Received: (at 81639) by debbugs.gnu.org; 31 Aug 2026 11:06:38 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Mon Aug 31 07:06:38 2026 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50996 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1x0zqY-0001ov-2z for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 31 Aug 2026 07:06:38 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:58132) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1x0zqV-0001oZ-Az for 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 31 Aug 2026 07:06:36 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1x0zqP-00024F-3z; Mon, 31 Aug 2026 07:06:29 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=Ff1WguR8dM3LoUbq5XBgIXtUlvHKJapZOOzVZv0VTLk=; b=KpfusjQrgYO8 G5FctCCsH3t7oCML2UV/e1t8/5FRNupYHfg2exp3MVTt+L8EJzWwFvsrlTVH9CgXROOeDS25jOOWI /1lhXxM+Lh4P8OyPWPJk1xgaxx6+unMqwjzaWvzAuGrYisZLZIEUROTJRcyEhv315qKKK1Wf656TJ x5GiXoRCWoOaVP8fWwzDnKXc2ZmowZZVcsKoEZkxtLal0BKW25ZNUNzF5nUpBdv/JD2ipwRrazJLr Nyd5AGQBVQMksg0E8wEr02/A4nAbIshbE4S5Aly6d+7mEAYYt0USoNNs1KVeq50ev2l2an4cFR4bh MoZGAEx8TtZsVSPL7CY7OA==; Date: Mon, 31 Aug 2026 14:06:17 +0300 Message-Id: <861pbea6s6.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Jared Finder <jared@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <a3c51119e5a495beddde3fbce9b2cd66@HIDDEN> (message from Jared Finder on Sun, 30 Aug 2026 15:11:50 -0700) Subject: Re: bug#81639: Please add alias from "ghostty" to "xterm" in faces.el References: <175a4d56da432fee65ea219f27710433@HIDDEN> <E1wwWJd-007EMQ-86@HIDDEN> <a2789115c7b011d6b13b22378bdb4cc5@HIDDEN> <86fr091blu.fsf@HIDDEN> <a3c51119e5a495beddde3fbce9b2cd66@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 81639 Cc: 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, rms@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) > Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2026 15:11:50 -0700 > From: Jared Finder <jared@HIDDEN> > Cc: rms@HIDDEN, 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > > On 2026-08-20 00:42, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > >> Cc: 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > >> Date: Wed, 19 Aug 2026 22:18:35 -0700 > >> From: Jared Finder via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, > >> the Swiss army knife of text editors" <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> > >> > >> They're correct that setting TERM to xterm-ghostty as a pracitcal > >> tradeoff generally makes things better for users, specifically because > >> ghostty is trying to be xterm behavior compatible. For example, Emacs > >> behaves more correct when TERM is set to xterm-ghostty specifically > >> because Emacs then assumes that the terminal is an xterm variant, > >> using > >> term/xterm.el for initialization. > > > > Can't we cater to both cases by adding lisp/term/ghostty that reused > > the parts of xterm.el which work fro Ghostty? I think this should be > > more robust and future-proof than just the alias. Since Emacs has a > > general machinery to cater to specifics of each terminal, it sounds > > not very clean to provide an alias, when "Ghostty is not de jure a > > xterm variant". Or what am I missing? > > I don't think we should do this. ghostty is attempting to be xterm > compatible as a core design principle. See > https://ghostty.org/docs/features#terminal-(vt)-features, where they > declare "Xterm compatibility: xterm is the de facto standard for > terminal emulation. If xterm does something, we should do the same > thing". They _attempt_ to be compatible, but in reality are somewhat incompatible, aren't they? Are you sure going with the declaration rather than with reality will help our users more than offering a dedicated term/ghostty.el? What are the disadvantages of the latter alternative?
