> <87jzg8u6tw.fsf@HIDDEN>
<86zfp4sqig.fsf@HIDDEN> <875xrmvub2.fsf@HIDDEN>
<86ikvlj4xr.fsf@HIDDEN> <87ed5fitlq.fsf@HIDDEN>
<8734gi3rhb.fsf@HIDDEN>
<67ae2a1d.170a0220.29b6ad.f995SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN>
<87ldu93gfy.fsf@HIDDEN>
<67ae3422.df0a0220.3f5f8.ebf3SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN>
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2025 19:57:52 +0100
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>>>>> On Thu, 13 Feb 2025 20:04:16 +0200, Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@tha=
odan.de> said:
Bj=C3=B6rn> Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> writes:
>>>>>>> On Thu, 13 Feb 2025 19:21:32 +0200, Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar <bjorn.bid=
ar@HIDDEN> said:
>>=20
Bj=C3=B6rn> The message manual is still tell insulting users and/or is =
inaccurate now:
>>=20
>> >> =E2=80=98message-subject-re-regexp=E2=80=99
>> >> Responses to messages have subjects that start with =E2=80=98Re: =
=E2=80=99. This
>> >> is _not_ an abbreviation of the English word =E2=80=9Cresponse=E2=
=80=9D, but it
>> >> comes from the Latin =E2=80=9Cres=E2=80=9D, and means =E2=80=9Cin=
the matter of=E2=80=9D. Some
>> >> illiterate nincompoops have failed to grasp this fact, and have
>> >> =E2=80=9Cinternationalized=E2=80=9D their software to use abomina=
tions like =E2=80=98Aw: =E2=80=99
>> >> (=E2=80=9Cantwort=E2=80=9D) or =E2=80=98Sv: =E2=80=99 (=E2=80=9Cs=
var=E2=80=9D) instead, which is meaningless and
>> >> evil. However, you may have to deal with users that use these ev=
il
>> >> tools, in which case you may set this variable to a regexp that
>> >> matches these prefixes. Myself, I just throw away non-compliant
>> >> mail.
>>=20
Bj=C3=B6rn> (info "(message) Message Headers")
>>=20
>> That text is slightly different now, but I=CA=BCm not going to bowdl=
erize
>> it further.
Bj=C3=B6rn> standards-challenged? The voicing is still passive aggressi=
ve. I think
Bj=C3=B6rn> it should be enough to say some users might fail to underst=
and or
Bj=C3=B6rn> misunderstand. Even better could be to just drop the drop t=
he offhanded
Bj=C3=B6rn> comment. I don't think insulting or judging user who don't =
use English
Bj=C3=B6rn> as their native language is a good thing.
The text concerns the *providers* of email software who changed it to
internationalize the "Re" prefix, in ignorance of the relevant
standards. It offers no judgement on the *users* of said software
based on their native language.
Robert
--=20
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
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From: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>
To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
In-Reply-To: <87ldu93gfy.fsf@HIDDEN> (Robert Pluim's message of "Thu, 13
Feb 2025 18:25:21 +0100")
References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87bk1nuwl3.fsf@HIDDEN> <87jzg8u6tw.fsf@HIDDEN>
<86zfp4sqig.fsf@HIDDEN> <875xrmvub2.fsf@HIDDEN>
<86ikvlj4xr.fsf@HIDDEN> <87ed5fitlq.fsf@HIDDEN>
<8734gi3rhb.fsf@HIDDEN>
<67ae2a1d.170a0220.29b6ad.f995SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN>
<87ldu93gfy.fsf@HIDDEN>
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Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2025 20:04:16 +0200
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Content preview: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> writes: >>>>>> On Thu, 13
Feb 2025 19:21:32 +0200, Björn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN> said: > > Björn>
The message manual is still tell insulting users and/or is inaccurate now:
> > >> ‘message-subject- [...]
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Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> writes:
>>>>>> On Thu, 13 Feb 2025 19:21:32 +0200, Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@th=
aodan.de> said:
>
> Bj=C3=B6rn> The message manual is still tell insulting users and/or i=
s inaccurate now:
>
> >> =E2=80=98message-subject-re-regexp=E2=80=99
> >> Responses to messages have subjects that start with =E2=80=98Re: =
=E2=80=99. This
> >> is _not_ an abbreviation of the English word =E2=80=9Cresponse=E2=
=80=9D, but it
> >> comes from the Latin =E2=80=9Cres=E2=80=9D, and means =E2=80=9Cin =
the matter of=E2=80=9D. Some
> >> illiterate nincompoops have failed to grasp this fact, and have
> >> =E2=80=9Cinternationalized=E2=80=9D their software to use abominat=
ions like =E2=80=98Aw: =E2=80=99
> >> (=E2=80=9Cantwort=E2=80=9D) or =E2=80=98Sv: =E2=80=99 (=E2=80=9Csv=
ar=E2=80=9D) instead, which is meaningless and
> >> evil. However, you may have to deal with users that use these evil
> >> tools, in which case you may set this variable to a regexp that
> >> matches these prefixes. Myself, I just throw away non-compliant
> >> mail.
>
> Bj=C3=B6rn> (info "(message) Message Headers")
>
> That text is slightly different now, but I=CA=BCm not going to bowdlerize
> it further.
standards-challenged? The voicing is still passive aggressive. I think
it should be enough to say some users might fail to understand or
misunderstand. Even better could be to just drop the drop the offhanded
comment. I don't think insulting or judging user who don't use English
as their native language is a good thing.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
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From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
To: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
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>>>>> On Thu, 13 Feb 2025 19:21:32 +0200, Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@tha=
odan.de> said:
Bj=C3=B6rn> The message manual is still tell insulting users and/or is =
inaccurate now:
>> =E2=80=98message-subject-re-regexp=E2=80=99
>> Responses to messages have subjects that start with =E2=80=98Re: =E2=
=80=99. This
>> is _not_ an abbreviation of the English word =E2=80=9Cresponse=E2=80=
=9D, but it
>> comes from the Latin =E2=80=9Cres=E2=80=9D, and means =E2=80=9Cin th=
e matter of=E2=80=9D. Some
>> illiterate nincompoops have failed to grasp this fact, and have
>> =E2=80=9Cinternationalized=E2=80=9D their software to use abominatio=
ns like =E2=80=98Aw: =E2=80=99
>> (=E2=80=9Cantwort=E2=80=9D) or =E2=80=98Sv: =E2=80=99 (=E2=80=9Csvar=
=E2=80=9D) instead, which is meaningless and
>> evil. However, you may have to deal with users that use these evil
>> tools, in which case you may set this variable to a regexp that
>> matches these prefixes. Myself, I just throw away non-compliant
>> mail.
Bj=C3=B6rn> (info "(message) Message Headers")
That text is slightly different now, but I=CA=BCm not going to bowdlerize
it further.
Robert
--=20
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
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From: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>
To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
In-Reply-To: <8734gi3rhb.fsf@HIDDEN> (Robert Pluim's message of "Thu, 13
Feb 2025 14:26:56 +0100")
References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN>
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Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2025 19:21:32 +0200
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Content preview: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> writes: > tags 72442 fixed
> close 72442 31.1 > quit > > This has been working fine for me for a while,
and if it breaks I have > time to fix it this week 😸 > > Closing. > Committed
as 315519fa7c8 > > Robe [...]
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Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> writes:
> tags 72442 fixed
> close 72442 31.1
> quit
>
> This has been working fine for me for a while, and if it breaks I have
> time to fix it this week =F0=9F=98=B8
>
> Closing.
> Committed as 315519fa7c8
>
> Robert
The message manual is still tell insulting users and/or is inaccurate now:
> =E2=80=98message-subject-re-regexp=E2=80=99
> Responses to messages have subjects that start with =E2=80=98Re: =E2=
=80=99. This
> is _not_ an abbreviation of the English word =E2=80=9Cresponse=E2=80=
=9D, but it
> comes from the Latin =E2=80=9Cres=E2=80=9D, and means =E2=80=9Cin the=
matter of=E2=80=9D. Some
> illiterate nincompoops have failed to grasp this fact, and have
> =E2=80=9Cinternationalized=E2=80=9D their software to use abomination=
s like =E2=80=98Aw: =E2=80=99
> (=E2=80=9Cantwort=E2=80=9D) or =E2=80=98Sv: =E2=80=99 (=E2=80=9Csvar=
=E2=80=9D) instead, which is meaningless and
> evil. However, you may have to deal with users that use these evil
> tools, in which case you may set this variable to a regexp that
> matches these prefixes. Myself, I just throw away non-compliant
> mail.
(info "(message) Message Headers")
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
Full text available.Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
to control <at> debbugs.gnu.org.
Full text available.Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
to control <at> debbugs.gnu.org.
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Committed as 315519fa7c8 Robert --=20
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
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From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
In-Reply-To: Robert Pluim's message of "(unknown date)"
References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87bk1nuwl3.fsf@HIDDEN> <87jzg8u6tw.fsf@HIDDEN>
<86zfp4sqig.fsf@HIDDEN> <875xrmvub2.fsf@HIDDEN>
<86ikvlj4xr.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2024 16:52:17 +0200
Message-ID: <87ed5fitlq.fsf@HIDDEN>
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--=-=-=
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>>>>> Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> said:
>>>>> On Tue, 27 Aug 2024 19:39:28 +0300, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> said:
>>> From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
>>> Cc: bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN, 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>>> Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2024 17:50:41 +0200
>>>=20
>>> >>>>> On Thu, 22 Aug 2024 15:15:03 +0300, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN=
rg> said:
>>>=20
Eli> For backward compatibility, let's leave rmail-re-abbrevs in place,=
and
Eli> just initialize it from that new defcustom.
>>>
OK
>>> + "\\(\\[[0-9]*\\]\\)*"
>>> + " ?\u00a0*[:=EF=BC=9A][ \t]*"
Eli> These two parts could use a comment that explains what they handle.
>>> + "\\(([0-9]+)\\|\\[[0-9]+\\]\\|\\^[0-9]+\\)?"
>>> + " ?\u00a0*[:=EF=BC=9A][ \t]*\\)*[ \t]*")))
Eli> Same here.
Done. The rmail and gnus code now use exactly the same final regexp
derived from the new user option. Patch attached, it=CA=BCs been working
fine for me in Gnus, but somebody who uses rmail should give it a go.
Robert
--=20
--=-=-=
Content-Type: text/x-diff; charset=utf-8
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filename=0001-Teach-gnus-message-about-international-Re-variants.patch
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
From 2452929bc2a615a93a626c06ac8b70e726789fed Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001
From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2024 18:49:12 +0200
Subject: [PATCH] Teach gnus/message about international Re: variants
To: emacs-devel@HIDDEN
Bug#72442
* lisp/mail/mail-utils.el (mail-re-regexps): New defcustom, contains the
components used to construct 'rmail-re-abbrevs' and
'message-subject-re-regexp'.
* lisp/gnus/message.el (message-subject-re-regexp): Derive from
'mail-re-regexps'.
(message-strip-subject-re): Make the match case-insensitive.
* lisp/mail/rmail.el (rmail-re-abbrevs): Derive from 'mail-re-regexps'.
Update 'rmail-reply-regexp' when it changes.
(rmail-reply-regexp): Set to nil, 'rmail-re-abbrevs' will set it.
