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Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2025 14:17:43 +0300
Message-Id: <86tt6f1608.fsf@HIDDEN>
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: Dmitry Gutov <dmitry@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <d2950a68-e891-4596-85ce-3b4590c27f33@HIDDEN> (message from
Dmitry Gutov on Tue, 22 Apr 2025 20:04:12 +0300)
Subject: Re: bug#77974: Manual updates for the VC-aware project backend
References: <8822f72a-bca8-438b-b7b1-e6c03f03f53c@HIDDEN>
<86msc82ysw.fsf@HIDDEN> <d2950a68-e891-4596-85ce-3b4590c27f33@HIDDEN>
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> Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2025 20:04:12 +0300
> Cc: 77974 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> From: Dmitry Gutov <dmitry@HIDDEN>
>
> >> +@node VC-Aware Project Backend
> >
> > Index entry leading to this node is missing here. Think about a
> > reader who wants to find this quickly without knowing the exact name
> > of the node.
>
> Any suggestions for what it should say?
Something simple and obvious. I'd start with
@cindex VC-aware project backend
@cindex project backend, VC-aware
> >> +This backend is used by default.
> >
> > This sentence confused me. What does it mean for a backend to be used
> > by default? This should be explained, I think, if we consider this
> > backend important enough to be described.
>
> Used out of the box.
Aren't other backends available out of the box? If not, I'd say
This backend is part of Emacs and is enabled by default. (Other
backend may need installation of add-on packages and their proper
configuration.)
> >> +@defopt project-vc-include-untracked
> >> +``untracked'' files are considered to be part of the project. To change
> > ^^^^^^^^^^^
> > Sentences should start with capital letters.
> >
> > Also, when you introduce new terminology, it is best to use @dfn
> > instead of literal quotes, and also have an indexing command for that
> > terminology.
>
> "Untracked" is a fairly common term to the VC subsystem and VC systems
> in general.
That's beside the point (you don't explain what it means, presumably
because that is known well enough). The important part is that this
is the first (or only) place where it is mentioned in the Emacs
manual.
> >> +Each element is either a base file name or a glob pattern for such.
> >> +
> >> +Example values: @samp{".dir-locals.el"}, @samp{"package.json"},
> >> +@samp{"requirements.txt}, @samp{"*.gemspec"}.
> >
> > Since these are file names, it is better to use @file markup and lose
> > the quotes.
>
> Not exactly file names -- they are globs. The last one contains a
> wildcard, for example.
>
> Should @file still be used?
Yes. Glob patterns are file-name specifications, so @file is still
the best markup.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77974; Package emacs.
Full text available.
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Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2025 20:04:12 +0300
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Subject: Re: bug#77974: Manual updates for the VC-aware project backend
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
References: <8822f72a-bca8-438b-b7b1-e6c03f03f53c@HIDDEN>
<86msc82ysw.fsf@HIDDEN>
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From: Dmitry Gutov <dmitry@HIDDEN>
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On 22/04/2025 14:58, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
>> Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2025 00:51:30 +0300
>> From: Dmitry Gutov <dmitry@HIDDEN>
>>
>> Here are some proposed updates, which create a new node for this backend
>> and list some of the options that were until now not mentioned in the
>> manual.
>>
>> Feedback welcome on the general structure (do we want the new node in
>> that place?) and the phrasing of the new text as well.
>
> Thanks.
>
> This node should probably be the last in its parent node, not the
> first one, because it describes a specific project backend while the
> rest of the section describes backend-agnostic features.
All right.
> I'm also not sure why these 5 user options are deemed important enough
> to be in the manual, while the other 14 defined in project.el aren't.
These are the options for the backend, which this aims to document.
Got a request to have 'project-vc-extra-root-markers' documented:
https://github.com/buzztaiki/project-rootfile.el/issues/17#issuecomment-2816505984
Most of the other options added affect which files are contained in a
project. The existing manual mentions project-vc-include-untracked
already, and it seemed to make sense to add project-vc-ignores and
project-vc-merge-submodules which also affect the fileset (and should be
more popular than the former, IMO).
> E.g., is project-vc-merge-submodules (which seems to be specific to
> Git, but its name doesn't say so?) really important enough to be in
> the manual?
I don't really mind dropping this one, except for the fact that it's
also among the options that affects the fileset.
Being Git-specific seems unimportant (99% of all projects use Git), but
being specific to submodules might make it too specialized, I don't know.
>> +@node VC-Aware Project Backend
>
> Index entry leading to this node is missing here. Think about a
> reader who wants to find this quickly without knowing the exact name
> of the node.
Any suggestions for what it should say?
>> +This backend is used by default.
>
> This sentence confused me. What does it mean for a backend to be used
> by default? This should be explained, I think, if we consider this
> backend important enough to be described.
Used out of the box. Without extra configuration necessary. Before any
third-package uses the hook variable.
Which of the explanations sounds better?
>> +@defopt project-vc-include-untracked
>> +``untracked'' files are considered to be part of the project. To change
> ^^^^^^^^^^^
> Sentences should start with capital letters.
>
> Also, when you introduce new terminology, it is best to use @dfn
> instead of literal quotes, and also have an indexing command for that
> terminology.
"Untracked" is a fairly common term to the VC subsystem and VC systems
in general. It doesn't seem like it has a description in the manual, though.
>> +Each element is either a base file name or a glob pattern for such.
>> +
>> +Example values: @samp{".dir-locals.el"}, @samp{"package.json"},
>> +@samp{"requirements.txt}, @samp{"*.gemspec"}.
>
> Since these are file names, it is better to use @file markup and lose
> the quotes.
