Received: (at 72915) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Sep 2024 13:49:40 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Sep 15 09:49:40 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48705 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1sppdD-0005gB-Pp for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 15 Sep 2024 09:49:40 -0400 Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]:58805) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <tomasn@HIDDEN>) id 1sppdA-0005fw-8d for 72915 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 15 Sep 2024 09:49:37 -0400 Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 76366240027 for <72915 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Sun, 15 Sep 2024 15:49:18 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1726408158; bh=UXZZR71nnMSwl7vGlbwbFtcvVunTtNDntvivFw/1Tv0=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type: From; b=UGGNzWLDMPvzUCoEV1S8lTecAP3JaRkxXP/EcRAUjFgGdZ4P+K/10vQYCXT+9BjWL TkhaGpC/h+nKfwSwXhXU3WRgKbXV6fQb3Ixm/q34JrEKXzgVzWxofLM/WI6rtBTnLi xh6UxTst/krqFplUrDiMHWVSaS4zDPM3JUZuQYPnkRj+CHJNyRG5Fp6cbMKlxsvGam IYYm1i6dvg7jyHT9SlbKBQuJerTxUZMYWkah0cB5XWCUCgIdpDm0nY23fuKzMZVIGK EQJFoa8E5RSj3+OsjQ7qQUUu1AxQxWI9DbOOYTbpKUwCoqZcCPdVcz+2I3vcdgVZIU emzpaqWN4iyeQ== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4X68Xr3wzhz6txy; Sun, 15 Sep 2024 15:49:16 +0200 (CEST) From: Tomas Nordin <tomasn@HIDDEN> To: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#72915: Docstrings of add-hook and remove-hook improvement? In-Reply-To: <jwvr09ldpuo.fsf-monnier+emacs@HIDDEN> References: <87v7zgrhrt.fsf@HIDDEN> <86y14c9dk3.fsf@HIDDEN> <jwvzforo3tv.fsf-monnier+emacs@HIDDEN> <CADwFkm=y0cUe0JBEFEygzZQJPHbyjNA4jceXU-HjGw64_oO3Sg@HIDDEN> <87ldztmaho.fsf@HIDDEN> <jwvr09ldpuo.fsf-monnier+emacs@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2024 13:49:15 +0000 Message-ID: <87frq1m3hg.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72915 Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@HIDDEN>, 72915 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN> writes: > The `add-hook` part was OK for me, indeed. > > [ I'm no great fan of that paragraph (neither the original nor the one > you replace it with), tho, because it's a bit "too detailed" for my > taste. E.g. the value *always* ends up being a list of functions, and > the parenthesis states something which sounds to me like it should be > inferrable from the rest of the docstring. ] I think I agree, the parenthesized part could be discarded, shortening the paragraph to "HOOK should be a symbol. If HOOK is void, or if HOOK's value is a single function, it is changed to a list of functions."
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72915; Package emacs.
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From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
To: Tomas Nordin <tomasn@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72915: Docstrings of add-hook and remove-hook improvement?
In-Reply-To: <87ldztmaho.fsf@HIDDEN> (Tomas Nordin's message of "Sun, 15
Sep 2024 11:17:55 +0000")
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Tomas Nordin [2024-09-15 11:17:55] wrote:
> Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@HIDDEN> writes:
>
>> Stefan Monnier via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of
>> text editors" <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> writes:
>>
>>> Something like:
>>>
>>> "Remove FUNCTION from HOOK's functions.
>>> HOOK should be a symbol, and FUNCTION may be any valid function.
>>> Does nothing if HOOK does not currently contain FUNCTION.
>>> Compares functions with `equal`, which means that it can be
>>> slow if FUNCTION is not a symbol. See `add-hook'.
>>
>> Ah, now I see that you posted this proposal. This is a better start
>> than what I had.
>>
>> Should we install it?
>
> This is about the doc of remove-hook. What about the edits in the
> add-hook docstring, was that OK? There was a question on the bit about
> setting the HOOK to nil, but I think that was sorted out.
The `add-hook` part was OK for me, indeed.
