GNU logs - #16493, boring messages

X-Loop: help-debbugs@HIDDEN
Subject: bug#16493: 24.3.50; (setq search-invisible t) is useless, let's allow to turn visible-mode temporarily on
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I see very little value in setting `search-invisible' to t.

Also, when doing so, text that is hidden with an overlay is not hit
during a search, only text that is hidden through an invisble text
property, which feels wrong.

I suggest this change: when `search-invisible' is set to `t',
temporarily turn visible-mode on in isearch-mode.  The meaning of
'open would not change and 'open is fine as a default IMO.

With this change, `C-s M-s i' will switch from 'open to 't, allowing
to display all invisible text temporarily, or from 't to 'open,
allowing to only open overlays containing hidden text.

What do you think?



In GNU Emacs 24.3.50.1 (i686-pc-linux-gnu, GTK+ Version 3.10.6)
 of 2014-01-13 on bzg
Repository revision: 116011 monnier@HIDDEN
Windowing system distributor `The X.Org Foundation', version 11.0.11405000
System Description:	Arch Linux

Important settings:
  value of $LC_COLLATE: C
  value of $LANG: fr_FR.UTF-8
  locale-coding-system: utf-8-unix

Major mode: Group

Minor modes in effect:
  gnus-topic-mode: t
  helm-match-plugin-mode: t
  erc-list-mode: t
  erc-menu-mode: t
  erc-autojoin-mode: t
  erc-ring-mode: t
  erc-networks-mode: t
  erc-pcomplete-mode: t
  erc-track-mode: t
  erc-match-mode: t
  erc-button-mode: t
  erc-fill-mode: t
  erc-stamp-mode: t
  erc-netsplit-mode: t
  erc-irccontrols-mode: t
  erc-noncommands-mode: t
  erc-move-to-prompt-mode: t
  erc-readonly-mode: t
  diff-auto-refine-mode: t
  gnus-undo-mode: t
  shell-dirtrack-mode: t
  display-time-mode: t
  show-paren-mode: t
  tooltip-mode: t
  mouse-wheel-mode: t
  file-name-shadow-mode: t
  global-font-lock-mode: t
  font-lock-mode: t
  auto-composition-mode: t
  auto-encryption-mode: t
  auto-compression-mode: t
  buffer-read-only: t
  line-number-mode: t
  transient-mark-mode: t

Recent input:
<C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> C-e C-a <C-down> 
<C-down> <C-down> <C-down> <tab> <return> <C-down> 
<C-down> <C-down> <C-down> <tab> <return> <C-down> 
<C-down> <C-down> <C-down> <C-down> <C-down> <C-down> 
C-x C-f C-g C-x 3 C-x o C-x C-f <C-backspace> <C-backspace> 
<C-backspace> <C-backspace> o h <tab> <C-backspace> 
h o <tab> g u <tab> i n s <tab> g i <tab> e m a <tab> 
/ l i s <tab> C-a C-e <C-backspace> e <tab> N E <tab> 
<tab> W <tab> <return> C-s s a e <backspace> e a <backspace> 
<backspace> <backspace> e a r c h C-s C-s C-s C-s C-s 
C-s C-s C-e <C-left> <C-left> <C-left> <C-left> <C-left> 
C-e <down> C-a <C-right> C-e <C-left> <C-left> <C-left> 
C-a <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-down> <C-down> <down> C-e 
C-a <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> 
<C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> 
<C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> <C-up> M-< 
M-x o u t l i n <tab> e <tab> - m o d <tab> <return> 
M-x <up> <return> C-x 1 M-x o r g - m o d e <return> 
<C-down> <down> <down> <down> <down> <down> <down> 
<down> <down> <down> <down> <down> <down> <down> <down> 
<down> <down> <down> <down> <down> <down> <down> s 
<tab> <tab> C-s s e a r c h C-s C-s C-a <up> <up> <up> 
<up> <tab> C-x n w <down> <tab> s M-x <up> C-g C-s 
C-s C-a C-x n w <tab> <down> <tab> s C-s s e a r c 
C-s C-a M-< C-x C-g C-x n w <tab> <down> C-e C-a <tab> 
s C-s s e a r c h C-a M-< C-x n w <tab> <down> <tab> 
s C-s s e a r c h C-s C-s C-a M-< <tab> C-x n w M-< 
C-e C-a C-x C-s C-z k C-x 1 M-x <up> <up> <up> <re
turn>

Recent messages:
Mark saved where search started
Quit
Mark saved where search started
Mark set
C-x C-g is undefined
Mark saved where search started
Mark set
Mark saved where search started
Mark set [2 times]
(No changes need to be saved)

