Received: (at 79058) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Jul 2025 11:18:10 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jul 23 07:18:10 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48829 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1ueXU9-0003fu-Re for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 23 Jul 2025 07:18:10 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:44074) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1ueXU7-0003fR-CK for 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 23 Jul 2025 07:18:08 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1ueXU1-000134-1N; Wed, 23 Jul 2025 07:18:02 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=GMZTPRwq8N+ASW1M6AhWaNkUqqCBZIUDw+xyTiK2QLc=; b=pniNEMFT16xu55ygt294 C+edfe/swDUMRCcEtNq3bj+Q0P4gYUM7DgJAYRsvZQ2pFf//2wyD+JG1yyep+lmNhA9o7wjWU37GS wji3KDvqzsSL7j9QwfYkNbpaFIJxsgMhrGadBpEJHJp07OxpBeIj+QzYz3OvXI7EuGuTFdQI1oOVn KT+Ut+gZ2z9oUIiDz8dPCsR62e1IhRXJNQYTVtndUGG3IybMgBMel2UGx/nO23T/cnBBiXsUKV7Bk klUitOhb6mqrXrJzHu8WBdRosp8YLxIbzXt05UW3eNiHweGKs6LYbhFnpAqLtiL/FttRA408G74/1 ryS02KNNgunCGA==; Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2025 14:17:59 +0300 Message-Id: <86y0sf6tqw.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <BC193E4B-86EF-4745-BC09-48A707CE6DDD@HIDDEN> (message from Bror Winther on Tue, 22 Jul 2025 20:06:15 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#79058: 30.1; involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete ~2 seconds References: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> <86o6tfcbod.fsf@HIDDEN> <9F2CC53A-3617-4859-A222-B51ECBB8E3AD@HIDDEN> <86jz43c7lr.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikjnc7b0.fsf@HIDDEN> <7C990395-4E29-41FB-97D5-717C4BF4B3CC@HIDDEN> <86ecuad76y.fsf@HIDDEN> <00737E70-01B4-4C25-A133-642352168659@HIDDEN> <86bjpddcrp.fsf@HIDDEN> <D55032A8-D38B-4741-B6EA-8D6F6218A7BA@HIDDEN> <86pldtbrdn.fsf@HIDDEN> <777AD538-CB8C-4218-BEA6-CC5FFD659DBF@HIDDEN> <86zfcw8i28.fsf@HIDDEN> <F2857AAE-CE79-4871-A0DA-26CF2FB9359C@HIDDEN> <BC193E4B-86EF-4745-BC09-48A707CE6DDD@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 79058 Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> > Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2025 20:06:15 +0200 > Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > Sorry I can see I used some confusing terms here. I wrote client frame in tty. I have since > found that there is no client frame and thus I understand why you didn’t understand the > question. I’m sorely concerned with using the --eval option only, not in in combination with > -c or any other option that would create a client frame. Apologies for the confusion. OK, but then your situation is very special, whereas the wait targets much more general use cases: it makes sure we give the user ample opportunity to see any error messages before they disappear from the screen.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 79058) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Jul 2025 11:10:28 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Jul 23 07:10:28 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48780 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1ueXMh-0003Bq-U9 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 23 Jul 2025 07:10:28 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:60738) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1ueXMf-0003B5-Ok for 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 23 Jul 2025 07:10:26 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1ueXMZ-0004lo-IM; Wed, 23 Jul 2025 07:10:19 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=DQxWu4Irjw+UxdQTmdM1agSxEDvfD+xKDOVDp1nvXhc=; b=LzzQKGAjrIG7HovqPKST aDMjqr7pfmaB6YqMNvS8QS2fagiYjtY1erbMOzUoelzNTayiagbEDiTl5jyXv4Q5rS4Tz4TvdVUHX DcU9uONG6wzhoi+RA2+n+nVgV8/0rbjG7LyHKgD+OtMI4HteWLRJ5OYWIlSecrJ4PMCH1FVQzqna2 BLgs0pcRPCUOUSRG5LUWMz2Aec8wCxcFf2ZtaBcUW/KnMa2TDgG7i/p8GkW7qpCS1/Ie5gu3YqpYx 4pMBGzgACr5qc+GOQu+yzA5PUVAdy8TMJ0gCEkiJaIuyCUAMrSOmtpDOxx6q379bMU5e3giLpq2j5 LAfmbX10eRZz3A==; Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2025 14:10:04 +0300 Message-Id: <861pq788oj.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <F2857AAE-CE79-4871-A0DA-26CF2FB9359C@HIDDEN> (message from Bror Winther on Tue, 22 Jul 2025 20:01:36 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#79058: 30.1; involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete ~2 seconds References: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> <86o6tfcbod.fsf@HIDDEN> <9F2CC53A-3617-4859-A222-B51ECBB8E3AD@HIDDEN> <86jz43c7lr.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikjnc7b0.fsf@HIDDEN> <7C990395-4E29-41FB-97D5-717C4BF4B3CC@HIDDEN> <86ecuad76y.fsf@HIDDEN> <00737E70-01B4-4C25-A133-642352168659@HIDDEN> <86bjpddcrp.fsf@HIDDEN> <D55032A8-D38B-4741-B6EA-8D6F6218A7BA@HIDDEN> <86pldtbrdn.fsf@HIDDEN> <777AD538-CB8C-4218-BEA6-CC5FFD659DBF@HIDDEN> <86zfcw8i28.fsf@HIDDEN> <F2857AAE-CE79-4871-A0DA-26CF2FB9359C@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 79058 Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> > Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2025 20:01:36 +0200 > Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > >> How does that work when the client frame is a tty? Not the sense of emacs in the terminal but > >> using --eval. > >> I’m asking to understand why we waiting in exactly that scenario is fitting. > > > > Sorry, I don't understand the question. Even if the client frame is a > > tty, it is the Emacs server that displays there, not emacsclient. > > emacsclient doesn't display anything on that frame, it just sends the > > command to the server. > > Let me see if I understand correctly and thank you for your patience with me. > I was under the impression that using --eval would not create a client frame > so your statement confuses me a bit. No, --eval doesn't disable creation of a client frame. Try this: $ emacsclient -t --eval '(message "foo")' This creates a client frame on the current terminal, and shows the message "foo" there. > I can’t wrap my head around the necessity of the wait in the case of --eval. > When you call --eval and encounter an error there is no output in the terminal > during the wait time. So let me rephrase my question, what are we waiting for? The expression inside --eval could signal an error. That error is shown on the client frame. If we delete the client frame immediately, the error message will only be shown on the stderr stream of emacsclient, and if that is not visible, the user won't have any opportunity of seeing the message. So we wait for the user to see the message on the client frame before we delete it.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
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[80.163.18.196]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a640c23a62f3a-aec6ca30d39sm904883466b.93.2025.07.22.11.06.25 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 22 Jul 2025 11:06:25 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3774.200.91.1.1\)) Subject: Re: bug#79058: 30.1; involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete ~2 seconds From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <F2857AAE-CE79-4871-A0DA-26CF2FB9359C@HIDDEN> Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2025 20:06:15 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <BC193E4B-86EF-4745-BC09-48A707CE6DDD@HIDDEN> References: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> <86o6tfcbod.fsf@HIDDEN> <9F2CC53A-3617-4859-A222-B51ECBB8E3AD@HIDDEN> <86jz43c7lr.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikjnc7b0.fsf@HIDDEN> <7C990395-4E29-41FB-97D5-717C4BF4B3CC@HIDDEN> <86ecuad76y.fsf@HIDDEN> <00737E70-01B4-4C25-A133-642352168659@HIDDEN> <86bjpddcrp.fsf@HIDDEN> <D55032A8-D38B-4741-B6EA-8D6F6218A7BA@HIDDEN> <86pldtbrdn.fsf@HIDDEN> <777AD538-CB8C-4218-BEA6-CC5FFD659DBF@HIDDEN> <86zfcw8i28.fsf@HIDDEN> <F2857AAE-CE79-4871-A0DA-26CF2FB9359C@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3774.200.91.1.1) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 79058 Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) > On 22 Jul 2025, at 20.01, Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> wrote: >=20 >=20 >=20 >> On 22 Jul 2025, at 15.35, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: >>=20 >>> From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> >>> Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2025 14:26:12 +0200 >>> Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org >>>=20 >>>>> My understanding was that the error might not have been written by = emacsclient to stderr and thus=20 >>>>> we just wait and hope the user sees it. =46rom your comment I = guess we wait for the client to show >>>>> it which makes a bit more sense. >>>>=20 >>>> No, we wait for the _server_ to show it in the client frame. >>>=20 >>> How does that work when the client frame is a tty? Not the sense of = emacs in the terminal but >>> using --eval. >>> I=E2=80=99m asking to understand why we waiting in exactly that = scenario is fitting. Sorry I can see I used some confusing terms here. I wrote client frame = in tty. I have since found that there is no client frame and thus I understand why you = didn=E2=80=99t understand the question. I=E2=80=99m sorely concerned with using the --eval option = only, not in in combination with -c or any other option that would create a client frame. Apologies for = the confusion.=20 >>=20 >> Sorry, I don't understand the question. Even if the client frame is = a >> tty, it is the Emacs server that displays there, not emacsclient. >> emacsclient doesn't display anything on that frame, it just sends the >> command to the server. >=20 > Let me see if I understand correctly and thank you for your patience = with me. > I was under the impression that using --eval would not create a client = frame > so your statement confuses me a bit. > I can=E2=80=99t wrap my head around the necessity of the wait in the = case of --eval.=20 > When you call --eval and encounter an error there is no output in the = terminal > during the wait time. So let me rephrase my question, what are we = waiting for? >=20 >>=20 >>>> A variable has a doc string, so it is not undocumented. It just = isn't >>>> a user option. >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Good point. The I concur, I=E2=80=99ll make a new patch. >>=20 >> Thanks. >=20 > Yeah no problem. Thank you for taking the time to help me understand
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
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[80.163.18.196]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a640c23a62f3a-aec6c7a08c5sm906319666b.33.2025.07.22.11.01.47 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 22 Jul 2025 11:01:48 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3774.200.91.1.1\)) Subject: Re: bug#79058: 30.1; involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete ~2 seconds From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <86zfcw8i28.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2025 20:01:36 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <F2857AAE-CE79-4871-A0DA-26CF2FB9359C@HIDDEN> References: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> <86o6tfcbod.fsf@HIDDEN> <9F2CC53A-3617-4859-A222-B51ECBB8E3AD@HIDDEN> <86jz43c7lr.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikjnc7b0.fsf@HIDDEN> <7C990395-4E29-41FB-97D5-717C4BF4B3CC@HIDDEN> <86ecuad76y.fsf@HIDDEN> <00737E70-01B4-4C25-A133-642352168659@HIDDEN> <86bjpddcrp.fsf@HIDDEN> <D55032A8-D38B-4741-B6EA-8D6F6218A7BA@HIDDEN> <86pldtbrdn.fsf@HIDDEN> <777AD538-CB8C-4218-BEA6-CC5FFD659DBF@HIDDEN> <86zfcw8i28.fsf@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3774.200.91.1.1) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 79058 Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) > On 22 Jul 2025, at 15.35, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: >=20 >> From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> >> Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2025 14:26:12 +0200 >> Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org >>=20 >>>> My understanding was that the error might not have been written by = emacsclient to stderr and thus=20 >>>> we just wait and hope the user sees it. =46rom your comment I guess = we wait for the client to show >>>> it which makes a bit more sense. >>>=20 >>> No, we wait for the _server_ to show it in the client frame. >>=20 >> How does that work when the client frame is a tty? Not the sense of = emacs in the terminal but >> using --eval. >> I=E2=80=99m asking to understand why we waiting in exactly that = scenario is fitting. >=20 > Sorry, I don't understand the question. Even if the client frame is a > tty, it is the Emacs server that displays there, not emacsclient. > emacsclient doesn't display anything on that frame, it just sends the > command to the server. Let me see if I understand correctly and thank you for your patience = with me. I was under the impression that using --eval would not create a client = frame so your statement confuses me a bit. I can=E2=80=99t wrap my head around the necessity of the wait in the = case of --eval.=20 When you call --eval and encounter an error there is no output in the = terminal during the wait time. So let me rephrase my question, what are we = waiting for? >=20 >>> A variable has a doc string, so it is not undocumented. It just = isn't >>> a user option. >>=20 >>=20 >> Good point. The I concur, I=E2=80=99ll make a new patch. >=20 > Thanks. Yeah no problem. Thank you for taking the time to help me understand=