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#81639; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 81639) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Aug 2026 22:21:53 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Aug 30 18:21:53 2026 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44127 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1x0nuT-0007uq-60 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Aug 2026 18:21:53 -0400 Received: from greenhill.hpalace.com ([192.155.80.58]:49888) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <jared@HIDDEN>) id 1x0nuQ-0007uh-QC for 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Aug 2026 18:21:51 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=finder.org; s=2018; t=1788128509; bh=bJqjilzJJDX1SDGthCWUTomF0UIm0cgglzcuAullVS4=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=UG0M+VD28vqHuup8neEkvR9+KAIIXUx2v1OEGd8h/p3ZqtbjdqI6aZHwWax3jFYFJ 5r6JBRVphjJ78L8JBs7/iKeeCsg+6f1yW2+rqcviC7NGONx7xi/dGLCKbKXWzhysr8 sR7TzXVpFutY7s8c1nC92Z4JTHPOgefjU5SUKqz1uTNvLZfGB6qG7ioCXyVwCB3KTU aJUJsSz8e5/PiLEY3+2dHq8ujoQfGZnWHbHgUAd1KM9Gdj66il2HeOQgIYHM4MHeqf gP6QkBK3ceoKrUHTRABcyAST9UkptAvR+V1so68Zmrodl8pE7RMun+5gYJVNmS49mL KwRoX4m8WqqAQ== Received: from mail.finder.org (unknown [192.155.80.58]) by greenhill.hpalace.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 721406FE; Sun, 30 Aug 2026 22:21:49 +0000 (UTC) MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2026 15:21:49 -0700 From: Jared Finder <jared@HIDDEN> To: rms@HIDDEN Subject: Re: bug#81639: Please add alias from "ghostty" to "xterm" in faces.el In-Reply-To: <E1wxzAB-004Rww-E1@HIDDEN> References: <175a4d56da432fee65ea219f27710433@HIDDEN> <E1wwWJd-007EMQ-86@HIDDEN> <a2789115c7b011d6b13b22378bdb4cc5@HIDDEN> <E1wxzAB-004Rww-E1@HIDDEN> Message-ID: <efec45b75ae847d2d4becf16258f09de@HIDDEN> X-Sender: jared@HIDDEN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 81639 Cc: 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) On 2026-08-22 20:46, Richard Stallman wrote: > [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] > [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] > [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > > > The main reason behind this is that the terminfo authors have > > > deliberately chosen to ship their own version of the terminfo > > > definition under a different name (ghostty instead of > xterm-ghostty), > > > with their own modifications that make it substantially different > from > > > our own terminfo definition, so it wouldn't even work > out-of-the-box > > > like what we had expected. Now, it is understandable from their > point > > > of view as custodians of the wider terminfo database, since > Ghostty is > > > not de jure a xterm variant, so it shouldn't receive the xterm- > prefix. > > This looks an incompatibility between two packages. I hope they can > work out cooperation. > > Can we help bring that about? > > Who are the people who maintain the system terminfo file? > What package is it in? How can we reach them? This is ncurses. The discussion that first added ghostty to the ncurses database was https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/bug-ncurses/2024-12/msg00035.html. However ncurses does choose to represent ghostty, I hope that Emacs can be compatible. In case you read emails in a different order -- I did attach a patch from a slightly earlier email. -- MJF
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#81639; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 81639) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Aug 2026 22:11:55 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sun Aug 30 18:11:55 2026 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44085 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1x0nkp-0007OY-4s for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Aug 2026 18:11:55 -0400 Received: from greenhill.hpalace.com ([192.155.80.58]:57356) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <jared@HIDDEN>) id 1x0nkm-0007OO-3x for 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sun, 30 Aug 2026 18:11:53 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=finder.org; s=2018; t=1788127911; bh=q7aTq+lFBFMK7+4yiADn/WsRtZGUp/DRSgCzqOkuHO8=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=YZX0ZfUqUwqf3grAhau7sYgtlZwy2WXDopPyql+fz7QxRyKQNZbUFaZeflAwMj+4e GaNjzXdtnH2O0NG0pYli9TBE6m/HUkvT1cl8dwDyUEhKLAW/aKRotdF+ER2fhW451G RADtYPtaFLpWKy2Cc/YnUQ9bA7Cb3CIr92766b7itMSVH7uNwhWQStaIpHUsIZ1nYY WtDwT/X9Wwf8vWQ0c109qzX7u7wdk6Znhpneal2AQmTijl16gcs65CgvUduUsiNJlv NpnUZWODY3LIAdKOhptj4rNWig4LXvF6RHjCK2EofVehokRHbRgGY12nwEam7hzpSH a8drpHn8RaKDA== Received: from mail.finder.org (unknown [192.155.80.58]) by greenhill.hpalace.