[ I'm no great fan of that paragraph (neither the original nor the one
you replace it with), tho, because it's a bit "too detailed" for my
taste. E.g. the value *always* ends up being a list of functions, and
the parenthesis states something which sounds to me like it should be
inferrable from the rest of the docstring. ]
Stefan
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72915; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 72915) by debbugs.gnu.org; 15 Sep 2024 11:18:18 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Sep 15 07:18:18 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48517 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1spnGk-0005pH-A4 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 15 Sep 2024 07:18:18 -0400 Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]:32933) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <tomasn@HIDDEN>) id 1spnGi-0005p2-0X for 72915 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 15 Sep 2024 07:18:17 -0400 Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3FF4B240028 for <72915 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Sun, 15 Sep 2024 13:17:58 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1726399078; bh=2xo/VPnlwNig0+6RP58QwgFjwgW033X0XKzolHJPFhk=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type: From; b=sIZ9QnjFoEFxbjN/3iAR3pXKorZfUfcAreuKh5AZIDP70Et264aUoj924j49kt5bS Yz7RXZzEI1gQVBYoYqgalTPi1kZ2J2V87V9/jkSDySLi8je1oH2KjjkMjkKN2wSN5f Zpz5CFaKx4aPdwmmS5u5+wO2Y5fmVkXJRb0LBmrheJypPF4iLURyZAQpa4Q13w3sHi Kdan/qJ7RarJ7JSNoanjmvOQYgjLx+ELyJHhOn9NaypqrMcYcvSO0lXRCqBBJNdYy4 RrYROiYmFIJGvFysb5Fcdot2FOBGPRs2L1eB0GVmFMs5DVyVEHxirXR1/g7yXLrq2x ubhCSDqUxVP4w== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4X65BD3tyKz9rxD; Sun, 15 Sep 2024 13:17:56 +0200 (CEST) From: Tomas Nordin <tomasn@HIDDEN> To: Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@HIDDEN>, Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#72915: Docstrings of add-hook and remove-hook improvement? In-Reply-To: <CADwFkm=y0cUe0JBEFEygzZQJPHbyjNA4jceXU-HjGw64_oO3Sg@HIDDEN> References: <87v7zgrhrt.fsf@HIDDEN> <86y14c9dk3.fsf@HIDDEN> <jwvzforo3tv.fsf-monnier+emacs@HIDDEN> <CADwFkm=y0cUe0JBEFEygzZQJPHbyjNA4jceXU-HjGw64_oO3Sg@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2024 11:17:55 +0000 Message-ID: <87ldztmaho.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72915 Cc: 72915 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@HIDDEN> writes: > Stefan Monnier via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of > text editors" <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> writes: > >> Something like: >> >> "Remove FUNCTION from HOOK's functions. >> HOOK should be a symbol, and FUNCTION may be any valid function. >> Does nothing if HOOK does not currently contain FUNCTION. >> Compares functions with `equal`, which means that it can be >> slow if FUNCTION is not a symbol. See `add-hook'. > > Ah, now I see that you posted this proposal. This is a better start > than what I had. > > Should we install it? This is about the doc of remove-hook. What about the edits in the add-hook docstring, was that OK? There was a question on the bit about setting the HOOK to nil, but I think that was sorted out.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72915; Package emacs.
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bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72915; Package emacs.
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bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72915; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 72915) by debbugs.gnu.org; 1 Sep 2024 15:48:48 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Sep 01 11:48:48 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:37203 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1skmoq-0004JF-80 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 01 Sep 2024 11:48:48 -0400 Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]:53311) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <tomasn@HIDDEN>) id 1skmom-0004Ix-TI for 72915 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 01 Sep 2024 11:48:46 -0400 Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2196124002B for <72915 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Sun, 1 Sep 2024 17:47:38 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1725205658; bh=w4tDUeQWAsHuUpIHhwQEsCbqObpMrscRLd3Gx9+tz+Y=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type: From; b=M1w+idBnEqXJRgX3L9rMyg9Se93BDAzopbzS2J2D2R5gfpfs9EKQg4Zvn9xLqXEd4 htOXNXNUmE/GvPArNE5BK/1OQ9FV4aVMRAnYGEU3AC/lV7J4MP4lFe6vqPD+N1W/9G OJpNJmyZPGTCNYHa09bvbxXei8gy29bAtvVatzTmVSA/IDYn9YIU/UlFWWBa1uMFtH 7m+FFTgrr8s9nFbfJfIpEap0R0aY+xXRrGKR4jvMv/2mnsiY1xBIaornErgjimU/wE