Received: (at 70984) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 May 2024 12:53:52 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Fri May 17 08:53:52 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:55115 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1s7x5s-0000zu-9L for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 17 May 2024 08:53:52 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.15]:39205) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <stephen.berman@HIDDEN>) id 1s7x5p-0000zo-U7 for 70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 17 May 2024 08:53:51 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmx.net; s=s31663417; t=1715950420; x=1716555220; i=stephen.berman@HIDDEN; bh=nYC74aF1zMGtkgRAtTvhZDz2/amrT6M2opCbz0IC/Uc=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date: Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:cc: content-transfer-encoding:content-type:date:from:message-id: mime-version:reply-to:subject:to; b=DEMHszvn4VjjQ+aO8rsyk0Uu3jaSHk5PtBaNFXN1vJQJlCkthOuCHN3qQdIQzQdj HMkmy4gwIVeTEWFVVGwDvyPKNIMJKH3NWxYZIAqoGMW7ybR0BZEHjXOYeg5N4rMle fZc9pqSiieWOOSCUF82VTpAOfZF9SEfSnZ4hkIuhu7Vvr2P8VhqvJ5hLZKxRBRGGg lqhrlq4mYFRaEC0ht/KH83PpK06NA+dntEwZxEjBXFYtplwC7lwI2DtfmZJc5Xtui Jzlf+knFLipj3Em/hf3HNnUFkIxscDHsRi9cdXWW5mO+Bf4TJgcygRLJx4o/1Vkju 0CKNIGctBAng2Zf0AA== X-UI-Sender-Class: 724b4f7f-cbec-4199-ad4e-598c01a50d3a Received: from strobelfs ([88.130.50.168]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx005 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1Mo6qv-1svsuF22Rv-00pbCc; Fri, 17 May 2024 14:53:40 +0200 From: Stephen Berman <stephen.berman@HIDDEN> To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#70984: 30.0.50; Improved support for entering quotation marks, Re: bug#70984: 30.0.50; Improved support for entering quotation marks In-Reply-To: <87eda0iqqs.fsf@HIDDEN> (Robert Pluim's message of "Fri, 17 May 2024 14:10:03 +0200") References: <87r0e1j03u.fsf@HIDDEN> <87r0e1j03u.fsf@HIDDEN> <86cypliwf5.fsf@HIDDEN> <87msooj305.fsf@HIDDEN> <87r0e0c0i3.fsf@HIDDEN> <87ikzcizjm.fsf@HIDDEN> <87msoobvy5.fsf@HIDDEN> <87eda0iqqs.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Fri, 17 May 2024 14:53:39 +0200 Message-ID: <87ikzcbnvw.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:YnKdpR/bSW8kp/TyT6CPVVF4pBPh3CtJytwWrhGrgNA3D4lghE/ p1uHwiXQA/OeT2ARoioiXlp3J7MQN4IgFc5HYU8Jnz9JRCtz+ExTOBPLY4EppOw80Wax+Lg RQZwPFTXRgSz/8ZYNiIRAJF/gzkbawul+O61I6a4YLQw6Q/TF4MV34CmAAoyB2J6wjm7mp7 R20yupSksFesMZmNj1GfA== X-Spam-Flag: NO UI-OutboundReport: notjunk:1;M01:P0:/o0ejJ5U22Q=;NkGRJGoFpHoH3MGxeaB2znji1aT ArSluh4H+0pk0kWcWqimCMZQNKZkx1TPAhrUliG5nUryOikC6DnUVwiB5OnZwEVJ59lixP9BM S97X9mWZUxUsQN/QFuPuS4+KGg3+/oY0BzLda5bZKlpC1sIcb6zQou6TYooiEYTWnfT/2CuZE i5hYTbrvEbwIiwR3r/ZavqPpeAi4H1gD6cAYN8EmMlcPz2mJ3uz2CjZfiEsy7DG0lO9ilQzCD HlMhc/PpYPt2ljcQgtDQr4nBbR9st+8y+3zeG6A8T/cOhNAHqwpdbltjFU0CIH7m/rjFgir/p IOwx05suF5oRXHj5kCQFkSCLz1ey3lez7LztigJd4OuYWyK70TM5K2hM3A3d1pc6wcrx/tbjY ReXABIzJkgSvFzyexJG4/N+B46iALYA4k0N3Y0w3koQ4pOR1yEduk8RmJyPJHJs1WwakAzx5F jAKUaW3PMCDiHxJIhvUrHoA+sZ0i3KaYy2FyrV6Y7pQlR+85RzOwFoDpDJKDiL3wOVx4Uo6Ii MRseCUddT2thle5K3jrgkN35Kyo2kexftPDVbrmJGfYBHvYIwCIqCdThJOWrNFmxI43+tq4wM 40WUTl3gsduw44RnaW5Q+lRr8YoI5uh6H5X1KcSrHaLC5mxQ83Ju7cbL1iiIiWP3gp4FF/xZr EZfjW3whdHzLkwMxkMYQtn9es1JmKqA9ZgiKXgVYY2UDTpgHgQ8Hf2meqLl+pp8Sa53NCs7jU ixjO4Oa1xpkFS9unCpI+xjR27hjZRjZHKNHrReaw4kQbJQiHkUbLQRdA9H9Rk+X47J/4FaAT0 gcXtagMvaBCaVWr18SGzKFOTD+BTeqXyOU5PpZh+Xe6Go= X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 70984 Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, 70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) On Fri, 17 May 2024 14:10:03 +0200 Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> wrote: [...] > >> (The official German layout has them on 2nd or 3rd > >> level shift variants of 'x' and 'v', which I thought was too > >> convoluted to emulate). > > 'AltGr =C3=97 <release> S-v' to produce "=E2=80=98", for example, where '= =C3=97' is > located where I=CA=BCd put ESC. Sorry, I don't follow you here. (Or do you mean like the key sequences I give for these characters below? But there there's no ESC and no release.) > Stephen> Probably. To add to the convolution, I use a German keyboar= d under > Stephen> Xfce4 with the no dead keys layout, and that assigns "=E2=80= =9E" to AltGr-v and > Stephen> "=E2=80=9C" to AltGr-b; no idea why... > > That=CA=BCs a gratuitous but coherent difference from the T2 layout, and > much easier to type. 'C-x 8 v' and 'C-x 8 b' (and thus 'A-v' and > 'A-b') are unused by iso-transl, we could put them there as well (or > only there) for the German language, since they seem sensible. > > Where do you have "=E2=80=9A" and "=E2=80=98"? We can copy those as well. AltGr-S-v for "=E2=80=9A" and AltGr-S-b for "=E2=80=98", which nicely paral= lels the bindings for "=E2=80=9E" and "=E2=80=9C", but it seems that can't be done w= ith the C-x 8 map: Typing `C-x 8 S-v' tells me "C-x 8 v is undefined" (n.b.: "v" not "V"). Steve Berman
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN
:bug#70984
; Package emacs
.