Load-path shadows:
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~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/notmuch-address hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-address
/home/guerry/install/git/bbdb/lisp/bbdb-gnus hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/bbdb-gnus
/home/guerry/install/git/bbdb/lisp/bbdb-sc hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/bbdb-sc
~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/notmuch-maildir-fcc hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-maildir-fcc
~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/notmuch-tag hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-tag
/home/guerry/install/git/bbdb/lisp/bbdb hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/bbdb
~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/notmuch-mua hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-mua
/home/guerry/install/git/bbdb/lisp/bbdb-loaddefs hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/bbdb-loaddefs
/home/guerry/install/git/bbdb/lisp/bbdb-print hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/bbdb-print
~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/notmuch-show hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-show
/home/guerry/install/git/bbdb/lisp/bbdb-site hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/bbdb-site
~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/notmuch-hello hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-hello
~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/notmuch-tree hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-tree
~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/notmuch-message hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-message
/home/guerry/install/git/bbdb/lisp/bbdb-snarf hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/bbdb-snarf
~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/notmuch-print hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-print
/home/guerry/install/git/bbdb/lisp/bbdb-mhe hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/bbdb-mhe
/home/guerry/install/git/bbdb/lisp/bbdb-migrate hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/bbdb-migrate
~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/notmuch-wash hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-wash
~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/notmuch hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch
~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/notmuch-lib hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-lib
/home/guerry/install/git/bbdb/lisp/bbdb-message hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/bbdb-message
~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/notmuch-parser hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-parser
~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/notmuch-query hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-query
/home/guerry/install/git/bbdb/lisp/bbdb-com hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/bbdb-com
/home/guerry/install/git/bbdb/lisp/bbdb-mua hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/bbdb-mua
/home/guerry/install/git/bbdb/lisp/bbdb-anniv hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/bbdb-anniv
/home/guerry/install/git/bbdb/lisp/bbdb-ispell hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/bbdb-ispell
~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/notmuch-crypto hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/notmuch-crypto
~/install/git/notmuch/emacs/coolj hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/coolj
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/bookmark-w3m hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/bookmark-w3m
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-ems hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-ems
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-mail hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-mail
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-load hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-load
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-filter hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-filter
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/mew-w3m hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/mew-w3m
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-namazu hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-namazu
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-util hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-util
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-search hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-search
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-session hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-session
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-rss hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-rss
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-form hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-form
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-perldoc hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-perldoc
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-antenna hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-antenna
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-bug hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-bug
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-cookie hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-cookie
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-hist hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-hist
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/octet hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/octet
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-image hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-image
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-tabmenu hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-tabmenu
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-dtree hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-dtree
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-lnum hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-lnum
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-symbol hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-symbol
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/mime-w3m hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/mime-w3m
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-ccl hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-ccl
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-fb hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-fb
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-bookmark hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-bookmark
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-favicon hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-favicon
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-weather hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-weather
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-ucs hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-ucs
~/install/cvs/emacs-w3m/w3m-proc hides /usr/local/share/emacs/site-lisp/w3m/w3m-proc
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/org-element hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/org-element
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ob-ocaml hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ob-ocaml
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ob-ledger hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ob-ledger
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ob-calc hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ob-calc
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/org-src hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/org-src
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ob-makefile hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ob-makefile
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ox hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ox
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ob-plantuml hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ob-plantuml
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ob-eval hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ob-eval
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/org-compat hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/org-compat
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ob-io hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ob-io
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ob-haskell hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ob-haskell
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/org-list hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/org-list
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ob-css hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ob-css
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ox-odt hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ox-odt
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/org-macro hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/org-macro
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ob-perl hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ob-perl
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/org-ctags hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/org-ctags
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/org-docview hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/org-docview
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ob-keys hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ob-keys
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ox-beamer hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ox-beamer
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ob-core hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ob-core
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/org-inlinetask hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/org-inlinetask
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/org-id hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/org-id
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/org-attach hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/org-attach
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ob-mscgen hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ob-mscgen
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ob-exp hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ob-exp
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/ob-picolisp hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/ob-picolisp
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/org-mhe hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/org-mhe
~/install/git/org-mode/lisp/org-mouse hides /usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/org/org-mouse
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/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/nnspool hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/nnspool
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/nndir hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/nndir
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/nndiary hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/nndiary
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/mm-uu hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/mm-uu
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/html2text hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/html2text
/home/guerry/elisp/testing/dict/lpath hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/lpath
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/nntp hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/nntp
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-salt hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-salt
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/calendar/time-date hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/time-date
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gmm-utils hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gmm-utils
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-win hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-win
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-logic hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-logic
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-group hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-group
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/sieve hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/sieve
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/net/hmac-def hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/hmac-def
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/mail-prsvr hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/mail-prsvr
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/yenc hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/yenc
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/nnweb hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/nnweb
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/nnmairix hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/nnmairix
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/mml-smime hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/mml-smime
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-sieve hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-sieve
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/sieve-manage hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/sieve-manage
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/nndraft hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/nndraft
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/mail-source hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/mail-source
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/nnmail hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/nnmail
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-setup hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-setup
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/nndoc hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/nndoc
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/net/sasl-cram hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/sasl-cram
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-start hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-start
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/nnmaildir hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/nnmaildir
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/mail/binhex hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/binhex
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-notifications hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-notifications
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-agent hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-agent
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/mm-archive hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/mm-archive
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-topic hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-topic
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/pop3 hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/pop3
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gssapi hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gssapi
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/mail/hashcash hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/hashcash
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-undo hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-undo
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-sync hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-sync
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/spam-stat hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/spam-stat
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-srvr hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-srvr
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/rtree hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/rtree
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-kill hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-kill
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/registry hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/registry
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-cite hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-cite
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/mm-decode hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/mm-decode
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-picon hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-picon
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/spam hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/spam
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/messcompat hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/messcompat
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-art hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-art
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/hex-util hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/hex-util
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/nnagent hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/nnagent
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/message hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/message
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/qp hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/qp
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-bookmark hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-bookmark
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/password-cache hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/password-cache
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/nneething hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/nneething
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gravatar hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gravatar
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/net/netrc hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/netrc
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/mm-encode hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/mm-encode
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/mail-parse hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/mail-parse
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/rfc1843 hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/rfc1843
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/rfc2104 hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/rfc2104
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-util hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-util
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-mlspl hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-mlspl
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/mml hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/mml
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/nnregistry hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/nnregistry
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/net/hmac-md5 hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/hmac-md5
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/spam-wash hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/spam-wash
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/gnus-sum hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-sum
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/mm-view hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/mm-view
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/gnus/ietf-drums hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/ietf-drums
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/json hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-fallback-lib/json
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/emacs-lisp/eieio hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-fallback-lib/eieio/eieio
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/emacs-lisp/eieio-custom hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-fallback-lib/eieio/eieio-custom
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/emacs-lisp/eieio-datadebug hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-fallback-lib/eieio/eieio-datadebug
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/emacs-lisp/eieio-opt hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-fallback-lib/eieio/eieio-opt
/home/guerry/elisp/testing/unused/cedet/eieio/eieio-comp hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-fallback-lib/eieio/eieio-comp
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/emacs-lisp/eieio-speedbar hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-fallback-lib/eieio/eieio-speedbar
/usr/local/share/emacs/24.3.50/lisp/emacs-lisp/eieio-base hides /home/guerry/install/git/gnus/lisp/gnus-fallback-lib/eieio/eieio-base