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 79058) by debbugs.gnu.org; 22 Jul 2025 13:35:46 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Jul 22 09:35:46 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:36505 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1ueD9m-0003si-1E for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 22 Jul 2025 09:35:46 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:43892) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1ueD9f-0003s0-UK for 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 22 Jul 2025 09:35:42 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1ueD9Z-0005nU-5Y; Tue, 22 Jul 2025 09:35:33 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=dH/VDrhVQPSjtknoHiPVDnQMS0La8Ip9OlaAd7rQyW4=; b=PAFK5PVDv3QEMVMq0aDy L/BzSEwsYQJKk9mIcnBOluqmoKX8dIX5piFdRhObXUcEMONvHfK1o77oqw5qTomSiGFQK0P8Q5+4D 65O30y1ySgSlJaJxxjRxnngZ0B3V9FrNR/mzGhmSBcYuIkIubHV53GP1Efy7Ot/YB91Hb5SDf+kBy f2pBz3FRiJfvv9StB5Ky5mGfuwYqMW9bNlnD2m3GX63RflqRW2W/74La+EFwL7bdxbszEyg2z9onG MHmCsjbMut4v2iOyBtwMn+BBuEPa5VLAR5dpqf8j56uWTLj1EyE8+Z9ztIf8myEBzrArw6leDu4za bggwcGjGbM2kzQ==; Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2025 16:35:11 +0300 Message-Id: <86zfcw8i28.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <777AD538-CB8C-4218-BEA6-CC5FFD659DBF@HIDDEN> (message from Bror Winther on Tue, 22 Jul 2025 14:26:12 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#79058: 30.1; involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete ~2 seconds References: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> <86o6tfcbod.fsf@HIDDEN> <9F2CC53A-3617-4859-A222-B51ECBB8E3AD@HIDDEN> <86jz43c7lr.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikjnc7b0.fsf@HIDDEN> <7C990395-4E29-41FB-97D5-717C4BF4B3CC@HIDDEN> <86ecuad76y.fsf@HIDDEN> <00737E70-01B4-4C25-A133-642352168659@HIDDEN> <86bjpddcrp.fsf@HIDDEN> <D55032A8-D38B-4741-B6EA-8D6F6218A7BA@HIDDEN> <86pldtbrdn.fsf@HIDDEN> <777AD538-CB8C-4218-BEA6-CC5FFD659DBF@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 79058 Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> > Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2025 14:26:12 +0200 > Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > >> My understanding was that the error might not have been written by emacsclient to stderr and thus > >> we just wait and hope the user sees it. From your comment I guess we wait for the client to show > >> it which makes a bit more sense. > > > > No, we wait for the _server_ to show it in the client frame. > > How does that work when the client frame is a tty? Not the sense of emacs in the terminal but > using --eval. > I’m asking to understand why we waiting in exactly that scenario is fitting. Sorry, I don't understand the question. Even if the client frame is a tty, it is the Emacs server that displays there, not emacsclient. emacsclient doesn't display anything on that frame, it just sends the command to the server. > > A variable has a doc string, so it is not undocumented. It just isn't > > a user option. > > > Good point. The I concur, I’ll make a new patch. Thanks.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
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[80.163.18.196]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a640c23a62f3a-aec6ca7d347sm867511766b.128.2025.07.22.05.26.22 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 22 Jul 2025 05:26:23 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3774.200.91.1.1\)) Subject: Re: bug#79058: 30.1; involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete ~2 seconds From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <86pldtbrdn.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2025 14:26:12 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <777AD538-CB8C-4218-BEA6-CC5FFD659DBF@HIDDEN> References: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> <86o6tfcbod.fsf@HIDDEN> <9F2CC53A-3617-4859-A222-B51ECBB8E3AD@HIDDEN> <86jz43c7lr.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikjnc7b0.fsf@HIDDEN> <7C990395-4E29-41FB-97D5-717C4BF4B3CC@HIDDEN> <86ecuad76y.fsf@HIDDEN> <00737E70-01B4-4C25-A133-642352168659@HIDDEN> <86bjpddcrp.fsf@HIDDEN> <D55032A8-D38B-4741-B6EA-8D6F6218A7BA@HIDDEN> <86pldtbrdn.fsf@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3774.200.91.1.1) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 79058 Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) > On 21 Jul 2025, at 15.33, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: >=20 >> From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> >> Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2025 15:22:06 +0200 >> Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org >>=20 >> That is why I think the proper solution is to have a simple variable >> that Lisp programs could bind as part of such scripts to easily >> disable the wait, if using ignore-errors or similar technique is for >> some reason inconvenient or inappropriate. >>=20 >> As I understand, this would mean that I would have to bind it every = time I call --eval if I don=E2=80=99t >> want to wait for errors? I don=E2=80=99t think this is ideal either. >=20 > No, you don't have to bind it. You could also use setq to set its > value globally, just like with user option. Right, then I think your suggestion of not doing a user variable is very = valid. >=20 >> Maybe I'm misunderstanding the intetion. =46rom the doc string I = understand that >> the delay is a means to fix a bug where the error might not be = written to stderr >> and thus showing the message somewhere. In daemonized mode that = message is not >> being displayed anywhere yet the client waits for it to finish = displaying. >>=20 >> The intent is to stderr of emacsclient. The server has no way of >> knowing whether the emacsclient's stderr is shown anywhere. >>=20 >> ;; Display the error as a message and give the user time to see >> ;; it, in case the error written by emacsclient to stderr is not >> ;; visible for some reason. >>=20 >> My understanding was that the error might not have been written by = emacsclient to stderr and thus=20 >> we just wait and hope the user sees it. =46rom your comment I guess = we wait for the client to show >> it which makes a bit more sense. >=20 > No, we wait for the _server_ to show it in the client frame. How does that work when the client frame is a tty? Not the sense of = emacs in the terminal but using --eval. I=E2=80=99m asking to understand why we waiting in exactly that scenario = is fitting. >=20 >> This raises another question, how does that make sense with=20 >> --eval then? Are we waiting, in the terminal, for the user to see the = output? In that case I think it is >> perfectly reasonable to exit early as stderr usually gets written as = well. I=E2=80=99m not sure I fully >> understand what the issue based on this doc string. >=20 > emacsclient will not exit until the server shuts down the connection. > Therefore, if the server waits, emacscilent also waits. >=20 >> I agreed to allow this to be controllable by Lisp programs. However, >> a user option is not the only method of providing such control, and = in >> this case I believe it is sub-optimal, for the reason I mentioned: = its >> effect is global. In addition, adding another user option requires = us >> to document it in user-level terms, and increases the number of user >> options in Emacs that is already huge. So I prefer to have a simple >> variable rather than a user option, because the problem, when it >> happens, is local and ephemeral. >>=20 >> That is completely fair. However it sounds like you are suggesting to = include this >> as an undocumented user option instead (I could be wrong). A simple = variable would definitely >> suffice but I don=E2=80=99t agree completely with the argument = against making it a user option. Only=20 >> that it would be less work, which is of course true. >=20 > A variable has a doc string, so it is not undocumented. It just isn't > a user option. Good point. The I concur, I=E2=80=99ll make a new patch. //bror=
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 79058) by debbugs.gnu.org; 21 Jul 2025 13:33:39 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jul 21 09:33:38 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:56511 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1udqeA-0002eL-2h for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2025 09:33:38 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:40552) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1udqe6-0002dT-Ba for 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2025 09:33:35 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1udqe0-0006Qj-60; Mon, 21 Jul 2025 09:33:28 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=xSn+mKmObhs8ufyK8VMZe/kirn0+oQN7l0LgyU07058=; b=bDbQo9LYKHMjQo102Kxu 0fXJEf9Phac/5TH/gTGo8ipkpEHSbSrq8X/08bYzbMfUqhCApVUkAEUXFTHS4xDtGaJ2picejSwfs yl8pOkluyuK7ENhnFhg5g3tDy9fyToXoVczVVa11UCPDog6FnYxOxDW5m70g9D7/hwaEMnqv5H1Fl vUwlGGNZqNkm6ERHQeCkBqs41gMt2zxGkFj/T8ZCB7gn4jnnVHCcEtay4Y32r/saIeKtM94Epy98B SKrNIJeARJBMUbFX0bsUJlCe1e6XcRctxkrKt709EC7EM0YUe2nYjQG2Z90Q1cHO1NNRm9WPCf5YF B9NE3BrKwJWDmQ==; Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2025 16:33:24 +0300 Message-Id: <86pldtbrdn.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <D55032A8-D38B-4741-B6EA-8D6F6218A7BA@HIDDEN> (message from Bror Winther on Mon, 21 Jul 2025 15:22:06 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#79058: 30.1; involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete ~2 seconds References: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> <86o6tfcbod.fsf@HIDDEN> <9F2CC53A-3617-4859-A222-B51ECBB8E3AD@HIDDEN> <86jz43c7lr.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikjnc7b0.fsf@HIDDEN> <7C990395-4E29-41FB-97D5-717C4BF4B3CC@HIDDEN> <86ecuad76y.fsf@HIDDEN> <00737E70-01B4-4C25-A133-642352168659@HIDDEN> <86bjpddcrp.fsf@HIDDEN> <D55032A8-D38B-4741-B6EA-8D6F6218A7BA@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 79058 Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> > Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2025 15:22:06 +0200 > Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > That is why I think the proper solution is to have a simple variable > that Lisp programs could bind as part of such scripts to easily > disable the wait, if using ignore-errors or similar technique is for > some reason inconvenient or inappropriate. > > As I understand, this would mean that I would have to bind it every time I call --eval if I don’t > want to wait for errors? I don’t think this is ideal either. No, you don't have to bind it. You could also use setq to set its value globally, just like with user option. > Maybe I'm misunderstanding the intetion. From the doc string I understand that > the delay is a means to fix a bug where the error might not be written to stderr > and thus showing the message somewhere. In daemonized mode that message is not > being displayed anywhere yet the client waits for it to finish displaying. > > The intent is to stderr of emacsclient. The server has no way of > knowing whether the emacsclient's stderr is shown anywhere. > > ;; Display the error as a message and give the user time to see > ;; it, in case the error written by emacsclient to stderr is not > ;; visible for some reason. > > My understanding was that the error might not have been written by emacsclient to stderr and thus > we just wait and hope the user sees it. From your comment I guess we wait for the client to show > it which makes a bit more sense. No, we wait for the _server_ to show it in the client frame. > This raises another question, how does that make sense with > --eval then? Are we waiting, in the terminal, for the user to see the output? In that case I think it is > perfectly reasonable to exit early as stderr usually gets written as well. I’m not sure I fully > understand what the issue based on this doc string. emacsclient will not exit until the server shuts down the connection. Therefore, if the server waits, emacscilent also waits. > I agreed to allow this to be controllable by Lisp programs. However, > a user option is not the only method of providing such control, and in > this case I believe it is sub-optimal, for the reason I mentioned: its > effect is global. In addition, adding another user option requires us > to document it in user-level terms, and increases the number of user > options in Emacs that is already huge. So I prefer to have a simple > variable rather than a user option, because the problem, when it > happens, is local and ephemeral. > > That is completely fair. However it sounds like you are suggesting to include this > as an undocumented user option instead (I could be wrong). A simple variable would definitely > suffice but I don’t agree completely with the argument against making it a user option. Only > that it would be less work, which is of course true. A variable has a doc string, so it is not undocumented. It just isn't a user option.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
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[80.163.18.196]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 4fb4d7f45d1cf-612f21073e6sm3642421a12.56.2025.07.21.06.22.17 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 21 Jul 2025 06:22:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> Message-Id: <D55032A8-D38B-4741-B6EA-8D6F6218A7BA@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_DD271CD2-7610-4DB7-8E25-B2B795F1A2E0" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3774.200.91.1.1\)) Subject: Re: bug#79058: 30.1; involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete ~2 seconds Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2025 15:22:06 +0200 In-Reply-To: <86bjpddcrp.fsf@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> References: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> <86o6tfcbod.fsf@HIDDEN> <9F2CC53A-3617-4859-A222-B51ECBB8E3AD@HIDDEN> <86jz43c7lr.