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Eli> I don't have any objections, but I'm not going to be a frequent us= er Eli> of this, so I guess we'll let the users judge that. Apropos, what about the following for electric-quote-chars? I think I=CA=BCve covered most of the common combinations: diff --git a/lisp/electric.el b/lisp/electric.el index fee0bf36d7f..406eac2f3a1 100644 --- a/lisp/electric.el +++ b/lisp/electric.el @@ -506,12 +506,55 @@ electric-quote-string :version "25.1" :type 'boolean :safe 'booleanp :group 'electricity) =20 +(define-widget 'electric-quote-chars-type 'lazy + "Display list of electric quote chars." + :group 'electricity + :format "%t:\n%v\n" + :type '(list (character :tag "Left single quote ") + (character :tag "Right single quote") + (character :tag "Left double quote ") + (character :tag "Right double quote"))) + (defcustom electric-quote-chars '(?=E2=80=98 ?=E2=80=99 ?=E2=80=9C ?=E2=80= =9D) "Curved quote characters for `electric-quote-mode'. This list's members correspond to left single quote, right single -quote, left double quote, and right double quote, respectively." +quote, left double quote, and right double quote, respectively. + +There are predefined settings for common styles, or you can define +your own custom style." :version "26.1" - :type '(list character character character character) + :type '(choice + ;; The countries and languages mentioned here are not intended + ;; to be an exhaustive list. + ;; US English, Canada, India, Brazil=E2=80=A6, almost everywhere= in + ;; fact. + (electric-quote-chars-type :tag "Default" (?=E2=80=98 ?=E2=80=99= ?=E2=80=9C ?=E2=80=9D)) + ;; This style has ?=E2=80=9C and ?=E2=80=9D as first level quota= tion, + ;; which is why they're on the single quote, not double quote. + ;; UK English + (electric-quote-chars-type :tag "Reversed" (?=E2=80=9C ?=E2=80= =9D ?=E2=80=98 ?=E2=80=99 )) + ;; France + (electric-quote-chars-type :tag "Guillemets" (?=C2=AB ?=C2=BB ?= =C2=AB ?=C2=BB)) + ;; Switzerland + (electric-quote-chars-type :tag "Single/double guillemets" (?=E2= =80=B9 ?=E2=80=BA ?=C2=AB ?=C2=BB)) + ;; Norway + (electric-quote-chars-type :tag "Single quote guillemets" (?=E2= =80=98 ?=E2=80=99 ?=C2=AB ?=C2=BB)) + ;; Greece, Italy, Portugal + (electric-quote-chars-type :tag "Guillemets double quote" (?=C2= =AB ?=C2=BB ?=E2=80=9C ?=E2=80=9D)) + ;; This style also has ?=E2=80=9C and ?=E2=80=9D as first level = quotation, + ;; Spain, Ukraine + (electric-quote-chars-type :tag "Double quote guillemets" (?=E2= =80=9C ?=E2=80=9D ?=C2=AB ?=C2=BB )) + ;; Hebrew, Sweden + (electric-quote-chars-type :tag "Right only" (?=E2=80=99 ?=E2=80= =99 ?=E2=80=9D ?=E2=80=9D)) + ;; Netherlands + (electric-quote-chars-type :tag "Low/high right only" (?=E2=80= =9A ?=E2=80=99 ?=E2=80=9E ?=E2=80=9D)) + ;; Germany + (electric-quote-chars-type :tag "Low/high right/left" (?=E2=80= =9A ?=E2=80=98 ?=E2=80=9E ?=E2=80=9C)) + ;; Chinese, simplified. + (electric-quote-chars-type :tag "Corners" (?=E3=80=8C ?=E3=80=8D= ?=E3=80=8E ?=E3=80=8F)) + ;; Chinese, traditional. + (electric-quote-chars-type :tag "Corners reversed" (?=E3=80=8E ?= =E3=80=8F?=E3=80=8C ?=E3=80=8D)) + (electric-quote-chars-type :tag "Custom" (?=E2=80=98 ?=E2=80=99 = ?=E2=80=9C ?=E2=80=9D))) :safe (lambda (x) (pcase x (`(,(pred characterp) ,(pred characterp) Robert --=20
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN
:bug#70984
; Package emacs
.
Full text available.Received: (at 70984) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 May 2024 12:11:16 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Fri May 17 08:11:16 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54848 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1s7wQd-0000Nd-MU for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 17 May 2024 08:11:15 -0400 Received: from mail-wm1-f53.google.com ([209.85.128.53]:46190) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <rpluim@HIDDEN>) id 1s7wQc-0000NV-1Y for 70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 17 May 2024 08:11:15 -0400 Received: by mail-wm1-f53.google.com with SMTP id 5b1f17b1804b1-41fd5dc0439so499995e9.0 for <70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Fri, 17 May 2024 05:11:11 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1715947805; x=1716552605; darn=debbugs.gnu.org; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:message-id:date:references :in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=Ld6coU9aSTlT0Zp7uusdW+m8CmJzTknYkr8YhxdRO88=; b=QrcDp2rXfbfWrcC6wQGEa8VPnMGdHaNelS8xwHHcy1Q7m8w3G8oLDIgVXtSgNSSgDS txPb5r6FZzcrUzmbzmObtDIU+zXQ/GHu2M8lWapeAlpYvpFQkLMU3a/J4KldFW8cntx0 yL0bD4fsz5LwDAAlvQHeLYgqCTUEgj3a5MnMm/Ex1mxGzsWnqh9I1KM/DJsQSuQO31wP 3+StLeav6sk/qWKuDgZaice0uUem1ahr6YqZ6YqapSTAL5xCmgsW8O9bPBvsyY9rKIzT 3xl5l/gIFswgDfzGIKWxy8ajmz7pHoaNzJM8uCRKanYJilwWX6AeVBCTWQoxWk1NL3/I ABmg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1715947805; x=1716552605; h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:message-id:date:references :in-reply-to:subject:cc:to:from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=Ld6coU9aSTlT0Zp7uusdW+m8CmJzTknYkr8YhxdRO88=; b=TGzYLzr0eFKRXHiSmjUDM0rp0l/MEwtWEOqQza2PnwQJUcmGDlyhiPz7Jd5fBHpUgN uW1V7fZv+CbX/ETojQpaF+gFet2gLwshMepkl7H5gZ+JE5/M/yiDhtqpUbBVl1JYbxv+ v/FTav4BMiJ1FZh96PK8D6qvSft39USxMJ5y3f65HTYKhI0ias5H24SlM9psM7yZcvvD SuDQDq0Fh+DnN6vDbaZWhX7QCRPdptwJ62jdpQY4b5bbaaS6eo8CWdSpxQ8yTnUB0ls5 ybM14r9okAZYO54MqWNy86+V2DJlRYqZ3qt1O555M3a90jRdO97B6AzoCODyC8J3cMig NgsA== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCVron/9m6gyRCj06DzeEIfyaINY36o9OtaD40TerK0fMlprj7xnfZ7fLSXtGhA5h1Wjjx2VoVb0Ij2hiZs9VI/4tGkgXwg= X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YzuI44Avr+kuGdGYMeQrNTrF2fdc4SUBGTq/dxLHQnB7THmkbIK