Features:
(shadow tramp-cache emacsbug edebug cal-move sgml-mode nxml-uchnm
rng-xsd xsd-regexp rng-cmpct rng-nxml rng-valid nxml-mode nxml-outln
nxml-rap nxml-glyph bug-reference vc-bzr org-colview eieio-opt
speedbar sb-image ezimage dframe add-log vcard calc-alg calc-ext
calc-menu calc calc-loaddefs calc-macs dabbrev org-table nnir
image-file org-capture debug tabify holidays hol-loaddefs cal-iso
compface gnus-fun gnus-dup flow-fill misearch multi-isearch dired-aux
copyright authors bookmark url-queue mm-archive gnus-html mm-url
gnus-kill sort smiley gnus-cite gnus-async gnus-bcklg qp gnus-ml
disp-table gnus-mlspl gnus-topic utf-7 nndraft nnmh nnfolder gnutls
network-stream nnimap parse-time utf7 netrc nnml nnmaildir gnus-agent
gnus-srvr gnus-score score-mode nnvirtual nntp gnus-cache
cyberpunk-theme clojure-cheatsheet helm-match-plugin helm helm-config
helm-aliases magit-key-mode magit view help-mode grep autorevert
filenotify git-rebase-mode rebase-mode git-commit-mode saveplace
server benchmark erc-services erc-list erc-menu erc-join erc-ring
erc-networks erc-pcomplete erc-track erc-match erc-button erc-fill
erc-stamp erc-netsplit erc-goodies erc erc-backend erc-compat pp
gnus-gravatar mail-extr gravatar url-cache ecomplete boxquote rect
spam spam-stat gnus-uu yenc gnus-msg gnus-art mm-uu mml2015 smtpmail
epa epg epg-config starttls bbdb-config bbdb-message sendmail
bbdb-gnus bbdb-mua bbdb-anniv bbdb-com bbdb-loaddefs bbdb bbdb-site
notmuch hl-line notmuch-message notmuch-maildir-fcc notmuch-hello
notmuch-tree notmuch-parser notmuch-show notmuch-print notmuch-crypto
notmuch-mua notmuch-address notmuch-wash diff-mode coolj notmuch-query
goto-addr icalendar notmuch-tag crm notmuch-lib mm-view mml-smime
smime dig debbugs-org debbugs-gnu debbugs soap-client url-http tls
url-auth url-gw url url-proxy url-privacy url-expand url-methods
url-history url-cookie url-domsuf url-util url-parse url-vars mailcap
warnings xml vc-git org-rmail org-mhe org-irc org-info org-docview
org-bibtex bibtex org-bbdb org-w3m org-agenda appt diary-lib
diary-loaddefs org-clock ob-gnuplot ob-R ob-plantuml ob-scheme geiser
ob-ditaa ob-org ob-clojure ob-dot ob-shell ox-koma-letter org-gnus
ox-odt rng-loc rng-uri rng-parse rng-match rng-dt rng-util rng-pttrn
nxml-parse nxml-ns nxml-enc xmltok nxml-util ox-beamer ox-reveal
ox-rss ox-latex ox-icalendar ox-html table ox-ascii ox-publish ox
org-element avl-tree org org-macro org-footnote org-pcomplete org-list
org-faces org-entities noutline outline org-version ob-emacs-lisp ob
ob-tangle org-src ob-ref ob-lob ob-table ob-keys ob-exp ob-comint
ob-core ob-eval org-compat org-macs org-loaddefs cal-menu calendar
cal-loaddefs gnus-sum nnoo gnus-group gnus-undo nnmail mail-source
gnus-start gnus-spec gnus-int gnus-range message rfc822 mml mml-sec
mm-decode mm-bodies mm-encode mail-parse rfc2231 rfc2047 rfc2045
ietf-drums mailabbrev gmm-utils mailheader gnus-win gnus gnus-ems
nnheader mail-utils wdired dired-x w3m browse-url doc-view jka-compr
dired image-mode timezone w3m-hist w3m-fb bookmark-w3m w3m-ems
wid-edit w3m-ccl ccl w3m-favicon w3m-image w3m-proc w3m-util ac-nrepl
cider cider-mode cider-repl cider-eldoc eldoc cider-interaction
compile arc-mode archive-mode cider-version pkg-info find-func epl
cider-client nrepl-client cider-util ewoc etags thingatpt clojure-mode
rx derived imenu inf-lisp tramp tramp-compat auth-source eieio
byte-opt bytecomp byte-compile cconv eieio-core gnus-util mm-util
mail-prsvr password-cache tramp-loaddefs trampver shell pcomplete
comint ansi-color ring format-spec auto-complete easy-mmode popup dash
ibuffer session mule-util advice help-fns alist pym static apel-ver
product elscreen register-list cl-macs gv edmacro kmacro cl
cl-loaddefs cl-lib time paren whitespace elec-pair asciidoc-autoloads
info easymenu auctex-autoloads clojurescript-mode-autoloads
creole-autoloads fakir-autoloads lmc-autoloads mediawiki-autoloads
rainbow-delimiters-autoloads rainbow-mode-autoloads
rect-mark-autoloads sunrise-commander-autoloads tuareg-autoloads
caml-autoloads undo-tree-autoloads yasnippet-autoloads package
time-date tooltip electric uniquify ediff-hook vc-hooks
lisp-float-type mwheel x-win x-dnd tool-bar dnd fontset image
regexp-opt fringe tabulated-list newcomment lisp-mode prog-mode
register page menu-bar rfn-eshadow timer select scroll-bar mouse
jit-lock font-lock syntax facemenu font-core frame cham georgian
utf-8-lang misc-lang vietnamese tibetan thai tai-viet lao korean
japanese hebrew greek romanian slovak czech european ethiopic indian
cyrillic chinese case-table epa-hook jka-cmpr-hook help simple abbrev
minibuffer nadvice loaddefs button faces cus-face macroexp files
text-properties overlay sha1 md5 base64 format env code-pages mule
custom widget hashtable-print-readable backquote make-network-process
dbusbind gfilenotify dynamic-setting system-font-setting
font-render-setting move-toolbar gtk x-toolkit x multi-tty emacs)