xP12rcLMbH2JxUP6Uyd8PTPZg3INeqYeRsCLu8kqoi/sLM+Mtd6IIuCi0RQlqpMOYB MjMO4CoYxJGfA== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4Wxbqs0k6zz6tsb; Sun, 1 Sep 2024 17:47:37 +0200 (CEST) From: Tomas Nordin <tomasn@HIDDEN> To: Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@HIDDEN>, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#72915: Docstrings of add-hook and remove-hook improvement? In-Reply-To: <CADwFkmnbTbJKkg=w+xWqHTUJ7gNYK8wKN4TM5GtGDknndgiRNQ@HIDDEN> References: <87v7zgrhrt.fsf@HIDDEN> <86y14c9dk3.fsf@HIDDEN> <CADwFkmkLcKOAE3snjkgzS_yQNcq-LOrBcdRrD3pLPe7HzJRmAg@HIDDEN> <CADwFkmnbTbJKkg=w+xWqHTUJ7gNYK8wKN4TM5GtGDknndgiRNQ@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 01 Sep 2024 15:47:36 +0000 Message-ID: <87plpnqstj.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72915 Cc: 72915 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@HIDDEN> writes: > Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@HIDDEN> writes: > >> The wording in the manual is probably all that is needed here: >> >> This function removes FUNCTION from the hook variable HOOK. > > BTW. Here's another idea: > > If HOOK is a list of functions, remove FUNCTION from that list. > > If HOOK is equal to FUNCTION, set HOOK to nil. > > Otherwise do nothing. I like that, adjusted maybe to respect Stefan M's nitpick: If HOOK's value is a list of functions, remove FUNCTION from that list. If HOOK's value is FUNCTION, set HOOK to nil. Otherwise do nothing.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72915; Package emacs.
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From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72915: Docstrings of add-hook and remove-hook improvement?
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>> -HOOK should be a symbol. If HOOK is void, it is first set to
>> -nil. If HOOK's value is a single function, it is changed to a
>> -list of functions.
> Is the bit about setting HOOK to nil incorrect? Because the new text
> drops that part.
That's an internal detail that's not observable to the caller anyway.
>> "Remove from the value of HOOK the function FUNCTION.
>> HOOK should be a symbol, and FUNCTION may be any valid function. If
>> FUNCTION isn't the value of HOOK, or, if FUNCTION doesn't appear in the
>> -list of hooks to run in HOOK, then nothing is done. See `add-hook'.
>> +list of functions to run in HOOK, then nothing is done. See `add-hook'.
>
> "list of functions to run in HOOK" is ambiguous wrt what "in HOOK"
> refers to. I would rephrase:
>
> If FUNCTION is not the value of HOOK and is not a member of the list
> that is the value of HOOK, do nothing.
Maybe we can simplify the wording a bit by focusing less about whether
the hook's value is a function or a list of functions, and talking about
the "sequence" or "set" of functions (which can be represented by
a list of functions or a function)?
Something like:
"Remove FUNCTION from HOOK's functions.
HOOK should be a symbol, and FUNCTION may be any valid function.
Does nothing if HOOK does not currently contain FUNCTION.
Compares functions with `equal`, which means that it can be
slow if FUNCTION is not a symbol. See `add-hook'.
- Stefan
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72915; Package emacs.
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From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
To: Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#72915: Docstrings of add-hook and remove-hook improvement?
In-Reply-To: <CADwFkmnbTbJKkg=w+xWqHTUJ7gNYK8wKN4TM5GtGDknndgiRNQ@HIDDEN>
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Date: Sun, 01 Sep 2024 10:17:43 -0400
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>> The wording in the manual is probably all that is needed here:
>>
>> This function removes FUNCTION from the hook variable HOOK.
>
> BTW. Here's another idea:
>
> If HOOK is a list of functions, remove FUNCTION from that list.
>
> If HOOK is equal to FUNCTION, set HOOK to nil.
>
> Otherwise do nothing.
Nit pick: a hook *is* not a function or a list of functions.
It only *holds* such things.
Stefan
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72915; Package emacs.
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Subject: Re: bug#72915: Docstrings of add-hook and remove-hook improvement?
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, Tomas Nordin <tomasn@HIDDEN>,
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Stefan Kangas <stefankangas@HIDDEN> writes:
> The wording in the manual is probably all that is needed here:
>
> This function removes FUNCTION from the hook variable HOOK.
BTW. Here's another idea:
If HOOK is a list of functions, remove FUNCTION from that list.
If HOOK is equal to FUNCTION, set HOOK to nil.