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 07E0F6FE; Sun, 30 Aug 2026 22:11:51 +0000 (UTC) MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Sun, 30 Aug 2026 15:11:50 -0700 From: Jared Finder <jared@HIDDEN> To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#81639: Please add alias from "ghostty" to "xterm" in faces.el In-Reply-To: <86fr091blu.fsf@HIDDEN> References: <175a4d56da432fee65ea219f27710433@HIDDEN> <E1wwWJd-007EMQ-86@HIDDEN> <a2789115c7b011d6b13b22378bdb4cc5@HIDDEN> <86fr091blu.fsf@HIDDEN> Message-ID: <a3c51119e5a495beddde3fbce9b2cd66@HIDDEN> X-Sender: jared@HIDDEN Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=_d7e7faaab09dccd2a15027ba987ea444" X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 81639 Cc: 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, rms@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) --=_d7e7faaab09dccd2a15027ba987ea444 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed On 2026-08-20 00:42, Eli Zaretskii wrote: >> Cc: 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org >> Date: Wed, 19 Aug 2026 22:18:35 -0700 >> From: Jared Finder via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, >> the Swiss army knife of text editors" <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> >> >> They're correct that setting TERM to xterm-ghostty as a pracitcal >> tradeoff generally makes things better for users, specifically because >> ghostty is trying to be xterm behavior compatible. For example, Emacs >> behaves more correct when TERM is set to xterm-ghostty specifically >> because Emacs then assumes that the terminal is an xterm variant, >> using >> term/xterm.el for initialization. > > Can't we cater to both cases by adding lisp/term/ghostty that reused > the parts of xterm.el which work fro Ghostty? I think this should be > more robust and future-proof than just the alias. Since Emacs has a > general machinery to cater to specifics of each terminal, it sounds > not very clean to provide an alias, when "Ghostty is not de jure a > xterm variant". Or what am I missing? I don't think we should do this. ghostty is attempting to be xterm compatible as a core design principle. See https://ghostty.org/docs/features#terminal-(vt)-features, where they declare "Xterm compatibility: xterm is the de facto standard for terminal emulation. If xterm does something, we should do the same thing". I've attached a patch that just adds the alias. -- MJF --=_d7e7faaab09dccd2a15027ba987ea444 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Type: text/x-diff; name=0001-Make-the-Ghostty-terminal-an-alias-of-xterm-256color.patch Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=0001-Make-the-Ghostty-terminal-an-alias-of-xterm-256color.patch; size=792 RnJvbSBlZDFlMDA5YWUyOWQ1Mjk0NTQ5OTMxY2NhODg2Y2UwODk2OTM4OTI3IE1vbiBTZXAgMTcg MDA6MDA6MDAgMjAwMQpGcm9tOiBKYXJlZCBGaW5kZXIgPGphcmVkQGZpbmRlci5vcmc+CkRhdGU6 IFN1biwgMzAgQXVnIDIwMjYgMTU6MDc6NDcgLTA3MDAKU3ViamVjdDogW1BBVENIXSBNYWtlIHRo ZSBHaG9zdHR5IHRlcm1pbmFsIGFuIGFsaWFzIG9mIHh0ZXJtLTI1NmNvbG9yCgoqIGxpc3AvZmFj ZXMuZWwgKHRlcm0tZmlsZS1hbGlhc2VzKTogTWFrZSB0aGUgR2hvc3R0eSB0ZXJtaW5hbCBhbgph bGlhcyBvZiB4dGVybS0yNTZjb2xvci4gIChCdWcjODE2MzkpCi0tLQogbGlzcC9mYWNlcy5lbCB8 IDEgKwogMSBmaWxlIGNoYW5nZWQsIDEgaW5zZXJ0aW9uKCspCgpkaWZmIC0tZ2l0IGEvbGlzcC9m YWNlcy5lbCBiL2xpc3AvZmFjZXMuZWwKaW5kZXggOTRkYTRiYTAyOTAuLmYyNDU2OTdiM2I2IDEw MDY0NAotLS0gYS9saXNwL2ZhY2VzLmVsCisrKyBiL2xpc3AvZmFjZXMuZWwKQEAgLTQ4LDYgKzQ4 LDcgQEAgdGVybS1maWxlLWFsaWFzZXMKICAgICAoInZ0NDIwIiAuICJ2dDIwMCIpCiAgICAgKCJh bGFjcml0dHkiIC4gInh0ZXJtIikKICAgICAoImZvb3QiIC4gInh0ZXJtIikKKyAgICAoImdob3N0 dHkiIC4gInh0ZXJtIikKICAgICAoImNvbnRvdXIiIC4gInh0ZXJtIikpCiAgICJBbGlzdCBvZiB0 ZXJtaW5hbCB0eXBlIGFsaWFzZXMuCiBFbnRyaWVzIGFyZSBvZiB0aGUgZm9ybSAoVFlQRSAuIEFM SUFTKSwgd2hlcmUgYm90aCBlbGVtZW50cyBhcmUgc3RyaW5ncy4KLS0gCjIuNDcuMwoK --=_d7e7faaab09dccd2a15027ba987ea444--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#81639; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 