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To: Bastien Guerry <bzg@HIDDEN>
Subject: bug#16493: Acknowledgement (24.3.50; (setq search-invisible t) is
 useless, let's allow to turn visible-mode temporarily on)
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Subject: bug#16493: 24.3.50; (setq search-invisible t) is useless, let's allow to turn visible-mode temporarily on
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Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2014 09:57:07 +0200
In-Reply-To: <878uucaun0.fsf@HIDDEN> (Bastien Guerry's message of "Sun, 19
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 Content preview:  > I see very little value in setting `search-invisible' to
 t. > > Also, when doing so, text that is hidden with an overlay is not hit
 > during a search, only text that is hidden through an invisble text > property,
 which feels wrong. > > I suggest this change: when `search-invisible' is
 set to `t', > temporarily turn visible-mode on in isearch-mode. The meaning
 of > 'open would not change and 'open is fine as a default IMO. > > With
 this change, `C-s M-s i' will switch from 'open to 't, allowing > to display
 all invisible text temporarily, or from 't to 'open, > allowing to only open
 overlays containing hidden text. > > What do you think? [...] 
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 Content preview:  > I see very little value in setting `search-invisible' to
    t. > > Also, when doing so, text that is hidden with an overlay is not hit
    > during a search, only text that is hidden through an invisble text > property,
    which feels wrong. > > I suggest this change: when `search-invisible' is
   set to `t', > temporarily turn visible-mode on in isearch-mode. The meaning
    of > 'open would not change and 'open is fine as a default IMO. > > With
   this change, `C-s M-s i' will switch from 'open to 't, allowing > to display
    all invisible text temporarily, or from 't to 'open, > allowing to only open
    overlays containing hidden text. > > What do you think? [...] 
 
 Content analysis details:   (1.3 points, 10.0 required)
 
  pts rule name              description
 ---- ---------------------- --------------------------------------------------
  1.3 RDNS_NONE              Delivered to internal network by a host with no rDNS

> I see very little value in setting `search-invisible' to t.
>
> Also, when doing so, text that is hidden with an overlay is not hit
> during a search, only text that is hidden through an invisble text
> property, which feels wrong.
>
> I suggest this change: when `search-invisible' is set to `t',
> temporarily turn visible-mode on in isearch-mode.  The meaning of
> 'open would not change and 'open is fine as a default IMO.
>
> With this change, `C-s M-s i' will switch from 'open to 't, allowing
> to display all invisible text temporarily, or from 't to 'open,
> allowing to only open overlays containing hidden text.
>
> What do you think?

I think we should keep the value `t' because it might be useful
for some users.  And add a new value like `open-all' that in its behavior
is similar to `open' but additionally will open all overlays at once
using `visible-mode' as you suggested to do.

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Juri Linkov <juri@HIDDEN> writes:

> I think we should keep the value `t' because it might be useful
> for some users.  And add a new value like `open-all' that in its behavior
> is similar to `open' but additionally will open all overlays at once
> using `visible-mode' as you suggested to do.

This would definitely be an improvement, thanks.

This was my first idea, but then `isearch-toggle-invisible' needs
to cycle through _three_ states instead of two, which deviates from
other toggle commands.

If such cycling is fine, I'm all for this change.

I consider this a bug, because anyone trying to replace text within
an Org bracket link will not reach the URL.

E.g. replacing "www" by "ftp" is currently not possible in

  [[http://gnu.org][GNU]]

you have to manually turn visible-mode on.

-- 
 Bastien

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Bastien <bzg@HIDDEN> writes:

> E.g. replacing "www" by "ftp" is currently not possible in
                  ^^^
I mean "http" of course.

-- 
 Bastien

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> E.g. replacing "www" by "ftp" is currently not possible in
>   [[http://gnu.org][GNU]]
> you have to manually turn visible-mode on.

I don't understand the relationship between this problem and the subject
of bug#16493.