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikjnc7b0.fsf@HIDDEN> <7C990395-4E29-41FB-97D5-717C4BF4B3CC@HIDDEN> <86ecuad76y.fsf@HIDDEN> <00737E70-01B4-4C25-A133-642352168659@HIDDEN> <86bjpddcrp.fsf@HIDDEN> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3774.200.91.1.1) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 79058 Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --Apple-Mail=_DD271CD2-7610-4DB7-8E25-B2B795F1A2E0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > On 21 Jul 2025, at 13.06, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: >=20 >> From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN <mailto:bbw@HIDDEN>> >> Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 22:07:10 +0200 >> Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org <mailto:79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org> >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>> On 20 Jul 2025, at 20.54, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN = <mailto:eliz@HIDDEN>> wrote: >>>=20 >>>> From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN <mailto:bbw@HIDDEN>> >>>> Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 19:20:22 +0200 >>>> Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org <mailto:79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org> >>>>=20 >>>> Sure, no problem at all. I use a tiling window manager. For this I = have a script >>>> for navigating between OS windows and for consistency I use the = same script to >>>> navigate windows in Emacs. The script uses emacsclient --eval = =E2=80=9C(evil-window-up >>>> 1)=E2=80=9D to navigate a window up, if this fails it will call the = window manager >>>> instead because it means that there is no window in that direction. = Because the >>>> wait is now 2 seconds it takes 2 seconds to shift focus out of = emacs. This might >>>> be a minor nuisance but enough to be annoying. >>>=20 >>> Sorry, I don't understand: the wait is only when an error message is >>> to be displayed. Your description above doesn't involve any = messages, >>> AFAIU, so how is the recipe you've shown related to your real = problem? >>=20 >> The script waits for emacsclient to finish execution, and execution = is halted >> for 2 seconds to wait for the error message to be displayed. This = means that any >> script calling an Emacs command with emacsclient that results in an = error now >> takes 2 seconds longer to complete than it did previously. >=20 > If there's no one to see the error message, why is the error message > issued? it should be suppressed if it is not intended for human > consumption. I don=E2=80=99t think that is a fair question as I don=E2=80=99t think = an error is only for human consumption. The error should not be suppressed, as it is still useful. >> In my case, the script I use for OS window management calls Emacs to = change >> windows. If there is no window in the requested direction Emacs = throws an error. >> The script then tells the OS window manager to change focus instead. = This now >> takes 2 seconds extra. >=20 > So my suggestion for this case is to use ignore-errors around the form > which could signal an error, or some other method of suppressing the > error. I currently use the exit code from emacsclient. If I where to suppress = the errors with ignore-errors, the exit code would always be 0. Of course I could = create=20 more logic to handle this but that seems like the wrong way to go about = this. It should be possible to fire one-liners to without having to wait for = the error to be displayed imo. >>> Thanks, but I don't see any need to make this a user option. If = some >>> rare Lisp program needs to control the wait time after showing an >>> error message, it can let-bind a simple variable. Users have no >>> reason to customize this time globally. >>=20 >> =46rom a user perspective, calling emacsclient --eval from a shell or = script, I >> would not expect it to halt execution for 2 seconds just to display = an error on >> the server. Especially since this also affects workflows where Emacs = is run >> daemonized.=20 >=20 > We had exactly opposite requests, and thus introduced this feature. > So at least some users do care about error messages in client frames. I would think as much. As I said I completely understand the reason = behind this and not being able to set the delay or ignore it is probably just a = small oversight. > You seem to be assuming that --eval used from a script necessarily > means that errors important for the users should never happen, but > that is definitely not the case in general. When errors do happen, it > is important to let the user see them. That was not what I was assuming. I understand the general use case and = that=20 my use is a bit more infrequent. And I=E2=80=99m not arguing to remove = the delay if that is what came across. I tried to make the case that exclusively = halting both emacs and caller program to show an error is a surprising (and somewhat = archaic, pardon my words) choice. Surely there would be a way to have the --eval = caller exit while retaining the error. >=20 >> For instance: >>=20 >> ``` >> emacs =E2=80=94daemon=20 >> emacsclient --eval "(windmove-up)=E2=80=9D=20 >> ``` >>=20 >> will now take 2 seconds longer due to the display wait. >=20 > As I said above, using >=20 > emacsclient --eval "(ignore-errors (windmove-up))=E2=80=9D >=20 > should solve this problem very easily. Yes but then I won=E2=80=99t know if it failed or not >=20 >> Having it as a user >> option would empower users to decide whether their scripts should = incur this >> delay or not, preserving the responsiveness of Emacs in integrated = window >> management or automation setups. _(please note I know that these two = commands >> are a bit nonsensical given that there are no windows)_ >=20 > A user option has global effect, i.e. it affects all the client > connections and frames. By contrast, ignoring errors only where the > user's scripts really don't care about the errors will allow users to > see messages that matter. I think being able to disable the wait globally is useful. That was the reasoning behind it at least. > That is why I think the proper solution is to have a simple variable > that Lisp programs could bind as part of such scripts to easily > disable the wait, if using ignore-errors or similar technique is for > some reason inconvenient or inappropriate. As I understand, this would mean that I would have to bind it every time = I call --eval if I don=E2=80=99t want to wait for errors? I don=E2=80=99t think this is ideal either. >> Maybe I'm misunderstanding the intetion. =46rom the doc string I = understand that >> the delay is a means to fix a bug where the error might not be = written to stderr >> and thus showing the message somewhere. In daemonized mode that = message is not >> being displayed anywhere yet the client waits for it to finish = displaying. >=20 > The intent is to stderr of emacsclient. The server has no way of > knowing whether the emacsclient's stderr is shown anywhere. ;; Display the error as a message and give the user time to see ;; it, in case the error written by emacsclient to stderr is not ;; visible for some reason. My understanding was that the error might not have been written by = emacsclient to stderr and thus=20 we just wait and hope the user sees it. =46rom your comment I guess we = wait for the client to show it which makes a bit more sense. This raises another question, how does = that make sense with=20 --eval then? Are we waiting, in the terminal, for the user to see the = output? In that case I think it is perfectly reasonable to exit early as stderr usually gets written as = well. I=E2=80=99m not sure I fully understand what the issue based on this doc string. >=20 >> While I understand the reasoning behind the fixed delay, I believe it = would be >> more user-friendly to make it configurable, since the current = approach halts >> execution and may not suit all use cases. >=20 > I agreed to allow this to be controllable by Lisp programs. However, > a user option is not the only method of providing such control, and in > this case I believe it is sub-optimal, for the reason I mentioned: its > effect is global. In addition, adding another user option requires us > to document it in user-level terms, and increases the number of user > options in Emacs that is already huge. So I prefer to have a simple > variable rather than a user option, because the problem, when it > happens, is local and ephemeral. That is completely fair. However it sounds like you are suggesting to = include this as an undocumented user option instead (I could be wrong). A simple = variable would definitely suffice but I don=E2=80=99t agree completely with the argument against = making it a user option. Only=20 that it would be less work, which is of course true. Apologies if I sound argumentative or combative, that is not my intent. //bror --Apple-Mail=_DD271CD2-7610-4DB7-8E25-B2B795F1A2E0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 <html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; = charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"overflow-wrap: break-word; = -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;"><br = id=3D"lineBreakAtBeginningOfMessage"><div><br><blockquote = type=3D"cite"><div>On 21 Jul 2025, at 13.06, Eli Zaretskii = <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote:</div><br = class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div><meta charset=3D"UTF-8"><div = style=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; = font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; = font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: = start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;">From: Bror Winther <<a = href=3D"mailto:bbw@HIDDEN">bbw@HIDDEN</a>><br>Date: Sun, = 20 Jul 2025 22:07:10 +0200<br>Cc:<span = class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><a = href=3D"mailto:79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org">79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org</a><br><br><br= ><br><blockquote type=3D"cite">On 20 Jul 2025, at 20.54, Eli Zaretskii = <<a href=3D"mailto:eliz@HIDDEN">eliz@HIDDEN</a>> = wrote:<br><br><blockquote type=3D"cite">From: Bror Winther <<a = href=3D"mailto:bbw@HIDDEN">bbw@HIDDEN</a>><br>Date: Sun, = 20 Jul 2025 19:20:22 +0200<br>Cc:<span = class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><a = href=3D"mailto:79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org">79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org</a><br><br>Sur= e, no problem at all. I use a tiling window manager. For this I have a = script<br>for navigating between OS windows and for consistency I use = the same script to<br>navigate windows in Emacs. The script uses = emacsclient --eval =E2=80=9C(evil-window-up<br>1)=E2=80=9D to navigate a = window up, if this fails it will call the window manager<br>instead = because it means that there is no window in that direction. Because = the<br>wait is now 2 seconds it takes 2 seconds to shift focus out of = emacs. This might<br>be a minor nuisance but enough to be = annoying.<br></blockquote><br>Sorry, I don't understand: the wait is = only when an error message is<br>to be displayed. Your description = above doesn't involve any messages,<br>AFAIU, so how is the recipe = you've shown related to your real problem?<br></blockquote><br>The = script waits for emacsclient to finish execution, and execution is = halted<br>for 2 seconds to wait for the error message to be displayed. = This means that any<br>script calling an Emacs command with emacsclient = that results in an error now<br>takes 2 seconds longer to complete than = it did previously.<br></blockquote><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, = 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">If = there's no one to see the error message, why is the error = message</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: = Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: = normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; = text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: = none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; = font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; = font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; = text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: = none; float: none; display: inline !important;">issued? it should be = suppressed if it is not intended for human</span><br style=3D"caret-color:= rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: = normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: = normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; = white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline = !important;">consumption.</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>I = don=E2=80=99t think that is a fair question as I don=E2=80=99t think an = error is only for human consumption.</div><div>The error should not be = suppressed, as it is still useful.<br></div><br><blockquote = type=3D"cite"><div><div style=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" = style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: = none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;">In my case, the = script I use for OS window management calls Emacs to change<br>windows. = If there is no window in the requested direction Emacs throws an = error.<br>The script then tells the OS window manager to change focus = instead. This now<br>takes 2 seconds extra.<br></blockquote><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;">So my suggestion for this case is to use = ignore-errors around the form</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, = 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">which = could signal an error, or some other method of suppressing the</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;">error.</span><br style=3D"caret-color: = rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: = normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: = normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; = white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>I = currently use the exit code from emacsclient. If I where to suppress the = errors</div><div>with ignore-errors, the exit code would always be 0. Of = course I could create </div><div>more logic to handle this but that = seems like the wrong way to go about this.</div><div>It should be = possible to fire one-liners to without having to wait for the error = to</div><div>be displayed imo.</div><br><blockquote = type=3D"cite"><div><div style=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" = style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: = none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><blockquote = type=3D"cite">Thanks, but I don't see any need to make this a user = option. If some<br>rare Lisp program needs to control the wait = time after showing an<br>error message, it can let-bind a simple = variable. Users have no<br>reason to customize this time = globally.<br></blockquote><br>=46rom a user perspective, calling = emacsclient --eval from a shell or script, I<br>would not expect it to = halt execution for 2 seconds just to display an error on<br>the server. = Especially since this also affects workflows where Emacs is = run<br>daemonized.<span = class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><br></blockquote><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;">We had exactly opposite requests, and thus = introduced this feature.