WlCHWKdQ+UvAoUjdKEqcpFSqxxqKoaXExe/5CZpZXy3S5Mn4gNYnzC+QIw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IEZ6PwSzbbUC543qiwxqhvB+A/sT4RZgQEbKgYC5Gpz6A2mD5MByNSjH2Wpg40JDOmGnt0rRA== X-Received: by 2002:a05:600c:314e:b0:418:3eb7:e8c6 with SMTP id 5b1f17b1804b1-41fea927e69mr184557865e9.5.1715947804679; Fri, 17 May 2024 05:10:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rltb ([82.66.8.55]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 5b1f17b1804b1-42028c7730dsm65124055e9.25.2024.05.17.05.10.03 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Fri, 17 May 2024 05:10:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> To: Stephen Berman <stephen.berman@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#70984: 30.0.50; Improved support for entering quotation marks, Re: bug#70984: 30.0.50; Improved support for entering quotation marks In-Reply-To: <87msoobvy5.fsf@HIDDEN> (Stephen Berman's message of "Fri, 17 May 2024 11:59:30 +0200") References: <87r0e1j03u.fsf@HIDDEN> <87r0e1j03u.fsf@HIDDEN> <86cypliwf5.fsf@HIDDEN> <87msooj305.fsf@HIDDEN> <87r0e0c0i3.fsf@HIDDEN> <87ikzcizjm.fsf@HIDDEN> <87msoobvy5.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Fri, 17 May 2024 14:10:03 +0200 Message-ID: <87eda0iqqs.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 70984 Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, 70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) >>>>> On Fri, 17 May 2024 11:59:30 +0200, Stephen Berman <stephen.berman@gm= x.net> said: >> Exactly (should I put the existing C-x 8 bindings in the NEWS >> entry?). Stephen> That probably would have spared me my momentary puzzlement and= the brief Stephen> time it took me to discover 'C-x 8 <' and 'C-x 8 >', but I'm n= ot sure Stephen> that makes them NEWSworthy. Since people don=CA=BCt read NEWS, does it matter? =F0=9F=98=89 It can=CA= =BCt hurt. >> I=CA=BCm more doubtful about my choices for the German quotation mar= ks in >> the C-x 8 map. They correspond to the keys that have '(' and ')' on >> the US keyboard, but not the German standard keyboard, but they=CA= =BCre >> easy to type on both layouts. I could put them on 'C-x 8 8' and 'C-x= 8 >> 9', since those can produce '[' and ']' in the German layout, which = is >> kind of mnemonic. Stephen> Yeah, and also shifted '8' and '9' produce "(" and ")" in the = German Stephen> layout, so using '8' and '9' for another pairing seems better = motivated Stephen> for the German iso-transl map than '9' and '0'. OK, I can make that change. >> (The official German layout has them on 2nd or 3rd >> level shift variants of 'x' and 'v', which I thought was too >> convoluted to emulate). 'AltGr =C3=97 <release> S-v' to produce "=E2=80=98", for example, where '= =C3=97' is located where I=CA=BCd put ESC. Stephen> Probably. To add to the convolution, I use a German keyboard = under Stephen> Xfce4 with the no dead keys layout, and that assigns "=E2=80= =9E" to AltGr-v and Stephen> "=E2=80=9C" to AltGr-b; no idea why... That=CA=BCs a gratuitous but coherent difference from the T2 layout, and much easier to type. 'C-x 8 v' and 'C-x 8 b' (and thus 'A-v' and 'A-b') are unused by iso-transl, we could put them there as well (or only there) for the German language, since they seem sensible. Where do you have "=E2=80=9A" and "=E2=80=98"? We can copy those as well. Robert --=20
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN
:bug#70984
; Package emacs
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Full text available.Received: (at 70984) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 May 2024 10:44:36 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Fri May 17 06:44:36 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54458 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1s7v4m-0004v0-Ek for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 17 May 2024 06:44:36 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:37384) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1s7v4j-0004ug-VM for 70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 17 May 2024 06:44:35 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1s7v4V-0008AH-DV; Fri, 17 May 2024 06:44:25 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=LI22TPlFLigU0Yj6210XEpRgkvgZLZZUYWdr3dLxB6E=; b=Ok/vvvKq1FKueJUObR0y nIIpDQmy6x2jhwZEBaEJt+XKIAF0lS6WCdAjlRNblfAsV0ESN8eCARBJs7vCl3cZoRaKpylzpFibS xXQyh5t7M/PFiEHuvl3r8GwO9xq54TJfoabdIoq7opqPmHau+sEo3LTNCSleL2sqQAOe2vpyoLGlb rz3aXcmSJvgQcSYbSe2R3/sf5n/VuRTBIUpix3/TP2vCxH7L1eXjnG3aOn0eWLt254f4g7bSBE+2c Lu1uvtxr3ddtw+yY2cT+lauTyEwR45e2r/L7l6bxLQ1xZf7RE9CbdtqryokLXGh3vOEzc/1nd8MYy ZczcmtHNTNFzgw==; Date: Fri, 17 May 2024 13:44:12 +0300 Message-Id: <864jawhg5f.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <87msooj305.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Robert Pluim on Fri, 17 May 2024 09:45:14 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#70984: 30.0.50; Improved support for entering quotation marks, Re: bug#70984: 30.0.50; Improved support for entering quotation marks References: <87r0e1j03u.fsf@HIDDEN> <87r0e1j03u.fsf@HIDDEN> <86cypliwf5.fsf@HIDDEN> <87msooj305.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 70984 Cc: stephen.berman@HIDDEN, 70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> > Cc: Stephen Berman <stephen.berman@HIDDEN>, 70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org > Date: Fri, 17 May 2024 09:45:14 +0200 > > Iʼm assuming this means youʼre both ok with the key sequences I chose. I don't have any objections, but I'm not going to be a frequent user of this, so I guess we'll let the users judge that.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN
:bug#70984
; Package emacs