81639) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Aug 2026 03:46:35 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sat Aug 22 23:46:35 2026 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:33096 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1wxzAJ-0006Cz-7N for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Aug 2026 23:46:35 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:43908) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <rms@HIDDEN>) id 1wxzAH-0005zP-DL for 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Sat, 22 Aug 2026 23:46:34 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <rms@HIDDEN>) id 1wxzAB-0002fy-On; Sat, 22 Aug 2026 23:46:27 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=Date:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: mime-version; bh=ruwYOlHsENfV0CghiocYvKsByjkozm1olhdBBTzQ9HA=; b=T7JODMU2YrHy deHhGTqzPkvUwpmw1U/Gd6ZsvA4PRblZ+/1/pNTwh1ED/QQ/75ysaHAJ1uF7Q8bX5IKFmTPKSdI4t 5vLg6MnErEYUSdI2V/Bd+ZqrnxdQg4eSmWftkBiuqzg5HmTrkA8VTyTIJu+fYsTLFdmMnyX3DLj3a Lr6aNPPFMpxKnBcJFL/OXZdC61Zr5I+W4HHcX6UWvm3N0C+ctdG8iMAIIPxgNZCf4mF86ADIWr6kY OH1Bj6+BUCgSu3FOtVJHJ5u5qm8F8NhqptxLt8Z5kMmMglVbtMvm8xhyXXLp/h6CNlRxruiKTmC1c Bx3cQUCubRDz7Wav69u+hA==; Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.93) (envelope-from <rms@HIDDEN>) id 1wxzAB-004Rww-E1; Sat, 22 Aug 2026 23:46:27 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman <rms@HIDDEN> To: Jared Finder <jared@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <a2789115c7b011d6b13b22378bdb4cc5@HIDDEN> (bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN) Subject: Re: bug#81639: Please add alias from "ghostty" to "xterm" in faces.el References: <175a4d56da432fee65ea219f27710433@HIDDEN> <E1wwWJd-007EMQ-86@HIDDEN> <a2789115c7b011d6b13b22378bdb4cc5@HIDDEN> Message-Id: <E1wxzAB-004Rww-E1@HIDDEN> Date: Sat, 22 Aug 2026 23:46:27 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 81639 Cc: 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Reply-To: rms@HIDDEN Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > The main reason behind this is that the terminfo authors have > > deliberately chosen to ship their own version of the terminfo > > definition under a different name (ghostty instead of xterm-ghostty), > > with their own modifications that make it substantially different from > > our own terminfo definition, so it wouldn't even work out-of-the-box > > like what we had expected. Now, it is understandable from their point > > of view as custodians of the wider terminfo database, since Ghostty is > > not de jure a xterm variant, so it shouldn't receive the xterm- prefix. This looks an incompatibility between two packages. I hope they can work out cooperation. Can we help bring that about? Who are the people who maintain the system terminfo file? What package is it in? How can we reach them? -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#81639; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 81639) by debbugs.gnu.org; 20 Aug 2026 07:43:15 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Thu Aug 20 03:43:15 2026 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:44695 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1wwxQh-0001rh-11 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 20 Aug 2026 03:43:15 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:42924) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1wwxQe-0001qJ-IJ for 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 20 Aug 2026 03:43:13 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1wwxQY-0003MS-KT; Thu, 20 Aug 2026 03:43:06 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=+q9VQ3CbPBlQZPwUuEmZGETEFe/tSTVUdVjKZ8uIv7E=; b=PQFHr6bftTti GnktZ/gBrZjPcl2kYuYNITIdDLNqNIbDJcx78kYj5A0AlRWFErVFmdBFLImGZ369JAClWxToh4N1J CAeLg6zDX8NeeuzGVZdHRHbiaccdBiLu1h+EEAttl4r+Qkwx/awRzd9e02OH1WpGq2neMYBFfCdGy 7thkNMWeXSPKSSvUAGUw76sl5InfkMhIRTxz9j3JZ7S6ZiWSKVSlyvi0VYFWWdssLqaYRj6oE2/Za HXp3EibVCqqYlLIw4chNI0lsE7jemkqsvJ5wfJ8xRDUy/ej+rk42wEEZNR2/8+O9HAHpS1GqQEVrO 3a5oyBELXilKuzOE//LU0A==; Date: Thu, 20 Aug 2026 10:42:53 +0300 Message-Id: <86fr091blu.