* doc/emacs/rmail.texi (Rmail Reply): Describe 'mail-re-regexps'.
* doc/misc/message.texi (Message Headers): Describe 'mail-re-regexps'.
---
doc/emacs/rmail.texi | 8 ++++++++
doc/misc/message.texi | 13 ++++++++++++-
etc/NEWS | 26 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++
lisp/gnus/message.el | 25 ++++++++++++++++++-------
lisp/mail/mail-utils.el | 31 +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
lisp/mail/rmail.el | 27 ++++++++++++++++-----------
6 files changed, 111 insertions(+), 19 deletions(-)
diff --git a/doc/emacs/rmail.texi b/doc/emacs/rmail.texi
index 9c20d30c442..e090ec6fe76 100644
--- a/doc/emacs/rmail.texi
+++ b/doc/emacs/rmail.texi
@@ -776,6 +776,14 @@ Rmail Reply
sent the message you received, and the @samp{CC} field starts out with
all the other recipients of that message.
=20
+@vindex rmail-re-abbrevs
+@vindex rmail-reply-prefix
+@vindex mail-re-regexps
+The @samp{Subject} header field may contain one or more instances of
+@samp{Re:} or localized variants thereof. These are removed if they
+match @code{rmail-re-abbrevs} (which is initialized from
+@code{mail-re-regexps}), and @code{rmail-reply-prefix} is prepended.
+
@vindex mail-dont-reply-to-names
You can exclude certain recipients from being included automatically
in replies, using the variable @code{mail-dont-reply-to-names}. Its
diff --git a/doc/misc/message.texi b/doc/misc/message.texi
index 468bf81599d..f5399aecee1 100644
--- a/doc/misc/message.texi
+++ b/doc/misc/message.texi
@@ -1693,13 +1693,14 @@ Message Headers
=20
@item message-subject-re-regexp
@vindex message-subject-re-regexp
+@vindex mail-re-regexps
@cindex Aw
@cindex Sv
@cindex Re
Responses to messages have subjects that start with @samp{Re: }. This
is @emph{not} an abbreviation of the English word ``response'', but it
comes from the Latin ``res'', and means ``in the matter of''. Some
-illiterate nincompoops have failed to grasp this fact, and have
+standards-challenged companies have failed to grasp this fact, and have
``internationalized'' their software to use abominations like
@samp{Aw: } (``antwort'') or @samp{Sv: } (``svar'') instead, which is
meaningless and evil. However, you may have to deal with users that
@@ -1731,6 +1732,16 @@ Message Headers
))
@end lisp
=20
+You shouldn't need to do this, since the default value of
+@code{message-subject-re-regexp} is initialized based on
+@code{mail-re-regexps}, which covers most known cases of such
+internationalization, and is a lot easier to customize. Customizing
+@code{mail-re-regexps} updates @code{message-subject-re-regexp} to
+match.
+
+Note that the regexp is matched case-insensitively against the
+@samp{Subject} header contents.
+
@item message-subject-trailing-was-query
@vindex message-subject-trailing-was-query
@vindex message-subject-trailing-was-ask-regexp
diff --git a/etc/NEWS b/etc/NEWS
index 8bd5c7c9515..35de85224d9 100644
--- a/etc/NEWS
+++ b/etc/NEWS
@@ -194,6 +194,32 @@ By passing '-t' or '--timeout', you can specify a maxi=
mum time to wait
for the processes to exit. Additionally, you can now wait for external
processes by passing their PIDs.
=20
++++
+** Mail-util
+
+*** New user option 'mail-re-regexps'.
+This contains the list of regular expressions used to match "Re:" and
+international variants of it when modifying the Subject field in
+replies.
+
++++
+** Rmail
+
+*** 'rmail-re-abbrevs' default value is now derived from 'mail-re-regexps'.
+'mail-re-regexps' is a new user option that is easier to customize than
+'rmail-re-abbrevs'. 'rmail-re-abbrevs' is still honored if it was
+already set.
+
++++
+** Message
+
+*** 'message-subject-re-regexp' default value is now derived from 'mail-re=
-regexps'.
+'mail-re-regexps' is a new user option that is easier to customize than
+'message-subject-re-regexp'. 'message-subject-re-regexp' is still
+honored if it was already set.
+
+*** 'message-strip-subject-re' now matches case-insensitively.
+
** SHR
=20
+++
diff --git a/lisp/gnus/message.el b/lisp/gnus/message.el
index d52ed9662a7..ad0c4d1f3f8 100644
--- a/lisp/gnus/message.el
+++ b/lisp/gnus/message.el
@@ -305,11 +305,20 @@ message-ignored-supersedes-headers
regexp))
=20
(defcustom message-subject-re-regexp
- "^[ \t]*\\([Rr][Ee]\\(\\[[0-9]*\\]\\)* ?:[ \t]*\\)*[ \t]*"
- "Regexp matching \"Re: \" in the subject line."
+ (mail--wrap-re-regexp
+ (concat
+ "\\("
+ (string-join mail-re-regexps "\\|")
+ "\\)"))
+ "Regexp matching \"Re: \" in the subject line.
+Matching is done case-insensitively.
+Initialized from the value of `mail-re-regexps', which is easier to
+customize."
:group 'message-various
:link '(custom-manual "(message)Message Headers")
- :type 'regexp)
+ :type 'regexp
+ :set-after '(mail-re-regexps)
+ :version "31.1")
=20
(defcustom message-screenshot-command '("import" "png:-")
"Command to take a screenshot.
@@ -2257,10 +2266,12 @@ message-strip-list-identifiers
subject)))
=20
(defun message-strip-subject-re (subject)
- "Remove \"Re:\" from subject lines in string SUBJECT."
- (if (string-match message-subject-re-regexp subject)
- (substring subject (match-end 0))
- subject))
+ "Remove \"Re:\" from subject lines in string SUBJECT.
+This uses `mail-re-regexps, matching is done case-insensitively."
+ (let ((case-fold-search t))
+ (if (string-match message-subject-re-regexp subject)
+ (substring subject (match-end 0))
+ subject)))
=20
(defcustom message-replacement-char "."
"Replacement character used instead of unprintable or not decodable char=
s."
diff --git a/lisp/mail/mail-utils.el b/lisp/mail/mail-utils.el
index c9e4d0b3812..cfac56c0125 100644
--- a/lisp/mail/mail-utils.el
+++ b/lisp/mail/mail-utils.el
@@ -46,6 +46,37 @@ mail-dont-reply-to-names
:type '(choice regexp (const :tag "Your Name" nil))
:group 'mail)
=20
+(defun mail--wrap-re-regexp (re)
+ (concat "\\`[ \t]*"
+ "\\("
+ re
+ ; Re(1) or Re[1] or Re^1
+ "\\(([0-9]+)\\|\\[[0-9]+\\]\\|\\^[0-9]+\\)?"
+ ; SPC/NBSP followed by colon and TAB/SPC
+ " ?\u00a0*[:=EF=BC=9A][ \t]*"
+ ; Handle repetition, eg "Re[1]: Re[2]:"
+ "\\)*"
+ "[ \t]*"))
+
+;;;###autoload
+(defcustom mail-re-regexps
+ '("RE" "R\u00c9\\.?" "FWD?" "=D8=B1=D8=AF" "=E5=9B=9E=E5=A4=8D" "=E5=9B=
=9E=E8=A6=86" "SV" "Antw\\.?"
+ "VS" "REF" "AW" "=CE=91=CE=A0" "=CE=A3=CE=A7=CE=95=CE=A4" "=D7=94=D7=A9=
=D7=91" "V=C3=A1" "R" "RIF" "BLS" "RES"
+ "Odp" "YNT" "ATB")
+ "List of localized \"Re:\" abbreviations in various languages.
+Each component can be a regular expression or a simple string. Matching
+is done case-insensitively. Used to initialize the legacy
+`rmail-re-abbrevs' and `message-subject-re-regexp' user options."
+ :type '(repeat regexp)
+ :set (lambda (sym val)
+ (custom-set-default sym val)
+ (dolist (sym '(rmail-re-abbrevs
+ message-subject-re-regexp))
+ (when (get sym 'standard-value)
+ (custom-reevaluate-setting sym))))
+ :group 'mail
+ :version "31.1")
+
(defvar epa-inhibit)
;; Returns t if file FILE is an Rmail file.
;;;###autoload
diff --git a/lisp/mail/rmail.el b/lisp/mail/rmail.el
index e38ab12fae6..7fc5363f30c 100644
--- a/lisp/mail/rmail.el
+++ b/lisp/mail/rmail.el
@@ -527,22 +527,27 @@ rmail-automatic-folder-directives
(defvar rmail-reply-prefix "Re: "
"String to prepend to Subject line when replying to a message.")
=20
-;; Note: this is matched with case-fold-search bound to t.
-(defcustom rmail-re-abbrevs
- "\\(RE\\|=D8=B1=D8=AF\\|=E5=9B=9E=E5=A4=8D\\|=E5=9B=9E=E8=A6=86\\|SV\\|A=
ntw\\|VS\\|REF\\|AW\\|=CE=91=CE=A0\\|=CE=A3=CE=A7=CE=95=CE=A4\\|=D7=94=D7=
=A9=D7=91\\|V=C3=A1\\|R\\|RIF\\|BLS\\|RES\\|Odp\\|YNT\\|ATB\\)"
- "Regexp with localized \"Re:\" abbreviations in various languages."
- :version "28.1"
- :type 'regexp)
+(defvar rmail-reply-regexp nil ;; set by `rmail-re-abbrevs
+ "Regexp to delete from Subject line before inserting `rmail-reply-prefix=
'.")
=20
;; Some mailers use "Re(2):" or "Re^2:" or "Re: Re:" or "Re[2]:".
;; This pattern should catch all the common variants.
;; rms: I deleted the change to delete tags in square brackets
;; because they mess up RT tags.
-(defvar rmail-reply-regexp
- (concat "\\`\\("
- rmail-re-abbrevs
- "\\(([0-9]+)\\|\\[[0-9]+\\]\\|\\^[0-9]+\\)?\u00a0*[:=EF=BC=9A] *=
\\)*")
- "Regexp to delete from Subject line before inserting `rmail-reply-prefix=
'.")
+;; Note: this is matched with case-fold-search bound to t.
+(defcustom rmail-re-abbrevs
+ (concat "\\("
+ (string-join mail-re-regexps "\\|")
+ "\\)")
+ "Regexp with localized \"Re:\" abbreviations in various languages.
+Matching is done case-insensitively.
+Initialized from `mail-re-regexps', which is easier to customize."
+ :set-after '(mail-re-regexps)
+ :set (lambda (sym val)
+ (custom-set-default sym val)
+ (setq rmail-reply-regexp (mail--wrap-re-regexp val)))
+ :type 'regexp
+ :version "31.1")
=20
(defcustom rmail-display-summary nil
"If non-nil, Rmail always displays the summary buffer."