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Full text available.Received: (at 70984) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 May 2024 09:59:45 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Fri May 17 05:59:45 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54285 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1s7uNN-0004K5-5e for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 17 May 2024 05:59:45 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.19]:47709) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <stephen.berman@HIDDEN>) id 1s7uNI-0004Jx-Lk for 70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 17 May 2024 05:59:44 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmx.net; s=s31663417; t=1715939971; x=1716544771; i=stephen.berman@HIDDEN; bh=KvmEyHhZ44PZaHBDjAwAev2ZZYOJkkrpX0VATtrvTMI=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date: Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:cc: content-transfer-encoding:content-type:date:from:message-id: mime-version:reply-to:subject:to; b=GpHKbDVWKGYruqSHy3uw4VsEgpUGRG7U6g2PRJ8xXTWRg2o8xAzXWtmd2HqJ6sCQ Ae4MXhLOpkZkIDkqjXmJzQVEeLh6NIv39Uu5HU/0W5PEg/IBOCQTGrNnGCMbv6aoK U+X4U8DVyYMb/dPRxdT8ikgZ+BLiN9nLCxtO83BivwLJauQMb64bLZ9iLcAF/zwko FzAA67Ken7+2keCmPu6/+lvsM5YA0rAo+c+msG42Rh7kduIFsRigDJK2VcpgT4in8 STMGA7igsoou5SmzQRh9JSvj2Pq/hKyHD7O8oYiCpVjhvGWEoI/kWC4jy1RMjMhgJ qSsXTrnjSiyiSqR71A== X-UI-Sender-Class: 724b4f7f-cbec-4199-ad4e-598c01a50d3a Received: from strobelfs ([88.130.50.168]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx005 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1Mdeb5-1sgy8p41NB-00ZdTV; Fri, 17 May 2024 11:59:31 +0200 From: Stephen Berman <stephen.berman@HIDDEN> To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#70984: 30.0.50; Improved support for entering quotation marks, Re: bug#70984: 30.0.50; Improved support for entering quotation marks In-Reply-To: <87ikzcizjm.fsf@HIDDEN> (Robert Pluim's message of "Fri, 17 May 2024 10:59:57 +0200") References: <87r0e1j03u.fsf@HIDDEN> <87r0e1j03u.fsf@HIDDEN> <86cypliwf5.fsf@HIDDEN> <87msooj305.fsf@HIDDEN> <87r0e0c0i3.fsf@HIDDEN> <87ikzcizjm.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Fri, 17 May 2024 11:59:30 +0200 Message-ID: <87msoobvy5.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:AJDrsKKsk6HqBFQVcPNYKsHXwNRN8UDssDLbR7+OKqpNQHlDoh/ sq5CspdLJ4OBYbjsPg1BLdp1kpKwK5wwRyrnQ5OnuL2lvyHSxG8glA6yy43Qy1VgP8YJvUw veajqaUiIHvAPHc5GYjCCZ+apmhfLAO94DeBmBG33m7w1xj5dtD5eWsbq/M792K8N6KzOkC eVW64FZfOeiNHREl8io9A== X-Spam-Flag: NO UI-OutboundReport: notjunk:1;M01:P0:2nhwFV01T0c=;CArQbUBo1KSJUiKVKNx0DaBm724 j7r+ydi78NjltvrszxzYhfXZHN+TrWOLiGnOZwq5akoRjvzwNQsbvoh4JjZTw3SvwNie+Nxy5 fbNWH2PYq8tFQFlk5Aqz16nIwr2lqMxP7E8jOlLFLxCFAr7VdcF9sZWj1PK0efYP7bl1xoY70 xWMRDBtKXbDevgU3BAaJLcmG1ewqz4rWLuW0vX9R6INKG2t0le0nblaQardGOZARZcdhq7xiq EuWeMV7oelmRYlisa3qcW8q+lYtDNvKjdn67lLTQXEEGzjZZBbYIS8tyaFQl/abF5xlUGt/Sb 19QHnHTCS4M9WIYkjlVCKQaVfeOmqYVg1Tyb/9s541ZBRpIJPQjqUX8YljwW3cFvVQqnn/4gA TBt8iTqLaywUrC55b+Y6JE4pbRZVwj6nwnehiwKjSGCWRlYz+VpbFIFoxq26gzhrj1FlPfSZc Vm8OYs1Z2ZU9Xi0UyWpMPuuJYu4xAQm15Kw1iJkuHRZNjxG7mE4iLw6dmmN/lLn4dgoyGbuSx kWc44Nmak7dXlppMYqUPK9MGUg0ZWFKcoVJ21DG1wnO46ROAJ/JcxSCT3esW2Xvg7fbZ56rGs H8EpP8FR5xRnhu1faro4TCKUJqRtR6VRoNhNQ/8m2Nxhl187S6XtWBTM8eThKQdmy+8Hbd+PV SpElEsH4X3djE2T90uyymfwQg+2uQaULQyvTnUwwKUEZKWWkAWlGwhtFYS7eBaW3UyN0Me8tc Ojb/Qyg4b8rwX5i12YtZQXaKIL+pXcjgRY76SWSgX/us/1vVRJR6CI21wVedzcBU899Y4IqFN Zqq+5VA6Z2heguIw4P830GHpoJVh2k8agZPQazWz1bTl4= X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 70984 Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, 70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) On Fri, 17 May 2024 10:59:57 +0200 Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> wrote: >>>>>> On Fri, 17 May 2024 10:21:08 +0200, Stephen Berman > <stephen.berman@HIDDEN> said: > > >> I=CA=BCm assuming this means you=CA=BCre both ok with the key sequ= ences I chose. > > Stephen> As an innocent bystander I was at first puzzled at your choi= ce of 'C-x 8 > Stephen> < <' and 'C-x 8 > >' for "=E2=80=B9" and "=E2=80=BA", respec= tively; but then I found > Stephen> that 'C-x 8 <' and 'C-x 8 >' in the global map already produ= ce "=C2=AB" and > Stephen> "=C2=BB", presumably because the latter are the real quotati= on marks in > Stephen> French, while "single guillemets" are less frequently used. = So your > Stephen> choice makes sense after all. > > Exactly (should I put the existing C-x 8 bindings in the NEWS > entry?). That probably would have spared me my momentary puzzlement and the brief time it took me to discover 'C-x 8 <' and 'C-x 8 >', but I'm not sure that makes them NEWSworthy. > I=CA=BCm more doubtful about my choices for the German quotation marks in > the C-x 8 map. They correspond to the keys that have '(' and ')' on > the US keyboard, but not the German standard keyboard, but they=CA=BCre > easy to type on both layouts. I could put them on 'C-x 8 8' and 'C-x 8 > 9', since those can produce '[' and ']' in the German layout, which is > kind of mnemonic. Yeah, and also shifted '8' and '9' produce "(" and ")" in the German layout, so using '8' and '9' for another pairing seems better motivated for the German iso-transl map than '9' and '0'. > (The official German layout has them on 2nd or 3rd > level shift variants of 'x' and 'v', which I thought was too > convoluted to emulate). Probably. To add to the convolution, I use a German keyboard under Xfce4 with the no dead keys layout, and that assigns "=E2=80=9E" to AltGr-v= and "=E2=80=9C" to AltGr-b; no idea why... (In my experience, for email and non-processed text in German, "" is mostly used for quoting. LibreOffice automatically turns "" into =E2=80=9E=E2=80=9C in documents con= figured for German, and otherwise, when I need processed German text I use LaTeX.) Steve Berman
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN
:bug#70984