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Jared Finder <jared@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <a2789115c7b011d6b13b22378bdb4cc5@HIDDEN> (bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN) Subject: Re: bug#81639: Please add alias from "ghostty" to "xterm" in faces.el References: <175a4d56da432fee65ea219f27710433@HIDDEN> <E1wwWJd-007EMQ-86@HIDDEN> <a2789115c7b011d6b13b22378bdb4cc5@HIDDEN> X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 81639 Cc: 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, rms@HIDDEN X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) > Cc: 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Wed, 19 Aug 2026 22:18:35 -0700 > From: Jared Finder via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, > the Swiss army knife of text editors" <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN> > > They're correct that setting TERM to xterm-ghostty as a pracitcal > tradeoff generally makes things better for users, specifically because > ghostty is trying to be xterm behavior compatible. For example, Emacs > behaves more correct when TERM is set to xterm-ghostty specifically > because Emacs then assumes that the terminal is an xterm variant, using > term/xterm.el for initialization. Can't we cater to both cases by adding lisp/term/ghostty that reused the parts of xterm.el which work fro Ghostty? I think this should be more robust and future-proof than just the alias. Since Emacs has a general machinery to cater to specifics of each terminal, it sounds not very clean to provide an alias, when "Ghostty is not de jure a xterm variant". Or what am I missing?
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#81639; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 81639) by debbugs.gnu.org; 20 Aug 2026 05:18:40 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Thu Aug 20 01:18:40 2026 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43392 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1wwvAl-0001Ek-Ga for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 20 Aug 2026 01:18:39 -0400 Received: from greenhill.hpalace.com ([192.155.80.58]:38420) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <jared@HIDDEN>) id 1wwvAj-0001Ea-6v for 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 20 Aug 2026 01:18:38 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=finder.org; s=2018; t=1787203115; bh=YqUDhWCqXsPuGPUKTgXq+B0Dj3y5C7lS2KHhdM6zdhU=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:From; b=dedBRvXOLm2u2tQAmNiPDim91bm/TXeD7BMR0aqS+ZkowVYVNJgQbpFLYQK3cwA4h GaDBKUAY/oJwyvfWEfDCUoP9WeWdBLfEf4V69fJBwVeh9ioyRaKvJgIzzfe7XUFEqe m+d53yO6hW8nSoMLKoIvNyEp0K9lKjQ+dqO9xJlszOoB/95nfTT12D/9WE0QGo372U bxasVRAxcFf/ZX1I1QN5YqzxCgOYe4C1Hv2M5+qsXIe/UQ5lbwU9RjAw9AJsAg4XVH krowYOwH23+dMHU+vXa4TPL96xFU7FiGXMHKQq7ipw5stfYWrn0bJam40LTVkzT4Jy P8TdkQZ+h+DIQ== Received: from mail.finder.org (unknown [192.155.80.58]) by greenhill.hpalace.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id CFEC95CB; Thu, 20 Aug 2026 05:18:35 +0000 (UTC) MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 19 Aug 2026 22:18:35 -0700 From: Jared Finder <jared@HIDDEN> To: rms@HIDDEN Subject: Re: bug#81639: Please add alias from "ghostty" to "xterm" in faces.el In-Reply-To: <E1wwWJd-007EMQ-86@HIDDEN> References: <175a4d56da432fee65ea219f27710433@HIDDEN> <E1wwWJd-007EMQ-86@HIDDEN> Message-ID: <a2789115c7b011d6b13b22378bdb4cc5@HIDDEN> X-Sender: jared@HIDDEN Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: 2.0 (++) X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "debbugs.gnu.org", has NOT identified this incoming email as spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: On 2026-08-18 19:46, Richard Stallman wrote: > [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] > [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] > [[[ foreign or [...] Content analysis details: (2.0 points, 10.