--=20
2.39.2
--=-=-=--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 72442) by debbugs.gnu.org; 27 Aug 2024 16:40:33 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Aug 27 12:40:33 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47492 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1sizFB-0001qb-Az for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 27 Aug 2024 12:40:33 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:40072) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1sizF9-0001qN-DD for 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 27 Aug 2024 12:40:32 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1sizED-0002D1-2I; Tue, 27 Aug 2024 12:39:33 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=0W0lMKXSmqLIvhiWx61ptiklpKWZIGSFCAjxHLQ8qf4=; b=KZ+0UDxXwwbcZFQazHxN afLzCyQLOERCPqE1m7F6BDAiQbHWxZ3OjCUfVl6R6JPD1Ni9P6VlyL1gg7l8LviwscvIGRKlR3+Hk xdgNH01zndMKBokCI3qyc2l6nxJe2swcb+ofEXHYp//+W5/Br9tRUrzITcWIMTUMtyr2ACQUcBgTF 4wzQkXaplZbE02eJagq4ycWhxWxSqnCB3cD7HuXmCZAP2Fpdju6gwL/u9V2RLaHF0XHHZefKRkpRu /rGcaAA5KQK3ds5TX1O0pb2LUYu8ePQMpMrQh/6B7Tnr4aOTLt+7OIrQZuKqkZ6etL8DxGQ7TgE6+ lBneJJS1UyEDnw==; Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2024 19:39:28 +0300 Message-Id: <86ikvlj4xr.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <875xrmvub2.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Robert Pluim on Tue, 27 Aug 2024 17:50:41 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle international message reply subject prefixes and insults users References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN> <87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN> <87bk1nuwl3.fsf@HIDDEN> <87jzg8u6tw.fsf@HIDDEN> <86zfp4sqig.fsf@HIDDEN> <875xrmvub2.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72442 Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> > Cc: bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN, 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2024 17:50:41 +0200 > > >>>>> On Thu, 22 Aug 2024 15:15:03 +0300, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> said: > > Eli> For backward compatibility, let's leave rmail-re-abbrevs in place, and > Eli> just initialize it from that new defcustom. > > Patch attached. Works for gnus for me, and manual testing of the rmail > regexp works. Thanks. > Did you want me to obsolote the rmail and message variables as well? I see no reason to obsolete them. > + "\\(\\[[0-9]*\\]\\)*" > + " ?\u00a0*[:：][ \t]*" These two parts could use a comment that explains what they handle. > + "\\(([0-9]+)\\|\\[[0-9]+\\]\\|\\^[0-9]+\\)?" > + " ?\u00a0*[:：][ \t]*\\)*[ \t]*"))) Same here.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
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Tue, 27 Aug 2024 08:50:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
In-Reply-To: <86zfp4sqig.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Thu, 22 Aug
2024 15:15:03 +0300")
References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87bk1nuwl3.fsf@HIDDEN> <87jzg8u6tw.fsf@HIDDEN>
<86zfp4sqig.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2024 17:50:41 +0200
Message-ID: <875xrmvub2.fsf@HIDDEN>
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--=-=-=
Content-Type: text/plain
>>>>> On Thu, 22 Aug 2024 15:15:03 +0300, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> said:
Eli> For backward compatibility, let's leave rmail-re-abbrevs in place, and
Eli> just initialize it from that new defcustom.
Patch attached. Works for gnus for me, and manual testing of the rmail
regexp works. Did you want me to obsolote the rmail and message
variables as well?
Robert
--
--=-=-=
Content-Type: text/x-diff; charset=utf-8
Content-Disposition: attachment;
filename=0001-Teach-gnus-message-about-international-Re-variants.patch
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
From ae84c547234ab28cc50ae2bb288bd401978ec293 Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001
From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2024 18:49:12 +0200
Subject: [PATCH] Teach gnus/message about international Re: variants
To: emacs-devel@HIDDEN
Bug#72442
* lisp/mail/mail-utils.el (mail-re-regexps): New defcustom, contains the
components used to construct 'rmail-re-abbrevs' and
'message-subject-re-regexp'.
* lisp/gnus/message.el (message-subject-re-regexp): Derive from
'mail-re-regexps'.
(message-strip-subject-re): Make the match case-insensitive.
* lisp/mail/rmail.el (rmail-re-abbrevs): Derive from 'mail-re-regexps'.
Update 'rmail-reply-regexp' when it changes.
(rmail-reply-regexp): Set to nil, 'rmail-re-abbrevs' will set it.
* doc/emacs/rmail.texi (Rmail Reply): Describe 'mail-re-regexps'.
* doc/misc/message.texi (Message Headers): Describe 'mail-re-regexps'.
---
doc/emacs/rmail.texi | 8 ++++++++
doc/misc/message.texi | 13 ++++++++++++-
etc/NEWS | 26 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++
lisp/gnus/message.el | 29 ++++++++++++++++++++++-------
lisp/mail/mail-utils.el | 19 +++++++++++++++++++
lisp/mail/rmail.el | 31 ++++++++++++++++++++-----------
6 files changed, 107 insertions(+), 19 deletions(-)
diff --git a/doc/emacs/rmail.texi b/doc/emacs/rmail.texi
index 9c20d30c442..e090ec6fe76 100644
--- a/doc/emacs/rmail.texi
+++ b/doc/emacs/rmail.texi
@@ -776,6 +776,14 @@ Rmail Reply
sent the message you received, and the @samp{CC} field starts out with
all the other recipients of that message.
=20
+@vindex rmail-re-abbrevs
+@vindex rmail-reply-prefix
+@vindex mail-re-regexps
+The @samp{Subject} header field may contain one or more instances of
+@samp{Re:} or localized variants thereof. These are removed if they
+match @code{rmail-re-abbrevs} (which is initialized from
+@code{mail-re-regexps}), and @code{rmail-reply-prefix} is prepended.
+
@vindex mail-dont-reply-to-names
You can exclude certain recipients from being included automatically
in replies, using the variable @code{mail-dont-reply-to-names}. Its
diff --git a/doc/misc/message.texi b/doc/misc/message.texi
index 468bf81599d..f5399aecee1 100644
--- a/doc/misc/message.texi
+++ b/doc/misc/message.texi
@@ -1693,13 +1693,14 @@ Message Headers
=20
@item message-subject-re-regexp
@vindex message-subject-re-regexp
+@vindex mail-re-regexps
@cindex Aw
@cindex Sv
@cindex Re
Responses to messages have subjects that start with @samp{Re: }. This
is @emph{not} an abbreviation of the English word ``response'', but it
comes from the Latin ``res'', and means ``in the matter of''. Some
-illiterate nincompoops have failed to grasp this fact, and have
+standards-challenged companies have failed to grasp this fact, and have
``internationalized'' their software to use abominations like
@samp{Aw: } (``antwort'') or @samp{Sv: } (``svar'') instead, which is
meaningless and evil. However, you may have to deal with users that
@@ -1731,6 +1732,16 @@ Message Headers
))
@end lisp
=20
+You shouldn't need to do this, since the default value of
+@code{message-subject-re-regexp} is initialized based on
+@code{mail-re-regexps}, which covers most known cases of such
+internationalization, and is a lot easier to customize. Customizing
+@code{mail-re-regexps} updates @code{message-subject-re-regexp} to
+match.
+
+Note that the regexp is matched case-insensitively against the
+@samp{Subject} header contents.
+
@item message-subject-trailing-was-query
@vindex message-subject-trailing-was-query
@vindex message-subject-trailing-was-ask-regexp
diff --git a/etc/NEWS b/etc/NEWS
index 07d1cce0966..82c0eac4e5c 100644
--- a/etc/NEWS
+++ b/etc/NEWS
@@ -162,6 +162,32 @@ By passing '-t' or '--timeout', you can specify a maxi=
mum time to wait
for the processes to exit. Additionally, you can now wait for external
processes by passing their PIDs.
=20
++++
+** Mail-util
+
+*** New user option 'mail-re-regexps'.
+This contains the list of regular expressions used to match "Re:" and
+international variants of it when modifying the Subject field in
+replies.
+
++++
+** Rmail
+
+*** 'rmail-re-abbrevs' default value is now derived from 'mail-re-regexps'.
+'mail-re-regexps' is a new user option that is easier to customize than
+'rmail-re-abbrevs'. 'rmail-re-abbrevs' is still honored if it was
+already set.
+
++++
+** Message
+
+*** 'message-subject-re-regexp' default value is now derived from 'mail-re=
-regexps'.
+'mail-re-regexps' is a new user option that is easier to customize than
+'message-subject-re-regexp'. 'message-subject-re-regexp' is still
+honored if it was already set.
+
+*** 'message-strip-subject-re' now matches case-insensitively.
+
** SHR
=20
+++
diff --git a/lisp/gnus/message.el b/lisp/gnus/message.el
index 98f63571389..081c6986a66 100644
--- a/lisp/gnus/message.el
+++ b/lisp/gnus/message.el
@@ -305,11 +305,24 @@ message-ignored-supersedes-headers
regexp))
=20
(defcustom message-subject-re-regexp
- "^[ \t]*\\([Rr][Ee]\\(\\[[0-9]*\\]\\)* ?:[ \t]*\\)*[ \t]*"
- "Regexp matching \"Re: \" in the subject line."
+ (concat "^[ \t]*"
+ "\\("
+ "\\("
+ (string-join mail-re-regexps "\\|")
+ "\\)"
+ "\\(\\[[0-9]*\\]\\)*"
+ " ?\u00a0*[:=EF=BC=9A][ \t]*"
+ "\\)"
+ "*[ \t]*")
+ "Regexp matching \"Re: \" in the subject line.
+Matching is done case-insensitively.
+Initialized from the value of `mail-re-regexps', which is easier to
+customize."
:group 'message-various
:link '(custom-manual "(message)Message Headers")
- :type 'regexp)
+ :type 'regexp
+ :set-after '(mail-re-regexps)
+ :version "31.1")
=20
(defcustom message-screenshot-command '("import" "png:-")
"Command to take a screenshot.
@@ -2257,10 +2270,12 @@ message-strip-list-identifiers
subject)))
=20
(defun message-strip-subject-re (subject)
- "Remove \"Re:\" from subject lines in string SUBJECT."
- (if (string-match message-subject-re-regexp subject)
- (substring subject (match-end 0))
- subject))
+ "Remove \"Re:\" from subject lines in string SUBJECT.
+This uses `mail-re-regexps, matching is done case-insensitively."
+ (let ((case-fold-search t))
+ (if (string-match message-subject-re-regexp subject)
+ (substring subject (match-end 0))
+ subject)))
=20
(defcustom message-replacement-char "."
"Replacement character used instead of unprintable or not decodable char=
s."
diff --git a/lisp/mail/mail-utils.el b/lisp/mail/mail-utils.el
index c9e4d0b3812..a04092b5727 100644
--- a/lisp/mail/mail-utils.el
+++ b/lisp/mail/mail-utils.el
@@ -46,6 +46,25 @@ mail-dont-reply-to-names
:type '(choice regexp (const :tag "Your Name" nil))
:group 'mail)
=20
+;;;###autoload
+(defcustom mail-re-regexps
+ '("RE" "R\u00c9\\.?" "FWD?" "=D8=B1=D8=AF" "=E5=9B=9E=E5=A4=8D" "=E5=9B=
=9E=E8=A6=86" "SV" "Antw\\.?"