</span></div></div></blockquote><blockquote = type=3D"cite"><div><div style=3D""><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, = 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">So at = least some users do care about error messages in client = frames.</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: = Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: = normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; = text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: = none;"></div></div></blockquote><br><div>I would think as much. As I = said I completely understand the reason behind this</div><div>and not = being able to set the delay or ignore it is probably just a small = oversight.</div><br><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div><div style=3D""><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;">You seem to be assuming that --eval used = from a script necessarily</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">means = that errors important for the users should never happen, but</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;">that is definitely not the case in general. = When errors do happen, it</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, = 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">is = important to let the user see them.</span><br style=3D"caret-color: = rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: = normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: = normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; = white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: = none;"></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>That was not what I = was assuming. I understand the general use case and = that </div><div>my use is a bit more infrequent. And I=E2=80=99m = not arguing to remove the delay</div><div>if that is what came across. I = tried to make the case that exclusively halting both emacs</div><div>and = caller program to show an error is a surprising (and somewhat = archaic,</div><div>pardon my words) choice. Surely there would be a way = to have the --eval caller exit</div><div>while retaining the = error.<br></div><br><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div><div style=3D""><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><blockquote = type=3D"cite" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; = font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: = 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; = word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: = none;">For instance:<br><br>```<br>emacs =E2=80=94daemon<span = class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>emacsclient --eval = "(windmove-up)=E2=80=9D<span = class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>```<br><br>will now = take 2 seconds longer due to the display wait.<br></blockquote><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;">As I said above, using</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;"> emacsclient --eval "(ignore-errors = (windmove-up))=E2=80=9D</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">should = solve this problem very easily.</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, = 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Yes = but then I won=E2=80=99t know if it failed or not</div><br><blockquote = type=3D"cite"><div><div style=3D""><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, = 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"font-family: = Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: = normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;">Having it as a user<br>option would empower = users to decide whether their scripts should incur this<br>delay or not, = preserving the responsiveness of Emacs in integrated = window<br>management or automation setups. _(please note I know = that these two commands<br>are a bit nonsensical given that there are no = windows)_<br></blockquote><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">A user = option has global effect, i.e. it affects all the client</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;">connections and frames. By contrast, = ignoring errors only where the</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, = 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">user's = scripts really don't care about the errors will allow users to</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;">see messages that matter.</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: = none;"></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>I think being able to = disable the wait globally is useful. That</div><div>was the reasoning = behind it at least.</div><div><br><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div><div = style=3D""><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: = Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: = normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; = text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: = none; float: none; display: inline !important;">That is why I think the = proper solution is to have a simple variable</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;">that Lisp programs could bind as part of = such scripts to easily</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">disable = the wait, if using ignore-errors or similar technique is for</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;">some reason inconvenient or = inappropriate.</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>As = I understand, this would mean that I would have to bind it every time I = call --eval if I don=E2=80=99t</div><div>want to wait for errors? I = don=E2=80=99t think this is ideal either.</div><br><blockquote = type=3D"cite"><div><div style=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" = style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: = none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;">Maybe I'm = misunderstanding the intetion. =46rom the doc string I understand = that<br>the delay is a means to fix a bug where the error might not be = written to stderr<br>and thus showing the message somewhere. In = daemonized mode that message is not<br>being displayed anywhere yet the = client waits for it to finish displaying.<br></blockquote><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;">The intent is to stderr of emacsclient. = The server has no way of</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, = 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">knowing = whether the emacsclient's stderr is shown anywhere.</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: = none;"></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div> ;; Display the = error as a message and give the user time to see</div><div> ;; it, = in case the error written by emacsclient to stderr is = not</div><div> ;; visible for some = reason.</div><div><br></div><div>My understanding was that the error = might not have been written by emacsclient to stderr and = thus </div><div>we just wait and hope the user sees it. =46rom your = comment I guess we wait for the client to show</div><div>it which makes = a bit more sense. This raises another question, how does that make sense = with </div><div>--eval then? Are we waiting, in the terminal, for = the user to see the output? In that case I think it = is</div><div>perfectly reasonable to exit early as stderr usually gets = written as well. I=E2=80=99m not sure I fully</div><div>understand what = the issue based on this doc string.</div><div><br></div><blockquote = type=3D"cite"><div><div style=3D""><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, = 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"font-family: = Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: = normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;">While I understand the reasoning behind the = fixed delay, I believe it would be<br>more user-friendly to make it = configurable, since the current approach halts<br>execution and may not = suit all use cases.<br></blockquote><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, = 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">I = agreed to allow this to be controllable by Lisp programs. = However,</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">a user = option is not the only method of providing such control, and = in</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; = font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; = font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; = text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: = none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; = font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; = font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; = text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: = none; float: none; display: inline !important;">this case I believe it = is sub-optimal, for the reason I mentioned: its</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;">effect is global. In addition, adding = another user option requires us</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, = 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">to = document it in user-level terms, and increases the number of = user</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: = Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: = normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; = text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: = none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; = font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; = font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; = text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: = none; float: none; display: inline !important;">options in Emacs that is = already huge. So I prefer to have a simple</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;">variable rather than a user option, because = the problem, when it</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline = !important;">happens, is local and = ephemeral.</span></div></div></blockquote></div><br><div>That is = completely fair. However it sounds like you are suggesting to include = this</div><div>as an undocumented user option instead (I could be = wrong). A simple variable would definitely</div><div>suffice but I = don=E2=80=99t agree completely with the argument against making it a = user option. Only </div><div>that it would be less work, which is = of course true.</div><div><br></div><div>Apologies if I sound = argumentative or combative, that is not my = intent.</div><div><br></div><div>//bror</div><div><br></div></body></html>= --Apple-Mail=_DD271CD2-7610-4DB7-8E25-B2B795F1A2E0--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 79058) by debbugs.gnu.org; 21 Jul 2025 11:06:23 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Jul 21 07:06:23 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55786 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1udoLf-0003j9-4j for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2025 07:06:23 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:38560) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1udoLb-0003ih-NA for 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 21 Jul 2025 07:06:20 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1udoLO-0004yZ-Po; Mon, 21 Jul 2025 07:06:11 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=T9v3z4K7fCzUqZfo2+PwNhu+Jq95ByNWTqPCEXk56nc=; b=jzXY/qUt3v6Jvn4IWwE7 Cl0GFTWJ39PQa0s+wA13a4RkVO6adbB/Pdvp4XsyAHmxk2hNMMYAfJ4yborM8VKcFDZyNo0ZPkx7V ODyKlE24Mjh0vuudELlaWGws0lwnA8SBkA9LNQb6qTy3me2mmciCd8nQj1Omm5115G6ar7rrPDhr4 t8Cj+9bp1hwUfDlj2kLXCmqOP0QxIiczrqr5BQIyDgVnI+QdssyhNphaxFK3h3Qo5NDGoNPtSipjc G9MJoed1SdACepuK0Q5lmBKqWPhnRF5BlRj6tP8skcGwsI4tQFz1UuepGRR35tsd/dAnrEXEBAUmZ VCW9Euzi0Tk2fA==; Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2025 14:06:02 +0300 Message-Id: <86bjpddcrp.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <00737E70-01B4-4C25-A133-642352168659@HIDDEN> (message from Bror Winther on Sun, 20 Jul 2025 22:07:10 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#79058: 30.1; involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete ~2 seconds References: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> <86o6tfcbod.fsf@HIDDEN> <9F2CC53A-3617-4859-A222-B51ECBB8E3AD@HIDDEN> <86jz43c7lr.