GNU bug report logs - #76031
31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work

Please note: This is a static page, with minimal formatting, updated once a day.
Click here to see this page with the latest information and nicer formatting.

Package: emacs; Reported by: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>; dated Mon, 3 Feb 2025 17:24:01 UTC; Maintainer for emacs is bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 20:24:49 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Feb 05 15:24:49 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52795 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tflx3-0001Xo-9X
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 15:24:49 -0500
Received: from mail-ed1-x52c.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::52c]:58577)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tflwz-0001XH-Jy
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 15:24:46 -0500
Received: by mail-ed1-x52c.google.com with SMTP id
 4fb4d7f45d1cf-5dce090bbe5so504572a12.0
 for <76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 12:24:45 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1738787079; x=1739391879; darn=debbugs.gnu.org;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=KXuTLrlEM1bTYqlpH51d3xTOqNIjJ9OV7aA5+GXq6t4=;
 b=RNZeuMoSqGGQvJyHLj+XSjHPAQyV+wGl8i9z6GcHy7oeWn9QAOw2cOIDK7+9A+UxuJ
 0/8ag6NpRphKj9IPxTBCmQzCFhOd3i+1IrmVlMTRxvpmUixFly8J/zUO9ZidFHhCaB/g
 mIuwU/R3X8C/XoXGY3EMstp00m/ba1J5OQ8nZH7tfguHPsXTJNOFLsbRwMYdXBCrPvA/
 eZqRaGzIEfiNoo5rki30t1+ifxRW+tHE4FycJLxXNHuz38dYWq/O7TiaU0nKkc9QgCrM
 /hWyuVnaTP4SHPr5cgH2Lj7a72jqJTuhhFn4+JDDdGgykt3WeWlonASG+A4Rq7MdZzVH
 Fekw==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1738787079; x=1739391879;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date
 :message-id:reply-to;
 bh=KXuTLrlEM1bTYqlpH51d3xTOqNIjJ9OV7aA5+GXq6t4=;
 b=Kc9LoJ2Z0P7VAQVAA5efr4O5i3q+gxm5qvk2KdALUxeqsCjORBoYU5SnVejHj7CAhX
 ADJSI44aNddo74XCs1333VlQYvDX89y+FnM8S7TYuza2J5R7YmpLkQ+15jNH77XiuEuM
 pX2wL9URINEHHDcUqcqxg1WqK3RPYv6RI6kuJaQjQ9MaSWi+MS2h+jgXhf0nYLToNu1l
 KrlGqb6O1mzPBACZGJMi055ZdHuYqVTrc834wTVHAC6CqIkefFyPTKuqbBGRLKIoRIHe
 PQq5nscZOO9P8ITUeS/CjDAi3267Pr3kspN1aGH6HxC8d03bD718qMo4dBvAkYQgQ1/M
 tapQ==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1;
 AJvYcCWcTJitEohmgx9D1xT6Igfp6pqmTYMDNTrWZgIhDRd+j92dFaxwMi9Ay1OcF3H1kWVazuB1Ug==@debbugs.gnu.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YyEseGDguGhTMnd/QCzJyWMG+TAV6l57HyGkC7HlODJBIbcS2gf
 SyJBZG2EvVeQ0FV0EILuqbGSW3UJTNwWK4DTj64EgJoL4KM7CCi0jsLgUw==
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncti4RCJu+YTEr8kQyraSrkSgLg0U96+YTcQPaiTrDBMWxHehdU077i8KPg1+M2
 WlAyXvr5akA3Q9twmf7jVKe5x4fOO4u/P988YjHyrMN5FVUN0gejpaJeRkR5YRTS/XBa4MuCMxy
 WBTazlwQMRbBePtYb/mRxx82X3LlTQFYCp1vlmxMwR+XUnTtebGhhte7X36/O8JaFuEG7w9jgRd
 iKCzIK3/3UVlrjF5pjUqoFc6XtMHqrfvrHPnQqNj6/3cRAG94q5wdVHlxcyqPbODG0akSTQaeBk
 sV4Ozo4DMrTBdcJL5C9iw/ggFmdt8qnLB+sT2mHl4EnKt+KgOTgj8pjWfdEelxSXVGzt/Kr2DY0
 U2fWfxHx5nug9VeZrrFO37iwn
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IF0UtJcbsjbo2X8LpqZyglp8+6iSiXtuNqfVoVRhsD3DflQea82XwQNCcpAqKDIh23VhvUSIw==
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6402:13c8:b0:5dc:cf9b:b01a with SMTP id
 4fb4d7f45d1cf-5dcdb6ff21dmr3776261a12.4.1738787078804; 
 Wed, 05 Feb 2025 12:24:38 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pro2 (p200300e0b70e7d00c4ce9c27d8bde411.dip0.t-ipconnect.de.
 [2003:e0:b70e:7d00:c4ce:9c27:d8bd:e411])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 4fb4d7f45d1cf-5dc723e4b6dsm11878825a12.24.2025.02.05.12.24.38
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Wed, 05 Feb 2025 12:24:38 -0800 (PST)
From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
In-Reply-To: <65946acd-2e63-437b-927f-215ed3160850@HIDDEN>
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dsgsn.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qqla2p1.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m21pwdsb3n.fsf@HIDDEN> <8634gt9ikt.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dq7sa.fsf@HIDDEN> <86lduk8pg0.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2wme4qxoh.fsf@HIDDEN> <86cyfw8nda.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2seosqvnt.fsf@HIDDEN> <86a5b08l8z.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2msf0qpqd.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <65946acd-2e63-437b-927f-215ed3160850@HIDDEN>
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 21:24:37 +0100
Message-ID: <m2ed0ccf7e.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN> writes:

>> After child frames: If a TTY frame is visible, it must be drawn. If a
>> TTY frame is invisible, it must not be drawn to.
>
> The proof of the pudding is in the eating.  And I'm afraid that we will
> get our bug reports sooner or later.  Anyway, try the following: Make a
> child frame on the selected frame like
>
> (setq frame
>       (make-frame
>        `((parent-frame . ,(selected-frame))
> 	 (left . 40) (top . 10)
> 	 (width . 20) (height . 10))))
>
> do C-x 5 2 and evaluate (visible-frame-list).  The child frame will be
> listed although it is not drawn.

Yes, but that's not related to the visibility of the root frame. It's
part of the semantics that need to be defined for tty child frame if one
really wants to go all the way to general child frames,

> Or do either
>
> (setq frame (make-frame))
> (make-frame-visible frame)
>
> or
>
> (setq frame (make-frame))
> (select-frame frame)
> (make-frame-invisible frame)
>
> In both cases C-x 5 o will get you out but before that you can't type
> anything into the window.  Frame visibility is a very fragile concept.

Yes, it's some way to go, for sure.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 19:20:43 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Feb 05 14:20:43 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52631 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfkx0-0006tg-R3
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 14:20:43 -0500
Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.19]:58551)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <rudalics@HIDDEN>) id 1tfkwy-0006tO-BL
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 14:20:41 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmx.at;
 s=s31663417; t=1738783219; x=1739388019; i=rudalics@HIDDEN;
 bh=rghenT/mBgW4o04Id8kN77FZnyWXidZkX/NhiBUl648=;
 h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version:Subject:To:Cc:
 References:From:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:
 Content-Transfer-Encoding:cc:content-transfer-encoding:
 content-type:date:from:message-id:mime-version:reply-to:subject:
 to;
 b=dzB9JIv1g7XsQA6Bf926VU1/sh3GRA7bUuRy6EkfAH3+r/pi4la/i//w3FqepuXJ
 pR7hBGBa0jUaJbeTKvrK5CWum9Bv1/m1m83UVlMS3iI6zT1OEFeh8IUFkYQ3aueRW
 QnZ7MW0LVO63RN/rZ2JvUQt9of7SQWO1mXXDSdoPeIPnrnWwO8eCWm460PNZnHbEV
 MfeUmXPMKjO4sMNcru0UwjhVfwEFf3770RTFHM1+IOSvzULhRBLJiJfYBA9FewG0P
 3i5mFnNI+Jqc8PIpmEm3SyqK33xnVzGaF01cWLbkXj7/jdg3vwhinrvX5aDqbkViA
 PB6gdfmb//hzmmN2fA==
X-UI-Sender-Class: 724b4f7f-cbec-4199-ad4e-598c01a50d3a
Received: from [192.168.31.113] ([213.142.96.129]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx005
 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MDQiS-1tXTjp0YJ4-00GY5n; Wed, 05
 Feb 2025 20:20:19 +0100
Message-ID: <65946acd-2e63-437b-927f-215ed3160850@HIDDEN>
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2025 20:20:18 +0100
MIME-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
To: =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>,
 Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN> <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN> <m2ed0dsgsn.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <868qqla2p1.fsf@HIDDEN> <m21pwdsb3n.fsf@HIDDEN> <8634gt9ikt.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dq7sa.fsf@HIDDEN> <86lduk8pg0.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2wme4qxoh.fsf@HIDDEN> <86cyfw8nda.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2seosqvnt.fsf@HIDDEN> <86a5b08l8z.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2msf0qpqd.fsf@HIDDEN>
Content-Language: en-US
From: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <m2msf0qpqd.fsf@HIDDEN>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:SK3k1crm9oXszcrZtp1b8x0RoLZ39vGEhTLK6VvubX4v/1pte8k
 PKeR4gwQ+S3Wzv7wVzWnie9pXEQ0bel3grWRxR+dO/Svb8L10gJowau2NfXU0VmOCS8Sj37
 IZ1D/vHkeAEXq1LsbE5g7kGCf2zEPC5qLe8cbxLYitc8vyVCpJfnYco7y27y0k/HwRpi6oZ
 d3nFpxoq3Snpn7y5MwVcA==
X-Spam-Flag: NO
UI-OutboundReport: notjunk:1;M01:P0:vd9I4HFyrQM=;9xPQvSCCUaPqH5Mh0f9Gn1UiXZg
 VYmVxnH4/HlsAZkIF8AT4ArK/0fJNv84jwXRROB99NwHuHkJbjIP6x+bqmYylwiZ5YC9ZwhOd
 HTo4eWNBQQJuvDsjNo0V24oNwphifDKjgUg95DTdafK9xvZ8xOzOR5x+1lJ9hNSmrSFJyxYtb
 QwU5iN9NtXmUP6EKhD+lugToer/aN9mkOoLW8JRMp8du6qwKTN92zUKezuv2kwA2pSGZ3Ou2l
 X0s6XbZqKqY0QJsJ7NLg0lAxUxzUpnVG+GCTmhlrLdzEFBdD41Vt4EyKSTkI5D590aEe5Vzno
 yZ0s3FG0SO5C6RS5vcYabLcDh8wdXdVZOACOp6fMlMXQIIIMYbDcRUV2fWMTmkWcOBLg9kYuf
 EId9qEr6PvokMVuFS/2zSlWj66T0wr5NrJz5r1hLMIV4N5AQ0hdUclfdl8qD6nczom0yeTVVI
 jmfqucPpCFKT5s9uNyVs1PWBM8xv4FU/7ovUPAS9PXrDPLcHPpXtA5NrR5LEWKXCpXtXC/JT3
 lK6P5DO1P4iyI5VwR4taxG2f+SDf4oFGlLP5jnOzuEB5XP3jsNNJhzayk7+VkcSgRFYDV+NUh
 WKFPCLrZZcxsoDa0Ia5YD6BoIPIFo6qKbpZhQ+ANnRyqC3Fezyl9GOSvv13J+gu89rVp/XRwP
 F/m+P6qGwU+ymSzqJGG0pTsTN1xs+So1+xBfjWmltuJT1v2QEXlexD8Bexa4DPjGYbbt2bQru
 TLhL42u1HUCkBrS2qup6c/Ki3yyTX+U6PPGaQV8rVdKOJmtaCodHI/p30pglT0sgNkGfIPV7P
 p7VR50XV5YiBB55pTvVBwX7ZTbIlaId2MRXsZ0b8FobJtx1UDXHJGSJdVY+dOkST8N2GpNI23
 NNq2983xWnJcGiOzEdAk6giPWIqUQ3uf2QKYgKOgP6Bv45GIgMj16kr3Dux0ytZ0Ha2N1Iqxc
 nKNWRcQ5uPYtSFaXnqC9XIvcQLKTcyXRDk7XQ/ysNNLgRP0a9lCK7LIhhw7iZ1TEntecJsZan
 7jn062aBE7+98WDTQ9cvSZyzEKvci4GNaSQ9+mKkoRVOMoYEHWzopPhLXffitGNvpeFyNB6YD
 tidfTwdPRFvlFxKp2dftgiBVW1s0Vv5OdSZHuzZGR+Dp5HzU4FX3LmoYrSVOlFMCfnIvB3wcp
 /iZ/VI8sxAujM607ZLsTbBzOK3Pa7qytdHt8zqEPBXLld5kfEjERGuAuAk5oFjOiboMoQkMhy
 dVWtyKJfOnnuW8euAT3n9sIW+9wEj3NQm+I63uqKub0LX8j6tTNIZFCwtl7fVUmxSewX0qHQn
 Yoo+4r8TmIe3dpJ58zf4EuhTuuGzJgV83EUEXNendXFsFs7Ptn0L5NThp5a5ziP7n+C
X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-)

 > After child frames: If a TTY frame is visible, it must be drawn. If a
 > TTY frame is invisible, it must not be drawn to.

The proof of the pudding is in the eating.  And I'm afraid that we will
get our bug reports sooner or later.  Anyway, try the following: Make a
child frame on the selected frame like

(setq frame
       (make-frame
        `((parent-frame . ,(selected-frame))
	 (left . 40) (top . 10)
	 (width . 20) (height . 10))))

do C-x 5 2 and evaluate (visible-frame-list).  The child frame will be
listed although it is not drawn.

Or do either

(setq frame (make-frame))
(make-frame-visible frame)

or

(setq frame (make-frame))
(select-frame frame)
(make-frame-invisible frame)

In both cases C-x 5 o will get you out but before that you can't type
anything into the window.  Frame visibility is a very fragile concept.

martin














Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 17:13:43 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Feb 05 12:13:43 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52191 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfiy6-0005zS-Li
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 12:13:42 -0500
Received: from mail-ej1-x62f.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::62f]:42347)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfiy3-0005zA-16
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 12:13:40 -0500
Received: by mail-ej1-x62f.google.com with SMTP id
 a640c23a62f3a-ab744d5e567so231656066b.1
 for <76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 09:13:38 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1738775611; x=1739380411; darn=debbugs.gnu.org;
 h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date
 :references:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date
 :message-id:reply-to;
 bh=yHHCgS8t2uOInrqgx+C2JiryUOg/+DAR1iRFA2mqQCA=;
 b=k1xkoYg67OQBqQbvK82YbToBBrwqndJ40KEFK4UnGkJG3d1BBJIhUh2GDbKMIkQLWN
 gK4rxd2G6MapP67xdkySVGehQms1SaIwBux8+Hj/OsS7EbNIMFylAlLrUpWAzgQFXSaG
 L5vrl82ybi5l6M6p/8E/bBY23/A6E7ZwlrBhw0p+IVRa9eHi09YJYzCbjomQqHGOiQ5C
 gIbgRWjDNhicYgBoUP7qCvAEN/alASmzXH+0G8xz8HR0MvudpNqHaSvnnyI0xQGAZo2F
 FMshSSFXobJrnMzsf25Z+A4BYnEix8x0DRNFeAPz9njNlLjZjds+55reo9g58O0YtybO
 Ta3w==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1738775611; x=1739380411;
 h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date
 :references:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from
 :to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=yHHCgS8t2uOInrqgx+C2JiryUOg/+DAR1iRFA2mqQCA=;
 b=S+eVxxQMA9l1Vb8Nb1b4AInGZwFPs81S0ycaehGKZi1Pa/Vbu6KnBfLJCJCwtTZ+sU
 Kn+Pc1NhgJQDIFQXvyRFcJDKSZkQ7tPCSNT692y17B357CbdYRV6hEuM0BWC6pAna7BN
 DkFe5Ic1Mu09L4SrzvN3qDxKFLBggWsefKFyTCg7G8bFZ4Q4Ri3HRed6hXXpeSXl81Xr
 LRl5ZVzS1+7q6aQufW5uvfxCkD9wXlhY0mv0zMwBHtK0c8ckJ2sy0AXYwlTnXny4qBH/
 8H8cazkZm3kqZb+XwJLEIJyyLZr92M2U45u3kXO1ETzKXiTd1Q8DU1nIbVfsZiGEs2eh
 i4IA==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1;
 AJvYcCUn6YCV+UnAvq1d3+w5ktL8GuSq+4aTiwOb0WoRMkw2phzANQ+KO0IljB50+1qxHwhUw6ctpw==@debbugs.gnu.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Ywutgr3o0CLxzPezgqRYVMwXHsQiRlbrvDRv01B05hG5afpY+2E
 ZyRidmvnYWXIav8iTIhJdAr0ptfO61WmhzMfcZDT2gJJlta8An2BG6P2RQ==
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncvRHqlT6SYfutEE3DjBLpH4FncFkWvh37PlWT+1dwhaAaburxTDv3f+Zqocq/l
 v3ieKMmvC/6z1op+425SPryoS9yL6fSLq7senLBLMAN74BwG4Y6NZY/W/aAoHfkDxfi7d3QMqv5
 oEuXklO8SMPpw3UzNzq46UNEFdgbd703wgoqMZzm6I8POt9Cb28XbTVn/PWm45YKjXi9mdajIVg
 /gFEmaTn+ihE7PauLuHTWsYjVQNRxgnQhlkixuBZx/WG4PGqFJieCriP/g8+5W8ci+WcC18ntym
 D6hgzmIHiAiptBA5jrusoHiglgMR3nbVjdPZgOm0G9uZAMk4c23NvUZKnrM1uSP2pc/+l38FDxA
 VkNPER1gxJCI5YpziyoyR7qqc
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IHOsPW9bNOFDWi1gfO+9kdakA+LrNxL4XPbPv201rV/N4lAXfaHnZOHCuVLpQ3EAHI5Pow9zA==
X-Received: by 2002:a17:907:3f22:b0:ab7:5983:13b5 with SMTP id
 a640c23a62f3a-ab76e8e9017mr9157466b.20.1738775611276; 
 Wed, 05 Feb 2025 09:13:31 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pro2 (p200300e0b70e7d00c4ce9c27d8bde411.dip0.t-ipconnect.de.
 [2003:e0:b70e:7d00:c4ce:9c27:d8bd:e411])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 a640c23a62f3a-ab6e47a7dc4sm1141698866b.16.2025.02.05.09.13.30
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Wed, 05 Feb 2025 09:13:30 -0800 (PST)
From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
In-Reply-To: <86a5b08l8z.fsf@HIDDEN>
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dsgsn.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qqla2p1.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m21pwdsb3n.fsf@HIDDEN> <8634gt9ikt.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dq7sa.fsf@HIDDEN> <86lduk8pg0.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2wme4qxoh.fsf@HIDDEN> <86cyfw8nda.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2seosqvnt.fsf@HIDDEN> <86a5b08l8z.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 18:13:30 +0100
Message-ID: <m2msf0qpqd.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:

>> From: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.mo>> As I see it, the different meanings =
of "visible" are actually just the
>> different effect of being visible in different use-cases.
>>
>> For example, my guess is that the old "if a tty frame is not displayed
>> on the terminal (=3D "obscured") then consider it visible nonetheless" w=
as
>> just to make use cases like other-frame work.
>
> Maybe so, but other-frame and other similar functions do have to work
> reasonably with TTY frames, right?

I sent a patch for other-frame.

> Also, why aren't you annoyed by the fact that a GUI frame obscured by
> another GUI frame is not considered "invisible"?  Isn't that the same
> situation as with 2 TTY frames on the same display?

If a GUI frame is visible, it must be drawn. If a GUI frame is
invisible, it must not be drawn to.

Details depend on the window system, expose events, possibly the window
manager. Clipping is not Emacs' responsibility. Insofar why would I be
annoyed? It's just how things work.

Before child frames: TTY frames are always visible, invisible doesn't
exist. Visible frames _must_not_ always be drawn, with the known
exception.

After child frames: If a TTY frame is visible, it must be drawn. If a
TTY frame is invisible, it must not be drawn to.

If that's not better, I don't know.

>> I propose something simpler: Make visible =3D not displayed, and move the
>> different effects on use-cases to the use-cases themselves.
>
> By "the use-cases", do you mean modifications of the Lisp code which
> calls next-frame etc.?  That would mean changes all over the place,
> and not just in Emacs core.  I fear that the 3 functions we found are
> just the tip of a very large iceberg.

I mean use-cases like other-frame, and I'm not afraid :-). If it's Lisp,
it's easy to change.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 15:27:53 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Feb 05 10:27:53 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51913 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfhJg-0003N9-Jk
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 10:27:52 -0500
Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:50278)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tfhJe-0003Mv-S6
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 10:27:51 -0500
Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e])
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfhJY-0004od-8s; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 10:27:44 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org;
 s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:
 Date; bh=Njcvb866dT2xy1tnyAZWFjr3QgZ/4yxNqIz4zXr4hQY=; b=NJ1IHz3iGAILOZ3XW3qr
 aKmo9iR7JcI1JffyozCcCLlDIUx4NvCs/9xLo7weRZNOo2ePhE9EAN/vRJrVQcrDZ31xw6HwIB85J
 lrdQZ4Wq3J8BRVmCkP+WUHErSLr+6St+u0PEjTf3g8q2NMFddOvaBNHIVAFQxsOV2iOE5N13MyR4T
 BVZ0YdayhFuOLiBgY5qXrxj+nkG3Ut6izwIIIwkzPDT5iRO4qzt+QjyJnMXiFlLZaGhXnzesR2lhI
 ZRKi7BW+sQcxQqGFccKJFVUr1FnRypUJNeWOdB2IzRqk5bezTUgP1qEQkTgxMo3aPIpaEL3ucoZGG
 oMxZS8ryJjdwyg==;
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 17:27:40 +0200
Message-Id: <86a5b08l8z.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <m2seosqvnt.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?=
 =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Wed, 05 Feb 2025 16:05:26 +0100)
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dsgsn.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qqla2p1.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m21pwdsb3n.fsf@HIDDEN> <8634gt9ikt.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dq7sa.fsf@HIDDEN> <86lduk8pg0.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2wme4qxoh.fsf@HIDDEN> <86cyfw8nda.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2seosqvnt.fsf@HIDDEN>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---)

> From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
> Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 16:05:26 +0100
> 
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
> 
> >> I don't find that a good idea because
> >
> > Not even in principle, i.e. to have two flags instead of one?  The
> > details of the flags could be different from what I proposed.
> 
> Not even in principle, no. I don't see ATM how that would be useful.