+ "VS" "REF" "AW" "=CE=91=CE=A0" "=CE=A3=CE=A7=CE=95=CE=A4" "=D7=94=D7=A9=
=D7=91" "V=C3=A1" "R" "RIF" "BLS" "RES"
+ "Odp" "YNT" "ATB")
+ "List of localized \"Re:\" abbreviations in various languages.
+Each component can be a regular expression or a simple string. Matching
+is done case-insensitively. Used to initialize the legacy
+`rmail-re-abbrevs' and `message-subject-re-regexp' user options."
+ :type '(repeat regexp)
+ :set (lambda (sym val)
+ (custom-set-default sym val)
+ (dolist (sym '(rmail-re-abbrevs
+ message-subject-re-regexp))
+ (when (get sym 'standard-value)
+ (custom-reevaluate-setting sym))))
+ :group 'mail
+ :version "31.1")
+
(defvar epa-inhibit)
;; Returns t if file FILE is an Rmail file.
;;;###autoload
diff --git a/lisp/mail/rmail.el b/lisp/mail/rmail.el
index e38ab12fae6..4965907916c 100644
--- a/lisp/mail/rmail.el
+++ b/lisp/mail/rmail.el
@@ -527,23 +527,32 @@ rmail-automatic-folder-directives
(defvar rmail-reply-prefix "Re: "
"String to prepend to Subject line when replying to a message.")
=20
-;; Note: this is matched with case-fold-search bound to t.
-(defcustom rmail-re-abbrevs
- "\\(RE\\|=D8=B1=D8=AF\\|=E5=9B=9E=E5=A4=8D\\|=E5=9B=9E=E8=A6=86\\|SV\\|A=
ntw\\|VS\\|REF\\|AW\\|=CE=91=CE=A0\\|=CE=A3=CE=A7=CE=95=CE=A4\\|=D7=94=D7=
=A9=D7=91\\|V=C3=A1\\|R\\|RIF\\|BLS\\|RES\\|Odp\\|YNT\\|ATB\\)"
- "Regexp with localized \"Re:\" abbreviations in various languages."
- :version "28.1"
- :type 'regexp)
-
;; Some mailers use "Re(2):" or "Re^2:" or "Re: Re:" or "Re[2]:".
;; This pattern should catch all the common variants.
;; rms: I deleted the change to delete tags in square brackets
;; because they mess up RT tags.
-(defvar rmail-reply-regexp
- (concat "\\`\\("
- rmail-re-abbrevs
- "\\(([0-9]+)\\|\\[[0-9]+\\]\\|\\^[0-9]+\\)?\u00a0*[:=EF=BC=9A] *=
\\)*")
+(defvar rmail-reply-regexp nil ;; set by `rmail-re-abbrevs
"Regexp to delete from Subject line before inserting `rmail-reply-prefix=
'.")
=20
+;; Note: this is matched with case-fold-search bound to t.
+(defcustom rmail-re-abbrevs
+ (concat "\\("
+ (string-join mail-re-regexps "\\|")
+ "\\)")
+ "Regexp with localized \"Re:\" abbreviations in various languages.
+Matching is done case-insensitively.
+Initialized from `mail-re-regexps', which is easier to customize."
+ :set-after '(mail-re-regexps)
+ :set (lambda (sym val)
+ (custom-set-default sym val)
+ (setq rmail-reply-regexp
+ (concat "\\`[ \t]*\\("
+ val
+ "\\(([0-9]+)\\|\\[[0-9]+\\]\\|\\^[0-9]+\\)?"
+ " ?\u00a0*[:=EF=BC=9A][ \t]*\\)*[ \t]*")))
+ :type 'regexp
+ :version "31.1")
+
(defcustom rmail-display-summary nil
"If non-nil, Rmail always displays the summary buffer."
:group 'rmail-summary
--=20
2.39.2
--=-=-=--
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Fri, 23 Aug 2024 01:00:59 -0700 (PDT)
From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
To: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: : bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
In-Reply-To: <66c8208e.050a0220.16a63b.3a8cSMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN>
(=?utf-8?Q?=22Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar"'s message of "Fri, 23 Aug 2024 08:39:25
+0300")
References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN>
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<87bk1ku2c8.fsf@HIDDEN>
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Date: Fri, 23 Aug 2024 10:00:58 +0200
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>>>>> On Fri, 23 Aug 2024 08:39:25 +0300, Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@tha=
odan.de> said:
Bj=C3=B6rn> Does it make sense to build the regexp using regexp-search-=
word or
Bj=C3=B6rn> regexp-opt after the user has entered the words to filter i=
n defcustom?
Not really. `regexp-opt' only works with fixed strings, and the
components here are regexps. I don=CA=BCt know what `regexp-search-word' is.
Robert
--=20
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From: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>
To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
In-Reply-To: <87bk1ku2c8.fsf@HIDDEN> (Robert Pluim's message of "Thu, 22
Aug 2024 15:14:15 +0200")
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Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> writes:
>>>>>> On Thu, 22 Aug 2024 15:04:56 +0300, Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@th=
aodan.de> said:
>
> Bj=C3=B6rn> Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> writes:
> >>>>>>> On Tue, 20 Aug 2024 15:56:24 +0200, Robert Pluim <rpluim@gmai=
l.com> said:
> >>=20
> Robert> The first is easy. The second is a bit more difficult, since =
the two
> Robert> don=CA=BCt cover exactly the same cases, and message matches
> Robert> case-sensitively, unlike rmail, so we=CA=BCd need to either a=
dapt eg "=CE=A3=CE=A7=CE=95=CE=A4" to
> Robert> "[=CE=A3=CF=83][=CE=A7=CF=87][=CE=95=CE=B5][=CE=A4=CF=84]" or=
make the breaking change of binding
> Robert> `case-fold-search' in message. Personally I=CA=BCd prefer the=
latter.
> >>=20
> Robert> (are there really mailers that prefix the subject with "R:"?)
> >>=20
> >> The current setting for rmail is more complete than the suggestion=
in
> >> the Gnus manual, except it=CA=BCs missing:
> >>=20
> >> - "R=C3=89"
> >> - an optional "." after "Antw"
> >> - an optional space between the "RE" string and the ":"
> >> - "FW"/"FWD"
> >>=20
> >> The first 3 seem obvious. Adding the last might annoy people :-)
> >>=20
> >> I can add those to `rmail-re-abbrevs', but perhaps it=CA=BCs bette=
r to have a
> >> new defcustom that both rmail and message would use? Something like
> >> 'mail-re-regexps' in "mail-utils.el" perhaps? Plus some appropriate
> >> editing of the manual.
>
> Bj=C3=B6rn> If there would be an easy way to new prefix to the ignore=
list that
> Bj=C3=B6rn> would work. Can't expect (avarage) users to build their r=
egular
> Bj=C3=B6rn> expression especially when multiple languages are involve=
d.
>
> The new defcustom could be a list of regexps, ie
>
> ("RE" "R\u00c9\\.?" "FWD?" "=D8=B1=D8=AF" "=E5=9B=9E=E5=A4=8D" "=E5=9B=
=9E=E8=A6=86" "SV" "Antw\\.?"
> "VS" "REF" "AW" =CE=91=CE=A0" "=CE=A3=CE=A7=CE=95=CE=A4" "=D7=94=D7=A9=
=D7=91" "V=C3=A1" "R" "RIF" "BLS" "RES"
> "Odp" "YNT" "ATB")
>
> which we=CA=BCd concatenate with "\\|" to get the real regexp. That would
> be quite easy to edit in custom.
Does it make sense to build the regexp using regexp-search-word or
regexp-opt after the user has entered the words to filter in defcustom?
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
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From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
To: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
In-Reply-To: <66c7296a.a70a0220.2590d7.c939SMTPIN_ADDED_BROKEN@HIDDEN>
(=?utf-8?Q?=22Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar"'s message of "Thu, 22 Aug 2024 15:04:56
+0300")
References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN>
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Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2024 15:14:15 +0200
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Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
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>>>>> On Thu, 22 Aug 2024 15:04:56 +0300, Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@tha=
odan.de> said:
Bj=C3=B6rn> Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> writes:
>>>>>>> On Tue, 20 Aug 2024 15:56:24 +0200, Robert Pluim <rpluim@gmail.=
com> said:
>>=20
Robert> The first is easy. The second is a bit more difficult, since th=
e two
Robert> don=CA=BCt cover exactly the same cases, and message matches
Robert> case-sensitively, unlike rmail, so we=CA=BCd need to either ada=
pt eg "=CE=A3=CE=A7=CE=95=CE=A4" to
Robert> "[=CE=A3=CF=83][=CE=A7=CF=87][=CE=95=CE=B5][=CE=A4=CF=84]" or m=
ake the breaking change of binding
Robert> `case-fold-search' in message. Personally I=CA=BCd prefer the l=
atter.
>>=20
Robert> (are there really mailers that prefix the subject with "R:"?)
>>=20
>> The current setting for rmail is more complete than the suggestion in
>> the Gnus manual, except it=CA=BCs missing:
>>=20
>> - "R=C3=89"
>> - an optional "." after "Antw"
>> - an optional space between the "RE" string and the ":"
>> - "FW"/"FWD"
>>=20
>> The first 3 seem obvious. Adding the last might annoy people :-)
>>=20
>> I can add those to `rmail-re-abbrevs', but perhaps it=CA=BCs better =
to have a
>> new defcustom that both rmail and message would use? Something like
>> 'mail-re-regexps' in "mail-utils.el" perhaps? Plus some appropriate
>> editing of the manual.
Bj=C3=B6rn> If there would be an easy way to new prefix to the ignore l=
ist that
Bj=C3=B6rn> would work. Can't expect (avarage) users to build their reg=
ular
Bj=C3=B6rn> expression especially when multiple languages are involved.
The new defcustom could be a list of regexps, ie
("RE" "R\u00c9\\.?" "FWD?" "=D8=B1=D8=AF" "=E5=9B=9E=E5=A4=8D" "=E5=9B=9E=
=E8=A6=86" "SV" "Antw\\.?"
"VS" "REF" "AW" =CE=91=CE=A0" "=CE=A3=CE=A7=CE=95=CE=A4" "=D7=94=D7=A9=D7=
=91" "V=C3=A1" "R" "RIF" "BLS" "RES"
"Odp" "YNT" "ATB")
which we=CA=BCd concatenate with "\\|" to get the real regexp. That would
be quite easy to edit in custom.