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikjnc7b0.fsf@HIDDEN> <7C990395-4E29-41FB-97D5-717C4BF4B3CC@HIDDEN> <86ecuad76y.fsf@HIDDEN> <00737E70-01B4-4C25-A133-642352168659@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 79058 Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> > Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 22:07:10 +0200 > Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > > > > On 20 Jul 2025, at 20.54, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: > > > >> From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> > >> Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 19:20:22 +0200 > >> Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > >> > >> Sure, no problem at all. I use a tiling window manager. For this I have a script > >> for navigating between OS windows and for consistency I use the same script to > >> navigate windows in Emacs. The script uses emacsclient --eval “(evil-window-up > >> 1)” to navigate a window up, if this fails it will call the window manager > >> instead because it means that there is no window in that direction. Because the > >> wait is now 2 seconds it takes 2 seconds to shift focus out of emacs. This might > >> be a minor nuisance but enough to be annoying. > > > > Sorry, I don't understand: the wait is only when an error message is > > to be displayed. Your description above doesn't involve any messages, > > AFAIU, so how is the recipe you've shown related to your real problem? > > The script waits for emacsclient to finish execution, and execution is halted > for 2 seconds to wait for the error message to be displayed. This means that any > script calling an Emacs command with emacsclient that results in an error now > takes 2 seconds longer to complete than it did previously. If there's no one to see the error message, why is the error message issued? it should be suppressed if it is not intended for human consumption. > In my case, the script I use for OS window management calls Emacs to change > windows. If there is no window in the requested direction Emacs throws an error. > The script then tells the OS window manager to change focus instead. This now > takes 2 seconds extra. So my suggestion for this case is to use ignore-errors around the form which could signal an error, or some other method of suppressing the error. > > Thanks, but I don't see any need to make this a user option. If some > > rare Lisp program needs to control the wait time after showing an > > error message, it can let-bind a simple variable. Users have no > > reason to customize this time globally. > > From a user perspective, calling emacsclient --eval from a shell or script, I > would not expect it to halt execution for 2 seconds just to display an error on > the server. Especially since this also affects workflows where Emacs is run > daemonized. We had exactly opposite requests, and thus introduced this feature. So at least some users do care about error messages in client frames. You seem to be assuming that --eval used from a script necessarily means that errors important for the users should never happen, but that is definitely not the case in general. When errors do happen, it is important to let the user see them. > For instance: > > ``` > emacs —daemon > emacsclient --eval "(windmove-up)” > ``` > > will now take 2 seconds longer due to the display wait. As I said above, using emacsclient --eval "(ignore-errors (windmove-up))” should solve this problem very easily. > Having it as a user > option would empower users to decide whether their scripts should incur this > delay or not, preserving the responsiveness of Emacs in integrated window > management or automation setups. _(please note I know that these two commands > are a bit nonsensical given that there are no windows)_ A user option has global effect, i.e. it affects all the client connections and frames. By contrast, ignoring errors only where the user's scripts really don't care about the errors will allow users to see messages that matter. That is why I think the proper solution is to have a simple variable that Lisp programs could bind as part of such scripts to easily disable the wait, if using ignore-errors or similar technique is for some reason inconvenient or inappropriate. > Maybe I'm misunderstanding the intetion. From the doc string I understand that > the delay is a means to fix a bug where the error might not be written to stderr > and thus showing the message somewhere. In daemonized mode that message is not > being displayed anywhere yet the client waits for it to finish displaying. The intent is to stderr of emacsclient. The server has no way of knowing whether the emacsclient's stderr is shown anywhere. > While I understand the reasoning behind the fixed delay, I believe it would be > more user-friendly to make it configurable, since the current approach halts > execution and may not suit all use cases. I agreed to allow this to be controllable by Lisp programs. However, a user option is not the only method of providing such control, and in this case I believe it is sub-optimal, for the reason I mentioned: its effect is global. In addition, adding another user option requires us to document it in user-level terms, and increases the number of user options in Emacs that is already huge. So I prefer to have a simple variable rather than a user option, because the problem, when it happens, is local and ephemeral.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
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[80.163.18.196]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 4fb4d7f45d1cf-612c8dea633sm4402484a12.0.2025.07.20.13.07.20 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 20 Jul 2025 13:07:21 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3774.200.91.1.1\)) Subject: Re: bug#79058: 30.1; involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete ~2 seconds From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <86ecuad76y.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 22:07:10 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <00737E70-01B4-4C25-A133-642352168659@HIDDEN> References: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> <86o6tfcbod.fsf@HIDDEN> <9F2CC53A-3617-4859-A222-B51ECBB8E3AD@HIDDEN> <86jz43c7lr.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikjnc7b0.fsf@HIDDEN> <7C990395-4E29-41FB-97D5-717C4BF4B3CC@HIDDEN> <86ecuad76y.fsf@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3774.200.91.1.1) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 79058 Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) > On 20 Jul 2025, at 20.54, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: >=20 >> From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> >> Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 19:20:22 +0200 >> Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org >>=20 >> Sure, no problem at all. I use a tiling window manager. For this I = have a script >> for navigating between OS windows and for consistency I use the same = script to >> navigate windows in Emacs. The script uses emacsclient --eval = =E2=80=9C(evil-window-up >> 1)=E2=80=9D to navigate a window up, if this fails it will call the = window manager >> instead because it means that there is no window in that direction. = Because the >> wait is now 2 seconds it takes 2 seconds to shift focus out of emacs. = This might >> be a minor nuisance but enough to be annoying. >=20 > Sorry, I don't understand: the wait is only when an error message is > to be displayed. Your description above doesn't involve any messages, > AFAIU, so how is the recipe you've shown related to your real problem? The script waits for emacsclient to finish execution, and execution is = halted for 2 seconds to wait for the error message to be displayed. This means = that any script calling an Emacs command with emacsclient that results in an = error now takes 2 seconds longer to complete than it did previously. In my case, the script I use for OS window management calls Emacs to = change windows. If there is no window in the requested direction Emacs throws = an error. The script then tells the OS window manager to change focus instead. = This now takes 2 seconds extra. For example, if you=E2=80=99re not using Evil, consider (windmove-up). = Previously, calling it with: `emacsclient --eval "(windmove-up)"` would return = instantly, even if there was no window in that direction and Emacs showed "No = window up from the selected window". This immediate return allowed my script to = pass control to the window manager. Currently, with the new 2-second delay, = the script halts for 2 seconds before passing control, only to display an = error in the minibuffer. >> +(defcustom server-error-display-wait 2 >> + "Number of seconds the server waits when displaying an error." >> + :type 'integer >> + :version "30.1") >=20 > Thanks, but I don't see any need to make this a user option. If some > rare Lisp program needs to control the wait time after showing an > error message, it can let-bind a simple variable. Users have no > reason to customize this time globally. =46rom a user perspective, calling emacsclient --eval from a shell or = script, I would not expect it to halt execution for 2 seconds just to display an = error on the server. Especially since this also affects workflows where Emacs is = run daemonized.=20 For instance: ``` emacs =E2=80=94daemon=20 emacsclient --eval "(windmove-up)=E2=80=9D=20 ``` will now take 2 seconds longer due to the display wait. Having it as a = user option would empower users to decide whether their scripts should incur = this delay or not, preserving the responsiveness of Emacs in integrated = window management or automation setups. _(please note I know that these two = commands are a bit nonsensical given that there are no windows)_ Maybe I'm misunderstanding the intetion. =46rom the doc string I = understand that the delay is a means to fix a bug where the error might not be written = to stderr and thus showing the message somewhere. In daemonized mode that message = is not being displayed anywhere yet the client waits for it to finish = displaying. While I understand the reasoning behind the fixed delay, I believe it = would be more user-friendly to make it configurable, since the current approach = halts execution and may not suit all use cases.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 79058) by debbugs.gnu.org; 20 Jul 2025 18:54:24 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jul 20 14:54:24 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51806 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1udZB1-0000IY-MO for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 14:54:24 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:54706) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1udZAz-0000IL-V8 for 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 14:54:22 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1udZAt-0003an-54; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 14:54:15 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=6G901e6aq3z2VTfceTlQDnO5DCVAJCyGT2wLgA7NoTI=; b=HXBJYFYKTbfMJVvndCWU F3sKJNhYVkqQQi5jcOu2dJw1zhX3axl1rO71rw/sY2FFwf4jpj+cXqs3WqhRcmLndKqMqKlpst4vp IrIkfXKVV+23isCXTJlTO081sV/pLeZ3jyhL40UB3GXESUawgw8cSKIgieRjCN6ETU1ig3snaDQoh XuNU+96WPoDssPO+iopsHx4E+iTwO9RzKZVQ42kPJYV6kNvpl8D2VtL0eJqs9U7L8RfAdGFX5dYZC IFzr43S3pIjRmp8+5WntNmHyJLpp2B8jI8xDHVu1JWnU2KuLemha3My8m4GNSLNT+DMWmXvrNSjJ6 Nq09QQk/2DWThw==; Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 21:54:13 +0300 Message-Id: <86ecuad76y.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <7C990395-4E29-41FB-97D5-717C4BF4B3CC@HIDDEN> (message from Bror Winther on Sun, 20 Jul 2025 19:20:22 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#79058: 30.1; involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete ~2 seconds References: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> <86o6tfcbod.fsf@HIDDEN> <9F2CC53A-3617-4859-A222-B51ECBB8E3AD@HIDDEN> <86jz43c7lr.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikjnc7b0.fsf@HIDDEN> <7C990395-4E29-41FB-97D5-717C4BF4B3CC@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 79058 Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> > Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 19:20:22 +0200 > Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > Sure, no problem at all. I use a tiling window manager. For this I have a script > for navigating between OS windows and for consistency I use the same script to > navigate windows in Emacs. The script uses emacsclient --eval “(evil-window-up > 1)” to navigate a window up, if this fails it will call the window manager > instead because it means that there is no window in that direction. Because the > wait is now 2 seconds it takes 2 seconds to shift focus out of emacs. This might > be a minor nuisance but enough to be annoying. Sorry, I don't understand: the wait is only when an error message is to be displayed. Your description above doesn't involve any messages, AFAIU, so how is the recipe you've shown related to your real problem? > +(defcustom server-error-display-wait 2 > + "Number of seconds the server waits when displaying an error." > + :type 'integer > + :version "30.1") Thanks, but I don't see any need to make this a user option. If some rare Lisp program needs to control the wait time after showing an error message, it can let-bind a simple variable. Users have no reason to customize this time globally.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
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[80.163.18.196]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 4fb4d7f45d1cf-612c8f07e0fsm4155783a12.13.2025.07.20.10.20.33 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 20 Jul 2025 10:20:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> Message-Id: <7C990395-4E29-41FB-97D5-717C4BF4B3CC@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_12497A49-F042-4DE0-BC50-6BA4543FF6F3" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3774.200.91.1.1\)) Subject: Re: bug#79058: 30.1; involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete ~2 seconds Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 19:20:22 +0200 In-Reply-To: <86ikjnc7b0.fsf@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> References: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> <86o6tfcbod.fsf@HIDDEN> <9F2CC53A-3617-4859-A222-B51ECBB8E3AD@HIDDEN> <86jz43c7lr.fsf@HIDDEN> <86ikjnc7b0.fsf@HIDDEN> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3774.200.91.1.1) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 79058 Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --Apple-Mail=_12497A49-F042-4DE0-BC50-6BA4543FF6F3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Sure, no problem at all. I use a tiling window manager. For this I have = a script for navigating between OS windows and for consistency I use the same = script to navigate windows in Emacs. The script uses emacsclient --eval = =E2=80=9C(evil-window-up 1)=E2=80=9D to navigate a window up, if this fails it will call the = window manager instead because it means that there is no window in that direction. = Because the wait is now 2 seconds it takes 2 seconds to shift focus out of emacs. = This might be a minor nuisance but enough to be annoying. --Apple-Mail=_12497A49-F042-4DE0-BC50-6BA4543FF6F3 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=0001-Make-error-display-timout-configurable.patch Content-Type: application/octet-stream; x-unix-mode=0644; name="0001-Make-error-display-timout-configurable.patch" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =46rom=20e918ae260ce72a9674a02a3475006d4bf00538ec=20Mon=20Sep=2017=20= 00:00:00=202001=0AFrom:=20Bror=20<git@HIDDEN>=0ADate:=20Sun,=2020=20= Jul=202025=2014:35:17=20+0200=0ASubject:=20[PATCH]=20Make=20error=20= display=20timout=20configurable=0A=0A*=20lisp/server.el=20= (server-return-error):=20New=20user=20option=20to=20control=20how=20long=0A= error=20messages=20are=20displayed=20when=20using=20`emacsclient=20= --eval`.=20Previously=20this=0Awas=20hardcoded=20to=202=20seconds.=20= Users=20can=20set=20it=20to=200=20to=20skip=20the=20wait.=0A---=0A=20= lisp/server.el=20|=207=20++++++-=0A=201=20file=20changed,=206=20= insertions(+),=201=20deletion(-)=0A=0Adiff=20--git=20a/lisp/server.el=20= b/lisp/server.el=0Aindex=204415c45971e..d1eb1add836=20100644=0A---=20= a/lisp/server.el=0A+++=20b/lisp/server.el=0A@@=20-173,6=20+173,11=20@@=20= space=20(this=20means=20characters=20from=20!