Not exactly file names -- they are globs. The last one contains a
wildcard, for example.
Should @file still be used?
> If you decide to install this, don't forget to update the @detailmenu
> in emacs.texi.
Thanks.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77974; Package emacs.
Full text available.
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Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2025 14:58:07 +0300
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From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: Dmitry Gutov <dmitry@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <8822f72a-bca8-438b-b7b1-e6c03f03f53c@HIDDEN> (message from
Dmitry Gutov on Tue, 22 Apr 2025 00:51:30 +0300)
Subject: Re: bug#77974: Manual updates for the VC-aware project backend
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> Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2025 00:51:30 +0300
> From: Dmitry Gutov <dmitry@HIDDEN>
>
> Here are some proposed updates, which create a new node for this backend
> and list some of the options that were until now not mentioned in the
> manual.
>
> Feedback welcome on the general structure (do we want the new node in
> that place?) and the phrasing of the new text as well.
Thanks.
This node should probably be the last in its parent node, not the
first one, because it describes a specific project backend while the
rest of the section describes backend-agnostic features.
I'm also not sure why these 5 user options are deemed important enough
to be in the manual, while the other 14 defined in project.el aren't.
E.g., is project-vc-merge-submodules (which seems to be specific to
Git, but its name doesn't say so?) really important enough to be in
the manual?
> +@node VC-Aware Project Backend
Index entry leading to this node is missing here. Think about a
reader who wants to find this quickly without knowing the exact name
of the node.
> +This backend is used by default.
This sentence confused me. What does it mean for a backend to be used
by default? This should be explained, I think, if we consider this
backend important enough to be described.
> +@defopt project-vc-include-untracked
> +``untracked'' files are considered to be part of the project. To change
^^^^^^^^^^^
Sentences should start with capital letters.
Also, when you introduce new terminology, it is best to use @dfn
instead of literal quotes, and also have an indexing command for that
terminology.
> +that, you can customize this variable to nil.
> +@end defopt
> +
> +@defopt project-vc-ignores
> +Using this variable you can add more ignore patterns to the project, to
> +exclude more files from the project's file listing. The value is a list
> +of glob strings. They can match both regular files and directories. To
> +anchor an entry to the project root, start it with @code{./}. To match
> +directories only, end it with @code{/}.
> +@end defopt
> +
> +@defopt project-vc-merge-submodules
> +By default all submodules inside a Git project are considered to be part
> +of the parent repository's project. Customize this to nil to make them
> +separate projects.
> +@end defopt
> +
> +Each element is either a base file name or a glob pattern for such.
> +
> +Example values: @samp{".dir-locals.el"}, @samp{"package.json"},
> +@samp{"requirements.txt}, @samp{"*.gemspec"}.
Since these are file names, it is better to use @file markup and lose
the quotes.
If you decide to install this, don't forget to update the @detailmenu
in emacs.texi.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77974; Package emacs.
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Mon, 21 Apr 2025 17:51:33 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------5Awgzls6RR1nHkYiefXMKJ8r" Message-ID: <8822f72a-bca8-438b-b7b1-e6c03f03f53c@HIDDEN> Date: Tue, 22 Apr 2025 00:51:30 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Content-Language: en-US To: bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN From: Dmitry Gutov <dmitry@HIDDEN> Subject: Manual updates for the VC-aware project backend Received-SPF: pass client-ip=103.168.172.146; envelope-from=dmitry@HIDDEN; helo=fout-a3-smtp.messagingengine.com X-Spam_score_int: -27 X-Spam_score: -2.8 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.8 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=0.001, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_RPBL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_SAFE_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -0.3 (/) This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------5Awgzls6RR1nHkYiefXMKJ8r Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tags: patch Here are some proposed updates, which create a new node for this backend and list some of the options that were until now not mentioned in the manual. Feedback welcome on the general structure (do we want the new node in that place?) and the phrasing of the new text as well. --------------5Awgzls6RR1nHkYiefXMKJ8r Content-Type: text/x-patch; charset=UTF-8; name="project-vc-manual-updates.diff" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="project-vc-manual-updates.diff" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 ZGlmZiAtLWdpdCBhL2RvYy9lbWFjcy9tYWludGFpbmluZy50ZXhpIGIvZG9jL2VtYWNzL21h aW50YWluaW5nLnRleGkKaW5kZXggYzc2MWRjMzNjODYuLmY2YzBjZDcxZGM0IDEwMDY0NAot LS0gYS9kb2MvZW1hY3MvbWFpbnRhaW5pbmcudGV4aQorKysgYi9kb2MvZW1hY3MvbWFpbnRh aW5pbmcudGV4aQpAQCAtMTc4MiwyMCArMTc4MiwxOCBAQCBQcm9qZWN0cwogYSBoaWVyYXJj aHkgb2YgZGlyZWN0b3JpZXM7IHRoZSB0b3AtbGV2ZWwgZGlyZWN0b3J5IG9mIHRoZSBoaWVy YXJjaHkKIGlzIGtub3duIGFzIHRoZSBAZGZue3Byb2plY3Qgcm9vdH0uCiAKLUBjaW5kZXgg cHJvamVjdCBiYWNrLWVuZAorQGNpbmRleCBwcm9qZWN0IGJhY2tlbmQKICAgV2hldGhlciBh IGdpdmVuIGRpcmVjdG9yeSBpcyBhIHJvb3Qgb2Ygc29tZSBwcm9qZWN0IGlzIGRldGVybWlu 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Dmitry Gutov <dmitry@HIDDEN>:bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN.
Full text available.bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#77974; Package emacs.
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