        Stefan

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Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN> writes:

>> E.g. replacing "www" by "ftp" is currently not possible in
>>   [[http://gnu.org][GNU]]
>> you have to manually turn visible-mode on.
>
> I don't understand the relationship between this problem and the subject
> of bug#16493.

I forgot to connect the dots.

When search-invisible is t, perform-replace can replace matches
in any invisible text, but does not display it when prompting the
user for confirmation.

When search-invisible is 'open, perform-replace can replace matches
only in hidden text (invisible through an overlay), and displays it
when prompting the user.

We lack a way to reveal truly invisible text when performing a search
and replace.  The URL of a bracket link in Org is an example of such
truly invisible text.

Juri's solution to add 'open-all could also be used in perform-replace
to let the user see truly invisible matches before replacing them.

So the *solutions* are related, if not the problems themselves.

-- 
 Bastien

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> We lack a way to reveal truly invisible text when performing a search
> and replace.  The URL of a bracket link in Org is an example of such
> truly invisible text.

What do you mean by "truly invisible"?  Does that refer to text that's
marked with an `invisible' text-property (as opposed to an overlay with
that property)?


        Stefan

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Subject: bug#16493: 24.3.50; (setq search-invisible t) is useless, let's allow to turn visible-mode temporarily on
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>> We lack a way to reveal truly invisible text when performing a search
>> and replace.  The URL of a bracket link in Org is an example of such
>> truly invisible text.
>
> What do you mean by "truly invisible"?  Does that refer to text that's
> marked with an `invisible' text-property (as opposed to an overlay with
> that property)?

I guess Bastien meant toggling the value of `buffer-invisibility-spec'
while isearch is active.  Let's wait for Bastien to confirm this.

It's the problem indeed that isearch doesn't match such invisible text
but query-replace matches and replaces it.

X-Loop: help-debbugs@HIDDEN
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Juri Linkov <juri@HIDDEN> writes:

>>> We lack a way to reveal truly invisible text when performing a search
>>> and replace.  The URL of a bracket link in Org is an example of such
>>> truly invisible text.
>>
>> What do you mean by "truly invisible"?  Does that refer to text that's
>> marked with an `invisible' text-property (as opposed to an overlay with
>> that property)?
>
> I guess Bastien meant toggling the value of `buffer-invisibility-spec'
> while isearch is active.  Let's wait for Bastien to confirm this.

Yes, I do confirm, thanks Juri.

> It's the problem indeed that isearch doesn't match such invisible text
> but query-replace matches and replaces it.

Yes.  I tried to state the problem here:
http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/bug-gnu-emacs/2014-01/msg01054.html

I think the default behavior should be to open both invisible-with-a
-text-property and invisible-within-an-overlay areas when performing
a search-and-replace.

-- 
 Bastien

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>>>> We lack a way to reveal truly invisible text when performing a search
>>>> and replace.  The URL of a bracket link in Org is an example of such
>>>> truly invisible text.
>>> What do you mean by "truly invisible"?  Does that refer to text that's
>>> marked with an `invisible' text-property (as opposed to an overlay with
>>> that property)?
>> I guess Bastien meant toggling the value of `buffer-invisibility-spec'
>> while isearch is active.  Let's wait for Bastien to confirm this.
> Yes, I do confirm, thanks Juri.

Sounds confused.  I'm asking "how is it made invisible" and you answer by
referencing some way to make it visible.  All forms of invisible are
affected by buffer-invisibility-spec.

> I think the default behavior should be to open both invisible-with-a
> -text-property and invisible-within-an-overlay areas when performing
> a search-and-replace.

So, IIUC you're indeed talking about the text made invisible by
a text-property rather than an overlay, right?

I'm fine with making isearch "reveal" those as well.  Of course, "how"
is an important question: tweaking buffer-invisibility-spec means that
we don't just reveal the part of the text we're interested in, but all
other parts hidden in the same way as well.  An alternative would be to
temporarily remove the text-property.


        Stefan

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Hi Stefan,

Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN> writes:

> So, IIUC you're indeed talking about the text made invisible by
> a text-property rather than an overlay, right?

Yes.

> I'm fine with making isearch "reveal" those as well.  Of course, "how"
> is an important question: tweaking buffer-invisibility-spec means that
> we don't just reveal the part of the text we're interested in, but all
> other parts hidden in the same way as well.  An alternative would be to
> temporarily remove the text-property.

Removing just the text property seems cleaner.

Thanks,

-- 
 Bastien

X-Loop: help-debbugs@HIDDEN
Subject: bug#16493: 24.3.50; (setq search-invisible t) is useless, let's allow to turn visible-mode temporarily on
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Hi Stefan and Juri,

reviving an old bug that continues to bug me.

The very frequent use-case I have is with (setq search-invisible t)
when I try to query-replace a string that's within an org-mode link.

I wish the content of the link could be displayed.

Bastien <bzg@HIDDEN> writes:

>> I'm fine with making isearch "reveal" those as well.  Of course, "how"
>> is an important question: tweaking buffer-invisibility-spec means that
>> we don't just reveal the part of the text we're interested in, but all
>> other parts hidden in the same way as well.  An alternative would be to
>> temporarily remove the text-property.
>
> Removing just the text property seems cleaner.

I guess this solution, though nice, is tricky to implement.  And
thinking about this again, I'd be fine with buffer-invisibility-spec
set to nil temporarily.

What do you think?  If you're okay with the buffer-invisibility-spec
solution, shall I go ahead and try to implement it?

Thanks,

-- 
 Bastien

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>> Removing just the text property seems cleaner.
> I guess this solution, though nice, is tricky to implement.

Why do you think so?