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 2.0 DOS_RCVD_IP_TWICE_B Received from the same IP twice in a row (only one external relay) 0.0 SPF_HELO_NONE SPF: HELO does not publish an SPF Record -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 81639 Cc: 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) On 2026-08-18 19:46, Richard Stallman wrote: > [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] > [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] > [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > I know where to find the ncurses developers. Can you tell me > how to reach the ghostty develpers? Ghostty developers mostly do discussions on GitHub and Discord, specifically https://github.com/ghostty-org/ghostty and https://discord.com/invite/ghostty, respectively. The motivation for setting TERM to xterm-ghostty is well documented at https://github.com/ghostty-org/ghostty/discussions/8268, which can be viewed without signing in with GitHub accounts. For people's convienience, I've copied pasted the relevant section below: > After some discussion among the team, we're reversing our position > regarding the system terminfo distribution — that is, we won't be > waiting for systems to come with Ghostty's terminfo definition > preinstalled. People should always use one of the manual or automated > ways to install it from their local client, or find some way to install > an extra terminfo package (e.g. ghostty-terminfo) from the system > package repository if one exists. > > The main reason behind this is that the terminfo authors have > deliberately chosen to ship their own version of the terminfo > definition under a different name (ghostty instead of xterm-ghostty), > with their own modifications that make it substantially different from > our own terminfo definition, so it wouldn't even work out-of-the-box > like what we had expected. Now, it is understandable from their point > of view as custodians of the wider terminfo database, since Ghostty is > not de jure a xterm variant, so it shouldn't receive the xterm- prefix. > In practice, however, we've found out that a lot of legacy programs > rely on TERM containing the xterm substring to enable a lot of features > that originated with xterm (extended colors support, most OSCs, etc), > while ignoring terminfo completely. We, much like other innovative > terminal emulators like Kitty, found it easier to just include the > xterm- prefix out of de facto pragmatism, diverging from the philosophy > of the terminfo maintainers. > > If you feel like this is unreasonable/dumb/etc. and none of this should > be the way this is, we don't blame you. Terminal emulators have had a > long history and with it come generations of technical cruft. You're > more than welcome to simply set TERM=xterm-256color and move on with > your life. What I am trying to say is that this is a problem not just > isolated to Ghostty, and the only true way to "fix" this once and for > all is to reduce dependency on TERM itself by using alternatives like > XTGETTCAP or capability-based queries at runtime. For now there are > only workarounds, automated or not. They're correct that setting TERM to xterm-ghostty as a pracitcal tradeoff generally makes things better for users, specifically because ghostty is trying to be xterm behavior compatible. For example, Emacs behaves more correct when TERM is set to xterm-ghostty specifically because Emacs then assumes that the terminal is an xterm variant, using term/xterm.el for initialization. -- MJF
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#81639; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 81639) by debbugs.gnu.org; 19 Aug 2026 02:46:17 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Tue Aug 18 22:46:17 2026 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59357 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1wwWJl-0008Cs-3Y for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 18 Aug 2026 22:46:17 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:58946) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <rms@HIDDEN>) id 1wwWJj-0008CT-5J for 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 18 Aug 2026 22:46:15 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <rms@HIDDEN>) id 1wwWJd-0002hT-Gq; Tue, 18 Aug 2026 22:46:09 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=Date:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: mime-version; bh=DIbZHsA5QOyOGOODbxcguMACfHmyibll4O2py18aTRc=; b=c7bp5SLpRlqj tv0z+cG54eZxNxlXlcJA+FA3kXuf8xyJDCwkNrxvHJ+FnRccI0umE/OGFugzN81V88bd0LfNtdZ4G 7/Xur0MPxfQOplw+ZC4hTswWUrsW0eXJyhWrL+pLS9Qlh+f1vhL5fhD8R0BWE5m1J1Ydu8I6phdJz rb3E0hSosoIWTL78fCO4i9EhGhktrS9C9B1S2dEANHfglU3GUNfmvDaUcIBr6p6a3Z1CGzd2anib/ YQM3+xVat5TCFSkFnKgQG6PjzXkiDF7bysUEg5lfT9A/WxdsxWi1jncXsJZ/MnRDWLbpLNGMUccgW KxK7LZ0wJW7B28f0nwzrnQ==; Received: from rms by fencepost.