It could be useful if it will solve the problems with next-frame and
other-frame without requiring modifications of Lisp code that is too
high-level.

We could also keep using a single flag, just call it by a different
name, so that it won't confuse due to the fact that "not visible"
could be caused either by not displaying a frame or by its being
obscured.  next-frame and friends care about the former, but not about
the latter.

> > Do you disagree that we have several different meanings of "invisible
> > frame", and that it would be better not to conflate them into a single
> > boolean?
> 
> As I see it, the different meanings of "visible" are actually just the
> different effect of being visible in different use-cases.
> 
> For example, my guess is that the old "if a tty frame is not displayed
> on the terminal (= "obscured") then consider it visible nonetheless" was
> just to make use cases like other-frame work.

Maybe so, but other-frame and other similar functions do have to work
reasonably with TTY frames, right?

Also, why aren't you annoyed by the fact that a GUI frame obscured by
another GUI frame is not considered "invisible"?  Isn't that the same
situation as with 2 TTY frames on the same display?

> I propose something simpler: Make visible = not displayed, and move the
> different effects on use-cases to the use-cases themselves.

By "the use-cases", do you mean modifications of the Lisp code which
calls next-frame etc.?  That would mean changes all over the place,
and not just in Emacs core.  I fear that the 3 functions we found are
just the tip of a very large iceberg.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 15:05:39 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Feb 05 10:05:39 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51864 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfgyB-0002OQ-7f
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 10:05:39 -0500
Received: from mail-ej1-x62c.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::62c]:54612)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfgy8-0002O5-DJ
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 10:05:37 -0500
Received: by mail-ej1-x62c.google.com with SMTP id
 a640c23a62f3a-ab6f636d821so1058140766b.1
 for <76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 07:05:36 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1738767930; x=1739372730; darn=debbugs.gnu.org;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=FoHcq/FYzBh3NQ8YXZMyEfweu7Ia0tB6dWaFwues/rM=;
 b=JTwyCUyPH4GKji6p/OAlwVZY9Ay6Za55cBLLFRc5Qu3WWumYXQc6oUYSKEdAHeW6Nb
 a4+TkittKDVCiapn24Api63d6qZygXH5cnUjcqDXZIio8yopE+ZAMu0GDk941fbOZ5ZF
 t8nEZ/uczqFYfFXvpc8JxfytZHHxD1uej/vcxj5itYC73Bfgpl+qkBsY1QPzBjXlvTW3
 yCQEeJat0Uh8axCCS868QDjTBmaxNGwIUJa4QE8CSGes0by5rWatOMpeJ1XaC0CUtI0g
 0dQNRHgS3dgnzu3onGUezq7yeCzVUrCjU+x9a8cX/vXgdMeNW9qM8oGaPZ0er+XoMRwO
 rMaQ==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1738767930; x=1739372730;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date
 :message-id:reply-to;
 bh=FoHcq/FYzBh3NQ8YXZMyEfweu7Ia0tB6dWaFwues/rM=;
 b=HUWq5CG5SDUW7Ca7j6Rzg5BapqsjQ/wK8hwJHlM2gadyjoEu343KmB63IF6WN5FxWF
 m8aT08k7RsqO/SmTx01XydyWfDr93lKTIPw2PG6BrK66pGtsSF+nlKdr/8TkPdkL7nLo
 vp8tw7hNWoa724LT6X+k7o+dA0aDGubDn6D/VLPKFdO14aauOcb41Sb8TogYnOmmP4o3
 5vL6/3W1wJp3A4wSDJh8VxLQcrZ2gdfDzLzOLUOhDhITbnSaYeT9wceJixTLYdMT9j14
 9hAvaX0qTaRUF1KOcxa0PgLdoaS3UgQ3FdGCt1aNEe52DiPBC3sIue9hNvfIAF4rTHqB
 luAA==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1;
 AJvYcCXyvHY4prBJeVSy6zVW8qkxdvmAljJHMoiEB0k60HG6sMBKFWV/zSaT8vakU7max0f5eN8bcA==@debbugs.gnu.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YzZnNBTdEBpr1qX4UKc1W7ki5+dKYhgpmU2r0mP7VtEuOuUwM86
 blswXm3rmtYUjEomAo9qEV0v//lSRRW5B2HDPafzzrr213/YsWI+x7HmgQ==
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncswpwHmohAHamoXlBHdSHV69muzwheJTh2xzWxcTnxSNf8cbDqu3XbMv7hUwM6
 TN0bqOR7pDp79QZGC4wNNLd9v8SivL63q0Xo7BA4P153Ofz2cCCHhMaIosSdK1UFPGcoJeYzDHh
 Ut8shVebkpIsAxgk0wBHJOlYbIOrfBdk5fbWplQ9ZdPtLWqpHzOxTvduaI4I4z7A5+hNakgd+Cr
 iCjpVuaAEsFF5qx+NEJWrEGHLeCSHUekG1j2oRHEskWxK3eE0wXM7SsJKm8n9iyOcxqjj3vLR7U
 z0TpRMldAf/RlfQWn2SZaX/fWDMCJr+/sOAANinrVNv0jqbgV2lLX48uVGLab1yG/cbJhDvrY1s
 gVMfzQ7E9FbCjZUbIC0jZAWZT
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IHvx++lcqY45fPdpuyxU4jtstrtOVgEcleHgWzWm1LHCOhBcmNrEmSJWq5q1rIymdEXXl8aXQ==
X-Received: by 2002:a17:907:320c:b0:ab7:590a:7759 with SMTP id
 a640c23a62f3a-ab75e262fd0mr377169666b.33.1738767927955; 
 Wed, 05 Feb 2025 07:05:27 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pro2 (p200300e0b70e7d00c4ce9c27d8bde411.dip0.t-ipconnect.de.
 [2003:e0:b70e:7d00:c4ce:9c27:d8bd:e411])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 a640c23a62f3a-ab6e47a818csm1112534366b.6.2025.02.05.07.05.27
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Wed, 05 Feb 2025 07:05:27 -0800 (PST)
From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
In-Reply-To: <86cyfw8nda.fsf@HIDDEN>
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dsgsn.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qqla2p1.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m21pwdsb3n.fsf@HIDDEN> <8634gt9ikt.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dq7sa.fsf@HIDDEN> <86lduk8pg0.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2wme4qxoh.fsf@HIDDEN> <86cyfw8nda.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 16:05:26 +0100
Message-ID: <m2seosqvnt.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:

>> I don't find that a good idea because
>
> Not even in principle, i.e. to have two flags instead of one?  The
> details of the flags could be different from what I proposed.

Not even in principle, no. I don't see ATM how that would be useful.

> Do you disagree that we have several different meanings of "invisible
> frame", and that it would be better not to conflate them into a single
> boolean?

As I see it, the different meanings of "visible" are actually just the
different effect of being visible in different use-cases.

For example, my guess is that the old "if a tty frame is not displayed
on the terminal (= "obscured") then consider it visible nonetheless" was
just to make use cases like other-frame work.

I propose something simpler: Make visible = not displayed, and move the
different effects on use-cases to the use-cases themselves.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 14:42:06 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Feb 05 09:42:06 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49235 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfgbO-0005uI-2S
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 09:42:06 -0500
Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:40216)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tfgbK-0005tT-Vp
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 09:42:03 -0500
Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e])
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfgbE-0005rB-6Q; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 09:41:56 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org;
 s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:
 Date; bh=hpWBZa4i1gqO43xRONnec7hNgaIaX0hj9wLo3ciUHuI=; b=nGPaN/9+2I7RbR2ORWlF
 JFhr8FmmXvcPKI//+t0we+7KlwvTKhNMJjnUXznUMGcd9Gr1MOg7SWIAsCmL9yXmSzjghG09ylHhz
 NzkP5KDCdorYnrfzVIKUAJ5HxcsPhHwsyM1HaXaPlz07ajZeZfKviWPU6HPPeh965Gb8I0ySJVe5i
 9gHCPqTaLPSEuNDmKypMQ3BtOiVaczjq7jbqCByPt24PReGO7xdyDn/6xjOfaSK9vg2Dq1AqD4Bx7
 0AeCeuaxs+LvjfLP3cWYUL8NEsGiokaT+39hwYBN0xlSbw1kJGBI928lxAE0DaOaFlFcGMBZsh/JO
 VCwFzNpRVnV/jQ==;
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 16:41:53 +0200
Message-Id: <86cyfw8nda.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <m2wme4qxoh.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?=
 =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Wed, 05 Feb 2025 15:21:50 +0100)
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dsgsn.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qqla2p1.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m21pwdsb3n.fsf@HIDDEN> <8634gt9ikt.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dq7sa.fsf@HIDDEN> <86lduk8pg0.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2wme4qxoh.fsf@HIDDEN>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---)

> From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
> Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 15:21:50 +0100
> 
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
> 
> >> From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
> >> Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> >> Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 06:28:53 +0100
> >> 
> >> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
> >> 
> >> >> From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
> >> >> Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> >> >> Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 21:34:20 +0100
> >> >> 
> >> >> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
> >> >> 
> >> >> >> The semantics of being visible before I removed being obscured was
> >> >> >> confusing. A frame could be visible but obscured, which is for me means
> >> >> >> it's invisible and can't be seen. That makes no sense to me.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > But nothing else makes sense on TTY when we have multiple frames on
> >> >> > the same display.  So for the purpose of switching frames, the
> >> >> > meaning of "visible" on TTY should be tweaked to produce the expected
> >> >> > effect.
> >> >> 
> >> >> This can be done on other-frame and maybe elsewhere in Lisp, as I showed
> >> >> in my patch.
> >> >
> >> > What about next-frame with non-nil 2nd argument?
> >> >
> >> > Are you saying that every call to next-frame should be audited and
> >> > changed if needed to DTRT with the new definition of "visible" for TTY
> >> > frames?  That'd mean an incompatible change, so my proposal is to
> >> > avoid that need by changing something on the C level.  Are you against
> >> > that as well?  If so, please explain your objections to changing
> >> > candidate_frame and/or next-frame/prev-frame as I proposed up-thread.
> >> 
> >> I'm proposing this change, yes, visible = visible, and not with the
> >> exception that tty root frames that are marked visible are actually
> >> invisible as far as redisplay is concerned.
> >> 
> >> The reason is the C code. The obscured thing appears to me like a
> >> kludge. Removing it simplifies things and makes it easier to reason
> >> about frames.
> >
> > I understand that the problem was with the terminology: saying that a
> > frame was "visible" when in fact it was completely obscured.
> >
> > If this is a terminology problem, maybe we can solve it by changing
> > the terminology.  E.g., we could have two flags instead of one:
> >
> >   . displayed_p flag -- if the frame is on display
> >   . obscured_p flag -- if the frame is obscured by another frame
> >
> > TTY frames then could be "obscured", but will always be "displayed".
> > GUI frames could be either "obscured", "displayed" or not "displayed".
> >
> > Then we can modify next-frame and other-frame to DTRT using these two
> > flags.
> >
> > WDYT?
> 
> I don't find that a good idea because

Not even in principle, i.e. to have two flags instead of one?  The
details of the flags could be different from what I proposed.

Do you disagree that we have several different meanings of "invisible
frame", and that it would be better not to conflate them into a single
boolean?




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 14:38:29 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Feb 05 09:38:29 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49223 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfgXs-0005hW-GO
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 09:38:29 -0500
Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:58346)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tfgXo-0005hE-9G
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 09:38:25 -0500
Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e])
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfgXi-0005Hq-Dd; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 09:38:18 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org;
 s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:
 Date; bh=MTAxm24+npgGeX2MuHANDmusx+FnWXm848YGfW9W8CQ=; b=aFUxYY9kruDH+5+YwxCN
 C5FAEfuUXl9194o5eX/TKMScZk14O5eOMl1ixwMY6gBywsq+A8w43QNUeO1Fq1ABN7fNXQKz7vQ4b
 ufoNq6FsRD/MfWI5CublNoSecMm5Q1qCmb0wlA2PMlWwHErcIVHLoVW94FTn2yQ4kcx/fXtOmX4Sy
 RrV2B2rhN5BJb5CkAB3+2ku/0okZHvUOzb66Ue9tjrzPKurEy9kTAWiQ+y7cw1seqvykfhoZk+0yP
 xcZPjvQcN7Z/wl4a0F0hRzZAXhrotLhuBHPVnaaJeTdhUyc0xeVrGfgFozt4WDiqdrE5zyoolKq3y
 RW1PD8N4pGrIaw==;
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 16:38:14 +0200
Message-Id: <86ed0c8njd.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <m2r04cv75v.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?=
 =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Wed, 05 Feb 2025 14:43:24 +0100)
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN> <86r04c8r0e.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2r04cv75v.fsf@HIDDEN>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---)

> From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
> Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 14:43:24 +0100
> 
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
> 
> > Thanks, but I'm worried that we will have to special-case TTY frames
> > in Lisp, due to these changes.  I think this again indicates that we
> > use "frame visibility" for several different purposes.  If so, a
> > better way forward would be to make the frame's visibility flag a
> > tristate or maybe even more values, instead of a simple boolean.
> 
> What would the values of such a visibility enum be?

I proposed one possible way in my other messages earlier today.  Other
factoring is, of course, possible.

> I find it easier to have a simple definition in C, and let Lisp decide
> what it wants to do, basically on a use-case basis. For example, if we
> decide other-frame should work with tty root frames that are not
> visible, let other-frame do it. Other function might not want to do the
> same thing.
> 
> An enum, on the other hand, makes things complicated for both C
> internals and Lisp.

We could have two separate flags or a bitmap in C.  For Lisp, I
propose to use predicates and/or teach the likes of next-frame to deal
with these flags internally, in some way that is convenient for Lisp
programs.  Something similar to the possible values of the 2nd
argument of next-frame.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 14:24:56 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Feb 05 09:24:55 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49176 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfgKl-0004uC-I2
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 09:24:55 -0500
Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:34348)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tfgKi-0004tw-8Z
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 09:24:53 -0500
Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e])
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfgKc-0002xx-QP; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 09:24:46 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org;
 s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date:
 mime-version; bh=vugAmzn/vx9aACteyk1f/NNNX+kz3IiPAvDbClsdmyE=; b=W/bHpdkevo0J
 fLYNsGWF519oZ5FZrNu758Z/kEL8NiQTncX+lFIpH1eiDu21TnF98AI0kq8wG56gZPvcwGItoI4v1
 kgTrgT1roMuAPoAnOCcyZYNmR8lXG3SbiYOWntUBPzuTtYciUwLYeP7SzD/6POb50q86md57Ww2VY
 2gLjAUpo+J2UoAZKFUTYaOxzopgk/2f9VBvh5CZ/B+yUbnKXMPbaBooTcCnFh77MQyfqYYjYefa8z
 KhNwvCGElHiCDnZdgzSTDqK7LUQXK8eVaxqSphsKUJ7cfT5bPIRQV4lgC6X8RiJ/SmT4/r9BPAz5i
 7zECijPAX7kU/80yaJ1A6Q==;
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 16:24:43 +0200
Message-Id: <86h6588o5w.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <8398555c-5a80-488f-a53c-dd6af3860059@HIDDEN> (message from
 martin rudalics on Wed, 5 Feb 2025 09:31:18 +0100)
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN> <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN> <86ikppadhw.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <e02e35c1-627e-4798-b19b-0fcb281372be@HIDDEN> <m2ikppsgyr.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <86a5b1a2t3.fsf@HIDDEN> <8398555c-5a80-488f-a53c-dd6af3860059@HIDDEN>
X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---)

> Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2025 09:31:18 +0100
> Cc: 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> From: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
> 
>  > I think there's a conceptual problem here: the meaning of "invisible"
>  > on TTY is different from its meaning on GUI displays.  On GUI display,
>  > "invisible" means the frame is not on display at all, whereas on TTY
>  > the frame is there, it's just obscured by the one(s) above it.  So I
>  > think we need to change candidate_frame to consider TTY frames
>  > "visible" for the purpose of returning "visible" frames in next_frame
>  > and prev_frame.
> 
> The concept of frame visibility has so many interpretations within Emcas
> that it's virtually impossible to say what it really means.
> 
> - Convey to the window manager whether a frame should be displayed or
>    not.

This is the "displayed"/non-"displayed" state.

> - Tell redisplay to draw the frame or not (for the case when Emacs is
>    its own window manager as on a tty).

This is the "obscured"/not "obscured" state.

> - Tell the buffer display methods whether a frame may be considered for
>    displaying the buffer.

This is "displayed".

> - Tell 'other-frame' which frames it should consider.

Likewise.

> - Simply allow the user to say that a frame should be visible or not and
>    subsequently ask for whether it is.

This is "displayed", AFAIU.

So I think we can introduce two flags, splitting the existing
"visible" flag between them.  Then we can modify the relevant C
functions to handle each flag accordingly, so that other-frame and
next-frame behave sensibly with both GUI and TTY frames.

Does it make sense?




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 14:22:03 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Feb 05 09:22:03 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49171 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfgHz-0004pT-7A
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 09:22:03 -0500
Received: from mail-wm1-x32e.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::32e]:48500)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfgHu-0004oo-9a
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 09:22:01 -0500
Received: by mail-wm1-x32e.google.com with SMTP id
 5b1f17b1804b1-436ce2ab251so47047875e9.1
 for <76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 06:21:58 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1738765312; x=1739370112; darn=debbugs.gnu.org;
 h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date
 :references:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date
 :message-id:reply-to;
 bh=qfElKyoaxJGT486WTtXG6WqdQf4VcHOGK1t7fIv1qIQ=;
 b=nRZK9QMNnQZQ+M/POXMl9pR9bxKto5rMiLgiSn67Yqrh8+yKelG62PW35e9apKcP2K
 RQoTTem2xrBCJ++MoMRIqLDo2FS6ROiin7EAefprX3eMKWZasYzPI57ua9DFJrl6MIlN
 1k8S6duHpI5cOzSCxz8z2rSuHmz3YR+1fyJk5D6a337g37D3Yo9sYhsoLookI8/cDdoj
 +0u9It8fYjsfbZPXbN/nEhZRcPiL4mIlfei/CXtpfL76IxW5KhRU9miL6WLPT0441Yp4
 LUhWC6OaKqx537sCghhrG/9BheqvKGeCUjCFG7Wv3geYVTFa+jCXDvrOMqs9s28Jzujh
 NNbQ==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1738765312; x=1739370112;
 h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date
 :references:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from
 :to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=qfElKyoaxJGT486WTtXG6WqdQf4VcHOGK1t7fIv1qIQ=;
 b=jkWt5Yb6ihZadTFOEEkduDilCcp/GQXEz91cSQq54oXgXhTwa7HUrlLGLf/f13qnq2
 6ePBa70QI+QbaRMDhqyMr0iw2DVdUJo6M/K7q9WatcXIzRW2unJaQ5Hcuhk8X2cgbJN3
 Cj7UCiB++O9vZ0f2xyI8xiIH1p2n2qgk5XC/wopg56eIHk6h64qaDfT2tZGgsXcIBRaA
 Z0LXEQZgG8mJbOjcBjV9H+qGA+VLZMc2SG2pVK6viLyHTkC+tsPU0JvYDBSjmQV8Z/jb
 hc0OmjZb1DsDFCf4ybRcmMWAWnC5GVl4EBVFkCdASt897s+IwqzTMkSOSIciRiuWPMWN
 aKhA==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1;
 AJvYcCXzzfeVP7OBBANsrqm2lFXmU4h171mmaWm29QigYoBNj1a5ILyscHUwPCS3E1Le6DPn/8EyMA==@debbugs.gnu.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YyZcUwh5f9ySksPTuT+iJWubicEC7ywZ5WhlBRoo4WW8WUuYiyv
 s6/8g80xlapGgG7GFOznbTrO9Nxv4Ok7eXuQPb9gbfdZesSHGdcqY4SYzw==
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncsxmKCLCGgfn28vINDWvD9T5sgL0rRvwGZy+4lKh2qR10eAI2+C9UEUxDstGFi
 7fAlFaNdBfbp7OzScAwy7vbqquZqC4st4dMqXNeDDRVmQ/rhiwSD68AhUTpQx++bV2xj3yONyXD
 WrR1BJnTVD9uVq/lh/5w/vwV/0G+9lr/sNBBOIroxZa7NWvf/6lsi8Nhh2SHpfiR+zDqPTbvI6H
 DjJH4ijAjx/gYdf/0FJM1EhZPynDl7cbhiTp5TRr6ngquLFUP1WHfTzM2S4IW+4QvosrPYD1GhA
 SABP5sr7LXqnwHtZQKg0b4kvqrUtdjZxNcuwJMg8/CQY+hOknbd0cABvZDS+DfXtxkggGajeXyI
 yZia6rZwBli09eGTdOWawIIKJ
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IHD7kmmOPtxCqfLU/JSdCpQnrWBgOknwK4MPQTwB0/g7+4Jv8Z8euE5ol5qaR+fQQs2pA9T6g==
X-Received: by 2002:a05:600c:1d0f:b0:431:60ec:7a96 with SMTP id
 5b1f17b1804b1-4390d56e5a6mr18183115e9.25.1738765311506; 
 Wed, 05 Feb 2025 06:21:51 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pro2 (p200300e0b70e7d00c4ce9c27d8bde411.dip0.t-ipconnect.de.
 [2003:e0:b70e:7d00:c4ce:9c27:d8bd:e411])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 ffacd0b85a97d-38c5c1cf53asm18551649f8f.87.2025.02.05.06.21.50
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Wed, 05 Feb 2025 06:21:51 -0800 (PST)
From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
In-Reply-To: <86lduk8pg0.fsf@HIDDEN>
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dsgsn.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qqla2p1.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m21pwdsb3n.fsf@HIDDEN> <8634gt9ikt.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dq7sa.fsf@HIDDEN> <86lduk8pg0.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 15:21:50 +0100
Message-ID: <m2wme4qxoh.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:

>> From: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
>> Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 06:28:53 +0100
>>=20
>> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
>>=20
>> >> From: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
>> >> Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> >> Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 21:34:20 +0100
>> >>=20
>> >> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
>> >>=20
>> >> >> The semantics of being visible before I removed being obscured was
>> >> >> confusing. A frame could be visible but obscured, which is for me =
means
>> >> >> it's invisible and can't be seen. That makes no sense to me.
>> >> >
>> >> > But nothing else makes sense on TTY when we have multiple frames on
>> >> > the same display.  So for the purpose of switching frames, the
>> >> > meaning of "visible" on TTY should be tweaked to produce the expect=
ed
>> >> > effect.
>> >>=20
>> >> This can be done on other-frame and maybe elsewhere in Lisp, as I sho=
wed
>> >> in my patch.
>> >
>> > What about next-frame with non-nil 2nd argument?
>> >
>> > Are you saying that every call to next-frame should be audited and
>> > changed if needed to DTRT with the new definition of "visible" for TTY
>> > frames?  That'd mean an incompatible change, so my proposal is to
>> > avoid that need by changing something on the C level.  Are you against
>> > that as well?  If so, please explain your objections to changing
>> > candidate_frame and/or next-frame/prev-frame as I proposed up-thread.
>>=20
>> I'm proposing this change, yes, visible =3D visible, and not with the
>> exception that tty root frames that are marked visible are actually
>> invisible as far as redisplay is concerned.
>>=20
>> The reason is the C code. The obscured thing appears to me like a
>> kludge. Removing it simplifies things and makes it easier to reason
>> about frames.
>
> I understand that the problem was with the terminology: saying that a
> frame was "visible" when in fact it was completely obscured.
>
> If this is a terminology problem, maybe we can solve it by changing
> the terminology.  E.g., we could have two flags instead of one:
>
>   . displayed_p flag -- if the frame is on display
>   . obscured_p flag -- if the frame is obscured by another frame
>
> TTY frames then could be "obscured", but will always be "displayed".
> GUI frames could be either "obscured", "displayed" or not "displayed".
>
> Then we can modify next-frame and other-frame to DTRT using these two
> flags.
>
> WDYT?