        Stefan

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--=-=-=
Content-Type: text/plain

Hi Stefan,

Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN> writes:

>>> Removing just the text property seems cleaner.
>> I guess this solution, though nice, is tricky to implement.
>
> Why do you think so?

I looked at the way isearch does the temporary opening of overlays,
and it looks complex to add another mechanism to temporarily ignore
the 'invisible text property.  At least I don't know how to do this.

Also, I tried a preliminary patches (attached) which I find quite
convenient and seems to do what I expected first when setting
(setq search-invisible t): turning on visible-mode.

The patch is not fully tested and incomplete, as query-replace is
not handled, but that's a start.

Let me know what you think.

Thanks,

-- 
 Bastien

--=-=-=
Content-Type: text/x-diff
Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=isearch.el.patch

diff --git a/lisp/isearch.el b/lisp/isearch.el
index 3725779..53958cc 100644
--- a/lisp/isearch.el
+++ b/lisp/isearch.el
@@ -665,6 +665,8 @@ isearch-input-method-local-p
 
 (defvar isearch--saved-overriding-local-map nil)
 
+(defvar isearch-initial-visibility-state nil)
+
 ;; Minor-mode-alist changes - kind of redundant with the
 ;; echo area, but if isearching in multiple windows, it can be useful.
 
@@ -936,6 +938,8 @@ isearch-mode
       (if minibuffer-auto-raise
 	  (raise-frame frame))))
 
+  (setq isearch-initial-visibility-state (or visible-mode -1))
+  (when (eq isearch-invisible t) (visible-mode 1))
   (setq	isearch-mode " Isearch")  ;; forward? regexp?
   (force-mode-line-update)
 
@@ -1054,6 +1058,7 @@ isearch-done
   (remove-hook 'post-command-hook 'isearch-post-command-hook)
   (remove-hook 'mouse-leave-buffer-hook 'isearch-done)
   (remove-hook 'kbd-macro-termination-hook 'isearch-done)
+  (visible-mode isearch-initial-visibility-state)
   (setq isearch-lazy-highlight-start nil)
   (when (buffer-live-p isearch--current-buffer)
     (with-current-buffer isearch--current-buffer
@@ -1608,7 +1613,9 @@ isearch--momentary-message
   (isearch--momentary-message
    (if (setq isearch-invisible
              (if isearch-invisible
-                 nil (or search-invisible 'open)))
+                 (and (visible-mode -1) nil)
+               (visible-mode 1)
+               (or search-invisible 'open)))
        "match invisible text"
      "match visible text")))
 

--=-=-=--

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From: Noam Postavsky <npostavs@HIDDEN>
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Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 00:34:41 -0400
In-Reply-To: <87wowql4sd.fsf@HIDDEN> (Bastien's message of "Sun, 29 Apr 2018
 11:50:58 +0200")
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Bastien <bzg@HIDDEN> writes:

> I looked at the way isearch does the temporary opening of overlays,
> and it looks complex to add another mechanism to temporarily ignore
> the 'invisible text property.  At least I don't know how to do this.

I was thinking all this complication could be avoided if we just allowed
(overlay-put OVERLAY 'invisible nil) to make text visible.

--- i/src/textprop.c
+++ w/src/textprop.c
@@ -630,14 +630,14 @@ get_char_property_and_overlay (Lisp_Object position, register Lisp_Object prop,
       /* Now check the overlays in order of decreasing priority.  */
       while (--noverlays >= 0)
 	{
-	  Lisp_Object tem = Foverlay_get (overlay_vec[noverlays], prop);
+          Lisp_Object tem = Fplist_member (XOVERLAY (overlay_vec[noverlays])->plist, prop);
 	  if (!NILP (tem))
 	    {
 	      if (overlay)
 		/* Return the overlay we got the property from.  */
 		*overlay = overlay_vec[noverlays];
 	      SAFE_FREE ();
-	      return tem;
+	      return XCAR (XCDR (tem));
 	    }
 	}
       SAFE_FREE ();



> Also, I tried a preliminary patches (attached) which I find quite
> convenient and seems to do what I expected first when setting
> (setq search-invisible t): turning on visible-mode.

This seems like a reasonable, though perhaps making the whole buffer
visible isn't always wanted.

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> From: Noam Postavsky <npostavs@HIDDEN>
> Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 00:34:41 -0400
> Cc: 16493 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
> 
> I was thinking all this complication could be avoided if we just allowed
> (overlay-put OVERLAY 'invisible nil) to make text visible.

But we already do: overlay-get returns nil in that case, and the text
is revealed, so the original code before your proposed changes already
does the job.  What am I missing?  Some context where the above
doesn't work?

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Subject: bug#16493: 24.3.50; (setq search-invisible t) is useless, let's allow to turn visible-mode temporarily on
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Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:

>> From: Noam Postavsky <npostavs@HIDDEN>
>> Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 00:34:41 -0400
>> Cc: 16493 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
>> 
>> I was thinking all this complication could be avoided if we just allowed
>> (overlay-put OVERLAY 'invisible nil) to make text visible.
>
> But we already do: overlay-get returns nil in that case, and the text
> is revealed, so the original code before your proposed changes already
> does the job.  What am I missing?  Some context where the above
> doesn't work?

Sorry, I wasn't clear.  I was talking about the situation where there is
a non-nil invisible text property (or a different existing overlay with
with a non-nil invisible property).  For example:

    (let ((p (point))
          overlay)
      (insert "(" (propertize "invisible" 'invisible t) ")")
      (setq overlay (make-overlay p (point)))
      ;; Text remains invisible.
      (overlay-put overlay 'invisible nil))

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Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 08:13:02 -0400
In-Reply-To: <87y33snmam.fsf@HIDDEN> (Noam Postavsky's message of "Tue, 30
 Apr 2019 00:34:41 -0400")
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> I was thinking all this complication could be avoided if we just allowed
> (overlay-put OVERLAY 'invisible nil) to make text visible.