=20to=20~;=20or=20from=20= code=2033=20to=0A=20=20=20:type=20'boolean=0A=20=20=20:version=20"22.1")=0A= =20=0A+(defcustom=20server-error-display-wait=202=0A+=20=20"Number=20of=20= seconds=20the=20server=20waits=20when=20displaying=20an=20error."=0A+=20=20= :type=20'integer=0A+=20=20:version=20"30.1")=0A+=0A=20(defcustom=20= server-visit-hook=20nil=0A=20=20=20"Hook=20run=20when=20visiting=20a=20= file=20for=20the=20Emacs=20server."=0A=20=20=20:type=20'hook)=0A@@=20= -1562,7=20+1567,7=20@@=20invocations=20of=20\"emacs\".")=0A=20=20=20=20=20= ;;=20Display=20the=20error=20as=20a=20message=20and=20give=20the=20user=20= time=20to=20see=0A=20=20=20=20=20;;=20it,=20in=20case=20the=20error=20= written=20by=20emacsclient=20to=20stderr=20is=20not=0A=20=20=20=20=20;;=20= visible=20for=20some=20reason.=0A-=20=20=20=20(server--message-sit-for=20= 2=20(error-message-string=20err))=0A+=20=20=20=20= (server--message-sit-for=20server-error-display-wait=20= (error-message-string=20err))=0A=20=20=20=20=20(server-send-string=0A=20=20= =20=20=20=20proc=20(concat=20"-error=20"=20(server-quote-arg=0A=20=20=20=20= =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20= =20(error-message-string=20err))))=0A--=20=0A2.49.0=0A=0A= --Apple-Mail=_12497A49-F042-4DE0-BC50-6BA4543FF6F3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii //bror > On 20 Jul 2025, at 15.37, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: >=20 >> Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org >> Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 16:30:40 +0300 >> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> >>=20 >>> From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> >>> Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 14:58:06 +0200 >>> Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org >>>=20 >>> Oh. Okay. I understand that this is probably not the best place to = discuss >>> features but having such a delay configurable would be nice. I have = created a >>> small patch. What email should I send it to? >>=20 >> Post it to this very discussion thread. >=20 > Btw, would you mind telling why it is important to have a script that > yields an error message finish quickly? Scripts don't usually emit > errors, and when they do, the error should be clearly visible before > it disappears from sight. --Apple-Mail=_12497A49-F042-4DE0-BC50-6BA4543FF6F3--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
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[80.163.18.196]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a640c23a62f3a-aec6c7dcf56sm488383666b.67.2025.07.20.05.58.17 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 20 Jul 2025 05:58:17 -0700 (PDT) From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> Message-Id: <9F2CC53A-3617-4859-A222-B51ECBB8E3AD@HIDDEN> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_62490806-72E3-44D7-A086-5076D663BB71" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3774.200.91.1.1\)) Subject: Re: bug#79058: 30.1; involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete ~2 seconds Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 14:58:06 +0200 In-Reply-To: <86o6tfcbod.fsf@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> References: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> <86o6tfcbod.fsf@HIDDEN> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3774.200.91.1.1) X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 79058 X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 10:54:08 -0400 Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --Apple-Mail=_62490806-72E3-44D7-A086-5076D663BB71 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Oh. Okay. I understand that this is probably not the best place to = discuss features but having such a delay configurable would be nice. I have = created a small patch. What email should I send it to? //bror > On 20 Jul 2025, at 14.02, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote: >=20 >> From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> >> Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 04:15:53 +0200 >>=20 >> After upgrading to 30.1 I have noticed that all my external scripts = take >> very long to finish from time to time. In particular I noticed the = line >> in my window manager script `emacsclient --eval "(evil-window-up 1)` >> would take a long time to finish if there is no window found. This >> causes the script to be very slow. I think I have narrowed it down to >> `signal`. >>=20 >> The time it takes to execute a simple signal seems to be very high. >>=20 >> time emacsclient --eval "(signal 'user-error (list (apply = #'format-message \"%s\" '(test))))" >> *ERROR*: test >> emacsclient --eval 0.00s user 0.00s system 0% cpu 2.013 total >=20 > This is a feature: the Emacs server waits fore 2 sec after showing an > error message, to make sure the user has time to see it: >=20 > (defun server-return-error (proc err) > (ignore-errors > ;; Display the error as a message and give the user time to see > ;; it, in case the error written by emacsclient to stderr is not > ;; visible for some reason. > (server--message-sit-for 2 (error-message-string err)) > (server-send-string > proc (concat "-error " (server-quote-arg > (error-message-string err)))) --Apple-Mail=_62490806-72E3-44D7-A086-5076D663BB71 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii <html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; = charset=3Dus-ascii"></head><body style=3D"overflow-wrap: break-word; = -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;"><div>Oh. Okay. = I understand that this is probably not the best place to = discuss</div><div>features but having such a delay configurable would be = nice. I have created a</div><div>small patch. What email should I send = it to?</div><div><br></div><div><div>//bror<br = id=3D"lineBreakAtBeginningOfMessage"><div><br><blockquote = type=3D"cite"><div>On 20 Jul 2025, at 14.02, Eli Zaretskii = <eliz@HIDDEN> wrote:</div><br = class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div><meta = charset=3D"UTF-8"><blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"font-family: = Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: = normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;">From: Bror Winther = <bbw@HIDDEN><br>Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 04:15:53 = +0200<br><br>After upgrading to 30.1 I have noticed that all my external = scripts take<br>very long to finish from time to time. In particular I = noticed the line<br>in my window manager script `emacsclient --eval = "(evil-window-up 1)`<br>would take a long time to finish if there is no = window found. This<br>causes the script to be very slow. I think I have = narrowed it down to<br>`signal`.<br><br>The time it takes to execute a = simple signal seems to be very high.<br><br>time emacsclient --eval = "(signal 'user-error (list (apply #'format-message \"%s\" = '(test))))"<br>*ERROR*: test<br>emacsclient --eval 0.00s = user 0.00s system 0% cpu 2.013 total<br></blockquote><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;">This is a feature: the Emacs server waits = fore 2 sec after showing an</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, = 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;">error = message, to make sure the user has time to see it:</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;"> (defun server-return-error (proc = err)</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: = Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: = normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; = text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: = none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; = font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; = font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; = text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; = word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: = none; float: none; display: inline = !important;"> (ignore-errors</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;"> ;; Display = the error as a message and give the user time to see</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;"> ;; it, in = case the error written by emacsclient to stderr is not</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;"> ;; visible = for some reason.</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline = !important;"> (server--message-sit-for 2 = (error-message-string err))</span><br style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, = 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); = font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline = !important;"> (server-send-string</span><br = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><span = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; = display: inline !important;"> proc = (concat "-error " (server-quote-arg</span><br style=3D"caret-color: = rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: = normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: = normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; = white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"><span class=3D"Apple-tab-span" = style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: = 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; = letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; = text-transform: none; white-space: pre; word-spacing: 0px; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"> = </span><span class=3D"Apple-tab-span" style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, = 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; = font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; = text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: = pre; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: = none;"> </span><span class=3D"Apple-tab-span" style=3D"caret-color: = rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: = normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: = normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; = white-space: pre; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none;"> </span><span style=3D"caret-color: = rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: = normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: = normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; = white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; = text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;"><span = class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>  = ; (error-message-string = err))))</span></div></blockquote></div><br></div></div></body></html>= --Apple-Mail=_62490806-72E3-44D7-A086-5076D663BB71--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 79058) by debbugs.gnu.org; 20 Jul 2025 13:37:21 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Jul 20 09:37:21 2025 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49724 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1udUEC-0003gK-MV for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 09:37:21 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:35188) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1udUE9-0003fj-Hy for 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 09:37:18 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1udUE3-0006yc-Vg; Sun, 20 Jul 2025 09:37:11 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=XlbTeeQtg6uzqtfOpB2q5D+R7tc8Lp7QYH7XnJvrfbg=; b=MqH9kYAr98No uJDGlkNC7E0Jpt34RHquhBVFprIUAuM9m+VNo561EyUV2FtjP6SYgsK7e84fRHR3JMmx7a0seoHWa +oAw7Vhli4StPPsPzgiWSOqCUH1pVrxHbL8Po9rPxhl13JGQ2jD3efHA8HNA7q6rQ5s37zjsawwnS 7J17s5e298+k2I+UMsjND6/z+cWIrAcG+tn42SbQO/+wAnuo2ngPYMoOKH1OV3EhSzZs9HN/Va4ia tMzIgG2ZI3b34oXlzsfVnaFashweAeY7aZv/0Levfjg+rgq2XaSlfDKgOx1Ed7PmBfiSS33N3vQIy XktdbYX56Zmcqbb0eJcIUg==; Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 16:37:07 +0300 Message-Id: <86ikjnc7b0.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: bbw@HIDDEN In-Reply-To: <86jz43c7lr.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Eli Zaretskii on Sun, 20 Jul 2025 16:30:40 +0300) Subject: Re: bug#79058: 30.1; involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete ~2 seconds References: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> <86o6tfcbod.fsf@HIDDEN> <9F2CC53A-3617-4859-A222-B51ECBB8E3AD@HIDDEN> <86jz43c7lr.fsf@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 79058 Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 16:30:40 +0300 > From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> > > > From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> > > Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 14:58:06 +0200 > > Cc: 79058 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > > > Oh. Okay. I understand that this is probably not the best place to discuss > > features but having such a delay configurable would be nice. I have created a > > small patch. What email should I send it to? > > Post it to this very discussion thread. Btw, would you mind telling why it is important to have a script that yields an error message finish quickly? Scripts don't usually emit errors, and when they do, the error should be clearly visible before it disappears from sight.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
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Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 15:02:42 +0300
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From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>
To: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> (message from
Bror Winther on Sun, 20 Jul 2025 04:15:53 +0200)
Subject: Re: bug#79058: 30.1;
involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete
~2 seconds
References: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN>
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> From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN>
> Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 04:15:53 +0200
>
> After upgrading to 30.1 I have noticed that all my external scripts take
> very long to finish from time to time. In particular I noticed the line
> in my window manager script `emacsclient --eval "(evil-window-up 1)`
> would take a long time to finish if there is no window found. This
> causes the script to be very slow. I think I have narrowed it down to
> `signal`.