I don't find that a good idea because

- the former obscured flag is equal to (and (not visible) (is root)
  (is tty frame)). No need for a flag.

- a new obscured that really means a frame is obscured by another frame
  or something cannot be computed easily, except for root frames.

- an obscured flag doesn't really help with the different use-cases.
  AFAIK it wasn't even exposed to Lisp.





Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 13:57:16 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Feb 05 08:57:16 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49140 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfftz-0003eg-TK
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 08:57:16 -0500
Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:44282)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tfftx-0003eR-Mt
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 08:57:14 -0500
Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e])
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfftr-0006O1-Q4; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 08:57:08 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org;
 s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:
 Date; bh=UaqQVPbmpa9HdA3tNpRS1XbTDbL4jznE43EfPTRUIt8=; b=J/SUWhfNJNBxZkZab1Ui
 s4+4NOsIn10sejmcr0R6xoMclQuGPbaeHKOix7JTNN4cryhyr5boOV5EdTupAo6u/dg2FjlMBIPjh
 I4SK7g4TfEVqocjhoI3W0+CAH6IaCxcEuC3HfkKafNBX06OS4tTIs2luVTkmsx/EbwdN2UUCM5frk
 7iKnky2NHk8jC6gSM51NzH3MEbGwvSHid8bekDjicb4fJ3uiJz4ST3DjOv6tDA3kbgGY7AnuGlbDC
 0xmJnItgTuXxQC0oemWlTDWMBCmc84Jcec27cI9pPGGvXnHcb8FSyqemxtch8bpZEfhwImIfsaTgg
 Vjp2BGNmBW0IiA==;
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 15:57:03 +0200
Message-Id: <86lduk8pg0.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <m2ed0dq7sa.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?=
 =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Wed, 05 Feb 2025 06:28:53 +0100)
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dsgsn.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qqla2p1.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m21pwdsb3n.fsf@HIDDEN> <8634gt9ikt.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dq7sa.fsf@HIDDEN>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---)

> From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
> Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 06:28:53 +0100
> 
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
> 
> >> From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
> >> Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> >> Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 21:34:20 +0100
> >> 
> >> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
> >> 
> >> >> The semantics of being visible before I removed being obscured was
> >> >> confusing. A frame could be visible but obscured, which is for me means
> >> >> it's invisible and can't be seen. That makes no sense to me.
> >> >
> >> > But nothing else makes sense on TTY when we have multiple frames on
> >> > the same display.  So for the purpose of switching frames, the
> >> > meaning of "visible" on TTY should be tweaked to produce the expected
> >> > effect.
> >> 
> >> This can be done on other-frame and maybe elsewhere in Lisp, as I showed
> >> in my patch.
> >
> > What about next-frame with non-nil 2nd argument?
> >
> > Are you saying that every call to next-frame should be audited and
> > changed if needed to DTRT with the new definition of "visible" for TTY
> > frames?  That'd mean an incompatible change, so my proposal is to
> > avoid that need by changing something on the C level.  Are you against
> > that as well?  If so, please explain your objections to changing
> > candidate_frame and/or next-frame/prev-frame as I proposed up-thread.
> 
> I'm proposing this change, yes, visible = visible, and not with the
> exception that tty root frames that are marked visible are actually
> invisible as far as redisplay is concerned.
> 
> The reason is the C code. The obscured thing appears to me like a
> kludge. Removing it simplifies things and makes it easier to reason
> about frames.

I understand that the problem was with the terminology: saying that a
frame was "visible" when in fact it was completely obscured.

If this is a terminology problem, maybe we can solve it by changing
the terminology.  E.g., we could have two flags instead of one:

  . displayed_p flag -- if the frame is on display
  . obscured_p flag -- if the frame is obscured by another frame

TTY frames then could be "obscured", but will always be "displayed".
GUI frames could be either "obscured", "displayed" or not "displayed".

Then we can modify next-frame and other-frame to DTRT using these two
flags.

WDYT?




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 13:43:36 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Feb 05 08:43:36 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49109 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tffgl-0002zv-Oa
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 08:43:36 -0500
Received: from mail-wr1-x433.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::433]:48533)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tffgi-0002zd-Qg
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 08:43:33 -0500
Received: by mail-wr1-x433.google.com with SMTP id
 ffacd0b85a97d-38db8f8786fso129960f8f.1
 for <76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 05:43:32 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1738763006; x=1739367806; darn=debbugs.gnu.org;
 h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date
 :references:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date
 :message-id:reply-to;
 bh=dsA9y8w3F4W5+1tUX1GE3qCpJeXnMfi5FgRWM6r5d0s=;
 b=EjpL1gcJcBt/2SKHBebP+EYeTxmZbN8do4LHwNjEm6IY3GSYA7dEiQvP6gwxXoYJC7
 jkIpNWyNdgGA+2+36sql6trtdRZnhaFIBdvzCOdFGw5gHLOtIP+r5aI7Hmx64GjkLFOQ
 YHsUTJ4mxMhCuYXKrS9eKS6PQ870A0MEss1P9aTxyXIuZNyi+Tt+BImsqoMNZadmZ/l/
 Lszl5U+nDgOM0TH2etp2waBJeZP4+5g3hqROzlit9GITlj/WLPG2feeWkwrpKpM+WQ/L
 pExfRrites4CDBrR9Fp162wCxPBFBZUQyXsbsOrdPOiKT1cK9NG0uHI8emYc+4XQUHOw
 zIwg==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1738763006; x=1739367806;
 h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date
 :references:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from
 :to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=dsA9y8w3F4W5+1tUX1GE3qCpJeXnMfi5FgRWM6r5d0s=;
 b=jSssA2qdavJXHFIKnpmA9Pm18dOOL3RzhBsIU9Oicxi3AHa6XN3U0VlM3yRJJVc2hO
 itGMIO5fcfdxh4vRIUcYtRqdnzzf5kW0SIwS+o0su+BnCkrd9kX5Q9WCPBcILHPe+Ne9
 P1cWRa3A7Ab8i9TRenmThZ88YXLlI7S3Pn0QNZsHj7B9oczvfkGxipu8GZpmC7zUc8HY
 vYpwh9ZXlWOGerIQ+v7ekBZF1FFZe5dwWWQKU/iCS1kTbkvn5BZAW2KzArV6WUd9OlON
 oJmShjZbjvCl8T6Dfjy+8REaouzCskAsNrv37oxBBy4sO8pZO6Uzog7XBGKB6rGHwKYF
 BjGA==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1;
 AJvYcCUDxXGfohaLBHgTcawrtbYdxHOCt9IO7yGEbPtXANA3h/jZ6VyZyQooLh1WNDNK35JaI2STMg==@debbugs.gnu.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Yy04dKbHwe6Wwpte01/E3QcAtBm/iHPherHQa/jW8rfnC3cZmjm
 UtKy+2vKogZcjayOkRJ0LLDn73wk9onnJUJZinSDkpylMg4HgGUwW6165A==
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGnctcN2ZwsVtMZq8iZ4CLVM1NKOo5mWaZZsfT8UfwJTDa5iA9mFuBs578Qmr23jL
 jo9kebdib+eA1In7Phn9omMm+L6VO2diEejaMA4WRx5WeTaXS1XyV3rPYspALphmbhOgKRyddmF
 ODuFzqwfpoLFDPYE9RAEs92J/72DkjdYtjjRTER92zxqTqpqvMOD7Vnbh7OIyFBrbwHqerG++Z+
 ppGLcz7Kde2SFaIPvl1SOi1CMGOAZEmm22PtfAa21Zn1Z7NZZx+WNjTCBkxjw1/sTdvVTWskJpK
 duFEAh4Gh/4Z9PHAjtb1k0+3I04exp1A53TMjG6NaPd1unvKDHJFNLanTJ6wXFrWLxvAnhAdwCL
 EsrfSvbfipG7yyOA+7Id0geLC
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IEa1lVwwGJ7ADkeCAhFoife9VL48K/79OutlIGpflM88dFfjk8nuB6sry+ceSv8SM/6DBOBCQ==
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6000:2cc:b0:385:e105:d884 with SMTP id
 ffacd0b85a97d-38db48df826mr1763714f8f.46.1738763006112; 
 Wed, 05 Feb 2025 05:43:26 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pro2 (p200300e0b70e7d00c4ce9c27d8bde411.dip0.t-ipconnect.de.
 [2003:e0:b70e:7d00:c4ce:9c27:d8bd:e411])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 ffacd0b85a97d-38dae1a1e4bsm4578924f8f.55.2025.02.05.05.43.25
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Wed, 05 Feb 2025 05:43:25 -0800 (PST)
From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
In-Reply-To: <86r04c8r0e.fsf@HIDDEN>
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN> <86r04c8r0e.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 14:43:24 +0100
Message-ID: <m2r04cv75v.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:

>> From: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
>> Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:30:42 +0100
>>=20
>> +    (cl-flet ((skip (frame)
>> +                (or (eq frame sframe)
>> +                    (if (display-graphic-p frame)
>> +                        (not (frame-visible-p frame))
>> +                      (and (frame-parent frame)
>> +                           (not (frame-visible-p frame)))))))
>
> Thanks, but I'm worried that we will have to special-case TTY frames
> in Lisp, due to these changes.  I think this again indicates that we
> use "frame visibility" for several different purposes.  If so, a
> better way forward would be to make the frame's visibility flag a
> tristate or maybe even more values, instead of a simple boolean.

What would the values of such a visibility enum be?

I find it easier to have a simple definition in C, and let Lisp decide
what it wants to do, basically on a use-case basis. For example, if we
decide other-frame should work with tty root frames that are not
visible, let other-frame do it. Other function might not want to do the
same thing.

An enum, on the other hand, makes things complicated for both C
internals and Lisp.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 13:23:26 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Feb 05 08:23:26 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49068 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tffNF-00021e-SX
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 08:23:26 -0500
Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:37988)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tffNC-00021N-FZ
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 08:23:23 -0500
Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e])
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tffN6-00014K-Ln; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 08:23:16 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org;
 s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:
 Date; bh=ranbmz1dEjKNXqDVexZ51HZLbdeV7Pr3OZt8tNf75jA=; b=LGZn4CoK857xYtLCzAYu
 nCqYknXT1isJRX/Ds5OnZojmTPMv5AJ4CEY6jBODCRta2ND0ssnl6BJXuP85h6bWUI5unrZkoUNNM
 ZxV9d1x9uuA/jmzaPptBBM6DivpxyUaUlq9ibm7eqilITz3IRIXi3VjX6G5wa6Sd8upprghyqK5D3
 YMY9a6urdFHq8UG5JzHDui9B3TkZOMXRoUO98YlNbGhZA3pnl36JNcPFhXKgb/V/ZDcQqDHc0v3IQ
 BGqEi00XfPFTJoORcdOR2Z5PdnrOHPSnqGU+kOXOJXroHupsoSKg8z9QWV5orCFhWjkxXKd0pqKrH
 JKSnRJ7TJ5FadQ==;
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 15:23:13 +0200
Message-Id: <86r04c8r0e.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?=
 =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:30:42 +0100)
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---)

> From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
> Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:30:42 +0100
> 
> +    (cl-flet ((skip (frame)
> +                (or (eq frame sframe)
> +                    (if (display-graphic-p frame)
> +                        (not (frame-visible-p frame))
> +                      (and (frame-parent frame)
> +                           (not (frame-visible-p frame)))))))

Thanks, but I'm worried that we will have to special-case TTY frames
in Lisp, due to these changes.  I think this again indicates that we
use "frame visibility" for several different purposes.  If so, a
better way forward would be to make the frame's visibility flag a
tristate or maybe even more values, instead of a simple boolean.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 08:58:25 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Feb 05 03:58:25 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48457 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfbEn-0005dc-9M
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 03:58:25 -0500
Received: from mail-wm1-x32f.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::32f]:46124)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfbEk-0005dO-3a
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 03:58:22 -0500
Received: by mail-wm1-x32f.google.com with SMTP id
 5b1f17b1804b1-43622267b2eso64618955e9.0
 for <76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 00:58:22 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1738745895; x=1739350695; darn=debbugs.gnu.org;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=8AgUHSO8l3XBvnoEVA2unvQiEy5nYbcVixq7dC1+4ug=;
 b=W4VzZp+Ejju4Jn5wRWUZ8q6IBexrJkI+oz97iTrQi14T5lU26biWrr3Mbnb0EnT2e0
 mtQR+LipHnXrylPVVFjfmol05FDyX9uCknuSiG3OjnRvcu7488pSYNJY55y05V5x3va3
 7qrFUfonvbIHBe5vc33FAeFeLx3LWLF5umW/x8ai6RA/RbGTq8Kf0SAY1tlCHGzRdMZ4
 CbWXcToCVqy2GN/nxc9QwYAghFCZpeU4AQXB8BYLExd2ifFveFHN9N/E2tSP4aEsmco6
 BU8yAOxhN3dvvZxJ/sBAyc5b+I8UHp/Rdppx6peMUuJ+F5aqFcfTDhVrJItY29umc+Nr
 Ialg==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1738745895; x=1739350695;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date
 :message-id:reply-to;
 bh=8AgUHSO8l3XBvnoEVA2unvQiEy5nYbcVixq7dC1+4ug=;
 b=u6fSD78AEtcFJ4FE8hmCnQWAHpU3sb8HvOapqsYBpCvdSb8hvugmaTa8Qhdjqp3E0b
 zHPhtBkNGA+ihVAJI/VfTwIMEQTD7mR+tVYU2rq9WRqFTkkP5W+693A+9Z2UCwdtvolb
 zghbhUL9dO684nJL802MZZx8nMfwudJDnt2vzHFBiNIXQy7Beg2vEXez8YCBXKii1WGz
 G6cvHfjjfLhV52mGwE5b6APljZZc2gjSMSeGI8gjtvgro2sgP+nDqu8Kuh8ecAj5hASv
 OrUC7L3zzOoC6ByeJgRKsfRekPKviaN+DDNccagDzAPgNhhQ9INnS20dF6UvmX4XSGHG
 Myyg==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1;
 AJvYcCX0n0ZakB+IjwxM9+4fw3eD1yTM5TCAl+fdjUWTRiMjQKTg0vXNuZ0W7NKmiqpFq3GC4c3Pmg==@debbugs.gnu.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YyScBSyT7jClm59aD7mIktNZnEq+bFZFHZBCqHuuq4aJ99y8pQL
 wPotKWJHpEU8+evhGB+bLomdL2Kzm8gPF5LKAD7W4jBuf95HMfvkx2Hqlw==
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncuH7lz3KvvvpRVFsyeMNcfy7bC0bAt68lE9QUVnrXUejGAMRwsWDw/poqPqshj
 plX33T3OCOsEV3UwDt0lrJV0UormgutV3n7ZB2djVVd4UItdIiqfc78vGJIg/RkhKuoNkiKxH2E
 03A6WsmOov4eeZqTBy1d/TLQ4X1MgmXA+a/8/W7OO+PR/58u1M26W9Mq6lMM0nRVLDGWTXge9yI
 8w0Tp09NKY5JzytgoULfcSZ1l+kBe+ckx1ygWN7p0SWbgQq5g2w7yOse43v982utNTHnQssMJJZ
 WSUF/Qlg+ULcqEswj0aaCFMCxtzkBXaqhszapNMEqesurHf7Y1/skDtj3rvIeykQg+MfQGaI3yx
 UNdS2qoL+al6YwLGnY+uWHI3W
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IE61pYUfyOB3g91lIqdqQuNYfxcZJ6TJovmtgeRVqsLm9ne7C1fuL579V65kFzfPqvzW+Z80Q==
X-Received: by 2002:a05:600c:444d:b0:438:a1f5:3e38 with SMTP id
 5b1f17b1804b1-4390d56c55amr14018625e9.30.1738745895141; 
 Wed, 05 Feb 2025 00:58:15 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pro2 (p200300e0b70e7d00c4ce9c27d8bde411.dip0.t-ipconnect.de.
 [2003:e0:b70e:7d00:c4ce:9c27:d8bd:e411])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 5b1f17b1804b1-4390d94d73bsm14280795e9.9.2025.02.05.00.58.14
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Wed, 05 Feb 2025 00:58:14 -0800 (PST)
From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
In-Reply-To: <8398555c-5a80-488f-a53c-dd6af3860059@HIDDEN>
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN> <86ikppadhw.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <e02e35c1-627e-4798-b19b-0fcb281372be@HIDDEN>
 <m2ikppsgyr.fsf@HIDDEN> <86a5b1a2t3.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <8398555c-5a80-488f-a53c-dd6af3860059@HIDDEN>
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 09:58:13 +0100
Message-ID: <m2msf0g44a.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN> writes:

>> I think there's a conceptual problem here: the meaning of "invisible"
>> on TTY is different from its meaning on GUI displays.  On GUI display,
>> "invisible" means the frame is not on display at all, whereas on TTY
>> the frame is there, it's just obscured by the one(s) above it.  So I
>> think we need to change candidate_frame to consider TTY frames
>> "visible" for the purpose of returning "visible" frames in next_frame
>> and prev_frame.
>
> The concept of frame visibility has so many interpretations within Emcas
> that it's virtually impossible to say what it really means.
>
> - Convey to the window manager whether a frame should be displayed or
>   not.
>
> - Tell redisplay to draw the frame or not (for the case when Emacs is
>   its own window manager as on a tty).
>
> - Tell the buffer display methods whether a frame may be considered for
>   displaying the buffer.
>
> - Tell 'other-frame' which frames it should consider.
>
> - Simply allow the user to say that a frame should be visible or not and
>   subsequently ask for whether it is.
>
> Note that the last three cannot be controlled for tty frames on Emacs
> versions <= 30.  I suppose that nobody did really care because (I still
> insist that) multiple frames are rarely used on ttys.

I think the same, and in addition to that tab-bar is much better from a
usability standpoint.

> With child frames, however, the need arises to at least consider child
> frames as invisible on ttys because IIUC many packages create a child
> frame once only and subsequently toggle its visibility.

True.

> I disregard here how these packages manage users that switch root
> frames and want to display the child frame on any of them - IIUC we
> cannot reparent child frames on ttys at the moment.

True. I haven't implemented re-parenting. Could be done of course, but
I'm not volunteering.

>
> Currently, on master, do_switch_frame in
>
> 	      if (old_root != new_root)
> 		SET_FRAME_VISIBLE (old_root, false);
>
> quite rudely decides that a top tty frame should be no more visible when
> switching away from it.  But I'm afraid that changing this alone will
> not suffice to obtain a reasonable behavior WRT the issues cited above.