Otherwise do nothing.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72915; Package emacs.
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Subject: Re: bug#72915: Docstrings of add-hook and remove-hook improvement?
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, Tomas Nordin <tomasn@HIDDEN>,
Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
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Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
>> From: Tomas Nordin <tomasn@HIDDEN>
>> Date: Sat, 31 Aug 2024 12:36:22 +0000
>>
>> The following on top of emacs-30.
>>
>> diff --git a/lisp/subr.el b/lisp/subr.el
>> index 28ba30f584e..e60c4119c60 100644
>> --- a/lisp/subr.el
>> +++ b/lisp/subr.el
>> @@ -2090,6 +2090,10 @@ add-hook
>> "Add to the value of HOOK the function FUNCTION.
>> FUNCTION is not added if already present.
>>
>> +HOOK should be a symbol. If HOOK is void, or if HOOK's value is a
>> +single function, it is changed to a list of functions (containing only
>> +FUNCTION in the void case).
>> +
>> The place where the function is added depends on the DEPTH
>> parameter. DEPTH defaults to 0. By convention, it should be
>> a number between -100 and 100 where 100 means that the function
>> @@ -2108,10 +2112,6 @@ add-hook
>> buffer-local value. That acts as a flag to run the hook
>> functions of the global value as well as in the local value.
>>
>> -HOOK should be a symbol. If HOOK is void, it is first set to
>> -nil. If HOOK's value is a single function, it is changed to a
>> -list of functions.
>> -
>
> Is the bit about setting HOOK to nil incorrect? Because the new text
> drops that part.
It makes no difference if HOOK is "first" set to nil from the POV of the
end user, I think. The end result is that HOOK will be a list of
functions.
IOW, the point here is that `add-hook` will work even if HOOK is void,
and that aspect is preserved in the above change.
>
>> "Remove from the value of HOOK the function FUNCTION.
>> HOOK should be a symbol, and FUNCTION may be any valid function. If
>> FUNCTION isn't the value of HOOK, or, if FUNCTION doesn't appear in the
>> -list of hooks to run in HOOK, then nothing is done. See `add-hook'.
>> +list of functions to run in HOOK, then nothing is done. See `add-hook'.
>
> "list of functions to run in HOOK" is ambiguous wrt what "in HOOK"
> refers to. I would rephrase:
>
> If FUNCTION is not the value of HOOK and is not a member of the list
> that is the value of HOOK, do nothing.
While the original is not ideal, I don't find this to be an improvement.
Sorry. I'd suggest trying to reformulate it again, to make it more
direct and avoid repeating the phrase "the value of".
The wording in the manual is probably all that is needed here:
This function removes FUNCTION from the hook variable HOOK.
In other words, we either get to assume that the user knows what a hook
is, or we can point the user to the relevant manual section to read
about it.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72915; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 72915) by debbugs.gnu.org; 1 Sep 2024 04:58:08 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Sep 01 00:58:08 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:60830 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1skcfA-000173-32 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 01 Sep 2024 00:58:08 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:35030) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1skcf8-00016V-C5 for 72915 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 01 Sep 2024 00:58:06 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1skce5-0000yV-Le; Sun, 01 Sep 2024 00:57:01 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=owZT5uacMnWUCBAPecg/GT0XQkvApG/4VaGdFYlsZUo=; b=T9MXdt9+fH54 VRFkDjID6bDuo+knSBwBeg0PssNi5bPbZp/2KjkiWv2S6UlFyr4fGR418e4oQYhMKvsEBgmUiQ0BU XZWWPBF+cWmq/wuUgav+NvxiADKWMheChEvs68kv/IWJ6SvsroPkSzOor8aeGvvbUcmOi8RByHW5i kOZbJv3bNjWiVxhPr/5ca9idEFNvofS6iYHBLwHo7HiqlwlqweUJVuOvTA/aYO+exccC3VB3vCsyi clUMOrwUjqdEoHIkOQuHQdsLEhpn5KAdNmYAGoXd304iAfHF4dsEQYlGirzAXI2NdA9gvmlL/q+FQ LVEhnLxDYNawWqIw087ziA==; Date: Sun, 01 Sep 2024 07:57:00 +0300 Message-Id: <86y14c9dk3.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Tomas Nordin <tomasn@HIDDEN>, Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <87v7zgrhrt.