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Stephen> As an innocent bystander I was at first puzzled at your choice= of 'C-x 8 Stephen> < <' and 'C-x 8 > >' for "=E2=80=B9" and "=E2=80=BA", respecti= vely; but then I found Stephen> that 'C-x 8 <' and 'C-x 8 >' in the global map already produce= "=C2=AB" and Stephen> "=C2=BB", presumably because the latter are the real quotation= marks in Stephen> French, while "single guillemets" are less frequently used. S= o your Stephen> choice makes sense after all. Exactly (should I put the existing C-x 8 bindings in the NEWS entry?). I=CA=BCm more doubtful about my choices for the German quotation marks in the C-x 8 map. They correspond to the keys that have '(' and ')' on the US keyboard, but not the German standard keyboard, but they=CA=BCre easy to type on both layouts. I could put them on 'C-x 8 8' and 'C-x 8 9', since those can produce '[' and ']' in the German layout, which is kind of mnemonic. (The official German layout has them on 2nd or 3rd level shift variants of 'x' and 'v', which I thought was too convoluted to emulate). Robert --=20
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN
:bug#70984
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Full text available.Received: (at 70984) by debbugs.gnu.org; 17 May 2024 08:21:26 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Fri May 17 04:21:25 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53884 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1s7sqD-0003EU-Ii for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 17 May 2024 04:21:25 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.15.15]:48265) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <stephen.berman@HIDDEN>) id 1s7sq7-0003EO-Bj for 70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 17 May 2024 04:21:24 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmx.net; s=s31663417; t=1715934069; x=1716538869; i=stephen.berman@HIDDEN; bh=69JkBxP+TY+iJGC4L5kTHc+gJ/V0giJWnGCps1muBbk=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date: Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:cc: content-transfer-encoding:content-type:date:from:message-id: mime-version:reply-to:subject:to; b=FsnqcQEpKi+sk9JFpw9jl0Wn2V3RcIo/2MbPPZhGH/JS3znN8MrFKab/PzW5E55f Jy3WhRIrJZqN6dd9cJn4H17uz4bm0QeHcXbvt9FZnBG1YkkKXl7LM0rCkoeRlZaMO zeyljNrqW8CkA1hOyNWVsVtLP7CNcbynWHTfenPerTULhutp+cdl1xNlNJq2jXoq+ R2yrIgCz28G9zep8OS+IJGqX0M4ZKT2DRMuTcbL4aq2jO6dmQxLzzw3B/r1bhcQpY 8bGspjiDVLt/7XQqsmcM1KrIUnDCqOa9UltqY2IhV2G3EwQNH5OO01vkysWfjC+r0 QuSjklexflfJWofTpw== X-UI-Sender-Class: 724b4f7f-cbec-4199-ad4e-598c01a50d3a Received: from strobelfs ([88.130.50.168]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx004 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1N8XTv-1scd3U1Fqb-017kF4; Fri, 17 May 2024 10:21:09 +0200 From: Stephen Berman <stephen.berman@HIDDEN> To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#70984: 30.0.50; Improved support for entering quotation marks, Re: bug#70984: 30.0.50; Improved support for entering quotation marks In-Reply-To: <87msooj305.fsf@HIDDEN> (Robert Pluim's message of "Fri, 17 May 2024 09:45:14 +0200") References: <87r0e1j03u.fsf@HIDDEN> <87r0e1j03u.fsf@HIDDEN> <86cypliwf5.fsf@HIDDEN> <87msooj305.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Fri, 17 May 2024 10:21:08 +0200 Message-ID: <87r0e0c0i3.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:YWE4WOZYEgfNpa6nOOYS9aR9twewcRPyc0YSZXzHWAvNzgYmlOc BZsk3resGSvCpAgixAOclQ6PFvmCdfkZqkNnWAbiU75N9Hj2miJ3XflSa7Y8NyaSA41lxPG dn/c/QyZkmMeJFbWQCQdkNaymAM1EWyfz/n6jGuWBB/f6CnzJ1qUoch3G9QzHvxDM28TcSl FEvBt4SZ78YVlqcc44GEw== X-Spam-Flag: NO UI-OutboundReport: notjunk:1;M01:P0:8fyRkDcYJkA=;tAq3B56pENGAry9jTqoHyVlmNdc /1tbp5Q5kgr0XdppYfVsKXBXBh1JhAhBTKlqpcg3qKIP+OfddXNJ0NBs2QswwtWmOGeUCQMO3 gFAE1hkmlzuAPHGJjXOJdYU9zaXO4cz+D9vu3zCwkcpeODbSjYdb5slN1x6EelMis+O7PrJWu KsUUCXtGWf0+iJ5sHV7u1vy+uyrUgYBCT+J3wzZC1VWheZP7ysjbdUkajKtAFkuhVAQQ2K1Jw f9d8v2OEkX2QlL8UCAlwrCTlU3ZtlWR/4ru3sL4YCY+F1DR0HOjBKkuvWhr9ceKZwfR7cE4yr p3gqRtc9ez5iMoRib4BLEHzmB4s1rsHa1qm8wHcka/FSBfOEMDL7mAgATvzePJB8jVx5YRL6m p1wXe6BwnLejuoh5/z+zHfrjTIh6CxCeo/6HkK3RkImbN1gz35cG6TGKuaGop8gzOWflVo8I8 f2CCPm3haANRKG97EEwUJ8osKsloxVLPuGlgvvh0dsqK6J+7YAxr3ct/QCRRbQrOlm3wXYAlw scDP30IdmdQoR9nzfsS16fav0rZbuc6VAwGa1SzDkaWWRzgOXVr/tfI7IzkwxfxbwmSGTSLKB qLU299GujYgEPytS3S/Q713UXfEczOF0J9drOcwr8paTA9hZ5b3cR5tu9bcIGgsu67NvczUJ1 QbyI5f5IZj5/9gK5IEs1hPuQhccbWDPC8kLFpTR8gCkRQ/2M+pk7mjzMLGqUlQ/h0Uqgctasr Jg0MJRqBxXXYnJ3vs4lmL01SVHDc+xp9fVnF+5DHTCwEQgY9gnOv589GLWVgcsarBtwFerRiQ VdbYHzBI4LRL7jJRGggInZRjY/crccCAnATwlPPkLJdsU= X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 70984 Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN>, 70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) On Fri, 17 May 2024 09:45:14 +0200 Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> wrote: [...] >>>>>> On Thu, 16 May 2024 18:05:33 +0200, Stephen Berman >>>>>> <stephen.berman@HIDDEN> said: > > Stephen> I spotted a couple of typos and stylistic infelicities (IMO): > > Thanks, all fixed. > > I=CA=BCm assuming this means you=CA=BCre both ok with the key sequences I= chose. As an innocent bystander I was at first puzzled at your choice of 'C-x 8 < <' and 'C-x 8 > >' for "=E2=80=B9" and "=E2=80=BA", respectively; but the= n I found that 'C-x 8 <' and 'C-x 8 >' in the global map already produce "=C2=AB" and "=C2=BB", presumably because the latter are the real quotation marks in French, while "single guillemets" are less frequently used. So your choice makes sense after all. Steve Berman
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN
:bug#70984