Maybe, could be.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 08:31:34 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Feb 05 03:31:33 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48389 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfaon-0004R2-JV
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 03:31:33 -0500
Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.18]:39243)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <rudalics@HIDDEN>) id 1tfaol-0004Qn-4G
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 03:31:31 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmx.at;
 s=s31663417; t=1738744279; x=1739349079; i=rudalics@HIDDEN;
 bh=VsdVHmW+NRHjLuVez719msjIMvQxIMoDR+lv+mq28iM=;
 h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version:Subject:To:Cc:
 References:From:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:
 Content-Transfer-Encoding:cc:content-transfer-encoding:
 content-type:date:from:message-id:mime-version:reply-to:subject:
 to;
 b=NrFk7ND/gmRmPeqdFBoHfWAo5zWn1DP9op1haHi6hptYbmQQGAcBq2ou83U22xlF
 j3AQbdrDQTmYCvK16p/Uy4UvgPL+8RBmlCz0k1DD3uedsFQeIoF0HE1AzA9HE1Chy
 Q4uXPSceyDkAZWHfg2WnY6C/OcsDGE0kUin/nzfAMtZiCQgAPETA4TAeu2A8qbsnt
 P+lvbKxVXcYojqAkSMvJzMSO7e7HuIeTLeucTFPBtPRrx1rlJcz09SKpgD4FQnBd/
 msT9AqzsYU60bT+IrK0v+eqv4Wi9E+HFbjbiw2Z7sKsXCZzj69umD9yLxSLeqIP8c
 50mcXrwcC2T4j1TVhw==
X-UI-Sender-Class: 724b4f7f-cbec-4199-ad4e-598c01a50d3a
Received: from [192.168.31.113] ([212.95.5.147]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx004
 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MxDkw-1tUpBu41jE-00uOYE; Wed, 05
 Feb 2025 09:31:19 +0100
Message-ID: <8398555c-5a80-488f-a53c-dd6af3860059@HIDDEN>
Date: Wed, 5 Feb 2025 09:31:18 +0100
MIME-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?=
 <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN> <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN> <86ikppadhw.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <e02e35c1-627e-4798-b19b-0fcb281372be@HIDDEN> <m2ikppsgyr.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <86a5b1a2t3.fsf@HIDDEN>
Content-Language: en-US
From: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <86a5b1a2t3.fsf@HIDDEN>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:oR+pdaz96Co3sLzyShjgucg6w9NLLzSEWs0MMdp94y4F5rY3k/U
 X3g1iyQHS9UgKBygpVJtjqaEwg0UOK5trB4OUnZHWChTi96siTs+mGVDEZioY8269K7dwVe
 4jAB5bTmFbBWkzrQy/Q/iLtkSvly12OBbCqtn3LJpr3XdfOp7BfFt+hi/xbmet2A3xKTqEY
 5AnW9A5GtGTx/f8PvZ1nQ==
X-Spam-Flag: NO
UI-OutboundReport: notjunk:1;M01:P0:CYd+X0MTFQk=;RZcI2nAFUI9OQoCbkYkhF2NS2RO
 T8hrg9Zrt7/1hzeQUvS0ueCpdU7fjlTFvoVQk8EszD495a6k/UmN5dSHIvOSFibwSzR7PW8yF
 DC2PMl6M3czDcIpx/nIJbO258wSeYsPcp4ann6EKdY+euP09+UC/tE4HcfPXN77PlhFwTBXPo
 nwp9t6KebGgEUiUlstwIdUboylsajt3k/LtAMmSfmdQ87m419YyzZ1jhFAhequvUkhrOi1kZI
 xqKrCzM1Poev/GQnYj60QM7vqadwChV2+HvQovIWTZUSfgER3ZFjUsiaJ4X2uiWrycSBvOSrH
 yc2HN5QDe1jHm0o+Q4P8BOiaQZjuCFddvod/vDXTAMXCmIvx0PmOUDuPbktPod4RmlH2TXH5L
 vrgHtVL6i/S44pzsVUqtdEAjUSsPdimDQVDwzpL/n0bg0VozsFaVH+hH1rK9sZuRlcFLAMFxj
 tHQhoQJHw1sB/jc3aBIMJEcN3GBXyxrotTBqDGAWSXuYVP/GmyaWjiSrN6IFKlPluWJ0xakoC
 NyRhE528TdnjudWvZxCplnT9/TqjwDysUFNh8NbtlES2Ex0C6T0ZMOGAXF/YDPjCdIx3hxws5
 CjUW+KBDrOA35iDH8gYIwSv9BrmcIwdRKSoTBKZsaeWiFJ+b/XTb68WTVe9WmUrMB3hO1Cwy5
 iJBfSmur+UCBrZAMOgaO94+78GU4aqEB8AylkwclmMcO33MVBiX5DwDf9N6ipArxJi6JbGQ5S
 tFg6KvRIBy9uGBW9L7BJEjhlIfG3erHL5h5GulaQoyFou6zc6p9UsLgkPxYkBX334vtigWSsk
 9l9MC0TN8OH66xWupBuahicba421M+/it3+uQwcqwqhxXIHB9q8ZawGGtbd8A1eQyVEy3CD0u
 sHnjxafUvaKyyi8plhnJOXEeS0U0GC3lTlu7EGOmZXcLYK+B04B2v/8P2Hec+OAnxsdHuOpaJ
 12neWKUXjAem4dAErQwSKkk5Cz2+inOAjCOpSpTh/cHFZ5D+LiDCinr1oVwqy4WJvwsOGK6SL
 6F5PleL4fF/OMX8ADSj0OZrMuUrbQBXpn5mg1PNNgtD+s39zcbtXCA5p4GQ42gN8Hpcce+zTm
 PoaQI/li9MZoi1c0WrjPEzCNSxEfWJvk9Iyu52UzuKsE3vnAz9079eYBnkuRfLoVXDK4P01ct
 T45X7jbzadfVu3gHQE4HeSvJdz0GQninwMyjsJUF78cMXPdR304Sz8NQRAGqED87lXQfb2++P
 3RGXyFff2kSeaDyZWdwnWOq93ju/nR7EPVyqHWwZ/SMDvVfeD3QTUmZaTSH/0CJGoon0j1AIE
 j/k9oCpyTCpIsxsCIS9MVHhCPixrubw+3b7sXSPW+l1kGs0fQEQPX1T9UqSIIkPbupxj3hWoY
 ScPxeQxIYKtThQxpBXZMG5Pg59nmuy3memWrlZ4X9t0p/oSH+L/1VRpiioe/h/L+DQwgYb/IT
 BYbuJag==
X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-)

 > I think there's a conceptual problem here: the meaning of "invisible"
 > on TTY is different from its meaning on GUI displays.  On GUI display,
 > "invisible" means the frame is not on display at all, whereas on TTY
 > the frame is there, it's just obscured by the one(s) above it.  So I
 > think we need to change candidate_frame to consider TTY frames
 > "visible" for the purpose of returning "visible" frames in next_frame
 > and prev_frame.

The concept of frame visibility has so many interpretations within Emcas
that it's virtually impossible to say what it really means.

- Convey to the window manager whether a frame should be displayed or
   not.

- Tell redisplay to draw the frame or not (for the case when Emacs is
   its own window manager as on a tty).

- Tell the buffer display methods whether a frame may be considered for
   displaying the buffer.

- Tell 'other-frame' which frames it should consider.

- Simply allow the user to say that a frame should be visible or not and
   subsequently ask for whether it is.

Note that the last three cannot be controlled for tty frames on Emacs
versions <= 30.  I suppose that nobody did really care because (I still
insist that) multiple frames are rarely used on ttys.  With child
frames, however, the need arises to at least consider child frames as
invisible on ttys because IIUC many packages create a child frame once
only and subsequently toggle its visibility.  I disregard here how these
packages manage users that switch root frames and want to display the
child frame on any of them - IIUC we cannot reparent child frames on
ttys at the moment.

Currently, on master, do_switch_frame in

	      if (old_root != new_root)
		SET_FRAME_VISIBLE (old_root, false);

quite rudely decides that a top tty frame should be no more visible when
switching away from it.  But I'm afraid that changing this alone will
not suffice to obtain a reasonable behavior WRT the issues cited above.

martin




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 05:29:06 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Feb 05 00:29:06 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47837 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfXyD-00011w-ND
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 00:29:06 -0500
Received: from mail-wr1-x42d.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::42d]:52290)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfXyA-00011P-RN
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 05 Feb 2025 00:29:03 -0500
Received: by mail-wr1-x42d.google.com with SMTP id
 ffacd0b85a97d-38dada77686so1157077f8f.0
 for <76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 21:29:02 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1738733336; x=1739338136; darn=debbugs.gnu.org;
 h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date
 :references:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date
 :message-id:reply-to;
 bh=ZCvhggE0mb0XOrdBaeYtOUT0ffekUHhp+bnpOnMRyj0=;
 b=CRjbTzK12ZKFMEFicNjHN8bLMKtG+YalmayfsiFGCzK58cSNfVAGLw27H0TMW2rM9C
 lsVpdzyfFsDA7dIvVNMPaBwYakxoKNhOUmmmcjbBKIPjRhllANF6SiVhAnK8eAHUqFRQ
 Iq/qRdHG+dwZ71U4PQxjU6DF76G0W3zbZLWjni8wsul1du5yrxDZ1uGi1UXbRuAcgqeK
 PJjK/p99arhSqmo0EOaWgbXsyMGD8O3yxFU1ddv8HhEZJfcrJBNuk1HBZ2msR0nWH/0T
 bH/YDzHUzvpIUDUdkFhBVyjrtZNysnw8xhY32y8XUUBMacsk+cvusb5LtaT4gCaLq0Hv
 ldyg==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1738733336; x=1739338136;
 h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date
 :references:in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from
 :to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=ZCvhggE0mb0XOrdBaeYtOUT0ffekUHhp+bnpOnMRyj0=;
 b=jaUvB4pPExzHARWgbUYLlvzUk151cjSqfQyqwyo9PnwGLvoEeVQmzkVlWrjoeYsdXI
 lbP7Yqu5F4v3fQI+ITlTj9SzH34Y5K+9blWVEZZk7hczLDs+prrZGLj62vI0B36Fz79A
 gsR28GCjWGg2Tsc8CKPLrWZzyxVm11PVdiGA20SpjA9kSszun6n6hR0xHkbEh853bjIQ
 OHTosv/0oQCX0qWWyQOqe6npTdlJBs9+JmHFrtqhFmcMtH+AWDRkLHfFiH/FznZWiRUQ
 9ZJNsPhHdD35a4kvWmTjxnffByoKzYR5LhjHxfFfjJMoi6JNi1jDFHa/lu7K0vTgjGpp
 BXrw==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1;
 AJvYcCVkZ576LEupVK1hcuvLoIGi7VT4tcOM4T+eQ709h5C02yNhJTOFVGOnefjt1GNJcGkIazo0kA==@debbugs.gnu.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YyxPd5zjYjA06rqsXeT1d74urY0HCWxc7qA456Fsbzi3HQw1e7R
 WAECKf1lEVF0O6uF/JMwKbLn99KDlf42XEfUSAdcgHqrxaBX7pY9uDp16g==
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGnct59Haw8mOlP4EMbX0WxBpYdqYmd5IgPyG4IZsc23WIA/4NonED40HeS90Oxxb
 YEGVaFjLjNs2TG0P/pmQV5R2zqVh385vrcYDAn1sLX+V+tGIMX05XjbUSFXCnjKIBjn53Qu3S9s
 ytwtYWgVMG5+fIvUNJJPglF8+Bpj5+AF4lRZBdEGSrVyJMtAQN8qU+Nefk8m+XHean0ydKHeWK4
 u/LzsEUgQTIHp1nU/jVnkhmddRR1xbQiJQXig8+iW8LXBRwZND4PJ0PijADPLESrrI92dIFdKwf
 A3jvzp+YTQVNpnAO7AJJe69vZaWHXtkkjgFuCp0GPtGURoC1YzjRKKoWM6M7hUNVsWDO7U3rwF2
 Xbw5dj9o7nsSmMftwpxrxI/fN
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IEMdAJhuNM02bFYSPdLm848SAVJXz8V8gsPCz1kN2U2PYA7wHihJmby69zUTSHGo5LoWaFW8w==
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6000:178a:b0:38b:e32a:109f with SMTP id
 ffacd0b85a97d-38db4881043mr721432f8f.12.1738733336115; 
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 21:28:56 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pro2 (p200300e0b70e7d00c4ce9c27d8bde411.dip0.t-ipconnect.de.
 [2003:e0:b70e:7d00:c4ce:9c27:d8bd:e411])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 ffacd0b85a97d-38dab853236sm3730352f8f.54.2025.02.04.21.28.54
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 21:28:55 -0800 (PST)
From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
In-Reply-To: <8634gt9ikt.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Wed, 05 Feb
 2025 05:27:46 +0200")
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dsgsn.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qqla2p1.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m21pwdsb3n.fsf@HIDDEN> <8634gt9ikt.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 06:28:53 +0100
Message-ID: <m2ed0dq7sa.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:

>> From: Gerd M=C3=B6llmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
>> Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 21:34:20 +0100
>>=20
>> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
>>=20
>> >> The semantics of being visible before I removed being obscured was
>> >> confusing. A frame could be visible but obscured, which is for me mea=
ns
>> >> it's invisible and can't be seen. That makes no sense to me.
>> >
>> > But nothing else makes sense on TTY when we have multiple frames on
>> > the same display.  So for the purpose of switching frames, the
>> > meaning of "visible" on TTY should be tweaked to produce the expected
>> > effect.
>>=20
>> This can be done on other-frame and maybe elsewhere in Lisp, as I showed
>> in my patch.
>
> What about next-frame with non-nil 2nd argument?
>
> Are you saying that every call to next-frame should be audited and
> changed if needed to DTRT with the new definition of "visible" for TTY
> frames?  That'd mean an incompatible change, so my proposal is to
> avoid that need by changing something on the C level.  Are you against
> that as well?  If so, please explain your objections to changing
> candidate_frame and/or next-frame/prev-frame as I proposed up-thread.

I'm proposing this change, yes, visible =3D visible, and not with the
exception that tty root frames that are marked visible are actually
invisible as far as redisplay is concerned.

The reason is the C code. The obscured thing appears to me like a
kludge. Removing it simplifies things and makes it easier to reason
about frames.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 5 Feb 2025 03:28:01 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 22:28:01 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:47511 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfW53-0003la-0T
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 22:28:01 -0500
Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:43436)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tfW4z-0003lI-LV
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 22:27:59 -0500
Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e])
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfW4t-0008B8-FD; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 22:27:51 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org;
 s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:
 Date; bh=3pi07q8WDDC1YH22OicpxhY0KfLMb8hTc+fa3hXngs8=; b=n4Ot876nF5+QFsFg3I+n
 q4wgUItxhp6HO7HQsNxm6gmDGLRCzkBdmZej64XZS/97XsfeFA9jn9vpu+i9XPljeWl3g2T5xeSxS
 d+IDXfdGe/yxE6SAILek0m+BUl/lghZyUtyg8wLRNx18WtoqdtydWzEuKTWBwHnaTixJaQ7PvciPH
 MFf6EZl+YvgyQ59nUvIAtwTJaFocP+admt7K955SWLrTwwzBROpzHs1Brd3WDMDAfQQSXKpd/sgAY
 IMbBU8B0Q3/IhGZ/tR7UDpF1jQd/ppGQn/whyto0zUVBbMKVmIlAmGIP2PW6e/uyrwZflucbNxcwW
 w7e0nFAv/v+KkA==;
Date: Wed, 05 Feb 2025 05:27:46 +0200
Message-Id: <8634gt9ikt.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <m21pwdsb3n.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?=
 =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Tue, 04 Feb 2025 21:34:20 +0100)
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dsgsn.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qqla2p1.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m21pwdsb3n.fsf@HIDDEN>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---)

> From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
> Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 21:34:20 +0100
> 
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
> 
> >> The semantics of being visible before I removed being obscured was
> >> confusing. A frame could be visible but obscured, which is for me means
> >> it's invisible and can't be seen. That makes no sense to me.
> >
> > But nothing else makes sense on TTY when we have multiple frames on
> > the same display.  So for the purpose of switching frames, the
> > meaning of "visible" on TTY should be tweaked to produce the expected
> > effect.
> 
> This can be done on other-frame and maybe elsewhere in Lisp, as I showed
> in my patch.

What about next-frame with non-nil 2nd argument?

Are you saying that every call to next-frame should be audited and
changed if needed to DTRT with the new definition of "visible" for TTY
frames?  That'd mean an incompatible change, so my proposal is to
avoid that need by changing something on the C level.  Are you against
that as well?  If so, please explain your objections to changing
candidate_frame and/or next-frame/prev-frame as I proposed up-thread.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 20:34:30 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 15:34:30 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46854 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfPcr-0005SW-LU
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:34:29 -0500
Received: from mail-wr1-x436.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::436]:52406)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfPcp-0005S9-SR
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:34:28 -0500
Received: by mail-wr1-x436.google.com with SMTP id
 ffacd0b85a97d-38dada77686so937098f8f.0
 for <76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 12:34:27 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1738701261; x=1739306061; darn=debbugs.gnu.org;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=6R6ELKFmd1PYiJOEba3vvsbBCnv6V4Ko8Bwr9ZD33fk=;
 b=A0P0dU/utUNscQzpC4vX4nCQ+U59zdO5HQTWKjmHdDqBcR2z1sYLuDo/f5OLqWkOJm
 GzDRvueUAGStVuUnI76BlJzTdfY3Qrzltx0bq3cngcJ0t6RxAJAbgado2uI2fcIDvuIR
 POxKSTI9Ml9MD5o8VQqLmO83fHv7wLigMHv2YLKq6u6D06f7AxCS+RfyOAbm3y+LkeUF
 yJGmvGmhhSBmnMTcAi4VJaH9+fPq13bw2FMd7BZ9GGzFAOJevjWic81mVltaNsj4xnm8
 vpnRoZ6XHQ+Mt1X/tf5yAZYUkwXMgdwZrkxX2xf2ihxY14GQp7HzI401PqnKS5GTz4+f
 pg5w==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1738701261; x=1739306061;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date
 :message-id:reply-to;
 bh=6R6ELKFmd1PYiJOEba3vvsbBCnv6V4Ko8Bwr9ZD33fk=;
 b=k8ZDy7bSUINv+UfbbWYNLbQOTRupWny3uB5tV+mwP3hoz/wsblLiA/HiZvdr6fnz0o
 K/UpGqPy+/x9RbyI9WReD4vzLDePKutTNKgpT4WJw/KLIrOfG6Ai6y3MhINPZ9LNS2Mh
 jS0zM3zxeC+uCHEHnha+3qvEbbcOCVuHEKn8H0Topj792XmEQgK0eJkHywrVpsalWemB
 Pq+1fYGq3z+hLRfZrQAPNvVTE7O2eq4FVBT6U/ov6U7DyeULpMzCT8Q5erWliGkp8jJV
 Bvc/Xc9+Hz2yRyqm00sNXgs4i5i6UWfhOKafBIzqM7KSpdZCAZXa6+2c5v3xMA+x+mdm
 1qOA==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1;
 AJvYcCWMBJFNCtpY68u4ZsR9DtckSRx4JHBut7YZoaGPN4uLn8EkFLRIIqDrVxTtLBLhgeS81u7McA==@debbugs.gnu.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YwmwHIEVd07nPqahuKiTP65GOgcmbofbgDGM+6D+dSxXWJA9EuA
 Dewp24Jl5Z31ySeBeZF7sU7bdRq4FWGdcAQEVcBh4UUZQZDpzj4uzAXJ8g==
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncuGXARRcBgm0Fn3OKS16SkZbZFsCvIBlPBJhSPFnF+q3qpHilGjVES8t5Sleww
 /3BC3MB2ZiFm3MPKPdzLQaYVHgcp6f0EYjmeuJ+BIM6xo7xrFfLYrHGynEOb/mF+i+82yyW/XmH
 /Cgn/vfcyvHiJIVf7NN5p6doi6fysDAtn94ybwWvaJJltjddPcGbJNO+q8FM94Bhecu3TcCkfbu
 N/RKHJiK8xb1jpwx+SkLY9/gFuAqfH6C6aC5KFIvukOsYnzmcDlAsfflu+QMJ7O8ybF0lrfspuH
 VqrHouOY1was3hYzcpDx2XjQG08kOzZE/Wz0sy2OoLU2PgSHdVJNMpF1mJlQmp3i0D+LbJs82ay
 bDGoZEeQF6DIvCZX2A5YoUNk+
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IE1CIdveKm8/aRBjAvtWuzS5zE3cW870Ulntu4Q4Dd2139i5+kddyEKtD+WA86T8eUrPhUa0Q==
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6000:1acb:b0:38b:d765:7039 with SMTP id
 ffacd0b85a97d-38db488252amr175442f8f.17.1738701261425; 
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 12:34:21 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pro2 (p200300e0b705a00058413e49c0284fb2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de.
 [2003:e0:b705:a000:5841:3e49:c028:4fb2])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 5b1f17b1804b1-438e245f492sm199556685e9.38.2025.02.04.12.34.20
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 12:34:21 -0800 (PST)
From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
In-Reply-To: <868qqla2p1.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Tue, 04 Feb
 2025 22:13:14 +0200")
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN>
 <m2ed0dsgsn.fsf@HIDDEN> <868qqla2p1.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 21:34:20 +0100
Message-ID: <m21pwdsb3n.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:

>> The semantics of being visible before I removed being obscured was
>> confusing. A frame could be visible but obscured, which is for me means
>> it's invisible and can't be seen. That makes no sense to me.
>
> But nothing else makes sense on TTY when we have multiple frames on
> the same display.  So for the purpose of switching frames, the
> meaning of "visible" on TTY should be tweaked to produce the expected
> effect.

This can be done on other-frame and maybe elsewhere in Lisp, as I showed
in my patch.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 20:32:55 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 15:32:55 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46850 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfPbK-0005OY-RZ
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:32:55 -0500
Received: from mail-wr1-x436.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::436]:47153)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfPbJ-0005OB-4d
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:32:53 -0500
Received: by mail-wr1-x436.google.com with SMTP id
 ffacd0b85a97d-385e27c75f4so5052823f8f.2
 for <76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 12:32:53 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1738701167; x=1739305967; darn=debbugs.gnu.org;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=wTco6bXK+aXmoKfSbe6LZPdMLi3sTnQ81PLRJTs2u34=;
 b=QYEKchehWAbqphP78adz806vNAxmFq4ahe3BqkCQzI+CZSatX/iYMzYc2ZNxnKvI0C
 9xIXyF3xjae6GczIh7IdJdvbEHsag9CmrIu+0mJ0LsdONg+3mPxEiLBqf9SN+BOO3bv3
 Aa9GRcIQS0OSq6G72tTR9Bt298ktSECIwBzgF/u4NOExAJ7iw+zc63mDpj4PGK6gacjv
 0GQ18wcz54skIbtbmK8xAwS6tckLyskC6cv80WFXpKcwAGPGM7Utsyc7ZWfMUW7leYrP
 u+fKDw8BP/xnjp37s4zgr0ttvrAD83kA7kwP97p+dTxeki3DTtTC0Oz1bg04F7NO9Aj+
 jZjA==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1738701167; x=1739305967;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date
 :message-id:reply-to;
 bh=wTco6bXK+aXmoKfSbe6LZPdMLi3sTnQ81PLRJTs2u34=;
 b=nheBUjDzi1Y/4UkrXJs25B1Yl8U7XFCvVcSsl0eKqllrNHpM63DvPl+Rv3IaSSHF6I
 kIXq4mcsBVS+bd4O0a4RGJJUJWLBHMggmlIHXXKx6a+itBsPrxBAJvFToOuXH+tX2j44
 W34bk+KY4Rzt72OqMjTzSB7FUwtmkLrE99PeA+hIn9TTnnRQLscmOQBP9c0L5ELD9URk
 oAAp+RC/jambU77ZALswxHW/+HUUmQJruSc3nAWQmsIWWztnRF9iPEDXFt1JUsaDbKJl
 K85NvMNSRAgtJvXv2v4N698N3jm2Kvb+MztnK6SM4zEAukI5jishfhi9oOWhgQ5Fa6gC
 g+Hg==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1;
 AJvYcCWRFyHIlKG9ahvUqJyiigBM+YaJIGiKsCrbVmusy0WfGg3Pduwmievsc+j6ekdeqyKyHQFmSA==@debbugs.gnu.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YyGVs4HXqcE0Yhq3+zmC4+SszwKKaJa73AwBchIl4jeRvCyFa4Q
 oH7pkKETPwnBtXLxcRaKOWVhy4GGf8oZVR5xk07U4HkIr7jgwkkcEhbbUA==
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncvmyViD81A6Ll9QD+yDW/0cFYjb72gfigvr7EakO8mu3lrq09p9iyx/DWwzYEU
 BKVTLupwIr9CEBUMbwJ4ZVtlA8QY6fiKuSNk+TvgOTw4rHWFJ2YYmblGNs2nubQkY5KPS03BPXP
 j1Ci4eo4bI87FavRGkdNbvVzHrUz5X8g3zTRnvVccbq7kvqv0oJFwzHC0BI4DFPC3u9bpcxADIb
 yn0OMDqLIH+ELaSk1edlY5qZxtEIJGWzIRpikN+QuEiA9dwAfgXpqvRqhnAJIGaZvdrRgio+hMk
 fNNrJ5iwtAu/b5fRinMgh71aCRvB6oqiBGtDPX6PRrBTbMN3a4em87hCuwuJY0eJKJ1+VL2P4A1
 +f7ePynYDA6S8LPcpNQjAAKSZ
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IELzYaFFJ5FT06NeuUHIYZxsR1xlXXDPgqlUCnASAv6Xzqa318X/TXiSBoUh/LucY1woXkVXg==
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6000:1aca:b0:38c:5c1d:2844 with SMTP id
 ffacd0b85a97d-38db48a9e95mr133616f8f.11.1738701166378; 
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 12:32:46 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pro2 (p200300e0b705a00058413e49c0284fb2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de.
 [2003:e0:b705:a000:5841:3e49:c028:4fb2])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 5b1f17b1804b1-438e23e6b62sm201381465e9.24.2025.02.04.12.32.44
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 12:32:46 -0800 (PST)
From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
In-Reply-To: <864j19a2a6.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Tue, 04 Feb
 2025 22:22:09 +0200")
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN> <86ikppadhw.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <e02e35c1-627e-4798-b19b-0fcb281372be@HIDDEN>
 <m2ikppsgyr.fsf@HIDDEN> <86a5b1a2t3.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <864j19a2a6.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 21:32:44 +0100
Message-ID: <m25xlpsb6b.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:

>> Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
>> Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 22:10:48 +0200
>> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
>> 
>> I think there's a conceptual problem here: the meaning of "invisible"
>> on TTY is different from its meaning on GUI displays.  On GUI display,
>> "invisible" means the frame is not on display at all, whereas on TTY
>> the frame is there, it's just obscured by the one(s) above it.  So I
>> think we need to change candidate_frame to consider TTY frames
>> "visible" for the purpose of returning "visible" frames in next_frame
>> and prev_frame.
>
> IOW, "invisible" here does not mean literally "not visible", it means
> something very specialized and specific to frames on GUI displays.
> Because, for example, a GUI frame obscured by another one is not
> treated as "invisible", is it?  And a frame that is iconified is also
> not treated as "invisible", although it cannot be seen.
>
> So maybe we should resurrect the "obscured" state for TTY frames after
> all?