>
> The time it takes to execute a simple signal seems to be very high.
>
> time emacsclient --eval "(signal 'user-error (list (apply #'format-message \"%s\" '(test))))"
> *ERROR*: test
> emacsclient --eval 0.00s user 0.00s system 0% cpu 2.013 total
This is a feature: the Emacs server waits fore 2 sec after showing an
error message, to make sure the user has time to see it:
(defun server-return-error (proc err)
(ignore-errors
;; Display the error as a message and give the user time to see
;; it, in case the error written by emacsclient to stderr is not
;; visible for some reason.
(server--message-sit-for 2 (error-message-string err))
(server-send-string
proc (concat "-error " (server-quote-arg
(error-message-string err))))
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
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[80.163.18.196]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a640c23a62f3a-aec6c7d475fsm405130866b.43.2025.07.19.19.16.06 for <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 19 Jul 2025 19:16:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3774.200.91.1.1\)) Subject: 30.1; involking signal using emacsclient takes very long time to complete ~2 seconds Message-Id: <6D5FA875-C5F3-4364-B107-EA9CE61C0C07@HIDDEN> Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 04:15:53 +0200 To: bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3774.200.91.1.1) Received-SPF: none client-ip=2a00:1450:4864:20::62d; envelope-from=bbw@HIDDEN; helo=mail-ej1-x62d.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -18 X-Spam_score: -1.9 X-Spam_bar: - X-Spam_report: (-1.9 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-Mailman-Approved-At: Sun, 20 Jul 2025 06:50:22 -0400 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) After upgrading to 30.1 I have noticed that all my external scripts take very long to finish from time to time. In particular I noticed the line in my window manager script `emacsclient --eval "(evil-window-up 1)` would take a long time to finish if there is no window found. This causes the script to be very slow. I think I have narrowed it down to `signal`. The time it takes to execute a simple signal seems to be very high. =20 time emacsclient --eval "(signal 'user-error (list (apply = #'format-message \"%s\" '(test))))" *ERROR*: test emacsclient --eval 0.00s user 0.00s system 0% cpu 2.013 total //bror In GNU Emacs 30.1 (build 2, x86_64-apple-darwin23.1.0, NS appkit-2487.20 Version 14.1 (Build 23B74)) of 2025-06-23 built on baldr.nobad.coffee Windowing system distributor 'Apple', version 10.3.2487 System Description: macOS 14.1 Configured using: 'configure --disable-dependency-tracking --disable-silent-rules --enable-locallisppath=3D/usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp --infodir=3D/usr/local/Cellar/emacs-plus@30/30.1/share/info/emacs --prefix=3D/usr/local/Cellar/emacs-plus@30/30.1 --with-native-compilation=3Daot --with-xml2 --with-gnutls --without-compress-install --without-dbus --without-imagemagick --with-modules --with-rsvg --with-webp --with-xwidgets --with-ns --disable-ns-self-contained 'CFLAGS=3D-O2 -DFD_SETSIZE=3D10000 -DDARWIN_UNLIMITED_SELECT -I/usr/local/opt/sqlite/include -I/usr/local/opt/gcc/include -I/usr/local/opt/libgccjit/include' 'LDFLAGS=3D-L/usr/local/opt/sqlite/lib -L/usr/local/lib/gcc/15 -I/usr/local/opt/gcc/include -I/usr/local/opt/libgccjit/include'' Configured features: ACL GIF GLIB GMP GNUTLS JPEG LCMS2 LIBXML2 MODULES NATIVE_COMP NOTIFY KQUEUE NS PDUMPER PNG RSVG SQLITE3 THREADS TIFF TOOLKIT_SCROLL_BARS TREE_SITTER WEBP XIM XWIDGETS ZLIB Important settings: value of $LANG: en_US.UTF-8 locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix Major mode: C/*l Minor modes in effect: sly-symbol-completion-mode: t evil-traces-mode: t eros-mode: t tree-sitter-hl-mode: t global-ts-fold-mode: t ts-fold-mode: t tree-sitter-mode: t +format-with-lsp-mode: t lsp-diagnostics-mode: t yas-global-mode: t yas-minor-mode: t lsp-modeline-workspace-status-mode: t lsp-modeline-diagnostics-mode: t lsp-modeline-code-actions-mode: t lsp-ui-mode: t lsp-ui-doc-mode: t lsp-ui-sideline-mode: t lsp-completion-mode: t lsp-managed-mode: t lsp-mode: t hl-todo-mode: t copilot-mode: t windmove-mode: t flycheck-popup-tip-mode: t flyspell-lazy-mode: t vi-tilde-fringe-mode: t display-line-numbers-mode: t save-place-mode: t global-so-long-mode: t diff-hl-flydiff-mode: t global-diff-hl-mode: t diff-hl-mode: t envrc-global-mode: t envrc-mode: t which-key-mode: t savehist-mode: t better-jumper-mode: t better-jumper-local-mode: t company-box-mode: t global-company-mode: t company-mode: t vertico-posframe-mode: t vertico-multiform-mode: t vertico-mode: t marginalia-mode: t evil-goggles-mode: t ultra-scroll-mode: t pixel-scroll-precision-mode: t evil-escape-mode: t evil-snipe-override-mode: t evil-snipe-mode: t evil-snipe-override-local-mode: t evil-snipe-local-mode: t org-roam-db-autosync-mode: t bug-reference-prog-mode: t global-git-commit-mode: t recentf-mode: t server-mode: t gcmh-mode: t global-hl-line-mode: t hl-line-mode: t winner-mode: t smartparens-global-mode: t smartparens-mode: t undo-fu-session-global-mode: t undo-fu-session-mode: t undo-fu-mode: t global-flycheck-mode: t flycheck-mode: t ws-butler-global-mode: t ws-butler-mode: t editorconfig-mode: t global-wakatime-mode: t wakatime-mode: t global-ligature-mode: t ligature-mode: t persp-mode: t doom-modeline-mode: t dtrt-indent-mode: t override-global-mode: t ue-global-mode: t projectile-mode: t solaire-global-mode: t global-atomic-chrome-edit-mode: t global-whitespace-mode: t whitespace-mode: t global-subword-mode: t subword-mode: t ns-auto-titlebar-mode: t +lsp-optimization-mode: t evil-mode: t evil-local-mode: t +popup-mode: t general-override-mode: t apheleia-global-mode: t apheleia-mode: t global-eldoc-mode: t eldoc-mode: t show-paren-mode: t electric-indent-mode: t mouse-wheel-mode: t menu-bar-mode: t file-name-shadow-mode: t global-font-lock-mode: t font-lock-mode: t window-divider-mode: t minibuffer-regexp-mode: t size-indication-mode: t column-number-mode: t line-number-mode: t indent-tabs-mode: t 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tree-sitter-hl ts-fold ts-fold-summary ts-fold-parsers ts-fold-util tree-sitter tree-sitter-load tree-sitter-cli tsc tsc-dyn tsc-dyn-get dired-aux tsc-obsolete conf-mode apheleia apheleia-rcs apheleia-dp apheleia-formatters apheleia-utils apheleia-log apheleia-formatter-context jka-compr delsel files-x consult-flycheck evil-collection-consult consult evil-collection-flymake flymake lsp-diagnostics doom-snippets doom-snippets-lib yasnippet elisp-mode company-yasnippet lsp-modeline lsp-icons lsp-lens hide-mode-line lsp-ui lsp-ui-flycheck lsp-ui-doc evil-collection-xwidget xwidget evil-collection-image image-mode exif magit-bookmark evil-collection-bookmark bookmark goto-addr evil-collection-lsp-ui-imenu lsp-ui-imenu lsp-ui-peek lsp-ui-sideline lsp-ui-util evil-collection-view view lsp-zig lsp-yang lsp-yaml lsp-xml lsp-wgsl lsp-volar lsp-vimscript lsp-vhdl lsp-vetur lsp-html lsp-verilog lsp-vala lsp-v lsp-typespec lsp-typeprof lsp-ttcn3 lsp-ts-query lsp-trunk lsp-toml-tombi lsp-toml lsp-tilt lsp-tex lsp-svelte lsp-steep lsp-sqls lsp-sql lsp-sourcekit lsp lsp-sorbet lsp-solidity lsp-solargraph lsp-semgrep lsp-rust lsp-ruff lsp-ruby-syntax-tree lsp-ruby-lsp lsp-rubocop lsp-roslyn lsp-roc lsp-rf lsp-remark lsp-racket lsp-r lsp-qml lsp-python-ty lsp-pylsp lsp-pyls lsp-pwsh lsp-purescript lsp-postgres lsp-pls lsp-php lsp-perlnavigator lsp-perl lsp-openscad lsp-ocaml lsp-nushell lsp-nix lsp-nim lsp-nginx lsp-nextflow lsp-move lsp-mojo lsp-mint lsp-meson lsp-mdx lsp-matlab lsp-marksman lsp-markdown lsp-magik lsp-fennel lsp-lua lsp-lisp lsp-kubernetes-helm lsp-kotlin lsp-json lsp-jq lsp-javascript lsp-idris lsp-haxe lsp-hack lsp-groovy lsp-graphql lsp-golangci-lint lsp-glsl lsp-gleam lsp-gdscript lsp-fsharp lsp-futhark lsp-fortran lsp-eslint lsp-erlang lsp-emmet lsp-elm lsp-elixir lsp-earthly lsp-dockerfile lsp-dhall lsp-d lsp-cypher lsp-cucumber lsp-copilot lsp-css lsp-c3 lsp-csharp lsp-crystal lsp-credo lsp-cobol lsp-cmake lsp-clojure lsp-clangd lsp-bufls lsp-go lsp-completion lsp-beancount lsp-bash lsp-awk lsp-autotools lsp-astro lsp-asm lsp-ansible lsp-angular lsp-ada lsp-semantic-tokens lsp-actionscript ccls ccls-member-hierarchy ccls-inheritance-hierarchy ccls-call-hierarchy ccls-tree ccls-code-lens ccls-semantic-highlight ccls-common cc-mode-expansions smartparens-c cc-mode cc-fonts cc-guess cc-menus cc-cmds cc-styles cc-align cc-engine cc-vars cc-defs lsp-mode lsp-protocol spinner network-stream hl-todo copilot copilot-balancer jsonrpc gdscript-mode gdscript-ts-mode gdscript-eglot gdscript-hydra hydra lv gdscript-godot