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Because I messed up the formatting. >> +*** "latin-prefix" and "latin-postfix" guillemets support. >> +These input methods can now produce single guillemets. For >> +"latin-prefix" use "~~<" and "~~>", for "latin-postfix" use "<~" and >> +">~". Double guillemets were already supported. Eli> Suggest to show the guillemets themselves: not sure everyone knows Eli> what they are. Those who need to use them know what they are =F0=9F=98=80, but I=CA=BCll a= dd them in anyway. Eli> Are any of these worthy of being mentioned in the user manual (the Eli> "Inserting Text" node)? I don=CA=BCt think so. I do plan to mention them in the manual when I extend `electric-quote-chars'. >>>>> On Thu, 16 May 2024 18:05:33 +0200, Stephen Berman <stephen.berman@gm= x.net> said: Stephen> I spotted a couple of typos and stylistic infelicities (IMO): Thanks, all fixed. I=CA=BCm assuming this means you=CA=BCre both ok with the key sequences I c= hose. Robert --=20
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN
:bug#70984
; Package emacs
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Full text available.Received: (at 70984) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 May 2024 16:05:45 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Thu May 16 12:05:45 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49541 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1s7dc1-0000DI-FT for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 16 May 2024 12:05:45 -0400 Received: from mout.gmx.net ([212.227.17.20]:49335) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <stephen.berman@HIDDEN>) id 1s7dby-0000D6-Nm for 70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 16 May 2024 12:05:43 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmx.net; s=s31663417; t=1715875534; x=1716480334; i=stephen.berman@HIDDEN; bh=jJGzGvLCOjRgemSZqcFMCH9dCXBndUzqYioPYas5w8I=; h=X-UI-Sender-Class:From:To:Cc:Subject:In-Reply-To:References:Date: Message-ID:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:cc: content-transfer-encoding:content-type:date:from:message-id: mime-version:reply-to:subject:to; b=h0/+3+AV7jz5PJXLj5L5jaZu4XbXLrLHwSpVmDXsD4jIjRfTZBHVySf0jlLHKE0v /ZImPqHyH5Uug/MY9z/dDuA0cAQQtd3NTfdbkF/CudN0E9IgnxKT4uTGNRtgF+1tr GZyaoZHAS73cAZQqbeTmxkudLZw57wB5Ui9oxka+YqwvraECclGU/nBciN3LiZlre dtxrW9FQK7K+oESypyO3DOtiNGxnB4UjDKRe1T9vde0CcjvjBXLGGfxSSlYI7gY+G MmtYvH2jDlVqal2yCsYpA1MJL5m6z+M2+sgdq5fFO5VKbJb5WumlJk9GsiMID3msY BmhoaQlv1K+eLkttTg== X-UI-Sender-Class: 724b4f7f-cbec-4199-ad4e-598c01a50d3a Received: from strobelfs ([94.134.95.177]) by mail.gmx.net (mrgmx105 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MJVHU-1rsIa600wy-00Jt8l; Thu, 16 May 2024 18:05:34 +0200 From: Stephen Berman <stephen.berman@HIDDEN> To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#70984: 30.0.50; Improved support for entering quotation marks In-Reply-To: <87r0e1j03u.fsf@HIDDEN> (Robert Pluim's message of "Thu, 16 May 2024 16:35:33 +0200") References: <87r0e1j03u.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Thu, 16 May 2024 18:05:33 +0200 Message-ID: <87wmntkaia.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:CjE+GA+Ow/nCZdqpdkbWmO9UKESt1qGcmUu16s1Esug+u4UCPRn yWFi89q+BzYR7tYQAw4zOxcIKvBybnZ86Z9PfIS3Oew2bHfJ2Jc9vK4mC/1WxCpA5VcrSK1 26S4eAtGCQ9zkXQZwZPOjnhjMgzUfInVZWm1/Se+cgt+V22FtVCXuAuj/50VJBlhOwUJ6pV RsrLTbzxiJWelPmFEsjJQ== X-Spam-Flag: NO UI-OutboundReport: notjunk:1;M01:P0:eSp6h1HD7Mc=;b3HD6uVeIRKNcp/7iB09NP/7gFq uY1orv/rVDjZTnlSJKU6dO6siGqRMpyCNeNYeeLbroJkHOWzCqh6Ks++5il3R/Ig8A4p8rj2s xgTrdST0iwYcdp8ZFZJLhFio3gqcYjdISMZHP9cmN47m7Nm3dfPXbH8FuMbFyoKNOJXbvA2p+ Nuaq+bfDROy+/obTz0P1fcuuNuOAHP/Kq8mWjgBHov9CgwVFaw22q2kCXwgRigbvT3qCGkqSR 11AxAwAgUaCJoYqr53igRnZO+6QOU4l0e1SuDXLVTWQj8dItM1NkNByifV+D5h6LihcHUnGOS wTAnmomCBJTz1aCQdCnfZQDPn3m69vEoS3WFvVUjP8dp1fNGQNoRN6/+OqxPsKpKS3sPK4/SS cu6hT0M/jf9z1NrlaqtmPO0boUUjgJxHbwd83p6yC8GqiKrDqauSh1j62WBXBEZnAx3f4bRLH /Zi37SlK2aPd/WPbCCHoUle4lpM0RGo/kh9c3QSDXNbiIW9r0iOwjb4U5DpAr23qS07sbjDSn rfpyicpp3rTXMwuybPCz7sdcH2ZueXcml4BI+CAF5MuZgDZMduqUnFXYSO47fMv8gbDTEISXj IqqyadoiWNyLsD5it7dThLUr+Y3CRoYwGIjSsCQxhZ7WELrZY/qvFhSHKjuf/g15/SsTfCOWs MnuJjhN2PNSCt/Tdnh8FtPGMd5IAoOI1LeW8/27Y0cwZN4SQRsyf2lZ/WOpoj77JAhR70+KHr k/0y3GACNQDexJsf/33xHmd3CYXPTaGFdtU7JrUrSTJcn3fT7eKF61EEp0sidO1J4faGLIfXh 61FX8maeWs4zgRZtGWVq3/ucuspgUZ5fOwBO+Qeh4ZuDg= X-Spam-Score: -0.7 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 70984 Cc: 70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.7 (-) On Thu, 16 May 2024 16:35:33 +0200 Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> wrote: I spotted a couple of typos and stylistic infelicities (IMO): > From d6de9b14660882924c13bd7237a4905bd6a5578e Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001 > From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> > Date: Thu, 16 May 2024 16:25:24 +0200 > Subject: [PATCH] Improve support for entering quotation marks > To: emacs-devel@HIDDEN > > * lisp/international/iso-transl.el (iso-transl-char-map): Add entries > for "low" single and double quotation marks. > (iso-transl-language-alist): Add convenient support for the official > German quoting style, which uses "low" double quotes on the left, > and *left* double quotes on the right. Add support for single > guillemets to the French language entrey. ^^^^^^ entry [...] > +*** German language 'C-x 8' key translations for "=E2=80=9E" and "=E2=80= =9C". > +These characters are used for the official German quoting style, and can > +now be input with 'C-x 8 9' and 'C-x 8 0' respectively (the latter could > +already be entered using 'C-x 8 {'. Using them requires activating ^^ '). > +"German" language support using 'iso-transl-set-language'. ^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^ [...] > +*** French language 'C-x 8' key translations for "=E2=80=B9" and "=E2=80= =BA". > +These characters can now be entered using 'C-x 8 < <' and 'C-x 8 > >' > +respectively, after activating "French" language support using ^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^ I would drop the quotes and replace "using" by "via" or "with".