I'm against this, obviously.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 20:31:25 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 15:31:25 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46846 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfPZt-0005Kt-4z
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:31:25 -0500
Received: from mail-wm1-x330.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::330]:48332)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfPZq-0005Gb-1y
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:31:22 -0500
Received: by mail-wm1-x330.google.com with SMTP id
 5b1f17b1804b1-43625c4a50dso41884295e9.0
 for <76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 12:31:22 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1738701076; x=1739305876; darn=debbugs.gnu.org;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=UGX3DI0nBorSxgrPOab/tssC2zpRw5iF2J6A1kYpBvU=;
 b=F7FCg3Kvr1yYuakUIVpX+op0DLiSFIWDZfpuCW2CBAb6920NJsaFMyXN7a4nYMnets
 DWrDUxIgS6LObAhjTJLv20q58j3y0FOMixzC2x/rX2LbjueXbaV0BR8of/kFrnwGb8W4
 w2NMogEg+w+Inc9EShujVO5MFrAX7jPLUsHhW0bhqEMeaQ5uld4tE3EhQrq+BW2ov0jY
 yHm/o3TTrKNqz0WzHOLiPZ5WbSS/s/Q4U8p1hX1T3jv54GjPEhVzQNa7Ch6OCTS4qQ9w
 vK5ongrnkicGrUlCS2Nvpx7NhSh2aXEMC4qDSO7IWfOooegbeiP5xsttEv6TJkDYxjXx
 j7Qg==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1738701076; x=1739305876;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date
 :message-id:reply-to;
 bh=UGX3DI0nBorSxgrPOab/tssC2zpRw5iF2J6A1kYpBvU=;
 b=R448A282F97oVyeuXZWKVrtkvQUwqiJ8NSQ7Z7dY/4gEOZ8z0dXltzDmDa+udMGe/i
 9IkfUoY+1rK4d9b6C6QrzlG/8Qp9b17GrNbzZVxxzIJr0GUX2bodYUJnLYGA0O60u1ML
 p6aVaOvq50V0cZjH7TN5oM8+zFbhe7S83qGrUpWhHPlSj0ezWBD+4C/TQkLDGv9j/yYZ
 jPkKy7vJfi2Owwko0b+V9Tn38SVAjBhESqX6z6QUSx4Em5w/RrdQPWpWaB2CE7rKmbwh
 Ma5y0OlQ5KLvG6pZ9hizNRygBHZaixUdefEldZ4vmvEwdqaXqkD/9jRLMzmUJ0e3uBGe
 4Jjg==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1;
 AJvYcCV0lyIABIJ/qkfYP4mjeMYJWx0MahR4gcz+aXz8qTFscJ4mss6xuSGUkcahG8C04UO15ZI1Jg==@debbugs.gnu.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YxvnZj/+jBgHR7FR1LZI7B2hPlyUmmQJBw/IJmu4C1yceDrXOBP
 p2RCRQkkBLSz3vOeSaxdtVto8jwgu4YVU/seTj7xkRYeOcCA6sUbwq1j1Q==
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGnctE4Idvpq0ITa0Ew4HXzZw9IFSW3R1niuYdW80sSx00RwUCjGa4DJE05UxvHsr
 LwZRI1+uvjE4hlOgFLMNooSZzPzgHhMw7x5DDs5ZCsU778TphCi90aOKcPDCqUARAu9y+WOpiAg
 IVudradGkYY3PDVNZ392KGxZe0mJ/+Ibms1UCLDf2rH8hFB3auwZtMAJbWSCLNw6nEdU9w1rcVO
 jIUklUxcTeW5XAJunKKMwdC5DHnN5rlr9VRSrLTx2zxwvxnzeXdK9G+BHty2M3NA3fgPFHlN33P
 tAemA7jWOHeboRkhrR7GVMiXBfkCtB1ZRAmu7UD7jQ6Yr2OFkYzGj/imJMqJwgRlD4NSnfs6bC0
 02YpiiViyLmwxZivl/3X4vJo/
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IHpIm8KktdlG0icpq/w6HPM/a3QmUPVTz8vQ5kNjHjvED1ma6zbuoM6XWxZEhZ5vIR47zPOeg==
X-Received: by 2002:a05:600c:548e:b0:436:5fc9:309d with SMTP id
 5b1f17b1804b1-4390d56f569mr270835e9.30.1738701075330; 
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 12:31:15 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pro2 (p200300e0b705a00058413e49c0284fb2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de.
 [2003:e0:b705:a000:5841:3e49:c028:4fb2])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 5b1f17b1804b1-438e23d4f9esm208794935e9.2.2025.02.04.12.31.14
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 12:31:14 -0800 (PST)
From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
In-Reply-To: <86a5b1a2t3.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Tue, 04 Feb
 2025 22:10:48 +0200")
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN> <86ikppadhw.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <e02e35c1-627e-4798-b19b-0fcb281372be@HIDDEN>
 <m2ikppsgyr.fsf@HIDDEN> <86a5b1a2t3.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 21:31:14 +0100
Message-ID: <m2a5b1sb8t.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:

> I think there's a conceptual problem here: the meaning of "invisible"
> on TTY is different from its meaning on GUI displays.  On GUI display,
> "invisible" means the frame is not on display at all, whereas on TTY
> the frame is there, it's just obscured by the one(s) above it.  So I

How is such a frame that was previously marked "obscured" still "on
display" as you write? It's literally not on display on the terminal.

> think we need to change candidate_frame to consider TTY frames
> "visible" for the purpose of returning "visible" frames in next_frame
> and prev_frame.

Please read my other mail, where I show that next-frame currently
returns the root frame in question, it's other-frame that skips it.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 20:22:21 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 15:22:21 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46823 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfPR7-0001lz-8i
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:22:21 -0500
Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:43356)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tfPR4-0001lc-Q4
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:22:19 -0500
Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e])
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfPQz-000191-7s; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:22:13 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org;
 s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date:
 mime-version; bh=4sDfeAeyaDWXCu+pzCKA8yqlPqcuivC4JU/bBwXNfqI=; b=HVG8rjcZcCgA
 LecFLQSCknHTyxPl/N5dtfL7lODJZChiALZKkyjdA4g1u33ipORsg/bugI4Or0nuAzVaFJDCY0Qil
 SZeWnwOTyh+EOpA5HTf4H/fo5SwihyJIeuV/7khjLwbtByHATuTQ2n2YqfZRM15LIlipxRsS7vkq1
 JgVh48SsF26nCGBi6867zfTbuPBI1ShE+TokUpGzIK0acKueQ/NmNU95wjX5e4D8nXWSKB0B0Y7zc
 +JhIu/Qkhv6nojxp09ENsmnZK5Rz2Mqa/WpWGgM2yq9LO1gcOvsciLHB8b1RDaEq7S1FB3U21CeAH
 RVlN8u0rsP55r19zQHnbEg==;
Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 22:22:09 +0200
Message-Id: <864j19a2a6.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, rudalics@HIDDEN
In-Reply-To: <86a5b1a2t3.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Eli Zaretskii on Tue, 04
 Feb 2025 22:10:48 +0200)
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN> <86ikppadhw.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <e02e35c1-627e-4798-b19b-0fcb281372be@HIDDEN> <m2ikppsgyr.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <86a5b1a2t3.fsf@HIDDEN>
X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---)

> Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 22:10:48 +0200
> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
> 
> I think there's a conceptual problem here: the meaning of "invisible"
> on TTY is different from its meaning on GUI displays.  On GUI display,
> "invisible" means the frame is not on display at all, whereas on TTY
> the frame is there, it's just obscured by the one(s) above it.  So I
> think we need to change candidate_frame to consider TTY frames
> "visible" for the purpose of returning "visible" frames in next_frame
> and prev_frame.

IOW, "invisible" here does not mean literally "not visible", it means
something very specialized and specific to frames on GUI displays.
Because, for example, a GUI frame obscured by another one is not
treated as "invisible", is it?  And a frame that is iconified is also
not treated as "invisible", although it cannot be seen.

So maybe we should resurrect the "obscured" state for TTY frames after
all?




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 20:13:23 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 15:13:23 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46791 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfPIQ-0001EL-Lf
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:13:23 -0500
Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:40832)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tfPIP-0001E7-KI
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:13:22 -0500
Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e])
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfPIJ-00071s-R6; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:13:16 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org;
 s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:
 Date; bh=nfUaQeDZKTSpJsa4vZyL5J1WrhgN/Ts+Y7Ba/Y+yjhk=; b=TDJyIt0SMmoc5+z8rqx/
 uR4Euc+/1utddSdtJhxVj4lMs/gT+0LqRk9sB8WDDyNv6xeWfDOgIuDsL6DcF138EqM6JULwX5cvB
 G1F9BA3M9vhzV5pYFEVgcP3tWcj+c/DxXKYaJzVqG5ujmlX3WLA0rxcNR4WtXlKSOxq4SaInGytGV
 sQ65+sillMisXt+OX9g6mWCuyQk6DffT1Ps76adrJilbfNo+H+4amknCRbhkAlyYBvSyh/czbVZBy
 +vk6Mhk0wWh2hHxWXLhNIzT4a4zRduqFh6IREXkjMsexwXmb7mBqHuHZprQjuqRuo5o5VQ3giIASA
 Ey4c9252ryw5tg==;
Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 22:13:14 +0200
Message-Id: <868qqla2p1.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <m2ed0dsgsn.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?=
 =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Tue, 04 Feb 2025 19:31:20 +0100)
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN> <m2ed0dsgsn.fsf@HIDDEN>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---)

> From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 19:31:20 +0100
> 
> martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN> writes:
> 
> >> Sorry, here's the right one
> >
> > This doesn't fix 'next-frame'.  See Eli's example with M-x
> > select-frame-by-name which calls (next-frame nil 0).
> >
> > You then probably want to fix the
> >
> >   else if (EQ (frames, Qvisible))
> >     /* If FRAMES is 'visible', ignore invisible frames.  */
> >     return FRAME_VISIBLE_P (c) ? candidate : Qnil;
> >
> > check in candidate_frame for the case where c is a tty frame (and the
> > subsequent "0" case).
> >
> > I doubt this can fixed in an ad hoc manner.  The semantics of
> > FRAME_VISIBLE_P must be resolved first in a way that 'frame-visible-p'
> > will hold only for frames that can be chosen via the 'visible' argument
> > of these functions and vice versa.
> 
> The semantics of being visible before I removed being obscured was
> confusing. A frame could be visible but obscured, which is for me means
> it's invisible and can't be seen. That makes no sense to me.

But nothing else makes sense on TTY when we have multiple frames on
the same display.  So for the purpose of switching frames, the
meaning of "visible" on TTY should be tweaked to produce the expected
effect.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 20:11:02 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 15:11:02 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46786 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfPG9-00017z-K5
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:11:02 -0500
Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:59914)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tfPG7-00017V-0j
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:11:00 -0500
Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e])
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfPG0-0006mv-7B; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:10:52 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org;
 s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:
 Date; bh=eG7hFpwecysUxHnJrds1Gq/CtBFe0m2auHbYJtH2go0=; b=MJDut/1CM8bkM+oJZvMv
 UdT4zaD9Bf92XROnT6IYOk2gATU2AUKKwu1wZvSXQaMgDnkHa53E3aXw5YxNCc8yDOw6DLFxNBRTZ
 XfuPLiQr4d+BviLBmidlo/bwlophx83u46GYA/ujsv1BjYPbuWvjJPWik3E3agB4YvkEapt4mtwG4
 tqfz4Mn9JFlF5cC2b2Hz8bVx4Q6FZf07Vmn3XN7vKEo6mBx5c5uKaCmzyBgQ3JsqzQiuSS3/VRjRt
 6wPzfdx2bv7MqY2OLlphaFjj4KOgUsbbWW8LzbrSPjYRGToLwT7qLW4E5/9q52xqrJg2/Lj48RxJ3
 3UpEL09ci5EtMA==;
Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 22:10:48 +0200
Message-Id: <86a5b1a2t3.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <m2ikppsgyr.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?=
 =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Tue, 04 Feb 2025 19:27:40 +0100)
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN> <86ikppadhw.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <e02e35c1-627e-4798-b19b-0fcb281372be@HIDDEN> <m2ikppsgyr.fsf@HIDDEN>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---)

> From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 19:27:40 +0100
> 
> martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN> writes:
> 
> >> Or was the problem caused by frame visibility changes?  So a frame
> >> that is not the top TTY frame on its display is considered "invisible"
> >> now, and so next-frame refuses to pick it up, is that the problem?
> >
> > Yes.  I tried to explain that a number of times but failed miserably.
> >
> 
> That could be understood wrong. With emacs -q -nw in master, after C-x 5
> 2:
> 
>   (selected-frame)
>   #<frame F2 0x135810158>
>   (next-frame)
>   #<frame F1 0x156019200>
>   (frame-visible-p (next-frame))
>   nil
> 
> For C-x 5 o, it's other-frame that filters out F1, not next-frame. It
> didn't before because F1 was considered "obscured", internally, but
> considered visible for Lisp. I removed that because it was confusing to
> work with.

Martin was talking about select-frame-by-name, which uses
make-frame-names-alist to create a list of frames from which it offers
to select.  And make-frame-names-alist uses next-frame with 2nd
argument 0, which does:

      else if (FIXNUMP (minibuf) && XFIXNUM (minibuf) == 0)
	{
	  if (FRAME_VISIBLE_P (c) || FRAME_ICONIFIED_P (c))
	    return candidate;
	}

So now this skips all the non-child TTY frames except the top frame,
and that makes no sense to me.

I think there's a conceptual problem here: the meaning of "invisible"
on TTY is different from its meaning on GUI displays.  On GUI display,
"invisible" means the frame is not on display at all, whereas on TTY
the frame is there, it's just obscured by the one(s) above it.  So I
think we need to change candidate_frame to consider TTY frames
"visible" for the purpose of returning "visible" frames in next_frame
and prev_frame.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 18:31:31 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 13:31:31 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46617 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfNhq-0004Wi-Su
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 13:31:31 -0500
Received: from mail-wm1-x336.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::336]:50348)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfNho-0004WR-0Y
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 13:31:28 -0500
Received: by mail-wm1-x336.google.com with SMTP id
 5b1f17b1804b1-43690d4605dso41213645e9.0
 for <76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 10:31:27 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1738693881; x=1739298681; darn=debbugs.gnu.org;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=f5ghBOlMpt9WsdqqMbQSt/IdAbyjddg6q/M8d5MheLo=;
 b=aTnI0P165xbTmwJvNXaspVBN0Qo8Lj3ueP4Dggy17c5FUftPKe0nSVI48KYx5MnC/O
 rO9KccTGpD0J128n+NEmLRZgnKVX/cWSkej/1etqrsLJeEG6AuShC3X2U0oUIIJbAn+/
 BfJ+5+PK2C2Z9KjExPdf6D50JU4wxjJ5ywGN+ybel2JHv6xuIEUh9x6hlliSNI9XFjye
 kEVcdAPHpjHpkF2eruFkqfjiSXFzubufvE3DWWW9PEAWQtVgWIEhb8TWwxNvvrMb9PjB
 kzL3TDtl79MxWDXPHQvh1ZzdutHExk1kMNkrPgnwKeAyTUsVPdVaLbkmW2WEt+bfHmgD
 PSsw==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1738693881; x=1739298681;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date
 :message-id:reply-to;
 bh=f5ghBOlMpt9WsdqqMbQSt/IdAbyjddg6q/M8d5MheLo=;
 b=E0aopTVePuvE8WV/+6+/RpebC2dKlGMe44p5xufvd+Jcm3Z1ifFayjoNbsa96mRrXp
 mNemAObJiuyNsrAUrxuEzYLXJwF9nwT830QFq3RLc74ZxPlTrmzegglPlsYvTLfwZp6s
 q3ARXF9Jo2YZEhUuz1FwIaLRdrm/CuO2dtYr4OV2VI05XO2mE6tvkAYAjL4kukVwmX/D
 lHQHnBivNVIjWAk00GXC8yIr9HQNy/fR5gVoOUH4Ej4XvLjB1XG/Pho5BY5I5P0tFMRU
 jEVqj+g6I2Zod/uf9oFGLH4X8cguF3xeDcuhZCl87STXIwrAcQDN3DimYE5dIguJucJc
 cguA==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1;
 AJvYcCUHwTRNWoP82gHbE0zpNo3eCRzTnRNStplgaRcaN6InWwp2RAMiM9FOimTFuZ1uQjmGitPOgg==@debbugs.gnu.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YySr9n/yntWskmKpSN/zZFJ01+m1bQB8a0ABNy0V6TEuyVcm9kH
 DYRYixYUDmRaLcjDcWaoN/HtpF6oP0EwFhQJ0j+7EZRM9543rdLdo93URw==
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGnctlgxSEd8Eex6Woh9R+qCZp6tOiheBgkun3JZNEE1alrxVkTB7Y3Q2MyzyIOjD
 PpC1kCCkOIRe6CLt3xymXN4ZatjBuSpBMSNIOqzNXVWuDpzP22dfqj/YgF0A0i9O+vdIgHs00wk
 uWCKYdn0TrCDYCpedzv4IjF9/livhkPWyhkPsHVHo6hp6PK2aqszIt/ins/r+S335EEn56V2jNo
 QeKiwsrLaiGe5SXv3XqbR4VwGiXBdDnbl/z4iSZWYCsWcXvyF7thmh0+Q7ujGX3mpxVYTy+HsOV
 a+q98/abPxVOnLx9b72JG5FV3tl9fT3oH6+GU8c0TpBoqwWLf+2q8FXvEFzqKAQVb/GOgaztTuK
 d1X6qyhNMn7EDzQrENGzQvbJa
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IHP9wS0+EZ7Kf/BXVHn3s1nSCQ9Bfx0b0+/P+RXOf3IWgNVGop3U/2QZnJfxP36dllVJf1DGQ==
X-Received: by 2002:a5d:5988:0:b0:38b:ed1c:a70d with SMTP id
 ffacd0b85a97d-38c5167b477mr24012213f8f.0.1738693881325; 
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 10:31:21 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pro2 (p200300e0b705a00058413e49c0284fb2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de.
 [2003:e0:b705:a000:5841:3e49:c028:4fb2])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 5b1f17b1804b1-438e23deddcsm196111575e9.14.2025.02.04.10.31.20
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 10:31:20 -0800 (PST)
From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
In-Reply-To: <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN> (martin rudalics's
 message of "Tue, 4 Feb 2025 16:06:10 +0100")
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 19:31:20 +0100
Message-ID: <m2ed0dsgsn.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN> writes:

>> Sorry, here's the right one
>
> This doesn't fix 'next-frame'.  See Eli's example with M-x
> select-frame-by-name which calls (next-frame nil 0).
>
> You then probably want to fix the
>
>   else if (EQ (frames, Qvisible))
>     /* If FRAMES is 'visible', ignore invisible frames.  */
>     return FRAME_VISIBLE_P (c) ? candidate : Qnil;
>
> check in candidate_frame for the case where c is a tty frame (and the
> subsequent "0" case).
>
> I doubt this can fixed in an ad hoc manner.  The semantics of
> FRAME_VISIBLE_P must be resolved first in a way that 'frame-visible-p'
> will hold only for frames that can be chosen via the 'visible' argument
> of these functions and vice versa.