Robert
--=20
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 72442) by debbugs.gnu.org; 22 Aug 2024 12:16:03 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Thu Aug 22 08:16:03 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37013 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1sh6jS-0000Ar-MB for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 22 Aug 2024 08:16:02 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:57602) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1sh6jQ-0000AJ-6P for 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 22 Aug 2024 08:16:00 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1sh6iZ-0003eM-MO; Thu, 22 Aug 2024 08:15:08 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=Jh0JG1DwNhwUo7kUAxhikFzqgeWa4jL6OClN/oW5yLM=; b=J+prcEXvwhcpwoV6a61g 3riFWbfD/pts3z4Lg0gGNsgPOXZl+AyYKOlr1GiM2B828jmgMMk/pvusI9iOO0kw9Fk969+CJhfIB BSluT8Rnvj9ZVE6MN6cvLpRFRE/SUqIwhNuGi02Mg1o6CriDI0ht1AQT7+fhcmkP7BmTMiLsiaFfn I6F5/2qL4lydFtPOApJHbS7nbyCRLwJ+1JYudzCDrULemksHDstYzJMB25ko/MsV/QPHPI+lEOoXC qaDPbj2O4yUthCyll0MeHtNo7Df44+9WKrlFOZXeOIYSMgQbtE+J6A+C68M+iz19FbEulRUVs6JjB uP5BRhkkotFhag==; Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2024 15:15:03 +0300 Message-Id: <86zfp4sqig.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <87jzg8u6tw.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Robert Pluim on Thu, 22 Aug 2024 13:37:15 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle international message reply subject prefixes and insults users References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN> <87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN> <87bk1nuwl3.fsf@HIDDEN> <87jzg8u6tw.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72442 Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> > Cc: bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN, 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2024 13:37:15 +0200 > > The current setting for rmail is more complete than the suggestion in > the Gnus manual, except itʼs missing: > > - "RÉ" > - an optional "." after "Antw" > - an optional space between the "RE" string and the ":" > - "FW"/"FWD" > > The first 3 seem obvious. Adding the last might annoy people :-) > > I can add those to `rmail-re-abbrevs', but perhaps itʼs better to have a > new defcustom that both rmail and message would use? Something like > 'mail-re-regexps' in "mail-utils.el" perhaps? Plus some appropriate > editing of the manual. Sounds like a good plan to me, thanks. For backward compatibility, let's leave rmail-re-abbrevs in place, and just initialize it from that new defcustom.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
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From: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>
To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
In-Reply-To: <87jzg8u6tw.fsf@HIDDEN> (Robert Pluim's message of "Thu, 22
Aug 2024 13:37:15 +0200")
References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN>
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Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2024 15:04:56 +0300
Message-ID: <87o75khifr.fsf@>
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Content preview: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> writes: >>>>>> On Tue, 20
Aug 2024 15:56:24 +0200, Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> said: > > Robert>
The first is easy. The second is a bit more difficult, since the two > Robert>
donʼt cover exactly the sam [...]
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Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> writes:
>>>>>> On Tue, 20 Aug 2024 15:56:24 +0200, Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> =
said:
>
> Robert> The first is easy. The second is a bit more difficult, since =
the two
> Robert> don=CA=BCt cover exactly the same cases, and message matches
> Robert> case-sensitively, unlike rmail, so we=CA=BCd need to either a=
dapt eg "=CE=A3=CE=A7=CE=95=CE=A4" to
> Robert> "[=CE=A3=CF=83][=CE=A7=CF=87][=CE=95=CE=B5][=CE=A4=CF=84]" or=
make the breaking change of binding
> Robert> `case-fold-search' in message. Personally I=CA=BCd prefer the=
latter.
>
> Robert> (are there really mailers that prefix the subject with "R:"?)
>
> The current setting for rmail is more complete than the suggestion in
> the Gnus manual, except it=CA=BCs missing:
>
> - "R=C3=89"
> - an optional "." after "Antw"
> - an optional space between the "RE" string and the ":"
> - "FW"/"FWD"
>
> The first 3 seem obvious. Adding the last might annoy people :-)
>
> I can add those to `rmail-re-abbrevs', but perhaps it=CA=BCs better to ha=
ve a
> new defcustom that both rmail and message would use? Something like
> 'mail-re-regexps' in "mail-utils.el" perhaps? Plus some appropriate
> editing of the manual.
If there would be an easy way to new prefix to the ignore list that
would work. Can't expect (avarage) users to build their regular
expression especially when multiple languages are involved.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
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From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
In-Reply-To: <87bk1nuwl3.fsf@HIDDEN> (Robert Pluim's message of "Tue, 20
Aug 2024 15:56:24 +0200")
References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87bk1nuwl3.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2024 13:37:15 +0200
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>>>>> On Tue, 20 Aug 2024 15:56:24 +0200, Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> s=
aid:
Robert> The first is easy. The second is a bit more difficult, since th=
e two
Robert> don=CA=BCt cover exactly the same cases, and message matches
Robert> case-sensitively, unlike rmail, so we=CA=BCd need to either ada=
pt eg "=CE=A3=CE=A7=CE=95=CE=A4" to
Robert> "[=CE=A3=CF=83][=CE=A7=CF=87][=CE=95=CE=B5][=CE=A4=CF=84]" or m=
ake the breaking change of binding
Robert> `case-fold-search' in message. Personally I=CA=BCd prefer the l=
atter.
Robert> (are there really mailers that prefix the subject with "R:"?)
The current setting for rmail is more complete than the suggestion in
the Gnus manual, except it=CA=BCs missing:
- "R=C3=89"
- an optional "." after "Antw"
- an optional space between the "RE" string and the ":"
- "FW"/"FWD"
The first 3 seem obvious. Adding the last might annoy people :-)
I can add those to `rmail-re-abbrevs', but perhaps it=CA=BCs better to have=
a
new defcustom that both rmail and message would use? Something like
'mail-re-regexps' in "mail-utils.el" perhaps? Plus some appropriate
editing of the manual.
Robert
--=20
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 72442) by debbugs.gnu.org; 21 Aug 2024 10:23:11 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Aug 21 06:23:11 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:35026 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1sgiUh-0005UW-Cr for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 21 Aug 2024 06:23:11 -0400 Received: from plesklin7.if1.ehiweb.it ([79.98.45.16]:43549) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <pot@HIDDEN>) id 1sgiUf-0005UL-8G for 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 21 Aug 2024 06:23:09 -0400 Received: from tucano.isti.cnr.it (tucano.isti.cnr.it [146.48.81.102]) by plesklin7.if1.ehiweb.it (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id F36BCFF43A; Wed, 21 Aug 2024 12:21:52 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <8734mymb0f.fsf@HIDDEN> From: =?utf-8?Q?Francesco_Potort=C3=AC?= <pot@HIDDEN> Date: Wed, 21 Aug 2024 12:21:52 +0200 To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <87bk1nuwl3.fsf@HIDDEN> (rpluim@HIDDEN) Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle international message reply subject prefixes and insults users References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN> <87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN> <87bk1nuwl3.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Organization: The GNU project X-fingerprint: 4B02 6187 5C03 D6B1 2E31 7666 09DF 2DC9 BE21 6115 X-PPP-Message-ID: <20240821102153.12185.43267@HIDDEN> X-PPP-Vhost: potorti.it X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72442 Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/) >(are there really mailers that prefix the subject with "R:"?) Yes, I have seen them regularly in the past years. I have just grepped my personal email backups for July and August and I found 3 different emails with "R:". Ok, it's 3 over some thousands, but anyway...
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
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From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
In-Reply-To: <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Tue, 20 Aug
2024 15:20:54 +0300")
References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN>
<87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN>
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>>>>> On Tue, 20 Aug 2024 15:20:54 +0300, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> said:
>> From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
>> Cc: Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>,
>> 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2024 11:46:26 +0200
>>=20
>> >>>>> On Sat, 03 Aug 2024 20:19:48 +0300, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN=
g> said:
>>=20
>> >> From: Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>
>> >> Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> >> Date: Sat, 03 Aug 2024 19:58:46 +0300
>> >>=20
>> >> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
>> >>=20
>> >> > FWIW, Rmail does support the various ways of saying "Re:", so t=
he code
>> >> > could be lifted from there.
>>=20
>> So does message, you just have to configure
>> `message-subject-re-regexp'. The message manual contains an
>> appropriate setting.
Eli> I wouldn't expect users to know how to do that in advance of getti=
ng
Eli> the various "Re:" variants out there. Should we perhaps improve t=
he
Eli> default value to be less English-centric?
Yes, we should.
>> We could just add the example from the manual to the `defcustom' for
>> `message-subject-re-regexp' (and also align it with whatever Rmail
>> does).
Eli> I think good defaults here win big time. This corner is notorious=
ly
Eli> dark and most users will not know how to make it better.
The first is easy. The second is a bit more difficult, since the two
don=CA=BCt cover exactly the same cases, and message matches
case-sensitively, unlike rmail, so we=CA=BCd need to either adapt eg "=CE=
=A3=CE=A7=CE=95=CE=A4" to
"[=CE=A3=CF=83][=CE=A7=CF=87][=CE=95=CE=B5][=CE=A4=CF=84]" or make the brea=
king change of binding
`case-fold-search' in message. Personally I=CA=BCd prefer the latter.
(are there really mailers that prefix the subject with "R:"?)
Robert
--=20
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 72442) by debbugs.gnu.org; 20 Aug 2024 12:21:51 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Aug 20 08:21:51 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:60022 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1sgNrz-0000E5-12 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 20 Aug 2024 08:21:51 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:51758) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1sgNrx-0000Da-2d for 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 20 Aug 2024 08:21:49 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1sgNrA-0005aY-PA; Tue, 20 Aug 2024 08:21:00 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=u8VAW/b++HmYC/pb1MzeqLK6tvabWj5S+Y3QDCa+oqQ=; b=BtMwW0gXYVvDb9dDFXkZ vlNvWeaPiEcfDsceTRHv69dYR6Eo6Zv8ZKLHlz9kMbNXLq4+qYX9MwVQkJtX7A21e2wIYdFvsAY+x N7/7K+C4Mzze6AMZnDtYGKjain17w/DuLSOVuEw+WZ7b9Q4AKz7RSOQlZydqC+MmtoeD87QP3nJk6 wW8/uvQ//PhQefpawn+aV49hN7pDeFkslXFrU+sH+EWTMKL3mEaMZ62JQ48jTMpwRsBfiiEAvZxwX pa042G9EQk8utUnJmVvDwOJmH/WKefBhIV/Vg494DPrjhzX1u5gPSWEoa7MfT93ubNXnf+ahVsRoE lMnSEjnGABNs8g==; Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2024 15:20:54 +0300 Message-Id: <86ed6jwfkp.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Robert Pluim on Tue, 20 Aug 2024 11:46:26 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle international message reply subject prefixes and insults users References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN> <87o75nv85p.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72442 Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> > Cc: Björn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>, > 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2024 11:46:26 +0200 > > >>>>> On Sat, 03 Aug 2024 20:19:48 +0300, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> said: > > >> From: Björn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN> > >> Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > >> Date: Sat, 03 Aug 2024 19:58:46 +0300 > >> > >> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: > >> > >> > FWIW, Rmail does support the various ways of saying "Re:", so the code > >> > could be lifted from there. > > So does message, you just have to configure > `message-subject-re-regexp'. The message manual contains an > appropriate setting. I wouldn't expect users to know how to do that in advance of getting the various "Re:" variants out there. Should we perhaps improve the default value to be less English-centric? > We could just add the example from the manual to the `defcustom' for > `message-subject-re-regexp' (and also align it with whatever Rmail > does). I think good defaults here win big time. This corner is notoriously dark and most users will not know how to make it better.
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From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle
international message reply subject prefixes and insults users
In-Reply-To: <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 03 Aug
2024 20:19:48 +0300")
References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 20 Aug 2024 11:46:26 +0200
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>>>>> On Sat, 03 Aug 2024 20:19:48 +0300, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> said:
>> From: Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>
>> Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Sat, 03 Aug 2024 19:58:46 +0300
>>=20
>> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
>>=20
>> > FWIW, Rmail does support the various ways of saying "Re:", so the =
code
>> > could be lifted from there.