No need for that.
You can do

    (overlay-put OVERLAY 'invisible 'visible)

to get the same result without far-reaching changes to the C code.


        Stefan

X-Loop: help-debbugs@HIDDEN
Subject: bug#16493: 24.3.50; (setq search-invisible t) is useless, let's allow to turn visible-mode temporarily on
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Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 08:24:03 -0400
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Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN> writes:

>> I was thinking all this complication could be avoided if we just allowed
>> (overlay-put OVERLAY 'invisible nil) to make text visible.
>
> No need for that.

I may have confused things a bit by forgetting to mention I was speaking
of overlays on top of an existing invisible text property (see my reply
to Eli).

> You can do
>
>     (overlay-put OVERLAY 'invisible 'visible)
>
> to get the same result without far-reaching changes to the C code.

Um, no, that gives the opposite effect.

(let ((p (point))
      overlay)
  (insert "(" (propertize "invisible" 'invisible t) ")")
  (setq overlay (make-overlay p (point)))
  ;; All text, including parens, becomes invisible.
  (overlay-put overlay 'invisible 'visible))

X-Loop: help-debbugs@HIDDEN
Subject: bug#16493: 24.3.50; (setq search-invisible t) is useless, let's allow to turn visible-mode temporarily on
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From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
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Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 08:45:54 -0400
In-Reply-To: <87sgtzof4s.fsf@HIDDEN> (Noam Postavsky's message of "Tue, 30
 Apr 2019 08:24:03 -0400")
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>> You can do
>>
>>     (overlay-put OVERLAY 'invisible 'visible)
>>
>> to get the same result without far-reaching changes to the C code.
>
> Um, no, that gives the opposite effect.
>
> (let ((p (point))
>       overlay)
>   (insert "(" (propertize "invisible" 'invisible t) ")")
>   (setq overlay (make-overlay p (point)))
>   ;; All text, including parens, becomes invisible.
>   (overlay-put overlay 'invisible 'visible))

You need to use `add-to-invisibility-spec` before that works.  E.g.: 

    (add-to-invisibility-spec 'dummy)
    
that's because of a quirk of the way we treat `invisible` and the
`buffer-invisibility-spec`.


        Stefan
        

PS: To fix this quirk, we should change buffer-invisibility-spec's
default value to nil (or `(t)`, maybe) instead of t.

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Subject: bug#16493: 24.3.50; (setq search-invisible t) is useless, let's allow to turn visible-mode temporarily on
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> From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
> Date: Tue, 30 Apr 2019 08:45:54 -0400
> Cc: Bastien <bzg@HIDDEN>, 16493 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> 
> You need to use `add-to-invisibility-spec` before that works.  E.g.: 
> 
>     (add-to-invisibility-spec 'dummy)
>     
> that's because of a quirk of the way we treat `invisible` and the
> `buffer-invisibility-spec`.
> 
> 
>         Stefan
>         
> 
> PS: To fix this quirk, we should change buffer-invisibility-spec's
> default value to nil (or `(t)`, maybe) instead of t.

That'd be confusing, IMO.  If we need to change some of the semantics
of buffer-invisibility-spec, I'd prefer to introduce some new form of
value which would mean "override any other invisibility properties".

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Subject: bug#16493: 24.3.50; (setq search-invisible t) is useless, let's allow to turn visible-mode temporarily on
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From: Noam Postavsky <npostavs@HIDDEN>
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Date: Wed, 01 May 2019 07:40:31 -0400
In-Reply-To: <83lfzrsemu.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Tue, 30 Apr
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Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:

>> From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>

>> PS: To fix this quirk, we should change buffer-invisibility-spec's
>> default value to nil (or `(t)`, maybe) instead of t.

(t) makes sense, I'd say.

> That'd be confusing, IMO.  If we need to change some of the semantics
> of buffer-invisibility-spec,

It's not a change to semantics though, just the default value.  And
starting from the current default of t, if some code does
(add-to-invisibility-spec 'foo) followed by
(remove-from-invisibility-spec 'foo) you get (t), so arguably just
starting from there in the first place makes things less confusing than
they are now.

X-Loop: help-debbugs@HIDDEN
Subject: bug#16493: 24.3.50; (setq search-invisible t) is useless, let's allow to turn visible-mode temporarily on
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> From: Noam Postavsky <npostavs@HIDDEN>
> Cc: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>,  bzg@HIDDEN,  16493 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Wed, 01 May 2019 07:40:31 -0400
> 
> Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:
> 
> >> From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
> 
> >> PS: To fix this quirk, we should change buffer-invisibility-spec's
> >> default value to nil (or `(t)`, maybe) instead of t.
> 
> (t) makes sense, I'd say.

The difference (or lack thereof) between t and (t) is something that's
confusing, and should be preferably avoided.

> It's not a change to semantics though, just the default value.  And
> starting from the current default of t, if some code does
> (add-to-invisibility-spec 'foo) followed by
> (remove-from-invisibility-spec 'foo) you get (t), so arguably just
> starting from there in the first place makes things less confusing than
> they are now.

I'd rather we fixed the remove-from-invisibility-spec result than
start promoting (t).

X-Loop: help-debbugs@HIDDEN
Subject: bug#16493: 24.3.50; (setq search-invisible t) is useless, let's allow to turn visible-mode temporarily on
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From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
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> The difference (or lack thereof) between t and (t)

There is a rather large difference between the two.