The semantics of being visible before I removed being obscured was
confusing. A frame could be visible but obscured, which is for me means
it's invisible and can't be seen. That makes no sense to me.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 18:27:50 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 13:27:50 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46604 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfNeI-0004Ic-Gy
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 13:27:50 -0500
Received: from mail-wr1-x433.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::433]:47201)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfNeG-0004IE-FZ
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 13:27:49 -0500
Received: by mail-wr1-x433.google.com with SMTP id
 ffacd0b85a97d-385e27c75f4so4967426f8f.2
 for <76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 10:27:48 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1738693662; x=1739298462; darn=debbugs.gnu.org;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=SeDjxtsUAqzUyC/UGVznxyms6AVTbePGRUsSLNHIjXc=;
 b=Pq7oU+iNDfiUjdtTjSckUiVGh6Q+hzP0QabgO0Je9EnUheqlo0PhTEr97E3YvX9C0b
 cvmdMjsvFCmsNxzECGpJZOHQEubemxivLLpMtV/5Oz0px13IM9Kyju3GlsEAVxpHQXmL
 7skMYR4rwDcosDv2uq2naCXZtAQOmXeOBj/owcklDiHooYNy8AQjXCZkFWyZ5HLadr/9
 eaFMQ7Z9jI4Y8+VNPKavHBCicUrqvBCp0A+gWfkk1TMSpFz5kWpi6Af078Cg/3U3azEH
 nigvKMreGnZDrSWSpJjHoiVc7fDxDkp1YJyHabkk+SH7FNnfTaKBBoc9pyw9v3NyMiML
 FY0w==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1738693662; x=1739298462;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date
 :message-id:reply-to;
 bh=SeDjxtsUAqzUyC/UGVznxyms6AVTbePGRUsSLNHIjXc=;
 b=q42WVjlmScMZAjKqFJ54EYs29dq0lWnuYyURF6Iq5RsUdOD3XM9PGlbFTrqq+ihYJ3
 aRHHLfmPkA+W+e/qHpKGF4I/zfcC4p8S7BGUomSss5kmxEFkqqkee4nioNOH6aUCYsBK
 qC6C7XvIlbqLbVUk3iRjfPIL8bdmW8gifa2sPt2+nx7ygqtebrVAuCj60jdHIPfdfeGh
 sZeU0C400sdivfb06Njl/xkS8+RSTfl3ir/yYkkWusFmNzv5nxEXhmSV4NgbCA+yeom+
 Hvd3WZFBBNVjDPu7dns6mNlEKBJJSBsB/Ayzp+YYIEzKrpL5B30Enuq+Fa76lx1IKKo5
 2qDg==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1;
 AJvYcCUwqnpJqVKzkuDQZ9i1/+bwRUcwhr0VOFTgc9UBvIg8L6l3+76PkIw9+5H3WXKm23tAH3RWmQ==@debbugs.gnu.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YzIWE5CoFk9B3RtNpgGkN1CDQccPPd8W3HUP4ixm4G0j6kGxcob
 En/MAD+QLuzuSqUEI8WauoL39/Fl/E8oL3hh2Ty7xugc12dC3sxDMACofA==
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncux/iz+BRCwSc+e7nTUo8P+wAw9kfER2NhHoi8kwQmDO+CX/zjfUy1BDKmF7hZ
 h2Yq7ymqtJwFSnScWR/3iOGQ9yQoaeAAIIkdM9n0GxKpLcaMOayadisxfbVqNn8J/omhL0gaO2N
 0YPSbL9vzvvnAIMQ8QNwehFaBc+5Xk2CZ36+Rx9wFMIl5EAJE0tDKy2JL6y1QcH/IxbAkc3ii5o
 xq17EwHp8PlOZOCsZmbQm34d4YhE+RK33Fny/jQHbLNe4k4wSiCxg1QJ7UjUDYQTUmszRo3MR9m
 5XnavQpNFsrnzm39m5gWVtEOxmn6R9l09L0hat745BnbeXkfJvVIhsOX5kTNN6PJYyf/wT3XUzL
 3lCxBWnT2ILcf1vtil2yMmuzk
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IF0zrW5i+WK6mb+oy/TciV09rbWKpq2yNZ4CHCme5KxYXx/9a8Yp5pX1dXdf50PMJ9VeKpFOQ==
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6000:2a6:b0:386:3262:28c6 with SMTP id
 ffacd0b85a97d-38c5194cf0cmr21650354f8f.5.1738693661733; 
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 10:27:41 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pro2 (p200300e0b705a00058413e49c0284fb2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de.
 [2003:e0:b705:a000:5841:3e49:c028:4fb2])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 ffacd0b85a97d-38c5c1cf853sm16321020f8f.84.2025.02.04.10.27.41
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 10:27:41 -0800 (PST)
From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
In-Reply-To: <e02e35c1-627e-4798-b19b-0fcb281372be@HIDDEN> (martin rudalics's
 message of "Tue, 4 Feb 2025 18:54:16 +0100")
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN> <86ikppadhw.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <e02e35c1-627e-4798-b19b-0fcb281372be@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 19:27:40 +0100
Message-ID: <m2ikppsgyr.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN> writes:

>> Or was the problem caused by frame visibility changes?  So a frame
>> that is not the top TTY frame on its display is considered "invisible"
>> now, and so next-frame refuses to pick it up, is that the problem?
>
> Yes.  I tried to explain that a number of times but failed miserably.
>

That could be understood wrong. With emacs -q -nw in master, after C-x 5
2:

  (selected-frame)
  #<frame F2 0x135810158>
  (next-frame)
  #<frame F1 0x156019200>
  (frame-visible-p (next-frame))
  nil

For C-x 5 o, it's other-frame that filters out F1, not next-frame. It
didn't before because F1 was considered "obscured", internally, but
considered visible for Lisp. I removed that because it was confusing to
work with.






Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 17:54:31 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 12:54:31 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46545 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfN83-0002iY-Al
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 12:54:31 -0500
Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.18]:56999)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <rudalics@HIDDEN>) id 1tfN81-0002iJ-Gi
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 12:54:29 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmx.at;
 s=s31663417; t=1738691659; x=1739296459; i=rudalics@HIDDEN;
 bh=chYAqWQwh847L6DFYiC6vVToaDYfKy1Md0cUOBnksxc=;
 h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version:Subject:To:Cc:
 References:From:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:
 Content-Transfer-Encoding:cc:content-transfer-encoding:
 content-type:date:from:message-id:mime-version:reply-to:subject:
 to;
 b=PH1wQoLEyFUka4dTr7zECVdvEk0v2KOgXAQg+IU6GstrOPdIOjwArQP+M/IFnU2Z
 cdYULrsNb7Wum4F3utbhCM6ip9jKgT6+gCDXun2ozxdzM6YnMYGn1+lvAlr4TLHJm
 wSIfmXsVc7MjtVHSF3/fe6tRIlIs00rgQTEQx1MalMmDW4yWt3pQfrGyPsX7+aYJ8
 0nNJzeMGBYgYd3JBXaby5PzucAexlUwMZjNL8KcjdFe0NGMf2YPErLFzDOGmXLfpE
 fllUTqryaUFb4ZTeKqLfg5YeYo1Wp8g3BOd+Ke9LCfwuWqeRIl24XcM/h48MRTpoB
 U0CBHAtwa/P25g0/PQ==
X-UI-Sender-Class: 724b4f7f-cbec-4199-ad4e-598c01a50d3a
Received: from [192.168.31.113] ([212.95.5.16]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx004
 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MbAcs-1t8WLT10ps-00hFC8; Tue, 04
 Feb 2025 18:54:19 +0100
Message-ID: <e02e35c1-627e-4798-b19b-0fcb281372be@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2025 18:54:16 +0100
MIME-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN> <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN> <86ikppadhw.fsf@HIDDEN>
Content-Language: en-US
From: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <86ikppadhw.fsf@HIDDEN>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:ax0bz1y+un+/TeNzDjQ2FW+2SscGqRI36h/L2pSI3VmpcosZguX
 J8cylux8LYoULngt5TRSN9aMfQwk2RpvG8NkNxPnJX5i6M31Ov9GHQv4u6ZOOxwIEBCKkdT
 URYE2tlCVONhrvU7YdQVZNxQTZ23UHUIajGv8/bPeCtnR0Xx2UCVvpk+OgC9R1gBgGTwhXz
 ORzP+oFB5Ay4gr3gB/QMQ==
X-Spam-Flag: NO
UI-OutboundReport: notjunk:1;M01:P0:aNyw5vQmK9g=;r2njjSXe7OpGjhaBYUWQ3iUWSmq
 tCO50zPpH9Pm3WFsTVTQyteXsJTievBhQDqfByr7Ts1GzUf3xekP3dq+m11+5fmGjSAnr60Rr
 dqbjVx4NcY/ybpuRt6tcTKQSOuLsDYgVcz1c2QaHhejJkmfWPlf8o1kKSzxfToyIaA0sq499o
 VoGQKPQ8f/Q65Ade72+rM8j1AIY1oKz/1pnCN9/N7RBP9wtcNo+vb03qF/boMxDWj0hcYa1Lq
 cRTHusPq2d4Z14WdQodTtxWaEz8BW10kffW9T1CF0zpyDJN8oeFneGYYplL89btQS3R+wVQ0q
 sIUB0Fs6Wi0Rmco8aQQYRN0azfNzOg5ZLp6j8AwG8MJz1IHWIHknZ3Z29fax5+2E3YhOFrlIK
 VutEWK1ieodvPr5WtxecIPqdlQVzTd36Xl+fKu25CRJX4lFr81XWkgyz2/9qp2YpATSmZQkHO
 DOjd3Dmpvi1JWXdKq9BrhvOZocHaJ0yssms5Yl3Uemb+EuCWVr+gBExfXRn0/uX/t9kfmFjfS
 BvlPRGCsRq4+KLRfHrwCfsGLplxv/r3c7AfKQ4rC2V53HFcEHENC3KjOcFn7bpdet7Nucft8/
 r7yR4LL5lip8NAwmd5kUYz0iMnBkPACux8LqFnPFNmjK7QCBgQoSm6B2XZ8iQdpsn3+FCPvq3
 2qdvoYkx+CjA/W/JanFfc1/t3ojQDToIO2LZDVUlo3/TnxsEob+BSTu7/ntonKh5LInYDeF0W
 Tn7UnPEDrJskYkGHHxoyeGTgiaUg6oAVxhMlpbEDgEwCbKUtD19sHsC275H6KRMHgAiNdpe8+
 iscnw/K9WeSP8iXKn2aiOAu01tZewzOCSBPNfJgLaAAFk57ZhFBEUK7fZ4Q6bXWfU7PxIggTT
 Z1D5ILH0aeSfVBLe0EHTPtnxKO41kV3h87DQWcuvxGBZCmCWYHiS4NHhM8+/IRox5o/sVY56x
 HqFbx+6E1sLdLR4NtAmmWbLNu7z0l/w97fRsiMgWXCLpVzJZgn9O+s6wyJOtEDfzy1uIzvy/j
 y7ESC2IP5gnp2rtIeNa/CHd12uN7ySmvxqHO7iuBzXjSOLa2Tr5uktv633gBAmfxpxD+/AAOG
 XzVO5VuiVOa+qvlrvfps+T/VqUrUaIyNGy1aQ18Gr/AagUWYzSKvpzzE1ixYxCVXrSN8w6n9B
 J2EYurk53fGHGncxbArGigHouHEBDuy5CrIc9ec1qy38u4dgvfa9OWJQMzeAGwFFGHMP2fR/q
 uhvF/PXysyOk1pKezpQzdAhi7QzEkVElDHgN7MRzDYq0b/s7w9xJEE5Ztipb8hz9BLxUufKAe
 Clrk+BMZCo/9ZfYKb4qlcXGGZNeeJ/9BGp1JvQLCIr54hCUQMdACMH+qoqiFTCFOkKtIXrhww
 uTEQbTEI31tG/K2eRE2B0Fx/UyAH2rpRQrm9lcWQqdkoUQZ9pYiGHJec5IBeNjsCcvvlPX65v
 y5X5JNw==
X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-)

 > Or was the problem caused by frame visibility changes?  So a frame
 > that is not the top TTY frame on its display is considered "invisible"
 > now, and so next-frame refuses to pick it up, is that the problem?

Yes.  I tried to explain that a number of times but failed miserably.

martin




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 16:20:06 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 11:20:06 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46371 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfLef-0000cp-KK
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 11:20:06 -0500
Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:57606)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tfLed-0000aY-Cz
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 11:20:04 -0500
Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e])
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfLeX-000149-Sq; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 11:19:57 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org;
 s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date:
 mime-version; bh=s2Pskw33jenfhP7Rs/BSjmsfdUEORdmv1pSEd595EVU=; b=nvYif7Y9mcKP
 V8bQV+iIoHabS8syHaZZoLREIVlRkswdSCSJlLJ3YXd4etVq1ixJo8gs50tUgMWuWerx31VDUAioO
 TmlygcjcnFB9yjJefRHHIF6r4cQiC0mvn89FCZUMHy00g0r11L0oGmKQ6cco7Aw0iKCACWRQieaAK
 Gmfs82XRds7GomZS0gOWS/C8Pgh0D074eIZDWo5BfSmAlHrP1oVVfcqdO/LTTf3jVWMBMF0Qo9tfV
 xSHmE9uG5UlnGpm8YGmxvZNWi1oEusRV1WWBcnv2zs+U1GOFLqiLyzGXyzdAi+AHAYdwPk3SDdUDo
 KdFoBm6rBup6kn9mOdhSxg==;
Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 18:19:55 +0200
Message-Id: <86ikppadhw.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN> (message from
 martin rudalics on Tue, 4 Feb 2025 16:06:10 +0100)
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN> <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN>
X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---)

> Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2025 16:06:10 +0100
> Cc: 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> From: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
> 
>  > Sorry, here's the right one
> 
> This doesn't fix 'next-frame'.  See Eli's example with M-x
> select-frame-by-name which calls (next-frame nil 0).
> 
> You then probably want to fix the
> 
>    else if (EQ (frames, Qvisible))
>      /* If FRAMES is 'visible', ignore invisible frames.  */
>      return FRAME_VISIBLE_P (c) ? candidate : Qnil;
> 
> check in candidate_frame for the case where c is a tty frame (and the
> subsequent "0" case).
> 
> I doubt this can fixed in an ad hoc manner.  The semantics of
> FRAME_VISIBLE_P must be resolved first in a way that 'frame-visible-p'
> will hold only for frames that can be chosen via the 'visible' argument
> of these functions and vice versa.

Can someone tell what change(s) broke this?  AFAIU, child frames were
not supposed to change the way next-frame works.  What part of those
changes had that effect?

Aren't child frames just like normal frames as far as next-frame
etc. are concerned?  If not, why not?

Or was the problem caused by frame visibility changes?  So a frame
that is not the top TTY frame on its display is considered "invisible"
now, and so next-frame refuses to pick it up, is that the problem?




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 15:06:26 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 10:06:26 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:46184 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfKVN-0005XM-O4
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 10:06:25 -0500
Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.17.20]:44817)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <rudalics@HIDDEN>) id 1tfKVL-0005X5-E6
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 10:06:23 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmx.at;
 s=s31663417; t=1738681571; x=1739286371; i=rudalics@HIDDEN;
 bh=5iVPqA8WiXZr6/1fYVsz5Fk/Azz/RPN13DezeFjd308=;
 h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version:Subject:To:Cc:
 References:From:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:
 Content-Transfer-Encoding:cc:content-transfer-encoding:
 content-type:date:from:message-id:mime-version:reply-to:subject:
 to;
 b=S1LK1BfzLFV7S3OqTHBv92/PeJ9705OBz8iu8shn/k0chIchr0S30D5lldwoKlqt
 2AlK42w5+bgeM53oOyaoKDh1dMXdJnXDQvvaBz8j6OaLB68UhKp5f2e+3pOodFk5M
 kD0FaROG3lNJGpMMWbqW1glPz1RBrNTr3BzmfZ7QQ4aYmo9OaMrj5V+YKSqUJGQmK
 Rfe+IJAJg3mBzTRiOP2JV+fk0wrHft3OaO1tNuZP3f4l28TXErpDdYltnD76qLg0W
 zvLxm2moxPuFi2WWrAVn7NwSVHWCA7wqTTGq9rIaO+mP/SS6Cvg+t3XNEimQ5AMMu
 hCz1oklUxfSksraeDw==
X-UI-Sender-Class: 724b4f7f-cbec-4199-ad4e-598c01a50d3a
Received: from [192.168.31.113] ([212.95.5.16]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx104
 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MQ5rU-1u1PjH335c-00WBxM; Tue, 04
 Feb 2025 16:06:11 +0100
Message-ID: <4909d6c2-6d72-494c-86bc-c273cf9912a5@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2025 16:06:10 +0100
MIME-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
To: =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>,
 Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN> <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
Content-Language: en-US
From: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:aknrNsfOd6GpuIjE97vQ0AngtV0hzISCX5i1znPveknvHy2dU2P
 uvbuPwFz1aWUzcun4hBBdenjJV2TCrnMkBtmXI4GeDaloLtUiHIi//2cS8y90aqQSczzLKq
 CQvJc9QJPX0VaqbYaPkkez7EXF8r8/O1Z98SyHOUoRltzb1MB+b8RTJRydT26aFvQbsscPm
 +6j5goz/79M1O/2w1Uhtw==
X-Spam-Flag: NO
UI-OutboundReport: notjunk:1;M01:P0:C8jy7lMclSA=;GmpAy0p68N/WBbXDje/qqwqh94e
 jWt9heAuRoIVP9b+QqMIe1vuZLej9B0Js/EK/5+rbod9M3YpHlPTxIANFJkZbNuUZ4SMXqW+2
 0iDwXoOIj1xCxWdm11aeN0vLMSexn5nx1l5o+BgBKER4tEwzqq0sIbDvFSWPdjZ/NdWkpWhP0
 ODxV3+jp/KGXSdg9cO9M+0ceRsVwY4O2D7aNy9DDj4h4bDiU1F4ugZaqd20+Fx/2M9SuIXlaz
 lZdixAD6bX6+cr4WCVdxL93jjfMZByWApPU+rFqsKftB1UCZd1915d/rmNYjMBlOgffz8dQED
 1rR8ENFWKsF91ORdPR52AJAq/cgDLbcR8XfhMcJMFTGOaWwOB/jBYTOg2yJla2uHfTiWsKm1y
 CjuuK9ZvRMmlLlDmZPUIOwHhzUpPKGAjNShImmvihfjdmq1UczCOHapV8auJAAsPNHcbVx1RM
 o8X8ZxuQxTsgZBwb21Z+eLyBDvsSxydgOSX+wZ1KqJu/k0b8taesX4MK82MthxikGP+wmylGq
 XesD7v4+WlCke8rLGVdNuOKzjMRajMB507PziSGaB0Zgky9cdUJdwMvxbpkKUZ5cmiIDeIOft
 ksR5z+lsQnW1SYjxVBzq3k1dMC+HxV2ci9uTqC4MkTCCmqbXVT+JfdpiqxoNsTLq22QR1Zkg/
 aWhSbCQ98zNC7qA9hfO7qs8CydRZwntEUw7TJ0RIsspidAMhKHbUGdkXHt7rq+/Kp/qpcLzV6
 UDxDHssYbyPpF1sq1Gfiq/nFyR3heGyLvPpWxm8Hf1uIN60O70jPU8XA8tEzpcJ0jaWNSCsY5
 M12PiU+wZ2Npt/fw3/iZp0EP1nzlWGFisaem4VeESQnNhec5lnofFEixs0Azbx39jJrQ8qOce
 +f6zFKSzKGL84fSpaCUK0MEvkRZpnNfIJgHKy4p8HIrUpzpORJlLm0IpnYlhwZOwXPnV3cWAy
 dSwcty/k0X3gG8SXXJBzaFX306RZQTCc+jhgFpKtLz2JO9b0hxK6zH+OD1Xrvp8tvb2oJbQoc
 CNh3XSpBbmnHAr4xFsEnqqG6jfQWI+cWVBlDDVt50hsWPxoohKeDtOfNR0jXEUL/DI6DZYyRa
 DBU2A1zSlPUiVr5qi/vPfDPw78Yc1qsBjQ4JZe4OsBsf8VYaEmqRiMqehc5MQQZpkn6jMVdXC
 8gjtjHoQ+bFI1IaMOQjJ4q43cm0dCRfSTplLB9FSiuz2Y9R9JBbYyAjQ/1i6vW4KrZURsiIDc
 IuvD3MSdr3chFDJZb5qh+r3CPH6RqPsaxliPP6dWP7Ip2Ztgrne9cxYo5otn6CIb1eJPgHIDT
 79WitCcbgmrBDSspFzBADZ4hE2wRw1uXLJk4+UsraUxfCT3qM/1EZm1sgu2KWkUGXubY6/ifY
 oSfEN2kZGEORLbDUASaF0BSUWVAYVK4uYg3eY2g7vqLCeupWfTbc3kX99uJzixUbsTjwJjekJ
 DDxVgvw==
X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-)

 > Sorry, here's the right one

This doesn't fix 'next-frame'.  See Eli's example with M-x
select-frame-by-name which calls (next-frame nil 0).

You then probably want to fix the

   else if (EQ (frames, Qvisible))
     /* If FRAMES is 'visible', ignore invisible frames.  */
     return FRAME_VISIBLE_P (c) ? candidate : Qnil;

check in candidate_frame for the case where c is a tty frame (and the
subsequent "0" case).