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Tomas Nordin on Sat, 31 Aug 2024 12:36:22 +0000) Subject: Re: bug#72915: Docstrings of add-hook and remove-hook improvement? References: <87v7zgrhrt.fsf@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72915 Cc: 72915 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Tomas Nordin <tomasn@HIDDEN> > Date: Sat, 31 Aug 2024 12:36:22 +0000 > > The following on top of emacs-30. > > diff --git a/lisp/subr.el b/lisp/subr.el > index 28ba30f584e..e60c4119c60 100644 > --- a/lisp/subr.el > +++ b/lisp/subr.el > @@ -2090,6 +2090,10 @@ add-hook > "Add to the value of HOOK the function FUNCTION. > FUNCTION is not added if already present. > > +HOOK should be a symbol. If HOOK is void, or if HOOK's value is a > +single function, it is changed to a list of functions (containing only > +FUNCTION in the void case). > + > The place where the function is added depends on the DEPTH > parameter. DEPTH defaults to 0. By convention, it should be > a number between -100 and 100 where 100 means that the function > @@ -2108,10 +2112,6 @@ add-hook > buffer-local value. That acts as a flag to run the hook > functions of the global value as well as in the local value. > > -HOOK should be a symbol. If HOOK is void, it is first set to > -nil. If HOOK's value is a single function, it is changed to a > -list of functions. > - Is the bit about setting HOOK to nil incorrect? Because the new text drops that part. > "Remove from the value of HOOK the function FUNCTION. > HOOK should be a symbol, and FUNCTION may be any valid function. If > FUNCTION isn't the value of HOOK, or, if FUNCTION doesn't appear in the > -list of hooks to run in HOOK, then nothing is done. See `add-hook'. > +list of functions to run in HOOK, then nothing is done. See `add-hook'. "list of functions to run in HOOK" is ambiguous wrt what "in HOOK" refers to. I would rephrase: If FUNCTION is not the value of HOOK and is not a member of the list that is the value of HOOK, do nothing. (This also avoids passive tense and clarifies the wording in other aspects.)
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72915; Package emacs.
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To: Tomas Nordin <tomasn@HIDDEN>, 72915 <at> debbugs.gnu.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 72915 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Tomas Nordin <tomasn@HIDDEN> writes: > diff --git a/lisp/subr.el b/lisp/subr.el > index 28ba30f584e..e60c4119c60 100644 > --- a/lisp/subr.el > +++ b/lisp/subr.el > @@ -2090,6 +2090,10 @@ add-hook > "Add to the value of HOOK the function FUNCTION. > FUNCTION is not added if already present. > > +HOOK should be a symbol. If HOOK is void, or if HOOK's value is a > +single function, it is changed to a list of functions (containing only > +FUNCTION in the void case). > + > The place where the function is added depends on the DEPTH > parameter. DEPTH defaults to 0. By convention, it should be > a number between -100 and 100 where 100 means that the function > @@ -2108,10 +2112,6 @@ add-hook > buffer-local value. That acts as a flag to run the hook > functions of the global value as well as in the local value. > > -HOOK should be a symbol. If HOOK is void, it is first set to > -nil. If HOOK's value is a single function, it is changed to a > -list of functions. > - > FUNCTION may be any valid function, but it's recommended to use a > function symbol and not a lambda form. Using a symbol will > ensure that the function is not re-added if the function is > @@ -2179,7 +2179,7 @@ remove-hook > "Remove from the value of HOOK the function FUNCTION. > HOOK should be a symbol, and FUNCTION may be any valid function. If > FUNCTION isn't the value of HOOK, or, if FUNCTION doesn't appear in the > -list of hooks to run in HOOK, then nothing is done. See `add-hook'. > +list of functions to run in HOOK, then nothing is done. See `add-hook'. > > The optional third argument, LOCAL, if non-nil, says to modify > the hook's buffer-local value rather than its default value. LGTM.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72915; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 31 Aug 2024 12:37:30 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sat Aug 31 08:37:30 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54233 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1skNM9-0005pj-R2 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 31 Aug 2024 08:37:30 -0400 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:45596) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <tomasn@HIDDEN>) id 1skNM7-0005pb-KT for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 31 Aug 2024 08:37:28 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <tomasn@HIDDEN>) id 1skNLB-0000MK-3h for bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN; Sat, 