gdscript-project gdscript-history gdscript-comint gdscript-debug gdscript-format gdscript-comint-gdformat gdscript-completion gdscript-fill-paragraph gdscript-imenu gdscript-indent-and-nav gdscript-rx gdscript-utils gdscript-syntax gdscript-keywords gdscript-docs evil-collection-eww eww url-queue mm-url gdscript-customization vertico-directory windmove evil-collection-vc-git vc-git auto-minor-mode flycheck-popup-tip evil-collection-popup popup org-contacts gnus-art mm-uu mml2015 mm-view mml-smime smime dig gnus-sum gnus-group gnus-undo gnus-start gnus-dbus dbus gnus-cloud nnimap nnmail mail-source utf7 nnoo gnus-spec gnus-int gnus-range gnus-win evil-collection-gnus gnus nnheader range embrace expand-region subword-mode-expansions text-mode-expansions the-org-mode-expansions er-basic-expansions expand-region-core expand-region-custom flyspell-lazy flyspell ispell writegood-mode toc-org org-eldoc evil-org vi-tilde-fringe display-line-numbers indent-bars evil-collection-custom cus-edit cus-start cus-load org-indent oc-basic ol-bibtex bibtex smartparens-go evil-collection-go-mode go-mode find-file ffap etags fileloop evil-collection-xref xref saveplace evil-collection-so-long so-long diff-hl-flydiff evil-collection-diff-hl diff-hl evil-collection-log-view log-view evil-collection-vc-dir vc-dir ewoc vc vc-dispatcher envrc inheritenv vertico-sort vertico-repeat evil-collection-which-key which-key savehist better-jumper company-box company-box-doc frame-local company-box-icons company-capf php-extras company vertico-posframe posframe vertico-multiform evil-collection-vertico vertico orderless marginalia evil-goggles evil-collection-ultra-scroll ultra-scroll pixel-scroll cua-base evil-easymotion avy evil-escape evil-snipe pulse org-agenda evil-collection-org evil-collection-org-roam org-roam-migrate org-roam-log org-roam-mode org-roam-capture org-roam-id org-roam-node org-roam-db org-roam-utils org-roam-compat org-roam org-capture org-element org-persist xdg avl-tree generator org-attach org-id org-refile org-element-ast inline smartparens-org org ob-emacs-lisp org-table org-loaddefs ob ob-tangle ol ob-ref ob-lob ob-table ob-exp org-macro org-src evil-collection-sh-script sh-script smie treesit executable org-keys oc ob-comint ob-core org-cycle org-fold ob-eval org-pcomplete org-list org-footnote org-fold-core org-entities org-faces org-version org-compat org-macs evil-collection-calendar cal-menu calendar cal-loaddefs code-review code-review-actions code-review-comment code-review-section code-review-bitbucket code-review-faces shr pixel-fill kinsoku url-file svg xml dom emojify evil-collection-apropos apropos evil-collection-tar-mode tar-mode evil-collection-arc-mode arc-mode archive-mode ht code-review-gitlab code-review-utils evil-collection-forge forge-repos forge-tablist forge-topics forge-commands forge-semi forge-bitbucket buck forge-gogs gogs forge-gitea gtea forge-gitlab glab forge-github forge-forgejo forge-notify forge-revnote forge-pullreq forge-issue forge-discussion forge-topic yaml parse-time iso8601 eieio-custom bug-reference forge-post smartparens-markdown evil-collection-markdown-mode markdown-mode edit-indirect color evil-collection-outline noutline outline forge-repo forge forge-core forge-db code-review-parse-hunk code-review-github code-review-db uuidgen calc-misc calc-ext evil-collection-calc calc calc-loaddefs calc-macs a code-review-interfaces deferred ghub-graphql treepy gsexp ghub url-http url-gw nsm url-auth gnutls closql emacsql-sqlite emacsql emacsql-compiler eieio-base magit-autoloads evil-collection-magit magit-submodule magit-blame magit-stash magit-reflog magit-bisect magit-push magit-pull magit-fetch magit-clone magit-remote magit-commit magit-sequence magit-notes magit-worktree magit-tag magit-merge magit-branch magit-reset magit-files magit-refs magit-status magit evil-collection-magit-repos magit-repos magit-apply magit-wip magit-log which-func magit-diff evil-collection-smerge-mode smerge-mode diff evil-collection-diff-mode diff-mode track-changes magit-core magit-autorevert magit-margin magit-transient git-commit evil-collection-log-edit log-edit message sendmail yank-media puny evil-collection-dired dired dired-loaddefs rfc822 mml mml-sec evil-collection-epa epa epg rfc6068 epg-config gnus-util time-date mm-decode mm-bodies mm-encode mail-parse rfc2231 rfc2047 rfc2045 mm-util ietf-drums mail-prsvr mailabbrev mail-utils gmm-utils mailheader pcvs-util add-log magit-process magit-mode transient pp benchmark magit-git magit-base evil-collection-magit-section magit-section format-spec cursor-sensor crm llama evil-collection-with-editor with-editor shell pcomplete recentf tree-widget wid-edit server autorevert filenotify gcmh hl-line winner smartparens-config smartparens-text smartparens advice loadhist undo-fu-session undo-fu evil-collection-flycheck flycheck-package package-lint evil-collection-imenu imenu evil-collection-finder finder finder-inf lisp-mnt evil-collection-package-menu package browse-url url url-proxy url-privacy url-expand url-methods url-history mailcap url-handlers flycheck find-func ws-butler editorconfig editorconfig-core editorconfig-core-handle editorconfig-fnmatch wakatime-mode ligature persp-mode doom-modeline doom-modeline-segments doom-modeline-env doom-modeline-core shrink-path f s dash nerd-icons nerd-icons-faces nerd-icons-data nerd-icons-data-mdicon nerd-icons-data-flicon nerd-icons-data-codicon nerd-icons-data-devicon nerd-icons-data-sucicon nerd-icons-data-wicon nerd-icons-data-faicon nerd-icons-data-powerline nerd-icons-data-octicon nerd-icons-data-pomicon nerd-icons-data-ipsicon compat dtrt-indent use-package-bind-key bind-key ue projectile project evil-collection-grep grep evil-collection-compile compile text-property-search evil-collection-comint comint ansi-osc ansi-color evil-collection-ibuffer ibuffer-vc ibuf-ext ibuffer ibuffer-loaddefs generic doom-themes-ext-org solaire-mode face-remap doom-one-theme doom-themes doom-themes-base evil-collection-atomic-chrome atomic-chrome websocket url-cookie generate-lisp-file url-domsuf url-util url-parse auth-source eieio password-cache url-vars bindat disp-table whitespace cap-words superword subword json map evil-collection-tabulated-list evil-collection-tab-bar evil-collection-simple evil-collection-replace evil-collection-process-menu evil-collection-kmacro evil-collection-info evil-collection-indent evil-collection-help evil-collection-eldoc evil-collection-buff-menu evil-collection annalist let-alist smartparens-elixir ns-auto-titlebar ibuf-macs evil evil-integration evil-maps evil-commands reveal evil-jumps evil-command-window evil-types evil-search evil-macros evil-repeat evil-states evil-core evil-common thingatpt rect evil-vars ring edmacro kmacro byte-opt derived doom-editor doom-projects doom-ui doom-keybinds use-package-core general info eieio-core comp comp-cstr cl-extra help-mode warnings icons comp-run bytecomp byte-compile comp-common rx :system easy-mmode doom-start doom doom-lib cl-seq cl-macs cl-loaddefs cl-lib doom-compat gv jansson dynamic-modules pcase subr-x rmc iso-transl tooltip cconv eldoc paren electric uniquify ediff-hook vc-hooks lisp-float-type mwheel term/ns-win ns-win ucs-normalize mule-util term/common-win tool-bar dnd fontset image regexp-opt fringe tabulated-list replace newcomment text-mode prog-mode register page tab-bar menu-bar rfn-eshadow isearch easymenu timer select scroll-bar mouse jit-lock font-lock syntax font-core term/tty-colors frame minibuffer nadvice seq simple cl-generic indonesian philippine cham georgian utf-8-lang misc-lang vietnamese tibetan thai tai-viet lao korean japanese eucjp-ms cp51932 hebrew greek romanian slovak czech european ethiopic indian cyrillic chinese composite emoji-zwj charscript charprop case-table epa-hook jka-cmpr-hook help abbrev obarray oclosure cl-preloaded button loaddefs theme-loaddefs faces cus-face macroexp files window text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env code-pages mule custom widget keymap hashtable-print-readable backquote threads xwidget-internal kqueue cocoa ns lcms2 multi-tty make-network-process native-compile emacs) Memory information: ((conses 16 1723170 514800) (symbols 48 110486 3) (strings 32 387607 = 49338) (string-bytes 1 13385179) (vectors 16 162710) (vector-slots 8 1980397 = 462793) (floats 8 1687 7990) (intervals 56 39429 795) (buffers 992 58))
Bror Winther <bbw@HIDDEN>:bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN.
Full text available.bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#79058; Package emacs.
Full text available.
GNU bug tracking system
Copyright (C) 1999 Darren O. Benham,
1997 nCipher Corporation Ltd,
1994-97 Ian Jackson.