I doubt this can fixed in an ad hoc manner.  The semantics of
FRAME_VISIBLE_P must be resolved first in a way that 'frame-visible-p'
will hold only for frames that can be chosen via the 'visible' argument
of these functions and vice versa.

martin




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 14:49:55 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 09:49:55 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43387 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfKFP-0000yF-DR
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 09:49:55 -0500
Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.17.20]:54875)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <rudalics@HIDDEN>) id 1tfKFL-0000xv-WD
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 09:49:53 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmx.at;
 s=s31663417; t=1738680584; x=1739285384; i=rudalics@HIDDEN;
 bh=rn8Ax5rbjIgdTyaxtzRcZIaxWyYrMttHiSdi0IdgEbY=;
 h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version:Subject:To:Cc:
 References:From:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:
 Content-Transfer-Encoding:cc:content-transfer-encoding:
 content-type:date:from:message-id:mime-version:reply-to:subject:
 to;
 b=Qu52td8RvshqFrh74i3e3EhUJfT8DHZ1k2UFaoYh+JI8q4RgMYB5LnAufnFh616D
 vdI5GjQAC1nGrT4kp58NrzkL8Y0kE45mDWA0jRxYL6rAkM9dFUSizzjgdoPDqx3iL
 hNN9+cfNPV2KQR59WYh/ibz1PkyA8MzBRRAHFwHcq1viZyzT0Rzhoa9RqeY9GIWDk
 QAPQl9BJTWhnE1OMx712sfPXTtvDauVENGtRVZnO561646EAvf0VkUY6nTgVj1d53
 rCWC2bQi/HSuCk+6E0SvlMWspEdpdOCQNfxoXXl6mu7QIWi9q/mUtkc1rnyrG32dk
 xWZBz8DAmmKl4NbuWg==
X-UI-Sender-Class: 724b4f7f-cbec-4199-ad4e-598c01a50d3a
Received: from [192.168.31.113] ([212.95.5.16]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx105
 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MTRQq-1trSHk0rVM-00Sy4v; Tue, 04
 Feb 2025 15:49:44 +0100
Message-ID: <dd9e809e-9a53-409f-87ca-081485aaa879@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2025 15:49:38 +0100
MIME-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN> <86wme5aiso.fsf@HIDDEN>
Content-Language: en-US
From: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <86wme5aiso.fsf@HIDDEN>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:BTG4Ylyz6B8p39cbA3pkfzTiFavG7zUPxw8qOeHYBvJt7ZqCuow
 z/y3BKdYSq3dW+IXO2viSfP1oKE/d8d5SNGbTMo0Bgh6IY9RZkZkSYj2V6bwT3brwx1C/PB
 6WSla2KG8QYKmeEU5qQkNnxbvMmK7dm7FkIwF7AJff1bv2cnEmww9L5QmTlDT8BiQGuQvX9
 TEEiV5k370zDa1nRHa2RQ==
X-Spam-Flag: NO
UI-OutboundReport: notjunk:1;M01:P0:D2/iVvgZ8k4=;0F4F4VK3HzTBaCrnu+VSEX4npDB
 4O9+TJ/otSpeB9wN89C3Lud9s3T6QGEwHsa+MGF0SigXFawqI0Il5ZRjWNjrF3kp9JGifkiok
 G9Gi8QVx2sivuV3jxpO5H/myCImHsBl+kL0hwOpdVjgPcY16yhYLS2MWraT2ftHDrDe8vZCvl
 Kt6dYnsUbXbJiCHz5XJZYoq31zDV7GpF/Ns30g7lXjkL5TQBV8uPHBW3bM1BWVADgiOlYh2ea
 xuy3uafXdT8EAhLso/IfQEBuwnYk/6nz87ulxmL+98iN0q5jlH9QYSMDuf50JgZVyLDHW7LJr
 ayaXYWmZtvkSGcdZ13vJ5g+NeTIU1tmWovBoi+8Dq7Nin6O3gxDmHOJqEtpt5ZhFcXWmxIr2x
 8vGPdLcowb7acdRwTaRND+lMMLRbehTSfUL6O2jS5R285sO5Q8VQVdE9jFkpn2hqJYLU6D0pY
 VB0dnGFUVwbHqKbJZObwg7wUhoKC/uqk7UI0LT7MJBGgz16n6Gp7FLq938wtwGe1wLF0ij4N1
 RE5ixagmuBPg8FlbjTlH3mdRXYyx4ivfhgYV31AsHmNteFuaBGJWwx8YQJAlJ7VwKNHsRsMAd
 Tk1d3FM6mDXKARDAutkKmJIZFm6iLx4Aq9gcxEof7iJwTSDI2umf9J5KhMp7ebA3n4UfpEMvA
 ZD3TBJL1PCqfG7LTX6obX5VhWVCOTBs1VOWgMfqdWhq0A4lAAHAeUmJiItbN9UrNzvpIf+cMZ
 aAlmc11pYNL/V9w8a48Q8oa7xF5M+d8Rx/bWs5Tzq72KRnT9SXVthWz4GUHHnlyKq5sI7NcEM
 tFyROfrb9cHlaob21zIS5b05x/Jw1zPpf+ZtioGKMIbabNk4Dq/Tcovl2wQej2fQqwEYjupwS
 qzLqy4FxfgZSguGpUUiQrtwnGfjSgDKD4hTeI5Wd3lxWlyGYSnaJ+6R1yemNPuCC7KqM3cJ28
 EwxgCvKnqj9iIlzI1ScaErjHcJx03f18kVk3Tq2i1y9yy8JYgsSd5rKPTgTBnZqoohxUUx29e
 UK7ME1y3RzYS/ByZVgNkTzMrBHn55ra7uLlF4DmBBgTWD0fBiTf5fEYthnrabiDj4tIMmyldj
 DOa5GKVPZ6hK3w9DBssnre9SsO0OhpuN9V9lSm/M/RButcDSWnVhCskIH7i++OeIGRmvVIxwW
 rFu8YY6Hhb36CNnbc3PCAce2DrE/9JNsSrdx0/XdqJmEqH8wHMJbKxY0pZYEfhlxIoSoXhxte
 AudIi/Lq46iidjwg8afZimctQYeE3iU+NWQtZI+ki8NSWsyEw2hL+bPT9NgFOsSleAequJhRV
 f9QF8EUuyXTTxdVH22XR4A5ulSztcjd3a5DVNO6imNqYfDydG9cGSeoC2tT+bOG0HcwjGBWR0
 iCToDq7fKSRc80K8tBDIUcuSHFVOOXjCb73aiFWrCL64k+wPiHVoafMMZaD/hBW2zHp3o224n
 jF8URbA==
X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-)
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Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 14:30:55 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 09:30:55 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43302 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfJx1-0005QQ-2z
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 09:30:55 -0500
Received: from mail-ej1-x62c.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::62c]:47463)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfJwx-0005Q7-DH
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 09:30:52 -0500
Received: by mail-ej1-x62c.google.com with SMTP id
 a640c23a62f3a-aaf900cc7fbso1166843866b.3
 for <76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 06:30:51 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1738679444; x=1739284244; darn=debbugs.gnu.org;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=4ep7pfGDu9c28XZpbPNAFxT0s5W4Y30fJ5fIl0ocUTU=;
 b=EckVLCC+xe88iN9D7CwsO7F+ZWJ/DZeN6IoIam5K/T760tJQRadOz5cWdvbrQLLOwP
 KC7HVUxc3BJ6AcmLsJrEXtANIZXqJmas23onOR9Lh+PKMzueCrOdBUWQptUh1nBTCIwd
 07ubptWpOfPjKWctFAZS3vnS6BHNRstYm1vBGdNIfXOmsUrEBliBcwBafkn6TgUEqqey
 OPjmWwuIDSrF68BrWbro9Fspz9YgV6UafnVGXK2Mliugq+2FtgXGHtt67Rcb0eZ6doQU
 tXkfPaFvKc7aBg3E/q7L1bLBg89t9ao9X70K2nqVQPZEmYoJnhxqTlgjIXrC91zHejpX
 KjZA==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1738679444; x=1739284244;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date
 :message-id:reply-to;
 bh=4ep7pfGDu9c28XZpbPNAFxT0s5W4Y30fJ5fIl0ocUTU=;
 b=T1EG8Ch/iB5Zm6nt34ttc3oDJRqzQOy2mAH7sCdMamPXARFqXpFcr/d0WgAG/egVdM
 e/H19/mFUZrztu7wxZJdBXm19u5bq/e45JI9a6gZEuqqYXDF6G4r2MwBQiiCuWKvjs+O
 R57RyHYtuvz5fAoEiLLyK+3AnIwACcypzZZamDahm8FiGrSVbXZOAYKl+uuFDsfJ0y3a
 k8PFCMU3qlLx0lD7ShUt/CjcxKSF9ZsTUgZc6DqoJL4yzQpWW8mO+KkzzoG6zydoAeGJ
 pLpRwEgMtLwtTrR2stzl4T9hyxEisS4fN8NfbKmV7fIyxJ9qCr/ItvaB9JXcVEDIFs3Z
 au8w==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1;
 AJvYcCXUR013auQyk18a2zfMPrrw1HakefkCGXlopqV8QkLcoiFaG/IBMSo4s3kCvbi66mw4qrFYTw==@debbugs.gnu.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Yx+lBxtazkUtDMP7aVnVyYSKMHreWFOqCB6sLP52MU0TadsBc6M
 +zbd8jP9RgleiBT6NQ57DvM0FuXxo4V+CfS1klMr1e8D6lhOrqNHFGPkyA==
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncv1GcaSq4pDtx5mhfFs6W5OldqBK66ehK9zD/CuDwPMNsCQmlFBLAR5z/1MGFo
 KSppHD+gzYZOAleqfGAoQ13cgF2WMyLqipFa+qnLGWgBBREmGAZHZR9zgiG8gMr/wTIRWIXzP39
 vbRZ7D/JEEulvH1S92UzkNHQktHqjGJug5kvOsQ71lQWIk+02vkUDOZpX8/hApX5VYgXB0RY9Qd
 PXJc44NcH+a6g56s4dUtWyXQDkQ+LiawLPPEBvHB860cIHjctZs5lVTQ9H0ojs7b2hG7LrVA8Ij
 INmbDnvRlsMu2YwTq8na5PcF6tHg9+iGTsqCxLssi3cVF+hqHkMWXPNJyEn5P1diSDJPppQRktR
 vpZMvRlEm02Nz5/FvGZmZjAZk
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IFvog+pHokCEEEP8rul1UbZpzpx4EXBgqzjqPHlTROHOqysBFS5JcaxdawNIw8Ory2ar4WXbg==
X-Received: by 2002:a17:907:9445:b0:aa6:a9fe:46e5 with SMTP id
 a640c23a62f3a-ab6cfe12e13mr3399990566b.53.1738679444201; 
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 06:30:44 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pro2 (p200300e0b705a00058413e49c0284fb2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de.
 [2003:e0:b705:a000:5841:3e49:c028:4fb2])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 a640c23a62f3a-ab6e4a562f2sm936380066b.173.2025.02.04.06.30.43
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 06:30:43 -0800 (PST)
From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
In-Reply-To: <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Tue, 04 Feb
 2025 16:26:58 +0200")
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
 <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 15:30:42 +0100
Message-ID: <m27c65ixyl.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=-=-="
X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

--=-=-=
Content-Type: text/plain

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:

> Ehm.. wrong patch?  You attached the patch for the min-width thingy.

Sorry, here's the right one


--=-=-=
Content-Type: text/x-patch
Content-Disposition: attachment;
 filename=0001-Don-t-skip-tty-root-frames-in-other-frame-bug-76031.patch

From e042482fe4ec6cfae954cdb3795aeaf14bd09221 Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001
From: =?UTF-8?q?Gerd=20M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2025 09:43:18 +0100
Subject: [PATCH] Don't skip tty root frames in other-frame (bug#76031)

* lisp/frame.el (other-frame): Don't skip tty root frames, they are
invisible but can be switched to.
---
 lisp/frame.el | 30 +++++++++++++++++-------------
 1 file changed, 17 insertions(+), 13 deletions(-)

diff --git a/lisp/frame.el b/lisp/frame.el
index a55fcb41ce1..0df62ca872b 100644
--- a/lisp/frame.el
+++ b/lisp/frame.el
@@ -1162,19 +1162,23 @@ other-frame
   (interactive "p")
   (let ((sframe (selected-frame))
         (frame (selected-frame)))
-    (while (> arg 0)
-      (setq frame (next-frame frame))
-      (while (and (not (eq frame sframe))
-                  (not (eq (frame-visible-p frame) t)))
-	(setq frame (next-frame frame)))
-      (setq arg (1- arg)))
-    (while (< arg 0)
-      (setq frame (previous-frame frame))
-      (while (and (not (eq frame sframe))
-                  (not (eq (frame-visible-p frame) t)))
-	(setq frame (previous-frame frame)))
-      (setq arg (1+ arg)))
-    (select-frame-set-input-focus frame)))
+    (cl-flet ((skip (frame)
+                (or (eq frame sframe)
+                    (if (display-graphic-p frame)
+                        (not (frame-visible-p frame))
+                      (and (frame-parent frame)
+                           (not (frame-visible-p frame)))))))
+      (while (> arg 0)
+        (setq frame (next-frame frame))
+        (while (skip frame)
+	  (setq frame (next-frame frame)))
+        (setq arg (1- arg)))
+      (while (< arg 0)
+        (setq frame (previous-frame frame))
+        (while (skip frame)
+	  (setq frame (previous-frame frame)))
+        (setq arg (1+ arg)))
+      (select-frame-set-input-focus frame))))
 
 (defun other-frame-prefix ()
   "Display the buffer of the next command in a new frame.
-- 
2.48.1


--=-=-=--




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 14:27:17 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 09:27:17 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43291 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfJtU-0005Dk-Oo
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 09:27:17 -0500
Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:33528)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tfJtN-0005D8-FC
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 09:27:10 -0500
Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e])
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfJtI-0006L2-5x; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 09:27:04 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org;
 s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:
 Date; bh=HsRESYdiIMJf5ScXV8qoTUMrGU7Grg0TAt7oV8gJZBw=; b=fBRrLW5LUIorUWRJZvLc
 wo7XuiHhRboG7/FAXVGvhrLhWLn3R19Gn0FhfWNAHSucmZwnDmRQtGbtTDB9ERAvBR3V4IzQ3EIdF
 iccAtsbVl7shkfQrcSI/yTXckgp6Rs6eLpMvEGadEnGUFGSXZD05dMKd6sEQR5eJ+XGn8QQXCpkl8
 9KlMCpw2QoCy4+tecj14XGTvc00QW5JVi0Sf1PL8DjVpoAdzUH6fMCKuodAaWIDLUP0rY/gqMcbWC
 Kj2m9b2KK35c+ReBIfrMWjMR91DTP6tw0ynZkfqHu7GAsmeYMcwVQa2KKeLgrBf5grS5vZSZqx/Cj
 IIbT/rxooWO7AA==;
Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 16:26:58 +0200
Message-Id: <86v7tpaiq5.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?=
 =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Tue, 04 Feb 2025 09:46:32 +0100)
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN> <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---)

> From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>,  76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 09:46:32 +0100
> 
> martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN> writes:
> 
> >> It seems C-x 5 o only works among root and children now. An interesting
> >> question would be which way we want it to work. I mean when there are
> >> children. In which way would one switch to the next root frame?
> >
> > The same way we do that on GUIs now.  Switch to any frame unless
> > it has 'no-other-frame' set:
> >
> > ‘no-other-frame’
> >      If this is non-‘nil’, then this frame is not eligible as candidate
> >      for the functions ‘next-frame’, ‘previous-frame’ (*note Finding All
> >      Frames::) and ‘other-frame’, see *note (emacs)Frame Commands::.
> >
> > martin
> 
> This patch fixes it for me:

Ehm.. wrong patch?  You attached the patch for the min-width thingy.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 14:25:45 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 09:25:45 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43283 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfJs1-0005Av-CC
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 09:25:45 -0500
Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:38006)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tfJrx-0005Aa-A9
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 09:25:41 -0500
Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e])
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfJrr-0006E0-HW; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 09:25:35 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org;
 s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:
 Date; bh=gF/lF1s0AVukdfIyLIz2EXSV82o+/bQWjmg+FQ9yARw=; b=jtukvA6XHsTyVavvhmJ8
 TmAKgeDuXIEDiWuLzgoulfhETwrHAHWl+0Uzgg/i4HotJRjywUxdrCAmMuxxya8jFmM9RFA07lVSn
 aibyT58pc8tV8SDKy73KikcsN/rc6SCSsfzEAteBX9/zx1wruG2YQJ04QVjVHHD7d5g0q8MypBLie
 uEUtrdGzVOyGtY3/Kqjie4JyzqdAjfOl5DpX/XqEGn/nAncc7EUk5NG6m8qOygTPcttQYZlkl9NHH
 SfcCWxoxDyVrpwr8ElsInevql1Q8ovbolQmNDBwvsvxpGsg3sXCpTEnRMRwT+72ddxgCKruRqKGKI
 0dfo1hWnRjmLJg==;
Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 16:25:27 +0200
Message-Id: <86wme5aiso.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN> (message from
 martin rudalics on Tue, 4 Feb 2025 09:09:48 +0100)
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---)

> Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2025 09:09:48 +0100
> Cc: 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> From: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
> 
>  > It seems C-x 5 o only works among root and children now. An interesting
>  > question would be which way we want it to work. I mean when there are
>  > children. In which way would one switch to the next root frame?
> 
> The same way we do that on GUIs now.

Maybe I'm missing something, but "C-x 5 o" works for me on GUI frames
as expected.  If I repeat the recipe of this bug in a GUI session,
there's no problem, and "C-x 5 o" switches to the other frame.

> Switch to any frame unless it has 'no-other-frame' set:
> 
> ‘no-other-frame’
>       If this is non-‘nil’, then this frame is not eligible as candidate
>       for the functions ‘next-frame’, ‘previous-frame’ (*note Finding All
>       Frames::) and ‘other-frame’, see *note (emacs)Frame Commands::.

How does this come into play in the recipe I posted.  Those were
ordinary frames, and I hope 'no-other-frame' is by default nil.

What am I missing?




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 08:46:44 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 03:46:44 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42561 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfEZv-0007v8-TY
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 03:46:44 -0500
Received: from mail-wm1-x32b.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::32b]:60650)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tfEZt-0007ui-2V
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 03:46:42 -0500
Received: by mail-wm1-x32b.google.com with SMTP id
 5b1f17b1804b1-436202dd7f6so61526075e9.0
 for <76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 00:46:41 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1738658794; x=1739263594; darn=debbugs.gnu.org;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=KkcqZ8Jk2ZRePfelANVbo0QpK68lMtel6oOhLrL1iKA=;
 b=eoSXndTk9OikZ3UoIK8dqzzTFMxVznFEzxLEnT1P5awT2o54txLxDsiEE/Y+2WWG4t
 nNAp22HJhmbFlZwyx+NeVzU0N8yxijXSKhVcnmbaRzutwxpyf8wDp1ku4+PpN9z62paR
 wZLgUi0FuNNwrAprsBxChxK3dxAtpF96XtMtYeC7byMNHMmOVHhytdLONl6EskcTfaOZ
 1PcjqIVLqxCrDzK/lNUcNWyfQ5/ZAUPwJCl1qpkk72DRnAEeUcsWxIwM8FAArj5ceWF4
 ArFOtNg3+3k29pFQKa6YeV3gAZwdlXG5ThLbvDxVBuMB3D3TYD/KFiIcwWeTpMU6dwQ0
 aUVQ==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1738658794; x=1739263594;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date
 :message-id:reply-to;
 bh=KkcqZ8Jk2ZRePfelANVbo0QpK68lMtel6oOhLrL1iKA=;
 b=RKS/+PBKzf5t+MY8Q/5/bYOKz328pCmaneOdWFlNKsHpF+owfo2v1UmymRvvfzZDBc
 1JaRYZbUUZuz64+K1Cl+eBTi/iiOfyBqhhORkrV/Lpp3lOirvYqz5yps/5JR/LcFBp1x
 maIdLq2haCC5u/hS/WWhcSSYmCS6OlavVm0v2iVmt9femjL4xzhAe2/hcQ5ihf/3BSFL
 Vee28yrDFP0fEvMXC4j+XEjJjQNYaJX31MDVmxE28S57Hg8b950foqJbBh0TFBAUQ+cR
 /ZcX7yoiemw3kP6vqBIKT+6bsiooOp4U0MRriafvsHtChJZrnNP/mg0BmGNB3GxmQKYT
 Qo1A==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1;
 AJvYcCXXuKWvh6Lb3rpH2E+31/BoCoWEm9wBTnFi1JfX3aD9YMkmMeOhDVES5bLyJB+uWGZ87a04hA==@debbugs.gnu.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YxtfvvRdBcasunJI4JZ5AXS9GBJz7dm6NMPF6JkocWd9QPLa3Y+
 j0v9tm2RKWAc7V5MhJdhnyKKWZF5bqYnO1hCSyd9QkfjYTgjAMJNlMYBlA==
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncuHrqofVNZpkVdPAMbaqwQozkiUxQgOKfVRSLVdNYlQCBCoDhgJheErPZwsX42
 1Re1DQlyczmx9v6GCEQr2vKTbA3xnJWZJvi7HDT9L2bizFOPc79i4MnNP1bQ/Wmg3hv8Mpuv3Q7
 PD1O0DerniYUv73KokfBf9QRfSyU2jEaBoPArq9j0/NaZ11y48B127Q0IBiitaPzJ9A1a+u5wQJ
 Z8/+1tnTsb0UPbSt1kpBpHSft27EN1LfY3SScJC4GAN2RvO+ELm8orZ1S9/LRnWgJFRnt/9O1xI
 mMXLbvOOrb0aaDhsRnoaCbtiyQixC+xeP360CubEdlo/mxUEBQD0WuDEEh0rjE2nemGOgXr2dxu
 Gd/1NWXs5w/5mnrcdD6SKkGoe
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IGureCORpE04w3Z009wrvj7WiiuK8YJHOneF/7iD6QplmR0+HfMFtBLBreNAEAyW6FkrfzYYA==
X-Received: by 2002:a05:600c:1e21:b0:436:1b96:7072 with SMTP id
 5b1f17b1804b1-438dc3af7a5mr241510785e9.5.1738658794185; 
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 00:46:34 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pro2 (p200300e0b705a00058413e49c0284fb2.dip0.t-ipconnect.de.
 [2003:e0:b705:a000:5841:3e49:c028:4fb2])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 5b1f17b1804b1-438dcc27125sm215301035e9.15.2025.02.04.00.46.33
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Tue, 04 Feb 2025 00:46:33 -0800 (PST)
From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
In-Reply-To: <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN> (martin rudalics's
 message of "Tue, 4 Feb 2025 09:09:48 +0100")
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
 <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 04 Feb 2025 09:46:32 +0100
Message-ID: <m27c66xfkn.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=-=-="
X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

--=-=-=
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN> writes:

>> It seems C-x 5 o only works among root and children now. An interesting
>> question would be which way we want it to work. I mean when there are
>> children. In which way would one switch to the next root frame?
>
> The same way we do that on GUIs now.  Switch to any frame unless
> it has 'no-other-frame' set:
>
> =E2=80=98no-other-frame=E2=80=99
>      If this is non-=E2=80=98nil=E2=80=99, then this frame is not eligibl=
e as candidate
>      for the functions =E2=80=98next-frame=E2=80=99, =E2=80=98previous-fr=
ame=E2=80=99 (*note Finding All
>      Frames::) and =E2=80=98other-frame=E2=80=99, see *note (emacs)Frame =
Commands::.
>
> martin

This patch fixes it for me:


--=-=-=
Content-Type: text/x-patch
Content-Disposition: attachment;
 filename=0001-Fix-min-width-display-spec-handling-bug-76014.patch

From 711f21b659633fb05b81f43f3e81391e5988fe3a Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001
From: =?UTF-8?q?Gerd=20M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2025 06:09:52 +0100
Subject: [PATCH] Fix min-width display spec handling (bug#76014)

* src/xdisp.c (display_min_width): Take into account that the output may
already be longer than the specified min-width.
---
 src/xdisp.c | 12 +++++++-----
 1 file changed, 7 insertions(+), 5 deletions(-)

diff --git a/src/xdisp.c b/src/xdisp.c
index ed4a5564427..72311362035 100644
--- a/src/xdisp.c
+++ b/src/xdisp.c
@@ -5650,7 +5650,7 @@ get_display_property (ptrdiff_t charpos, Lisp_Object prop, Lisp_Object object)
 
 /* Handle 'display' property '(min-width (WIDTH))' at CHARPOS in OBJECT.
    OBJECT can be a buffer (or nil, which means the current buffer) or a
-   string.  MIN_WIDTH is the value of min-width spec that we expect to
+   string.  WIDTH_SPEC is the value of min-width spec that we expect to
    process.  */
 static void
 display_min_width (struct it *it, ptrdiff_t charpos,
@@ -5696,8 +5696,9 @@ display_min_width (struct it *it, ptrdiff_t charpos,
                  a stretch that ends beyond the visible portion of the
                  window if we are truncating screen lines.  If we are
                  requested to do that, some Lisp program went awry.  */
-	      if (!(it->line_wrap == TRUNCATE
-		    && it->current_x + width > it->last_visible_x))
+	      if (width > 0
+		  && !(it->line_wrap == TRUNCATE
+		       && it->current_x + width > it->last_visible_x))
 		w = list1 (make_int (width));
 	    }
 	  else
@@ -5708,8 +5709,9 @@ display_min_width (struct it *it, ptrdiff_t charpos,
 					  NULL, true, NULL);
 	      width -= (it->current_x - it->min_width_start) /
 		FRAME_COLUMN_WIDTH (it->f);
-	      if (!(it->line_wrap == TRUNCATE
-		    && it->current_x + width > it->last_visible_x))
+	      if (width > 0
+		  && !(it->line_wrap == TRUNCATE
+		       && it->current_x + width > it->last_visible_x))
 		w = make_int (width);
 	    }
 
