GNU bug report logs - #79802
Please upgrade texinfo.tex, currently included version caused FTFBS in gnutls

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Message #5 received at submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eric Dorland <eric <at> kuroneko.ca>
To: bug-automake <at> gnu.org
Subject: Please upgrade texinfo.tex, currently included version caused FTFBS
 in gnutls
Date: Sun, 9 Nov 2025 16:10:14 -0500

Quoting from https://bugs.debian.org/1119031:

> Hello,
> 
> automake ships and installs texinfo.tex 2025-06-18.21. This version
> (well any version from 2025-03-01.21 up to 2025-07-31.19) has a bug that
> makes gnutls FTBFS (#111832).[1] The issue has been fixed in texinfo
> upstream yesterday, please upgrade to 2025-10-25.20.

-- 
Eric Dorland <eric <at> kuroneko.ca>
43CF 1228 F726 FD5B 474C  E962 C256 FBD5 0022 1E93

Message #8 received at 79802 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Karl Berry <karl <at> freefriends.org>
To: eric <at> kuroneko.ca
Cc: 79802 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#79802: Please upgrade texinfo.tex,
 currently included version caused FTFBS in gnutls
Date: Sun, 9 Nov 2025 14:47:44 -0700

Hi Eric. I updated texinfo.tex (and other common files) in the automake
repository. Thanks for mentioning it. Closing this. --karl.

P.S. Not so much directed at you as at the archives, for the sake of
other people who have written recently about this recurring question ...
I hope the suggestion was not to make another automake release. We have
never tried to make automake releases for such "mirrored file" problems
-- that would result in constant churn. The de-synchronization of
automake with the absolute latest version of everything is
unavoidable. Thus, people who need the latest version need to arrange to
get it themselves, e.g., from gnulib, since automake's version is hardly
ever the current one.

Message #16 received at 79802 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Eric Dorland <eric <at> kuroneko.ca>
To: Karl Berry <karl <at> freefriends.org>
Cc: 79802 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#79802: Please upgrade texinfo.tex, currently included
 version caused FTFBS in gnutls
Date: Tue, 11 Nov 2025 12:04:04 -0500

Thanks Karl. So you would recommend getting all those files
from gnulib? It's a large package but I guess we could split out the
automake depending parts into a smaller package.

* Karl Berry (karl <at> freefriends.org) wrote:
> Hi Eric. I updated texinfo.tex (and other common files) in the automake
> repository. Thanks for mentioning it. Closing this. --karl.
> 
> P.S. Not so much directed at you as at the archives, for the sake of
> other people who have written recently about this recurring question ...
> I hope the suggestion was not to make another automake release. We have
> never tried to make automake releases for such "mirrored file" problems
> -- that would result in constant churn. The de-synchronization of
> automake with the absolute latest version of everything is
> unavoidable. Thus, people who need the latest version need to arrange to
> get it themselves, e.g., from gnulib, since automake's version is hardly
> ever the current one.
> 

-- 
Eric Dorland <eric <at> kuroneko.ca>
43CF 1228 F726 FD5B 474C  E962 C256 FBD5 0022 1E93

Message #19 received at 79802 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Karl Berry <karl <at> freefriends.org>
To: eric <at> kuroneko.ca
Cc: 79802 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#79802: Please upgrade texinfo.tex, currently included
 version caused FTFBS in gnutls
Date: Tue, 11 Nov 2025 14:48:29 -0700

If you want to ensure you have the current versions of texinfo.tex,
config.{guess,sub}, and so on, yes, you should get them from gnulib (or
other upstreams, but we copy them into gnulib precisely to make it
simpler for people to get the current versions).

gnulib is what we (I) keep up to date with upstream changes, typically
within a day or two.

What I do for some of my projects where I don't have or want a whole
gnulib checkout hanging around is extract the build-aux directory from
its repository into a local directory (/home/ftp/dist in the code
below):

  # git incantation from Ben Pfaff, bug-gnulib 17 Jan 2012 18:38:18.
  auxtar=/tmp/build-aux.tar.gz
  if git archive --remote=git.sv.gnu.org:/srv/git/gnulib.git \
      refs/heads/master build-aux | gzip >$auxtar-new; then
   (
    cd /home/ftp/dist || exit 1
    mv $auxtar $auxtar-old
    mv $auxtar-new $auxtar || exit 1
    rm -rf build-aux
    tar xf $auxtar
   )
  fi

It would be possible to use the srclist-update script and srclist.txt
files (in gnulib/config, which is tiny, and rarely changes) to update
from there. I do that sometimes.

Another approach I've used in other cases is to compare the desired
build-aux files in a script run from cron, like the below. There are
some special cases in there that we need in TeX Live but I hope the idea
is clear enough.

No doubt other people have taken other approaches.

Hope this helps,
Karl

#  config.guess/sub/etc. [...] mirrored from gnulib.
# 
config_masterdir=/home/ftp/dist/build-aux
for gnuconf in ar-lib compile config.guess config.sub depcomp \
               install-sh texinfo.tex; do 
  master_conffile=$config_masterdir/$gnuconf
  local_conffile=../Build/source/build-aux/$gnuconf
  #
  if test ! -s $master_conffile; then
    echo "$0: $master_conffile missing, skipping." >&2
    continue
  fi
  #
  if $diff $local_conffile $master_conffile >$temp.$gnuconf.diff; then
    $verbose "  $gnuconf ok."
    rm -f $temp.$gnuconf.diff
  else
    # update needed, find all copies in source.
    # Build/source/utils/asymptote/gc* is not checked in (since it's not
    # unpacked in the original release), therefore we cannot commit to it.
    alldev="`find ../Build/source -name $gnuconf | grep -v asymptote/gc`"
    for f in $alldev; do
      $chicken $cp $master_conffile $f
    done
    update_list="$update_list $alldev"
    