So does message, you just have to configure
`message-subject-re-regexp'. The message manual contains an
appropriate setting.
>>=20
>> Would it make sense to move regexp and intermittent variable to
>> message.el or mail-utils.el?
>>=20
>> I would assume the latter.
Eli> The latter, yes. But note that Rmail does that for 2 different
Eli> purposes and in 2 different functions AFAIR.
We could just add the example from the manual to the `defcustom' for
`message-subject-re-regexp' (and also align it with whatever Rmail
does).
Robert
--=20
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 72442) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Aug 2024 17:20:18 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sat Aug 03 13:20:18 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54749 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1saIQU-0004Wg-DG for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Aug 2024 13:20:18 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:50592) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1saIQS-0004W9-Jj for 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Aug 2024 13:20:17 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1saIQ3-0006Gh-5M; Sat, 03 Aug 2024 13:19:51 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=8HGb5qFSNctCRJSloHXPKyCw3IFkywelYviw2vJ97+M=; b=FqKu6QGzfYaFuVPR8jak BrUKoFwD2tLdVvG3ZT5FYY9PG1d4AsreFFYIH30SW/3cwENyneu8Q4+od029eeCgZuupjBF9ICTYJ ts96xCpbTweOJAAfmzZYI22QqXi73WtE3e9RGfS3JvLW/rl0dWBsDQlSSU6krm8F4CGoyZ/TqPHs3 61hoEQkt3NextwM6RIiJ7VMEG2091FM9ZQk7wJUNGDKgKxiBgAzx3RLsBnrUbhbx1OfI4/2WzdwPC JYJONmw8GYHTAzz4MQ9a2b3G5WoYoERlVFnTkK6FkQ38Qc+6Oq69KmtL+drZPFUHiREsnHgZKeuPs /04G7RhBXNWBsQ==; Date: Sat, 03 Aug 2024 20:19:48 +0300 Message-Id: <861q35v80b.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <87ed75lf09.fsf@> (message from =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar on Sat, 03 Aug 2024 19:58:46 +0300) Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle international message reply subject prefixes and insults users References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> <87ed75lf09.fsf@> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72442 Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Björn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN> > Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sat, 03 Aug 2024 19:58:46 +0300 > > Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: > > > FWIW, Rmail does support the various ways of saying "Re:", so the code > > could be lifted from there. > > Would it make sense to move regexp and intermittent variable to > message.el or mail-utils.el? > > I would assume the latter. The latter, yes. But note that Rmail does that for 2 different purposes and in 2 different functions AFAIR.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 72442) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Aug 2024 16:59:47 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sat Aug 03 12:59:47 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54739 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1saI6c-0003W7-Vx for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Aug 2024 12:59:47 -0400 Received: from thaodan.de ([185.216.177.71]:37248) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>) id 1saI6a-0003Vj-NV for 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Aug 2024 12:59:46 -0400 Received: from odin (dsl-trebng12-50dc75-154.dhcp.inet.fi [80.220.117.154]) by thaodan.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 49FE4D00080; Sat, 3 Aug 2024 19:58:47 +0300 (EEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=thaodan.de; s=mail; t=1722704327; bh=KUfWsMwhP/rMHmAi2+gFU1245VfML0FElx3vBbDJirY=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date; b=VjKopB7qZdW0/HyKPjzSDRPaECMS1Uu2uNxb/AyNItZ0KAzlXtL/pMZTR+6OgQoSL Zomg33wqIbHpLNOR+qUpy3iVrOgIG9QBlHUDSR84k2E2LHpqectrOtjM++RJyotMF+ cyKLIwJ63vmSA7Bt66/rZg8fml+xX7ty69/PyyynTpY045X55xKqAMtaBcVZes3+4/ XYC2m5defJ41b/i1LXhWZVubn7295hhRgPFxL+nxFsUw74GwysIZwemiIxQK3c8oQs DkaHvRzEBhOVboxUZmORqOjQ11REgRgERTpcaJB4pxm3Ct5rP2cKQzf29CRWwDPXwX rTZeP8LBFDN4zKgbvTJdbpkinhk8xhLERfR+EZ3guVgkOCIaLLYBIpOtd7jgTuFXyn VJTBcNWjdgw46jm2HX4MYFch8GfMQFPGwOSAncQ8DFaPa5AdnXAQuQNVp3EuJYrbL+ IAIXzKC9krOV92yNgJiDSWDLbXkiBaVBjeojWbZNnaXPkTHrd1Gv1zcr6qicN7Yn8T aCEjhxnQkAxRPwrf3LkG1NgFpPi3s1QyWEtPaeTYrZR8Lwn4Mph0gRDWLiGd5Xr8jv 9ymcvKcTely3R6w1wlx0wZ4wTolB1tWZwHQFerYIsP1XIdOSYX12Nff7++ebfgfkNe bj4H1VV0vcj8Vwhmg+P+YtTw= From: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle international message reply subject prefixes and insults users In-Reply-To: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Sat, 03 Aug 2024 18:43:11 +0300") References: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> Autocrypt: addr=bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN; prefer-encrypt=nopreference; keydata= mDMEZNfpPhYJKwYBBAHaRw8BAQdACBEmr+0xwIIHZfIDlZmm7sa+lHHSb0g9FZrN6qE6ru60JUJq w7ZybiBCaWRhciA8Ympvcm4uYmlkYXJAdGhhb2Rhbi5kZT6IlgQTFgoAPgIbAwULCQgHAgIiAgYV CgkICwIEFgIDAQIeBwIXgBYhBFHxdut1RzAepymoq1wbdKFlHF9oBQJk1/YmAhkBAAoJEFwbdKFl HF9oB9cBAJoIIGQKXm4cpap+Flxc/EGnYl0123lcEyzuduqvlDT0AQC3OlFKm/OiqJ8IMTrzJRZ8 phFssTkSrrFXnM2jm5PYDoiTBBMWCgA7FiEEUfF263VHMB6nKairXBt0oWUcX2gFAmTX6T4CGwMF CwkIBwICIgIGFQoJCAsCBBYCAwECHgcCF4AACgkQXBt0oWUcX2hbCQEAtru7kvM8hi8zo6z9ux2h K+B5xViKuo7Z8K3IXuK5ugwA+wUfKzomzdBPhfxDsqLcEziGRxoyx0Q3ld9aermBUccHtBxCasO2 cm4gQmlkYXIgPG1lQHRoYW9kYW4uZGU+iJMEExYKADsCGwMFCwkIBwICIgIGFQoJCAsCBBYCAwEC HgcCF4AWIQRR8XbrdUcwHqcpqKtcG3ShZRxfaAUCZNf2FQAKCRBcG3ShZRxfaCzSAP4hZ7cSp0YN XYpcjHdsySh2MuBhhoPeLGXs+2kSiqBiOwD/TP8AgPEg/R+SI9GI9on7fBJJ0mp2IT8kZ2rhDOjg gA6IkwQTFgoAOxYhBFHxdut1RzAepymoq1wbdKFlHF9oBQJk1+ntAhsDBQsJCAcCAiICBhUKCQgL AgQWAgMBAh4HAheAAAoJEFwbdKFlHF9oBgwA/iQHwe0VL4Df4GGTYlNjMSHFlIkBmN4UfYGLYj3E TrOUAQC51M+M3cjsL8WHdpBz6VAo6df9d+rVwhQ9vQuFHqevArg4BGTX6T4SCisGAQQBl1UBBQEB B0Cbohc3JEfn005/cm0AOGjSsW1ZxAkgaoVNjbpqk4MgNAMBCAeIeAQYFgoAIBYhBFHxdut1RzAe pymoq1wbdKFlHF9oBQJk1+k+AhsMAAoJEFwbdKFlHF9ooHABAKGmrGBic/Vys3BBrOQiRB3Z7izO HwhqTRpAqFZtXS2nAQDZhp/5aYw1TZjTzkm1KVt9QiYnjd/MvxRE9iaY6x4mDbgzBGTX6T4WCSsG AQQB2kcPAQEHQAgRJq/tMcCCB2XyA5WZpu7GvpRx0m9IPRWazeqhOq7uiO8EGBYKACAWIQRR8Xbr dUcwHqcpqKtcG3ShZRxfaAUCZNf71AIbIgCBCRBcG3ShZRxfaHYgBBkWCgAdFiEEUfF263VHMB6n KairXBt0oWUcX2gFAmTX+9QACgkQXBt0oWUcX2jeSwD6AtWn0cuo8IF35YRo4o3cDRJnUfJnbvJy GxyCDThR+zYBAKG6/jdwmZkBQZKslnDAbMMd2WfiZZT5JW3IWC4EaKMO7HkBAKYPGZ3UbfkRvfFK S+pQ9CgtNfkSJQBtT1Ob7Y6nsacgAQCpyXN7yppmhW/oBgivITPy9Lkg+V4NK9WZYZCU9Q7LBA== Date: Sat, 03 Aug 2024 19:58:46 +0300 Message-ID: <87ed75lf09.fsf@> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 1.2 (+) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "debbugs.gnu.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: >> Date: Sat, 03 Aug 2024 16:14:39 +0300 >> From: Björn Bidar via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, >> the Swiss army knife of text editors" <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> >> >> >> Gnus doesn't handle internation [...] Content analysis details: (1.2 points, 10.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record -0.0 SPF_HELO_PASS SPF: HELO matches SPF record 1.2 INVALID_MSGID Message-Id is not valid, according to RFC 2822 X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72442 Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes: >> Date: Sat, 03 Aug 2024 16:14:39 +0300 >> From: Bj=C3=B6rn Bidar via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, >> the Swiss army knife of text editors" <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> >>=20 >>=20 >> Gnus doesn't handle international message reply prefixes as opposed >> to Re: or it's variants. >>=20 >> An example would be `gnus-simpliy-subject-re' which threats English >> subject prefixes. >>=20 >> Message.el doesn't do so either (by default) I don't think it makes >> sense to open a separate bug about this but please reply that should be >> done. >>=20 >> The message manual also judges users for using localized variants of >> "Re: " by calling them "nincompoops" for using these "abominations" >> which it says are "meaningless and evil". >>=20 >> The offending text can be found in the documentation for >> `message-subject-re-regexp' in the chapter "3.1 Message Headers". > > FWIW, Rmail does support the various ways of saying "Re:", so the code > could be lifted from there. Would it make sense to move regexp and intermittent variable to message.el or mail-utils.el? I would assume the latter.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 72442) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Aug 2024 15:43:41 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sat Aug 03 11:43:41 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54712 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1saGuy-0000A1-U8 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Aug 2024 11:43:41 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:42728) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1saGux-00009o-3I for 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 03 Aug 2024 11:43:40 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1saGuX-0002sG-V3; Sat, 03 Aug 2024 11:43:13 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=Gfr5SQJNRBS7sGwgoa3kF4D4FuFqoMP/uNl+IYd64pA=; b=BhZWXmjcfKOZNqYk4fFC S9u5CR7l+cEXdz/ZwK6n/cmTW9BFLwlavqNTjTcX/VgvmQ9fCagyfnvPI10GzqumshsA9WoMedyxm 5Eo5stIHKflHtGB1dsF9nre32hpcoFuJ6OQzB8FQnM7ja89paA7pYHavujGx1wpZM+nAjylkWRFdH kXoqHqBu2wbeZwjTlLjhgxuUvsg2C6y1irPJ2V3AsW6n2H4Oo6QBLxJfE9Chug/RsfgIVo8BeYpm7 GpHWaMSEEhYLgVRTkZOA5I9wBbKXYl6WNo1yCddKNCAjzknbUpw0VqQ1c7itV1Mlefge3W+Q3yk/F xCSnyQLQvci4+w==; Date: Sat, 03 Aug 2024 18:43:11 +0300 Message-Id: <868qxdvchc.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <87o769n3y8.fsf@> (bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN) Subject: Re: bug#72442: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle international message reply subject prefixes and insults users References: <87o769n3y8.fsf@> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72442 Cc: 72442 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Date: Sat, 03 Aug 2024 16:14:39 +0300 > From: Björn Bidar via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, > the Swiss army knife of text editors" <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> > > > Gnus doesn't handle international message reply prefixes as opposed > to Re: or it's variants. > > An example would be `gnus-simpliy-subject-re' which threats English > subject prefixes. > > Message.el doesn't do so either (by default) I don't think it makes > sense to open a separate bug about this but please reply that should be > done. > > The message manual also judges users for using localized variants of > "Re: " by calling them "nincompoops" for using these "abominations" > which it says are "meaningless and evil". > > The offending text can be found in the documentation for > `message-subject-re-regexp' in the chapter "3.1 Message Headers". FWIW, Rmail does support the various ways of saying "Re:", so the code could be lifted from there.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