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.93) (envelope-from <rms@HIDDEN>) id 1wwWJd-007EMQ-86; Tue, 18 Aug 2026 22:46:09 -0400 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=Utf-8 From: Richard Stallman <rms@HIDDEN> To: Jared Finder <jared@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <175a4d56da432fee65ea219f27710433@HIDDEN> (bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN) Subject: Re: bug#81639: Please add alias from "ghostty" to "xterm" in faces.el References: <175a4d56da432fee65ea219f27710433@HIDDEN> Message-Id: <E1wwWJd-007EMQ-86@HIDDEN> Date: Tue, 18 Aug 2026 22:46:09 -0400 X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 81639 Cc: 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Reply-To: rms@HIDDEN Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] I know where to find the ncurses developers. Can you tell me how to reach the ghostty develpers? -- Dr Richard Stallman (https://stallman.org) Chief GNUisance of the GNU Project (https://gnu.org) Founder, Free Software Foundation (https://fsf.org) Internet Hall-of-Famer (https://internethalloffame.org)
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#81639; Package emacs.
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From: Sean Whitton <spwhitton@HIDDEN>
To: Jared Finder <jared@HIDDEN>, 81639 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: Re: bug#81639: Please add alias from "ghostty" to "xterm" in faces.el
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Date: Tue, 18 Aug 2026 12:37:04 +0100
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Jared Finder via "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" [16/Aug 9:10pm -07] wrote:
> Ghostty is a terminal emulator that intends to be fully xterm
> compatible. Unfortunately, due to disagreements between the ncurses
> maintainers and the Ghostty maintainers, it has two TERM values:
> "xterm-ghostty" (preferred by ghostty maintainers) and "ghostty"
> (preferred by ncurses maintainers). Many people run with TERM set to
> "ghostty" because that's what ncurses packages, however that prevents
> Emacs from noticing that this terminal is xterm compatible.
>
> Adding ("ghostty" . "xterm") to term-file-aliases enables Emacs to
> properly handle this terminal with both values. It's a simple patch:
>
> ("vt420" . "vt200")
> ("alacritty" . "xterm")
> ("foot" . "xterm")
> - ("contour" . "xterm"))
> + ("contour" . "xterm")
> + ("ghostty" . "xterm"))
> "Alist of terminal type aliases.
> Entries are of the form (TYPE . ALIAS), where both elements are
> strings.
> This means to treat a terminal of type TYPE as if it were of type
> ALIAS."
I think this is fine, please turn it into a git-am'able patch and we can
install it.
--
Sean Whitton
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#81639; Package emacs.
Full text available.
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From: Jared Finder <jared@HIDDEN>
To: Bug-gnu Emacs <bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN>
Subject: Please add alias from "ghostty" to "xterm" in faces.el
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Ghostty is a terminal emulator that intends to be fully xterm
compatible. Unfortunately, due to disagreements between the ncurses
maintainers and the Ghostty maintainers, it has two TERM values:
"xterm-ghostty" (preferred by ghostty maintainers) and "ghostty"
(preferred by ncurses maintainers). Many people run with TERM set to
"ghostty" because that's what ncurses packages, however that prevents
Emacs from noticing that this terminal is xterm compatible.
Adding ("ghostty" . "xterm") to term-file-aliases enables Emacs to
properly handle this terminal with both values. It's a simple patch:
("vt420" . "vt200")
("alacritty" . "xterm")
("foot" . "xterm")
- ("contour" . "xterm"))
+ ("contour" . "xterm")
+ ("ghostty" . "xterm"))
"Alist of terminal type aliases.
Entries are of the form (TYPE . ALIAS), where both elements are
strings.
This means to treat a terminal of type TYPE as if it were of type
ALIAS."
-- MJF
Jared Finder <jared@HIDDEN>:bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN.
Full text available.bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#81639; Package emacs.
Full text available.
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