    # in the case of config.guess, but nothing else, we also need it in
    # the installer.
    if test $gnuconf = config.guess; then
      installer_config_guess=tlpkg/installer/$gnuconf
      $chicken $cp $master_conffile $installer_config_guess
      update_list="$update_list $installer_config_guess"
    fi
  fi
done

Message #22 received at 79802 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Collin Funk <collin.funk1 <at> gmail.com>
To: Karl Berry <karl <at> freefriends.org>
Cc: 79802 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, eric <at> kuroneko.ca
Subject: Re: bug#79802: Please upgrade texinfo.tex, currently included
 version caused FTFBS in gnutls
Date: Tue, 11 Nov 2025 13:57:07 -0800

Karl Berry <karl <at> freefriends.org> writes:

> If you want to ensure you have the current versions of texinfo.tex,
> config.{guess,sub}, and so on, yes, you should get them from gnulib (or
> other upstreams, but we copy them into gnulib precisely to make it
> simpler for people to get the current versions).
>
> gnulib is what we (I) keep up to date with upstream changes, typically
> within a day or two.
>
> What I do for some of my projects where I don't have or want a whole
> gnulib checkout hanging around is extract the build-aux directory from
> its repository into a local directory (/home/ftp/dist in the code
> below):
>
>   # git incantation from Ben Pfaff, bug-gnulib 17 Jan 2012 18:38:18.
>   auxtar=/tmp/build-aux.tar.gz
>   if git archive --remote=git.sv.gnu.org:/srv/git/gnulib.git \
>       refs/heads/master build-aux | gzip >$auxtar-new; then
>    (
>     cd /home/ftp/dist || exit 1
>     mv $auxtar $auxtar-old
>     mv $auxtar-new $auxtar || exit 1
>     rm -rf build-aux
>     tar xf $auxtar
>    )
>   fi
>
> It would be possible to use the srclist-update script and srclist.txt
> files (in gnulib/config, which is tiny, and rarely changes) to update
> from there. I do that sometimes.
>
> Another approach I've used in other cases is to compare the desired
> build-aux files in a script run from cron, like the below. There are
> some special cases in there that we need in TeX Live but I hope the idea
> is clear enough.
>
> No doubt other people have taken other approaches.

An easier way, if you only require a few files and/or cannot remember
that git invocation is to fetch them using wget or curl.

For example, to get texinfo.tex you would use one of the following:

    https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/gnulib.git/plain/build-aux/texinfo.tex
    https://raw.githubusercontent.com/coreutils/gnulib/refs/heads/master/build-aux/texinfo.tex

The GitHub one is likely much faster and will have less downtime. It is
maintained by Coreutils and Gnulib committers.

Collin

Message #25 received at 79802 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Karl Berry <karl <at> freefriends.org>
To: collin.funk1 <at> gmail.com
Cc: 79802 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, eric <at> kuroneko.ca
Subject: Re: bug#79802: Please upgrade texinfo.tex, currently included
 version caused FTFBS in gnutls
Date: Tue, 11 Nov 2025 15:04:54 -0700

Hi Collin,

    An easier way, if you only require a few files and/or cannot remember
    that git invocation 

Well, whatever the invocation is has to be in a script/Makefile in any
case to be used repeatedly, so it's not a matter of remembering it. I
certainly didn't have it memorized, I copied that bit of shell from my
script that does it.

    is to fetch them using wget or curl.

Except, as you know, using wget/curl with savannah to retrieve files
adds to the load on savannah web servers, which are already continously
overstressed. Thus it is better to use other methods, in the sense of
doing something which will work for everyone, instead of being
(sometimes) the most convenient for an individual.  Categorical
imperative and all that.

As for github ... it just feels weird to me to rely on github for free
software projects. Just MHO. -k

Message #28 received at 79802 <at> debbugs.gnu.org (full text, mbox):

From: Collin Funk <collin.funk1 <at> gmail.com>
To: Karl Berry <karl <at> freefriends.org>
Cc: 79802 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, eric <at> kuroneko.ca
Subject: Re: bug#79802: Please upgrade texinfo.tex, currently included
 version caused FTFBS in gnutls
Date: Tue, 11 Nov 2025 14:13:14 -0800

Karl Berry <karl <at> freefriends.org> writes:

> Hi Collin,
>
>     An easier way, if you only require a few files and/or cannot remember
>     that git invocation 
>
> Well, whatever the invocation is has to be in a script/Makefile in any
> case to be used repeatedly, so it's not a matter of remembering it. I
> certainly didn't have it memorized, I copied that bit of shell from my
> script that does it.

True. I have seen very outdated texinfo.tex files (e.g. earlier than
2010), though, so some people might just run it once and forget until a
bug pops up. Of course, I like your solution better.

>     is to fetch them using wget or curl.
>
> Except, as you know, using wget/curl with savannah to retrieve files
> adds to the load on savannah web servers, which are already continously
> overstressed. Thus it is better to use other methods, in the sense of
> doing something which will work for everyone, instead of being
> (sometimes) the most convenient for an individual.  Categorical
> imperative and all that.
>
> As for github ... it just feels weird to me to rely on github for free
> software projects. Just MHO. -k

I agree regarding GitHub, but for this purpose it doesn't seem too bad.
The link I shared is the file itself, so it doesn't require non-free
JavaScript like the rest of the site. And Microsoft is paying for the
tiny amount of egress instead of the FSF. :)

Collin

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