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Sat, 03 Aug 2024 09:14:50 -0400 Received: from odin (dsl-trebng12-50dc75-154.dhcp.inet.fi [80.220.117.154]) by thaodan.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 505DAD00080 for <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN>; Sat, 3 Aug 2024 16:14:40 +0300 (EEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=thaodan.de; s=mail; t=1722690880; bh=MKW8mXR1gcHumbrqDgob2zAZWWeAJrEPr8ZJtcyzKZ0=; h=From:To:Subject:Date; b=QihpIRSpLYfBlsiDDAk6tGXzosF1MkoEEDtJj4TDRxlZQm9swHq8+mdKFam8Ac314 NJWGirEE0ZdzrEjMcv0CoUA6DG5X1kFvh7psHsfS4xzdlvTiuml7gBpRzpCPd0L6Me sVXC0ClC6nupfR1/OJre41E+v+HIvI1h7ZFigp2FV9e0oBj75icsT5FyEXTk7d+RT0 3z4a5naumevQTnszlUHxogI88TY7G8bbea2Eenyt4Z5n5pNyqvexGPK0F7E6PtbGDE 1pH1FlFRiEsQsvaPIt6viETLbkDLo2kdvaJAgSqb2f0wiQNopcWgELABWqv1S1RVVK 9RbkSiFLR3cIu7M3BKNK4Qw5hTYJMLkMeSUbImNKWGWHAR1dBSQDq5SwfJgzJwzYiG zAVMOUsmgC+ZIA2sRrimpwe8gvaVP6Hbc3ILZOCZMtAY0oNCkCKJ2ijL+cziMZ5bZR XeBuqYBG1vftP00oHRoYhPjvBxXdnxIcnC2IhEuDCAMVPsBW4+mJt5a3qzmZYBRB+W 34wKxcziYYTb/a19zGlggS6n/xP6R3M6tcDCSZ4MW+w9ln6QJ9YbRSM5i0am4jbwJ4 Faaq86gZtaAm/SHWqQR2HdMz4FeMqUkY70Z7xZDVtVB/p9CusBwIO+hoalfyMNRYdq Y4sRpAj3pAGDg3jbWwPT6+ww= From: =?utf-8?Q?Bj=C3=B6rn?= Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN> To: bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN Subject: 31.0.50; Gnus or message.el doesn't handle international message reply subject prefixes and insults users X-Debbugs-Cc: Autocrypt: addr=bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN; prefer-encrypt=nopreference; keydata= mDMEZNfpPhYJKwYBBAHaRw8BAQdACBEmr+0xwIIHZfIDlZmm7sa+lHHSb0g9FZrN6qE6ru60JUJq w7ZybiBCaWRhciA8Ympvcm4uYmlkYXJAdGhhb2Rhbi5kZT6IlgQTFgoAPgIbAwULCQgHAgIiAgYV CgkICwIEFgIDAQIeBwIXgBYhBFHxdut1RzAepymoq1wbdKFlHF9oBQJk1/YmAhkBAAoJEFwbdKFl HF9oB9cBAJoIIGQKXm4cpap+Flxc/EGnYl0123lcEyzuduqvlDT0AQC3OlFKm/OiqJ8IMTrzJRZ8 phFssTkSrrFXnM2jm5PYDoiTBBMWCgA7FiEEUfF263VHMB6nKairXBt0oWUcX2gFAmTX6T4CGwMF CwkIBwICIgIGFQoJCAsCBBYCAwECHgcCF4AACgkQXBt0oWUcX2hbCQEAtru7kvM8hi8zo6z9ux2h K+B5xViKuo7Z8K3IXuK5ugwA+wUfKzomzdBPhfxDsqLcEziGRxoyx0Q3ld9aermBUccHtBxCasO2 cm4gQmlkYXIgPG1lQHRoYW9kYW4uZGU+iJMEExYKADsCGwMFCwkIBwICIgIGFQoJCAsCBBYCAwEC HgcCF4AWIQRR8XbrdUcwHqcpqKtcG3ShZRxfaAUCZNf2FQAKCRBcG3ShZRxfaCzSAP4hZ7cSp0YN XYpcjHdsySh2MuBhhoPeLGXs+2kSiqBiOwD/TP8AgPEg/R+SI9GI9on7fBJJ0mp2IT8kZ2rhDOjg gA6IkwQTFgoAOxYhBFHxdut1RzAepymoq1wbdKFlHF9oBQJk1+ntAhsDBQsJCAcCAiICBhUKCQgL AgQWAgMBAh4HAheAAAoJEFwbdKFlHF9oBgwA/iQHwe0VL4Df4GGTYlNjMSHFlIkBmN4UfYGLYj3E TrOUAQC51M+M3cjsL8WHdpBz6VAo6df9d+rVwhQ9vQuFHqevArg4BGTX6T4SCisGAQQBl1UBBQEB B0Cbohc3JEfn005/cm0AOGjSsW1ZxAkgaoVNjbpqk4MgNAMBCAeIeAQYFgoAIBYhBFHxdut1RzAe pymoq1wbdKFlHF9oBQJk1+k+AhsMAAoJEFwbdKFlHF9ooHABAKGmrGBic/Vys3BBrOQiRB3Z7izO HwhqTRpAqFZtXS2nAQDZhp/5aYw1TZjTzkm1KVt9QiYnjd/MvxRE9iaY6x4mDbgzBGTX6T4WCSsG AQQB2kcPAQEHQAgRJq/tMcCCB2XyA5WZpu7GvpRx0m9IPRWazeqhOq7uiO8EGBYKACAWIQRR8Xbr dUcwHqcpqKtcG3ShZRxfaAUCZNf71AIbIgCBCRBcG3ShZRxfaHYgBBkWCgAdFiEEUfF263VHMB6n KairXBt0oWUcX2gFAmTX+9QACgkQXBt0oWUcX2jeSwD6AtWn0cuo8IF35YRo4o3cDRJnUfJnbvJy GxyCDThR+zYBAKG6/jdwmZkBQZKslnDAbMMd2WfiZZT5JW3IWC4EaKMO7HkBAKYPGZ3UbfkRvfFK S+pQ9CgtNfkSJQBtT1Ob7Y6nsacgAQCpyXN7yppmhW/oBgivITPy9Lkg+V4NK9WZYZCU9Q7LBA== Date: Sat, 03 Aug 2024 16:14:39 +0300 Message-ID: <87o769n3y8.fsf@> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.216.177.71; envelope-from=bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN; helo=thaodan.de X-Spam_score_int: -14 X-Spam_score: -1.5 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.5 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, INVALID_MSGID=0.568, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_CERTIFIED_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_RPBL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=no autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -0.2 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.2 (-) Gnus doesn't handle international message reply prefixes as opposed to Re: or it's variants. An example would be `gnus-simpliy-subject-re' which threats English subject prefixes. Message.el doesn't do so either (by default) I don't think it makes sense to open a separate bug about this but please reply that should be done. The message manual also judges users for using localized variants of "Re: " by calling them "nincompoops" for using these "abominations" which it says are "meaningless and evil". The offending text can be found in the documentation for `message-subject-re-regexp' in the chapter "3.1 Message Headers". Steps to reproduce: 1. Enable any of the functions which thread subjects such as `gnus-simpliy-subject-re' 2. Receive a message which contains a subject prefix for a reply that isn't the Latin or English "Re: " such as "Aw" or "Sv: " 3. See result. In GNU Emacs 31.0.50 (build 1, x86_64-suse-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.24.43, cairo version 1.18.0) Windowing system distributor 'The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.12101012 System Description: openSUSE Tumbleweed Configured using: 'configure --disable-build-details --without-pop --with-mailutils --without-hesiod --with-gameuser=:games --with-kerberos --with-kerberos5 --with-file-notification=inotify --with-modules --enable-autodepend --enable-link-time-optimization --prefix=/usr --mandir=/usr/share/man --infodir=/usr/share/info --datadir=/usr/share --localstatedir=/var --sharedstatedir=/var/lib --libexecdir=/usr/libexec --with-file-notification=yes --libdir=/usr/lib64 --with-native-compilation=aot --enable-locallisppath=/usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/site-lisp:/usr/share/emacs/site-lisp --with-x --with-xim --with-sound --with-xpm --with-jpeg --with-tiff --with-gif --with-png --with-rsvg --with-dbus --with-xft --without-gpm --with-tree-sitter --with-x-toolkit=gtk --without-pgtk --with-toolkit-scroll-bars --x-includes=/usr/include --x-libraries=/usr/lib64 --with-libotf --with-m17n-flt --with-cairo --with-xwidgets --build=x86_64-suse-linux --with-dumping=pdumper build_alias=x86_64-suse-linux 'CC=sccache cc' 'CFLAGS=-O2 -Wall -U_FORTIFY_SOURCE -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=3 -fstack-protector-strong -funwind-tables -fasynchronous-unwind-tables -fstack-clash-protection -Werror=return-type -flto=auto -march=znver3 -mmmx -mpopcnt -msse -msse2 -msse3 -mssse3 -msse4.1 -msse4.2 -mavx -mavx2 -msse4a -mno-fma4 -mno-xop -mfma -mno-avx512f -mbmi -mbmi2 -maes -mpclmul -mno-avx512vl -mno-avx512bw -mno-avx512dq -mno-avx512cd -mno-avx512er -mno-avx512pf -mno-avx512vbmi -mno-avx512ifma -mno-avx5124vnniw -mno-avx5124fmaps -mno-avx512vpopcntdq -mno-avx512vbmi2 -mno-gfni -mvpclmulqdq -mno-avx512vnni -mno-avx512bitalg -mno-avx512bf16 -mno-avx512vp2intersect -mno-3dnow -madx -mabm -mno-cldemote -mclflushopt -mclwb -mclzero -mcx16 -mno-enqcmd -mf16c -mfsgsbase -mfxsr -mno-hle -msahf -mno-lwp -mlzcnt -mmovbe -mno-movdir64b -mno-movdiri -mmwaitx -mno-pconfig -mpku -mno-prefetchwt1 -mprfchw -mno-ptwrite -mrdpid -mrdrnd -mrdseed -mno-rtm -mno-serialize -mno-sgx -msha -mshstk -mno-tbm -mno-tsxldtrk -mvaes -mno-waitpkg -mwbnoinvd -mxsave -mxsavec -mxsaveopt -mxsaves -mno-amx-tile -mno-amx-int8 -mno-amx-bf16 -mno-uintr -mno-hreset -mno-kl -mno-widekl -mno-avxvnni -mno-avx512fp16 -mno-avxifma -mno-avxvnniint8 -mno-avxneconvert -mno-cmpccxadd -mno-amx-fp16 -mno-prefetchi -mno-raoint -mno-amx-complex --param l1-cache-size=32 --param l1-cache-line-size=64 --param l2-cache-size=512 -mtune=znver3 -fno-optimize-sibling-calls -g -D_GNU_SOURCE -DGDK_DISABLE_DEPRECATION_WARNINGS -DGLIB_DISABLE_DEPRECATION_WARNINGS -pipe -Wno-pointer-sign -Wno-unused-variable -Wno-unused-label -DPDMP_BASE='\''"emacs-gtk"'\''' LDFLAGS=-Wl,-O2 'CXX=sccache c++' PKG_CONFIG_PATH=:/usr/lib64/pkgconfig:/usr/share/pkgconfig' Configured features: ACL CAIRO DBUS FREETYPE GIF GLIB GMP GNUTLS GSETTINGS HARFBUZZ JPEG LCMS2 LIBOTF LIBSELINUX LIBSYSTEMD LIBXML2 M17N_FLT MODULES NATIVE_COMP NOTIFY INOTIFY PDUMPER PNG RSVG SECCOMP SOUND SQLITE3 THREADS TIFF TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS TREE_SITTER WEBP X11 XDBE XIM XINPUT2 XPM XWIDGETS GTK3 ZLIB Important settings: value of $LC_MONETARY: fi_FI.UTF-8 value of $LC_NUMERIC: POSIX value of $LANG: en_GB.UTF-8 value of $XMODIFIERS: @im=local locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix Major mode: Info Minor modes in effect: dap-tooltip-mode: t dap-ui-many-windows-mode: t dap-ui-controls-mode: t dap-ui-mode: t dap-auto-configure-mode: t dap-mode: t lsp-treemacs-sync-mode: t treemacs-filewatch-mode: t treemacs-git-mode: t treemacs-fringe-indicator-mode: t circe-lagmon-mode: t magit-wip-initial-backup-mode: t magit-wip-before-change-mode: t magit-wip-after-apply-mode: t magit-wip-after-save-mode: t magit-wip-mode: t magit-auto-revert-mode: t pdf-occur-global-minor-mode: t pdf-virtual-global-minor-mode: t global-atomic-chrome-edit-mode: t minions-mode: t back-button-mode: t recentf-mode: t global-auto-revert-mode: t savehist-mode: t emms-playing-time-display-mode: t emms-playing-time-mode: t gnus-desktop-notify-mode: t tracking-mode: t org-super-agenda-mode: t global-git-commit-mode: t projectile-mode: t global-company-mode: t company-mode: t electric-pair-mode: t editorconfig-mode: t frames-only-mode: t windmove-mode: t marginalia-mode: t which-key-mode: t dirvish-override-dired-mode: t dired-async-mode: t helm-mode: t helm-minibuffer-history-mode: t global-so-long-mode: t global-emojify-mode: t emojify-mode: t change-cursor-mode: t doom-modeline-mode: t server-mode: t helm-autoresize-mode: t desktop-save-mode: t Info-persist-history-mode: t save-place-mode: t delete-selection-mode: t override-global-mode: t tooltip-mode: t global-eldoc-mode: t show-paren-mode: t electric-indent-mode: t mouse-wheel-mode: t menu-bar-mode: t file-name-shadow-mode: t global-font-lock-mode: t font-lock-mode: t blink-cursor-mode: t undelete-frame-mode: t minibuffer-regexp-mode: t buffer-read-only: t line-number-mode: t transient-mark-mode: t auto-composition-mode: t auto-encryption-mode: t auto-compression-mode: t Load-path shadows: /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/org/lisp/ox-koma-letter hides /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/lisp/ox-koma-letter /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/org-contrib/lisp/ox-groff hides /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/lisp/ox-groff /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/vim-modeline/vim-modeline hides /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/lisp/vim-modeline /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/lisp/htmlize hides /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/htmlize/htmlize /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/lisp/cursor-chg hides /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/cursor-chg/cursor-chg /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/cmake-mode/cmake-mode hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/cmake-mode /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/async/dired-async hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/dired-async /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/async/async-bytecomp hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/async-bytecomp /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/async/async-autoloads hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/async-autoloads /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/async/smtpmail-async hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/smtpmail-async /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/async/async hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/async /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/compat/compat hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/compat /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/compat/compat-29 hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/compat-29 /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/compat/compat-28 hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/compat-28 /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/compat/compat-27 hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/compat-27 /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/compat/compat-26 hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/compat-26 /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/compat/compat-25 hides /usr/share/emacs/site-lisp/compat-25 /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/which-key/which-key hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/which-key /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/transient/lisp/transient hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/transient /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/editorconfig/editorconfig hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/editorconfig /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/use-package/bind-key hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/bind-key /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/editorconfig/editorconfig-tools hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/editorconfig-tools /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/editorconfig/editorconfig-fnmatch hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/editorconfig-fnmatch /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/editorconfig/editorconfig-core hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/editorconfig-core /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/editorconfig/editorconfig-core-handle hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/editorconfig-core-handle /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/editorconfig/editorconfig-conf-mode hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/editorconfig-conf-mode /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/modus-themes/theme-loaddefs hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/theme-loaddefs /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/use-package/use-package hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/use-package/use-package /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/use-package/use-package-lint hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/use-package/use-package-lint /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/use-package/use-package-jump hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/use-package/use-package-jump /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/use-package/use-package-ensure hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/use-package/use-package-ensure /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/use-package/use-package-ensure-system-package hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/use-package/use-package-ensure-system-package /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/use-package/use-package-diminish hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/use-package/use-package-diminish /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/use-package/use-package-delight hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/use-package/use-package-delight 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/usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/org/ob-comint /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/org/lisp/ob-clojure hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/org/ob-clojure /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/org/lisp/ob-calc hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/org/ob-calc /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/org/lisp/ob-awk hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/org/ob-awk /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/org/lisp/ob-C hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/org/ob-C /home/bidar/.local/etc/emacs/lib/compat/compat hides /usr/share/emacs/31.0.50/lisp/emacs-lisp/compat Features: (descr-text tmm avy dumb-jump popup lsp-completion lsp-diagnostics lsp-modeline dap-mouse lsp-ui lsp-ui-flycheck lsp-ui-doc xwidget lsp-ui-imenu lsp-ui-peek lsp-ui-sideline lsp-ui-util dap-lldb dap-ui gdb-mi gud bui bui-list bui-info bui-entry bui-core bui-history bui-button bui-utils lsp-lens dap-mode dap-tasks dap-launch lsp-docker posframe dap-overlays ccls ccls-member-hierarchy ccls-inheritance-hierarchy ccls-call-hierarchy ccls-tree 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gnus-draft gitattributes-mode vc-dir two-column helm-descbinds mailalias bbdb-pgp message-attachment-reminder bbdb-message gnus-alias autocrypt-message git-rebase magit-extras shortdoc cl-print adaptive-wrap adaptive-wrap-autoloads gitconfig-mode help-fns emacsql-sqlite-builtin sqlite org-indent crux smart-region multiple-cursors mc-separate-operations rectangular-region-mode mc-mark-pop mc-edit-lines mc-hide-unmatched-lines-mode mc-mark-more html-mode-expansions sgml-mode mc-cycle-cursors multiple-cursors-core rect expand-region yaml-mode-expansions subword-mode-expansions cperl-mode-expansions text-mode-expansions cc-mode-expansions the-org-mode-expansions python-el-fgallina-expansions er-basic-expansions expand-region-core expand-region-custom char-fold helm-org-rifle misearch multi-isearch orgit-forge orgit doctor helm-command org-clock-helpers flow-fill mastodon-notifications mastodon-media mastodon-profile mastodon-auth mastodon-client plstore mastodon mastodon-search mastodon-toot persist mastodon-http request circe-lagmon ietf-drums-date gnus-gravatar gnus-cite message-view-patch forge-repos forge-tablist forge-topics forge-commands forge-semi forge-bitbucket buck forge-gogs gogs forge-gitea gtea forge-gitlab glab forge-github ghub-graphql treepy gsexp ghub forge-notify forge-revnote forge-pullreq forge-issue forge-topic yaml eieio-custom forge-post markdown-mode forge-repo forge forge-core forge-db magit-popup magit-bookmark magit-submodule magit-blame magit-stash magit-reflog magit-bisect magit-push magit-pull magit-fetch magit-clone magit-remote magit-commit magit-sequence magit-notes magit-worktree magit-tag magit-merge magit-branch magit-reset magit-files magit-refs magit-status magit magit-repos magit-apply magit-wip magit-log magit-diff smerge-mode diff magit-core magit-autorevert magit-margin magit-transient magit-process magit-mode w3m-form w3m-symbol w3m w3m-hist bookmark-w3m w3m-ems w3m-favicon w3m-image w3m-fb tab-line w3m-proc 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prog-mode register page tab-bar menu-bar rfn-eshadow isearch easymenu timer select scroll-bar mouse jit-lock font-lock syntax font-core term/tty-colors frame minibuffer nadvice seq simple cl-generic indonesian philippine cham georgian utf-8-lang misc-lang vietnamese tibetan thai tai-viet lao korean japanese eucjp-ms cp51932 hebrew greek romanian slovak czech european ethiopic indian cyrillic chinese composite emoji-zwj charscript charprop case-table epa-hook jka-cmpr-hook help abbrev obarray oclosure cl-preloaded button loaddefs theme-loaddefs faces cus-face macroexp files window text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env code-pages mule custom widget keymap hashtable-print-readable backquote threads xwidget-internal dbusbind inotify lcms2 dynamic-setting system-font-setting font-render-setting cairo gtk x-toolkit xinput2 x multi-tty move-toolbar make-network-process native-compile emacs) Memory information: ((conses 16 9249983 2256064) (symbols 48 128499 400) (strings 32 2188961 332207) (string-bytes 1 198462873) (vectors 16 425459) (vector-slots 8 7748112 2162063) (floats 8 9274 46200) (intervals 56 577147 42148) (buffers 992 505))
Björn Bidar <bjorn.bidar@HIDDEN>:bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN.
Full text available.bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72442; Package emacs.
Full text available.
GNU bug tracking system
Copyright (C) 1999 Darren O. Benham,
1997 nCipher Corporation Ltd,
1994-97 Ian Jackson.