> is something that's confusing, and should be preferably avoided.

Agreed and the way to avoid it, IMO, is to eliminate the `t` case which
is the weird one out whose behavior you can't rely on since some
other package may come around and call
(remove-from|add-to)-invisibility-spec from under you.


        Stefan

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Date: Sat, 11 May 2019 11:27:55 -0400
In-Reply-To: <83h8aeqfao.fsf@HIDDEN> (Eli Zaretskii's message of "Wed, 01 May
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Eli Zaretskii <eliz@HIDDEN> writes:

>> >> PS: To fix this quirk, we should change buffer-invisibility-spec's
>> >> default value to nil (or `(t)`, maybe) instead of t.
>> 
>> (t) makes sense, I'd say.
>
> The difference (or lack thereof) between t and (t) is something that's
> confusing, and should be preferably avoided.
>
>> It's not a change to semantics though, just the default value.  And
>> starting from the current default of t, if some code does
>> (add-to-invisibility-spec 'foo) followed by
>> (remove-from-invisibility-spec 'foo) you get (t), so arguably just
>> starting from there in the first place makes things less confusing than
>> they are now.
>
> I'd rather we fixed the remove-from-invisibility-spec result than
> start promoting (t).

Starting from t, (add-to-invisibility-spec 'foo) also has the weird
result that it *reduces* the number of properties which cause
invisibility (from infinity to 2).  It seems unavoidable due to the
semantics of t (hence why we should default to (t) instead).

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> From: Noam Postavsky <npostavs@HIDDEN>
> Cc: bzg@HIDDEN,  16493 <at> debbugs.gnu.org,  monnier@HIDDEN
> Date: Sat, 11 May 2019 11:27:55 -0400
> 
> > I'd rather we fixed the remove-from-invisibility-spec result than
> > start promoting (t).
> 
> Starting from t, (add-to-invisibility-spec 'foo) also has the weird
> result that it *reduces* the number of properties which cause
> invisibility (from infinity to 2).

Yes, but I don't see that as a problem.  buffer-invisibility-spec is a
filter, so adding to it could have that effect.

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Subject: bug#16493: 24.3.50; (setq search-invisible t) is useless, let's allow to turn visible-mode temporarily on
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>> Starting from t, (add-to-invisibility-spec 'foo) also has the weird
>> result that it *reduces* the number of properties which cause
>> invisibility (from infinity to 2).
> Yes, but I don't see that as a problem.

Here's another way to look at it:

Give me a circumstance where an Elisp package can make use of the fact
that buffer-invisibility-spec defaults to t?

I can't come up with any, because there are only 3 cases:
- the package doesn't use `invisible` and hence doesn't care.
- the package only uses the `t` value of the `invisible` property, so it
  doesn't care because add-to-invisibility-spec always puts `t` in the list.
- the package uses non-nil, non-t value of the `invisible` property.
  In this case, either the package:
  - calls add-to-invisibility-spec to register that value, in which case
    it doesn't care.
  - doesn't call add-to-invisibility-spec, so the text is only invisible
    until some other unrelated package comes around and calls
    add-to-invisibility-spec, thus causing undesired behavior.

So any package which makes use of this default value is vulnerable to
being broken by activation of some unrelated package.


        Stefan

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> From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
> Cc: Noam Postavsky <npostavs@HIDDEN>,  bzg@HIDDEN,  16493 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Sat, 11 May 2019 16:06:12 -0400
> 
> >> Starting from t, (add-to-invisibility-spec 'foo) also has the weird
> >> result that it *reduces* the number of properties which cause
> >> invisibility (from infinity to 2).
> > Yes, but I don't see that as a problem.
> 
> Here's another way to look at it:
> 
> Give me a circumstance where an Elisp package can make use of the fact
> that buffer-invisibility-spec defaults to t?

That's the wrong way of looking at the issue, if you want to talk
about the aspects that I called "confusing".  I see no technical
problems with using (t) instead of t, I just said that it confuses the
heck out of me, because its semantics is not clear by just looking at
the value.

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Subject: bug#16493: 24.3.50; (setq search-invisible t) is useless, let's allow to turn visible-mode temporarily on
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> That's the wrong way of looking at the issue, if you want to talk
> about the aspects that I called "confusing".  I see no technical
> problems with using (t) instead of t, I just said that it confuses the
> heck out of me, because its semantics is not clear by just looking at
> the value.

I'm sorry, I misunderstood.  I don't see anything confusing about any of
this, I thought you were opposed to changing the default because you
thought it was a useful value (plus the usual backward compatibility
risks).

Regarding the possible new defaults and their possible confusing
qualities, then:

- could you explain what you find confusing about `(t)`?

- Personally I'm fine with either `(t)` and `nil` as default values.

- Currently an `invisible` property with value `t` "always" makes the
  text invisible without having to pay attention to
  buffer-invisibility-spec, so `(t)` is more backward compatible.  I put
  quotes around "always" because it's always possible for someone to
  come around and set buffer-invisibility-spec to nil by hand, and
  because until not too long ago, remove-from-invisibility-spec
  occasionally ended up setting buffer-invisibility-spec to nil.


        Stefan

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> From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN>
> Cc: npostavs@HIDDEN,  bzg@HIDDEN,  16493 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Sun, 12 May 2019 11:35:01 -0400
> 
> - could you explain what you find confusing about `(t)`?

It's neither nil nor t.  So its semantics is unclear, until you read
the documentation.  I also envision people making mistakes and using
just t.