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN
:bug#70984
; Package emacs
.
Full text available.Received: (at 70984) by debbugs.gnu.org; 16 May 2024 15:55:59 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Thu May 16 11:55:59 2024 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:49466 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1s7dSY-0008T8-VU for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 16 May 2024 11:55:59 -0400 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:37868) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1s7dSW-0008T2-N8 for 70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 16 May 2024 11:55:57 -0400 Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <eliz@HIDDEN>) id 1s7dSN-00041r-PH; Thu, 16 May 2024 11:55:48 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=8uypfZh2ybrmPnWmMSJ4jgn2wIK2UdizryJMaYY1rms=; b=RMwl2Mqo8QULwclsnpbX LbaZnbXEVacmu2YvZ8kJDjA+kI9cfrLaZvuIas7WXeEkQnAYNYJfRMKJfSOpjvVovo9sWKS6D63kr VsnXA/NJdjnJanN9+u3UlVsLdypx0e8Iy8e3IVlPeYUjcu3BBigL20VF+gwuDdvlXtGnXHnvdT91i ET4ZzQRakdZcQiG39P2cn+vyz+ydBaZeSXdNpl58BUHrWqG7pZNq85WY/bC+I0XD/6EOIzF8ZjmnV 1h7vvx3MJoWuwuebiSiuTt+4jW7wimzSBT9GbVnp4jtfBDZfBfDwm9ejCNoqYDDUbi0SAxURONFUV FFUQXY1lcG1WLQ==; Date: Thu, 16 May 2024 18:55:10 +0300 Message-Id: <86cypliwf5.fsf@HIDDEN> From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> To: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> In-Reply-To: <87r0e1j03u.fsf@HIDDEN> (message from Robert Pluim on Thu, 16 May 2024 16:35:33 +0200) Subject: Re: bug#70984: 30.0.50; Improved support for entering quotation marks References: <87r0e1j03u.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 70984 Cc: 70984 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) > From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> > Date: Thu, 16 May 2024 16:35:33 +0200 > > * lisp/international/iso-transl.el (iso-transl-char-map): Add entries > for "low" single and double quotation marks. > (iso-transl-language-alist): Add convenient support for the official > German quoting style, which uses "low" double quotes on the left, > and *left* double quotes on the right. Add support for single > guillemets to the French language entrey. ^^^^^^ A typo? > +*** Add 'C-x 8' key translations for "low" quotes "„", and "‚". This style is for ChangeLog entries, not for NEWS. In NEWS we say something like "New 'C-x 8' key translations for..." instead. > +*** "latin-prefix" and "latin-postfix" quotation marks additions. > +These input methods can now produce single, double and "low" left and > +right quotation marks: > +"‘", "’", "“", "”", "„", and "‚" Why is the last line broken in the middle? > +*** "latin-prefix" and "latin-postfix" guillemets support. > +These input methods can now produce single guillemets. For > +"latin-prefix" use "~~<" and "~~>", for "latin-postfix" use "<~" and > +">~". Double guillemets were already supported. Suggest to show the guillemets themselves: not sure everyone knows what they are. Are any of these worthy of being mentioned in the user manual (the "Inserting Text" node)?
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN
:bug#70984
; Package emacs
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I started looking at quotation marks, and came up with the attached extensions to iso-transl and the latin-prefix and latin-postfix methods. Please let me know if my key sequence choices need to be improved. Robert --=20 --=-=-= Content-Type: text/x-diff; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline; filename=0001-Improve-support-for-entering-quotation-marks.patch Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From d6de9b14660882924c13bd7237a4905bd6a5578e Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001 From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> Date: Thu, 16 May 2024 16:25:24 +0200 Subject: [PATCH] Improve support for entering quotation marks To: emacs-devel@HIDDEN * lisp/international/iso-transl.el (iso-transl-char-map): Add entries for "low" single and double quotation marks. (iso-transl-language-alist): Add convenient support for the official German quoting style, which uses "low" double quotes on the left, and *left* double quotes on the right. Add support for single guillemets to the French language entrey. * lisp/leim/quail/latin-post.el ("latin-postfix"): Add entries for single, double and "low" Unicode quotation marks. Add entries for single guillemets. * lisp/leim/quail/latin-pre.el ("latin-prefix"): And here. * etc/NEWS: Announce the changes. --- etc/NEWS | 26 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++ lisp/international/iso-transl.el | 8 +++++++- lisp/leim/quail/latin-post.el | 19 +++++++++++++++++++ lisp/leim/quail/latin-pre.el | 11 +++++++++++ 4 files changed, 63 insertions(+), 1 deletion(-) diff --git a/etc/NEWS b/etc/NEWS index 77b2749fe43..f7aeeab46d9 100644 --- a/etc/NEWS +++ b/etc/NEWS @@ -573,6 +573,32 @@ These characters can now be input with 'C-x 8 a e' and= 'C-x 8 A E', respectively, in addition to the existing translations 'C-x 8 / e' and 'C-x 8 / E'. =20 +*** Add 'C-x 8' key translations for "low" quotes "=E2=80=9E", and "=E2=80= =9A". +These can now be entered with 'C-x , "' and 'C-x , ''. + +*** German language 'C-x 8' key translations for "=E2=80=9E" and "=E2=80= =9C". +These characters are used for the official German quoting style, and can +now be input with 'C-x 8 9' and 'C-x 8 0' respectively (the latter could +already be entered using 'C-x 8 {'. Using them requires activating +"German" language support using 'iso-transl-set-language'. + +*** "latin-prefix" and "latin-postfix" quotation marks additions. +These input methods can now produce single, double and "low" left and +right quotation marks: +"=E2=80=98", "=E2=80=99", "=E2=80=9C", "=E2=80=9D", "=E2=80=9E", and "=E2= =80=9A" +using "[", "]", and "," for "left", "right", and "low" respectively to +modify "'" and """. + +*** "latin-prefix" and "latin-postfix" guillemets support. +These input methods can now produce single guillemets. For +"latin-prefix" use "~~<" and "~~>", for "latin-postfix" use "<~" and +">~". Double guillemets were already supported. + +*** French language 'C-x 8' key translations for "=E2=80=B9" and "=E2=80= =BA". +These characters can now be entered using 'C-x 8 < <' and 'C-x 8 > >' +respectively, after activating "French" language support using +'iso-transl-set-language'. + * Changes in Specialized Modes and Packages in Emacs 30.1 =20 diff --git a/lisp/international/iso-transl.el b/lisp/international/iso-tran= sl.el index 67659f7c265..648770fa658 100644 --- a/lisp/international/iso-transl.el +++ b/lisp/international/iso-transl.el @@ -111,6 +111,8 @@ iso-transl-char-map ("*+" . [?=C2=B1]) ("+" . [?=C2=B1]) (",," . [?=C2=B8]) + (",\"" . [?=E2=80=9E]) + (",'" . [?=E2=80=9A]) (",A" . [?=C4=84]) (",C" . [?=C3=87]) (",N" . [?=C5=85]) @@ -327,7 +329,9 @@ iso-transl-language-alist ("u" . [?=C5=AD])) ("French" ("C" . [?=C3=87]) - ("c" . [?=C3=A7])) + ("c" . [?=C3=A7]) + ("<<" . [?=E2=80=B9]) + (">>" . [?=E2=80=BA])) ("German" ("A" . [?=C3=84]) ("O" . [?=C3=96]) @@ -336,6 +340,8 @@ iso-transl-language-alist ("a" . [?=C3=A4]) ("o" . [?=C3=B6]) ("s" . [?=C3=9F]) + ("9" . [?=E2=80=9E]) + ("0" . [?=E2=80=9C]) ("u" . [?=C3=BC])) ("Portuguese" ("C" . [?=C3=87]) diff --git a/lisp/leim/quail/latin-post.el b/lisp/leim/quail/latin-post.el index 25e7c4a64a8..00851a94284 100644 --- a/lisp/leim/quail/latin-post.el +++ b/lisp/leim/quail/latin-post.el @@ -2302,6 +2302,9 @@ subscript | _ | 0_ -> =E2=82=80 1_ -> =E2=82=81 +_ -> =E2=82= =8A -_ -> =E2=82=8B others | / | s/ -> =C3=9F ?/ -> =C2=BF !/ -> =C2=A1 // -= > =C2=B0 o/ -> =C5=93 | / | 2/ -> =C2=BD 3/ -> =C2=BE 4/ -> ?=C2=BC + | [ | \\=3D'[ -> =E2=80=98 \"[ -> =E2=80=9C + | ] | \\=3D'] -> =E2=80=99 \"] -> =E2=80=9D + | , | \\=3D', -> =E2=80=9A \", -> =E2=80=9E | various | << -> =C2=AB >> -> =C2=BB o_ -> =C2=BA a_ -= > =C2=AA =20 Doubling the postfix separates the letter and postfix: e.g. a\\=3D'\\=3D' = -> a\\=3D' @@ -2309,6 +2312,12 @@ =20 ;; Fixme: =C2=A6 =C2=A7 =C2=A8 =C2=A9 =C2=AC =C2=B1 =C2=B4 =C2=B5 =C2=B6 = =C2=B7 =C2=B8 =C3=97 =C3=B7 (quail-define-rules + ("'[" ?=E2=80=98) + ("']" ?=E2=80=99) + ("\"[" ?=E2=80=9C) + ("\"]" ?=E2=80=9D) + ("\"," ?=E2=80=9E) + ("'," ?=E2=80=9A) ("2/" ?=C2=BD) ("3/" ?=C2=BE) ("4/" ?=C2=BC) @@ -2341,6 +2350,8 @@ ("//" ?=C2=B0) ("<<" ?\=C2=AB) (">>" ?\=C2=BB) + ("<~" ?\=E2=80=B9) + (">~" ?\=E2=80=BA) ("?/" ?=C2=BF) ("$/" ?=C2=A3) ("$/" ?=C2=A4) @@ -2532,6 +2543,12 @@ ("z~" ?=C5=BE) ("--" ?=C2=AF) =20 + ("'[[" ["'["]) + ("']]" ["']"]) + ("\"[[" ["\"["]) + ("\"]]" ["\"]"]) + ("\",," ["\","]) + ("',," ["',"]) ("2//" ["2/"]) ("3//" ["3/"]) ("4//" ["4/"]) @@ -2564,6 +2581,8 @@ ("///" ["//"]) ("<<<" ["<<"]) (">>>" [">>"]) + ("<~~" ["<~"]) + (">~~" [">~"]) ("?//" ["?/"]) ("$//" ["$/"]) ("A''" ["A'"]) diff --git a/lisp/leim/quail/latin-pre.el b/lisp/leim/quail/latin-pre.el index 91164df0c72..b344a6304bb 100644 --- a/lisp/leim/quail/latin-pre.el +++ b/lisp/leim/quail/latin-pre.el @@ -1107,6 +1107,9 @@ macron | - | -a -> =C4=81 -/e -> =C7=A3 -- -> =C2=AF dot above | / . | /g -> =C4=A1 .g -> =C4=A1 misc | \" ~ / | \"s -> =C3=9F ~d -> =C3=B0 ~t -> =C3=BE /a -> = =C3=A5 /e -> =C3=A6 /o -> =C3=B8 + | [ | [\\=3D' -> =E2=80=98 [\" -> =E2=80=9C + | ] | ]\\=3D' -> =E2=80=99 ]\" -> =E2=80=9D + | , | ,\\=3D' -> =E2=80=9A ,\" -> =E2=80=9E symbol | ~ | ~> -> =C2=BB ~< -> =C2=AB ~! -> =C2=A1 ~? -> = =C2=BF ~~ -> =C2=B8 symbol | _ / | _o -> =C2=BA _a -> =C2=AA // -> =C2=B0 /\\ -> = =C3=97 _y -> =C2=A5 symbol | ^ | ^r -> =C2=AE ^t -> =E2=84=A2 ^c -> =C2=A9 ^1 ->= =C2=B9 ^2 -> =C2=B2 ^3 -> =C2=B3 @@ -1132,6 +1135,12 @@ ("-y" ?=C8=B3) ("' " ?') ("''" ?=C2=B4) + ("['" ?=E2=80=98) + ("]'" ?=E2=80=99) + ("[\"" ?=E2=80=9C) + ("]\"" ?=E2=80=9D) + (",\"" ?=E2=80=9E) + (",'" ?=E2=80=9A) ("'A" ?=C3=81) ("'E" ?=C3=89) ("'I" ?=C3=8D) @@ -1295,8 +1304,10 @@ ("~-" ?=C2=AD) ("~." ?=C2=B7) ("~<" ?\=C2=AB) + ("~~<" ?\=E2=80=B9) ("~=3D" ?=C2=AF) ("~>" ?\=C2=BB) + ("~~>" ?\=E2=80=BA) ("~?" ?=C2=BF) ("~A" ?=C3=83) ("~A" ?=C4=82) --=20 2.38.1.420.g319605f8f0 --=-=-=--
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN
:bug#70984
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Copyright (C) 1999 Darren O. Benham,
1997 nCipher Corporation Ltd,
1994-97 Ian Jackson.