31 Aug 2024 08:36:29 -0400 Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <tomasn@HIDDEN>) id 1skNL8-0007p5-WC for bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN; Sat, 31 Aug 2024 08:36:28 -0400 Received: from submission (posteo.de [185.67.36.169]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 70D5E240027 for <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN>; Sat, 31 Aug 2024 14:36:23 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1725107783; bh=MAw1T9lsuc2m3zR4Jw3CNgEnlFKW5Ow+VtP/O2a8coA=; h=From:To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:From; b=AMT+nK7wCPk6b7xAzrvcM3USi6nefONtkEdWgl1Lzw7AZmq0Vx0yZst/dt/IBEQiD ZBWLQ6KWgzlfW4SuFyjjsRWhWhlpeHfQlFvheZJDxxtWqOwo2EekKmmdSNJhn0fjxj WVw3VVsGfvTEAEOZXiJ+HickxOPldtrM/uJZOWY45ozUG5wLD7gQJ6+IrwBNwdugow EHj/bBdhvzLnsqdMCk0UyAlbNtOww7ZMaTRbFOGWX88TahtxE2V2fchAgmSbqXkOBL QF08wpkjNoeqqS4snjh2dnY8hSBDP4vnMDIjMUMbHkemlV1ayGYtOXicNBCK0KOQ5U v976jIi2iRY1w== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 4Wwvdg0gLfz9rxF for <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN>; Sat, 31 Aug 2024 14:36:22 +0200 (CEST) From: Tomas Nordin <tomasn@HIDDEN> To: bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN Subject: Docstrings of add-hook and remove-hook improvement? Date: Sat, 31 Aug 2024 12:36:22 +0000 Message-ID: <87v7zgrhrt.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Received-SPF: pass client-ip=185.67.36.65; envelope-from=tomasn@HIDDEN; helo=mout01.posteo.de X-Spam_score_int: -43 X-Spam_score: -4.4 X-Spam_bar: ---- X-Spam_report: (-4.4 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: -1.3 (-) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) Hello List In bug#70820 August 14, Stefan mentions that it is a common confusion to think of the functions in a hook as hooks. It got my attention because I belong to the confused ones every second year or so adding or removing functions from a hook. I suggest the provided patch as a small improvement of the function documentation of add-hook and remove-hook. Maybe it doesn't mitigate the confusion mentioned that much, but it seem to align better with the manual as I read it. What do you think? In add-hook doc, lift up the paragraph about HOOK and FUNCTION and remove the mention about first setting the HOOK to nil. I think that is something internal to the add-hook function and not relevant to the programmer calling the add-hook function? And then say that the resulting hook will be a list both when the HOOK symbol is void or a single function. In remove-hook, stick to the notion that a hook contain functions to run, not hooks. This notion though is a bit confusing in relation to the names of those functions, but that's another story I guess. The following on top of emacs-30. diff --git a/lisp/subr.el b/lisp/subr.el index 28ba30f584e..e60c4119c60 100644 --- a/lisp/subr.el +++ b/lisp/subr.el @@ -2090,6 +2090,10 @@ add-hook "Add to the value of HOOK the function FUNCTION. FUNCTION is not added if already present. +HOOK should be a symbol. If HOOK is void, or if HOOK's value is a +single function, it is changed to a list of functions (containing only +FUNCTION in the void case). + The place where the function is added depends on the DEPTH parameter. DEPTH defaults to 0. By convention, it should be a number between -100 and 100 where 100 means that the function @@ -2108,10 +2112,6 @@ add-hook buffer-local value. That acts as a flag to run the hook functions of the global value as well as in the local value. -HOOK should be a symbol. If HOOK is void, it is first set to -nil. If HOOK's value is a single function, it is changed to a -list of functions. - FUNCTION may be any valid function, but it's recommended to use a function symbol and not a lambda form. Using a symbol will ensure that the function is not re-added if the function is @@ -2179,7 +2179,7 @@ remove-hook "Remove from the value of HOOK the function FUNCTION. HOOK should be a symbol, and FUNCTION may be any valid function. If FUNCTION isn't the value of HOOK, or, if FUNCTION doesn't appear in the -list of hooks to run in HOOK, then nothing is done. See `add-hook'. +list of functions to run in HOOK, then nothing is done. See `add-hook'. The optional third argument, LOCAL, if non-nil, says to modify the hook's buffer-local value rather than its default value.
Tomas Nordin <tomasn@HIDDEN>:bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN.
Full text available.bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#72915; Package emacs.
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