-- 
2.48.1


--=-=-=--




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 4 Feb 2025 08:09:58 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Feb 04 03:09:58 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:42488 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tfE0M-00066A-Hb
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 03:09:58 -0500
Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.19]:52419)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <rudalics@HIDDEN>) id 1tfE0J-00065s-Tw
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 04 Feb 2025 03:09:56 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmx.at;
 s=s31663417; t=1738656589; x=1739261389; i=rudalics@HIDDEN;
 bh=HTUyr7Z2afktjDvkKvczg+oAIJTCyKgfnDszDNx125c=;
 h=X-UI-Sender-Class:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version:Subject:To:Cc:
 References:From:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:
 Content-Transfer-Encoding:cc:content-transfer-encoding:
 content-type:date:from:message-id:mime-version:reply-to:subject:
 to;
 b=ATlHXk7NhojRLzKmJZuWrn5cETFyprOJXnscdN8UsipvA3JKHWZvLY4KZJerwxKS
 bBO7OyC5zz3wEOJF9e2ZnR8Lk0XZMD7xt5FsBgrRgHs4MD4hX3lWcK15Wm/IVDhgN
 /8pQTbQvvKgNgS3FSm790aOfdkZAeOysMIutPEnI5LITnBVFpE8evofsT44PNF9LR
 CJJmTsOnW7hw/QswjFDl8faAXgPeGeW0SVDe6Jemtk6s6BqDJ1vu6Pwh6ZCIsoctn
 8ukblF2EaPWMa/1Dvf1jQni+zDfwprZB9R5vLjfSsshSgloHtixQdZz3JdBOziiVk
 S4z6okuZGiXMxQcwMg==
X-UI-Sender-Class: 724b4f7f-cbec-4199-ad4e-598c01a50d3a
Received: from [192.168.31.113] ([212.95.5.16]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx004
 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1M4JqV-1tewt21xXV-009UDF; Tue, 04
 Feb 2025 09:09:49 +0100
Message-ID: <414e0484-0ad6-4fed-9c13-d2f7b463cb8c@HIDDEN>
Date: Tue, 4 Feb 2025 09:09:48 +0100
MIME-Version: 1.0
User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
To: =?UTF-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>,
 Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
Content-Language: en-US
From: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:HCMhdB9i31FM779HNqwvJIfdzJKqCVhG5dYDtFpcS7qChthmKbP
 OgkJnOIjoSmxnkjfJ7QfcTmaN2/avVSVb00VI6ZoWmRoEYf72Hw3Piohn1s24Elv0yYVA7N
 QBjbjVTbi1lEB1IFVXYVz8CLf2m0WALNtzD28rqURPmRaBdyJ4V5ElvKnHAOJ1kHRF5acH1
 r6oJ9PmQt3hkB+TQdU2jg==
X-Spam-Flag: NO
UI-OutboundReport: notjunk:1;M01:P0:x4n07QAEEHU=;d5HOdizHzk+/0ScJmXoHjsMW2Au
 SoiNh5aShjy5z/eH2tRI8SIjvjS8ZWoLU+sEixROMorUR7C3LpM1BW7jktD27taPmlzIkZsae
 lgt6Lk67r5dC9zmqTCHzXSi2rojFyZvgh08A/KGBayoa9nFNLgdLM/Fhqe3Vb6GUoOx2lSZ2T
 mFWqXSJlrP7HA8zYn4S4PLPmE1Dp695iwd0hfYvwTqoO47H317/0lWskw7nghRcxZLf1r5BHG
 j6BIcB3c1C1gze8mPJ/3YXx3PlyrApBShXfM3rb6rL0bnZ7GXbXAAmBBANwZK8ZWWp/KH5H3j
 CcDtVE+G9Vo+PBmgR26ESRp13kFv3Q1vImGP1PHP1fJaHNY9dAiBjMqX5YDApoN3qS2x8XyQY
 dhiCcF6rWT1YnfQz85iJQB5Ygr/wx+tBz9NT/QBSax61o3/a6XPqijfddZsUDObXsxLQO6xok
 c7enY9314qLLrK/QfGrrgsIPfRl//KGIEUr5vWTOitvUnwgs8yxadQdVLe6HmrMnMFlKSTWgp
 JC68qbwLjQ+3b/1H55alDGqH7s1Zzsg1ho4rBnGMTxfk7FZeuCYr/HjEXzcDM7Oy+3LiT5I9o
 UrD3QS5qkDTko4LzLI9+tnukjKnJ3FinFPS6S9zvRxRpjF3WnXrtTPgnYCyuYSXnsWcuZhl/R
 t/Tr9VOJEctd6AM9p6X7tOHIwL1iey8dGe7SFJA0bXxO9Y0YNW6QBHY2nFEXjdwd3bviNjfH2
 Zw7CsSZ9gOV0ZxQ81adsQ/+DS10YlbTxYSkEkVxP91jEczmOk2qWgMcAuJBvdaRw0M3vcH60b
 eMdNwVi6EQ4d792TNBp0JIQbFeC5mgnnZ8XS2MZF1um5KKPPjNNPOuX+890xghsV4bR4o9aIK
 E5crS6o9M3uSiutmpQolJzyE+rcGF14myoABSgCyGxzU/T11qsmyfzisSuCzz3Pg3GL/ZPWXp
 FxXr9BBiL/NwhMpuSnR2sCMxZDUzIFCr2KpYIHnBYf7VqUWgCFGTasgJj0OzY8jPrDNn1Puta
 YLAAVTEGkfdAGP+Eq1We4eON7m5d3Wl5xUYHMKYnGZ5mkl/pQnZY4sk3u+Z6hia3BCsReUhfM
 AXRaztL1v+kSAWfhBY6QNhCQkokxG2/A7WTMYXi2DPBRRu6dBYI2ZAkMoOnLJVLKDWGpLa70d
 5PAmpZmErIU9+sOj+mIKMYoCI6gVMoiLr3W1PQ9wt7+k1QHd7TyXXUQYlxNrrGFVLkPwBiJlW
 5ZPVKTlghI6LLBvYJKLqDVlVvhf58zkvOBAu1rb6G/L1KpmsgiHZGOMruoIVpbc1ICZRuXmaN
 aJdknf3yczrjg3UbhATgSC2Y98lKWDOowARcaPMYdBUAwQ=
X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-)
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==




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Feb 2025 20:05:52 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Feb 03 15:05:52 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41402 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tf2hb-0005fg-UF
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 03 Feb 2025 15:05:52 -0500
Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:47984)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tf2hZ-0005fR-Ra
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 03 Feb 2025 15:05:50 -0500
Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e])
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tf2hT-0004Na-Ux; Mon, 03 Feb 2025 15:05:44 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org;
 s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:
 Date; bh=VIj5mfUUrOVcl9jl6KNf4mq+2TX6/Xp+CdN4jgqVclQ=; b=aHPB9Kk8432sIDaW0Wkx
 7L7xe5ZTKpQlNP3X47r+nBU4wh4dmq3lfLNFdTlaEigMkgE2E0tyOC6p1bMPdTMOkc5/9lHg+vVmO
 MukgJ1wuAT0VkrKUHPzhwZzgJoC033BLUSFII0lBW38pSUdBxhPXW6p7tuYBc1upAKiIgFZIuTo/+
 9/FCplotS40qeUfO45Wd1rI7a2vfdU6dqRVJeLrj1QKEmfB/e+3st2m3Nexi9rU2dixIsSb6GBe47
 PH9DpRq8dLXblmDajNgZBV1f1O+1EWp5TOFa0sL8P/3B1a4E6t/t4qN8bLcgHvgAiMLnTA6W+RYuW
 6CfAogVIycTMzQ==;
Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2025 22:05:40 +0200
Message-Id: <86frkubxpn.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Gerd =?utf-8?Q?M?=
 =?utf-8?Q?=C3=B6llmann?= on Mon, 03 Feb 2025 20:20:51 +0100)
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: rudalics@HIDDEN, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---)

> From: Gerd Möllmann <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
> Cc: 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org,  martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>
> Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2025 20:20:51 +0100
> 
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
> 
> > To reproduce:
> >
> >   emacs -Q -nw
> >   C-x 5 f src/xdisp.c RET
> >   C-x 5 o
> >
> > The last step should have switched back to frame F1 showing the
> > *scratch* buffer, but instead it does nothing, showing the frame F2 as
> > before.
> >
> > Perhaps related, "M-x select-frame-by-name" insists that the only
> > frame to switch to is the currently selected frame F2; if you try to
> > type "F1" at the prompt, you get "No match".
> >
> > This report is from GNU/Linux, but I also see this on MS-Windows, so
> > it is not platform-specific, it seems.
> 
> I see this too on macOS, with Martin's latest diff installed.
> 
> It seems C-x 5 o only works among root and children now. An interesting
> question would be which way we want it to work. I mean when there are
> children. In which way would one switch to the next root frame?

I think it should work in the order of next-frame.




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at 76031) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Feb 2025 19:21:01 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Feb 03 14:21:01 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41281 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tf20C-0003Yq-U2
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 03 Feb 2025 14:21:01 -0500
Received: from mail-ed1-x529.google.com ([2a00:1450:4864:20::529]:54734)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>)
 id 1tf20A-0003Yb-SQ
 for 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 03 Feb 2025 14:20:59 -0500
Received: by mail-ed1-x529.google.com with SMTP id
 4fb4d7f45d1cf-5dca468c5e4so2819663a12.1
 for <76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Mon, 03 Feb 2025 11:20:58 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1738610453; x=1739215253; darn=debbugs.gnu.org;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to;
 bh=fQce4ItlbLRbneGMYzcWsYhba1OTQyRcDaxd9ctGkE8=;
 b=bwoXkVc5iVkK3axmtmoMupANx85ZLUvHBGVrw6Xjsx0VuuuWJDuQX/WAt6leOB4Tsg
 A5tmXfHimd1DLp3ngtVXWZBGclCnDn0Nt81hFD/zoz99RerLVKL9n8nNCl8NjTMezR1D
 f2P0Rk0I0NHl4/6N6lNY53qirfFx5nsN9PkEB5nkqWh8AdCNTnT19J9DBdFbJvH9D/Lf
 /TNrbeY5EljcGk6Fmq3veZb+26ArTcgzaiIFaqB7qKkpVWwm6jVRqnIYDUKqvHLRJYqn
 lMHCqcSSjphBsGIC6iCoDJtdr/BY1v7TpVWbvoY7+TBX5BpDDnwAior6HLfvrkrdSVMg
 52jQ==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
 d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1738610453; x=1739215253;
 h=mime-version:user-agent:message-id:date:references:in-reply-to
 :subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date
 :message-id:reply-to;
 bh=fQce4ItlbLRbneGMYzcWsYhba1OTQyRcDaxd9ctGkE8=;
 b=qINDvUkAlUgarGyfWSczYO3wWijImjMjaBdjPuWZmnRG2OOkLufwXcICfDDi0B6E7y
 +AcSW77u1HSYFogPpMW/puAzmvwbT556Rz29N7aXreBTTO/MMtxD+fe2JknVxJEv6Lbh
 akVjInsi0xYoz9EUzENlte2/4rUEl+0oVRLd3oUXfcp7ZCu5a+cjqzOv7Gc0kaIGUpaa
 Kpuxj/Xifqbo7cSj2Uycq+7c8+uAYE7ErGT4sihvLbZdTYwe/gMEM7NKmdgM7xSaRvKa
 TthyoYKMpxU4ZeguWnbz7wlAHAV8dRB6yX/tobkZAk3GXWXdyNj8rdYzj0vlU6D6Mmis
 k6EQ==
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YxmfAtKWN2HGS5v3IXVo7OH9kRx4b0j2iBRW7FP6JU05JlwrlFF
 fH545X7Eb4G0QigT2lUMW+CtUl5RU4yKU4epKZ/XKnC/DgsMgi8lCCX5sQ==
X-Gm-Gg: ASbGncuuVchkCf5zJ2LQ7yp72pu/f5K0AIke/5NKCsiUuprSyTPkexOLi6QR8vWDYfz
 ojpYFqNZ+2UDE2Zbf72xLklU77k+3zvl+c8blM8/fqLaSGxaOn0YnQHrl6DZ+ML1Upktfh9acXl
 wI22PjWKRGZoHT3CNGY6pJlbIrXBnyAeSG822RMjeBf3ZDZHGeG9yvlrNhnA94dLiGYcHvxzyMV
 O8KIKcK6AFXCRN96c68KObtbfJwwpx/JcTwgXp381WZTqOk7YzJcyA9wm1QHOIzUT1bQgse+maF
 RFxUZyhAVWwNuQPD5ToJb5ILiXwhd3uZl48EaCeF92WSjgQ+fAg8IVhVggcqKsw0eWdsEYuXK6S
 0EwVSNYrmkIjrhGmjUFJnNDKU
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IGbaKu24BxVii5/ytMnApSJka/qVVpuvj8ayIWayQmKnZAqMrr85wAB9O1EIoaF3S2/grMa2A==
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6402:84d:b0:5d0:bdc1:75df with SMTP id
 4fb4d7f45d1cf-5dc5efebbb2mr23456515a12.24.1738610452532; 
 Mon, 03 Feb 2025 11:20:52 -0800 (PST)
Received: from pro2 (p200300e0b7285e007cabc7148d4ef104.dip0.t-ipconnect.de.
 [2003:e0:b728:5e00:7cab:c714:8d4e:f104])
 by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id
 4fb4d7f45d1cf-5dc724aa09bsm8005733a12.58.2025.02.03.11.20.51
 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256);
 Mon, 03 Feb 2025 11:20:52 -0800 (PST)
From: =?utf-8?Q?Gerd_M=C3=B6llmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
Subject: Re: bug#76031: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
In-Reply-To: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Mon, 03 Feb
 2025 19:23:06 +0200")
References: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN>
Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2025 20:20:51 +0100
Message-ID: <m2a5b27s30.fsf@HIDDEN>
User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 76031
Cc: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>, 76031 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:

> To reproduce:
>
>   emacs -Q -nw
>   C-x 5 f src/xdisp.c RET
>   C-x 5 o
>
> The last step should have switched back to frame F1 showing the
> *scratch* buffer, but instead it does nothing, showing the frame F2 as
> before.
>
> Perhaps related, "M-x select-frame-by-name" insists that the only
> frame to switch to is the currently selected frame F2; if you try to
> type "F1" at the prompt, you get "No match".
>
> This report is from GNU/Linux, but I also see this on MS-Windows, so
> it is not platform-specific, it seems.

I see this too on macOS, with Martin's latest diff installed.

It seems C-x 5 o only works among root and children now. An interesting
question would be which way we want it to work. I mean when there are
children. In which way would one switch to the next root frame?




Information forwarded to bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.

Message received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org:


Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 3 Feb 2025 17:23:32 +0000
From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Feb 03 12:23:32 2025
Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:41048 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
	by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
	(envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>)
	id 1tf0AW-0000B7-9X
	for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 03 Feb 2025 12:23:32 -0500
Received: from lists.gnu.org ([2001:470:142::17]:50244)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tf0AU-0000Ap-4z
 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 03 Feb 2025 12:23:30 -0500
Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10])
 by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tf0AM-0005lT-NU
 for bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN; Mon, 03 Feb 2025 12:23:23 -0500
Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e])
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1tf0AM-0004Tc-Fr
 for bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN; Mon, 03 Feb 2025 12:23:22 -0500
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org;
 s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:Subject:To:From:Date:in-reply-to:
 references; bh=o6oQ4I5h4Z1nhuhEjKBAxNgbl3KIwuq3P18UY42IAOI=; b=JsfFYRudc3yzXu
 WU1tyQGvGNGqiVhse8HlIpTBAUKCzit/LEWUBMvh/KkKP5y2g3L6L+63pUXXlwHHuXHjq2IqU8X6Z
 I4p8SOBbS8IJeLley/wt3haoF+Vxalm0HBiOsMa8kitt5nLrQ605mK5WpPCKZqG/B89MXfD6pslm/
 YfirBHSnoPBS8x9WKvqR+rfLasZkWgPAUCVVVk7lvAHR3puFKSDYKq1fPBoBjD8wLuHVuIJ/jVbsD
 RXhHVAR1rB/XZ9TFhNGXTHjA0+Ue6O2lMg81LV2VEQcQxOKrDmEJyVRVnE0zm6QmfUsVjgS2RS9jw
 eJlU1RyuBgxU3NOAXdbg==;
Date: Mon, 03 Feb 2025 19:23:06 +0200
Message-Id: <86msf3aqo5.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN
Subject: 31.0.50; Switching frames on TTY display doesn't work
X-Debbugs-Cc: martin rudalics <rudalics@HIDDEN>, Gerd =?iso-8859-1?Q?M=F6l?=
 =?iso-8859-1?Q?lmann?= <gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Spam-Score: -0.0 (/)
X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/>
List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, 
 <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>
X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-)

To reproduce:

  emacs -Q -nw
  C-x 5 f src/xdisp.c RET
  C-x 5 o

The last step should have switched back to frame F1 showing the
*scratch* buffer, but instead it does nothing, showing the frame F2 as
before.

Perhaps related, "M-x select-frame-by-name" insists that the only
frame to switch to is the currently selected frame F2; if you try to
type "F1" at the prompt, you get "No match".

This report is from GNU/Linux, but I also see this on MS-Windows, so
it is not platform-specific, it seems.

In GNU Emacs 31.0.50 (build 145, x86_64-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version
 3.24.33, cairo version 1.16.0) of 2025-02-03 built on
 maintain0p.gnu.org
Repository revision: 1639ad2814ae100c9f878a1388eb9ffc9d208b07
Repository branch: master
System Description: Trisquel GNU/Linux Aramo (11.0.1)

Configured using:
 'configure --with-gif=ifavailable --with-tiff=ifavailable
 --with-jpeg=ifavailable --with-xpm=ifavailable
 --without-native-compilation --enable-checking=yes,glyphs 'CFLAGS=-O2
 -g3''

Configured features:
ACL CAIRO DBUS FREETYPE GIF GLIB GMP GNUTLS GPM GSETTINGS HARFBUZZ JPEG
LCMS2 LIBOTF LIBSELINUX LIBSYSTEMD LIBXML2 M17N_FLT MODULES NOTIFY
INOTIFY PDUMPER PNG RSVG SECCOMP SOUND SQLITE3 THREADS TIFF
TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS WEBP X11 XDBE XIM XINERAMA XINPUT2 XPM XRANDR GTK3
ZLIB

Important settings:
  value of $LC_ALL: en_US.UTF-8
  value of $LANG: en_US.UTF-8
  locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix

Major mode: C/*l

Minor modes in effect:
  bug-reference-prog-mode: t
  tooltip-mode: t
  global-eldoc-mode: t
  show-paren-mode: t
  electric-indent-mode: t
  mouse-wheel-mode: t
  tool-bar-mode: t
  menu-bar-mode: t
  file-name-shadow-mode: t
  global-font-lock-mode: t
  font-lock-mode: t
  blink-cursor-mode: t
  minibuffer-regexp-mode: t
  line-number-mode: t
  indent-tabs-mode: t
  transient-mark-mode: t
  auto-composition-mode: t
  auto-encryption-mode: t
  auto-compression-mode: t
  abbrev-mode: t

Load-path shadows:
None found.

Features:
(shadow sort mail-extr emacsbug message mailcap yank-media puny dired
dired-loaddefs rfc822 mml mml-sec password-cache epa derived epg rfc6068
epg-config gnus-util text-property-search mm-decode mm-bodies mm-encode
mail-parse rfc2231 mailabbrev gmm-utils mailheader sendmail rfc2047
rfc2045 ietf-drums mm-util mail-prsvr mail-utils vc-git diff-mode
track-changes easy-mmode files-x vc vc-dispatcher bug-reference
thingatpt cc-mode cc-fonts cc-guess cc-menus cc-cmds cc-styles cc-align
cc-engine cc-vars cc-defs time-date subr-x cl-loaddefs cl-lib term/xterm
xterm byte-opt gv bytecomp byte-compile rmc iso-transl tooltip cconv
eldoc paren electric uniquify ediff-hook vc-hooks lisp-float-type
elisp-mode mwheel term/x-win x-win term/common-win x-dnd touch-screen
tool-bar dnd fontset image regexp-opt fringe tabulated-list replace
newcomment text-mode lisp-mode prog-mode register page tab-bar menu-bar
rfn-eshadow isearch easymenu timer select scroll-bar mouse jit-lock
font-lock syntax font-core term/tty-colors frame minibuffer nadvice seq
simple cl-generic indonesian philippine cham georgian utf-8-lang
misc-lang vietnamese tibetan thai tai-viet lao korean japanese eucjp-ms
cp51932 hebrew greek romanian slovak czech european ethiopic indian
cyrillic chinese composite emoji-zwj charscript charprop case-table
epa-hook jka-cmpr-hook help abbrev obarray oclosure cl-preloaded button
loaddefs theme-loaddefs faces cus-face macroexp files window
text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env code-pages mule
custom widget keymap hashtable-print-readable backquote threads dbusbind
inotify lcms2 dynamic-setting system-font-setting font-render-setting
cairo gtk x-toolkit xinput2 x multi-tty move-toolbar
make-network-process tty-child-frames emacs)

Memory information:
((conses 16 88939 11577) (symbols 48 8846 0) (strings 32 23202 1908)
 (string-bytes 1 728563) (vectors 16 12123)
 (vector-slots 8 109442 5360) (floats 8 32 346) (intervals 56 3766 0)
 (buffers 984 11))





Acknowledgement sent to Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>:
New bug report received and forwarded. Copy sent to rudalics@HIDDEN, gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN. Full text available.
Report forwarded to rudalics@HIDDEN, gerd.moellmann@HIDDEN, bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:
bug#76031; Package emacs. Full text available.
Please note: This is a static page, with minimal formatting, updated once a day.
Click here to see this page with the latest information and nicer formatting.
Last modified: Wed, 5 Feb 2025 20:30:02 UTC

GNU bug tracking system
Copyright (C) 1999 Darren O. Benham, 1997 nCipher Corporation Ltd, 1994-97 Ian Jackson.