Received: (at 34390) by debbugs.gnu.org; 23 Oct 2019 16:45:45 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Wed Oct 23 12:45:45 2019 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:34907 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1iNJlZ-0004Ye-3f for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 23 Oct 2019 12:45:45 -0400 Received: from mail-pg1-f176.google.com ([209.85.215.176]:44417) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <stefankangas@HIDDEN>) id 1iNJlX-0004YQ-FR for 34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 23 Oct 2019 12:45:43 -0400 Received: by mail-pg1-f176.google.com with SMTP id e10so12461185pgd.11 for <34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Wed, 23 Oct 2019 09:45:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=b3L/Y/SLRYqk1MfWpf4KWCFKsF7Jy7GNIozAjLRe7xA=; b=T/J12gdaV0BVG5FKItGJ7svl93VxCCBRPfL3FJK1JaMnlv9a8kYH1j8hONeKHgpaqx iOGC/1tOBU1iZIJb6xBE2JmS2P2TLLCvoisoPZwUpj1zeS9I42ADm0HAqb5sKgc/GpQn NAevNaynkueeJ8PFII+1KQhMXqnf3H1yfE2cKNng+wtFV6Euos0VZK9fxcAF+ZbO0Jg2 K3mR9GHZwvgGXQdDyyh4P91zunt27PX9sN6uQUWJDMgjf9jXPC+dWEmE9pooDJjqrPC9 Vt2fhgF84dN+pBq/37qofFThUmHyyhi//4+U0IoAyQR5VBTUxIelbKFw+UIRSrkx+3yA 8RhA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXZquY7++Lxudb2eH/lp3xJ3mzl5Cfd0+uPxzMg1JDlps2iBoro fRcAxX/k1F+nQJBuFvTVoHGyo80tgz2jaO+ht94= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqx0rp/ainG7vDkjJdwG/uMzT5e6CoKFy/mgI/u2eMlG6ywiBD2Lc+cmg8vYoL/RVPeeSO9aDxTDKvj2gnoiaL0= X-Received: by 2002:a17:90a:fb92:: with SMTP id cp18mr1224949pjb.2.1571849137537; Wed, 23 Oct 2019 09:45:37 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Stefan Kangas <stefan@HIDDEN> Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2019 18:45:25 +0200 Message-ID: <CADwFkm=rg1UPhBo4mX4aaHbrY71b_=D9oW9vhq_juXSSuenhOA@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#34390: package.el says "Obsolete" when it means "No Longer Used" To: Brett Gilio <brettg@HIDDEN> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 34390 Cc: "Basil L. Contovounesios" <contovob@HIDDEN>, 34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Phillip Lord <phillip.lord@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -0.5 (/) Brett Gilio <brettg@HIDDEN> writes: > Basil L. Contovounesios writes: > >> phillip.lord@HIDDEN (Phillip Lord) writes: >> >>> Currently package.el reports packages as "Obsolete" when this is >>> probably not a good choice of word, as it is being interpreted as "no >>> longer in active development". >>> >>> http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2019-02/msg00070.html >>> >>> It happens when several versions of a package are installed. Consider >>> this report from M-x package-list-packages >>> >>> dash 2.12.0 obsolete A modern list library for Emacs >>> eglot 1.4 incompat gnu Client for Language Server Protocol (LSP) servers >>> kiwix 0.4.0 incompat melpa-s... Kiwix interface and support. >>> >>> >>> Dash is showing here are obsolete because in my installation 2.15.0 is installed. >>> >>> >>> company 0.9.9 dependency Modular text completion framework >>> dash 2.15.0 dependency A modern list library for Emacs >>> dash-functional 2.15.0 dependency Collection of useful combinators for Emacs >>> Lisp >>> direnv 1.4.0 dependency direnv support for emacs >>> >>> >>> The problem is "obsolete" line appears quite some distance away from >>> other line which shows dash is installed. >>> >>> I would suggested "installed but outdated" perhaps. Or "More Recent >>> Version Installed". Both a bit long. >> >> How about "shadowed" or similar? I think that's the wrong term, because it implies that it is currently unused. > The Guix package manager uses a term "superseded." I quite find this > term to be useful and nice. I guess that could work, but I don't find it very user friendly. How about "upgradable"? That makes it clear that it's both installed and that it can be upgraded. Best regards, Stefan Kangas
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#34390; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 34390) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Feb 2019 23:50:39 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Fri Feb 08 18:50:39 2019 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40301 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1gsFup-0004AG-3r for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 18:50:39 -0500 Received: from mout02.posteo.de ([185.67.36.66]:55571) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <brettg@HIDDEN>) id 1gsFul-00049y-KI for 34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 18:50:36 -0500 Received: from submission (posteo.de [89.146.220.130]) by mout02.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 017EA2400FB for <34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Sat, 9 Feb 2019 00:50:27 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1549669828; bh=gE0cTf7elU6kBaZKVBxdNm0DmQc22jd2W/+f1KQjzmI=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:From; b=Y7qdeoEmMV+8eHFFv5I8uowSnebtiegSUti+lgv3JPK/Q0SiatnDCQEQWFBVKIcbO FLLyRK32LnQGFGWNJ3sDaRRhvxowo1TIZ8j9HgsRQBvCp50SuRyxH4DliB9CW03vOV 5Q8nSbVaP1QfR9uuzmEXlWKCBQeWpCM8zeXvnNyATL+xiv2FPvCRw0tXG1bRfXqjqZ 9HMpl6YdiWFdZC/r5HvqDLCQxmP3C4MGt4vSOu8KF0cE4Yrl/cWPli+fv7ZuLpnCvw FjhqLW/hnYUuTqM9VBvA/DVo1q8aE2g+S4uSHvU90VDio/MNi9o75fHxvhlClQRbu0 XeJVeSyyJDHfA== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 43xBkn6Qzrz9rxM; Sat, 9 Feb 2019 00:50:25 +0100 (CET) References: <87pns2p6ny.fsf@HIDDEN> <s2br0c4me0j4ohtcvima294q.1549647670652@HIDDEN> <jwvpns2q6u7.fsf-monnier+emacs@HIDDEN> User-agent: mu4e 1.0; emacs 26.1 From: Brett Gilio <brettg@HIDDEN> To: Stefan Monnier <monnier@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#34390: package.el says "Obsolete" when it means "No Longer Used" In-reply-to: <jwvpns2q6u7.fsf-monnier+emacs@HIDDEN> Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2019 17:50:23 -0600 Message-ID: <874l9dhmbk.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 34390 Cc: "Basil L. Contovounesios" <contovob@HIDDEN>, 34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, brettg@HIDDEN, Phillip Lord <phillip.lord@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Stefan Monnier writes: >> The statement of superseded as used by Guix is that it has a reference >> pointer to what it is superseded by, and will either point to a different >> package definition of a new version of the original package. > > Regardless if we change "obsolete" to "superseded" or something else, > I think making the word into a link/button that explains itself would be > a great improvement. > > > Stefan Agreed, knowing what the package definition is point to for upgrade/replacement is a necessary step. Brett Gilio
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#34390; Package emacs.
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To: brettg@HIDDEN
Subject: Re: bug#34390: package.el says "Obsolete" when it means "No Longer
Used"
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> The statement of superseded as used by Guix is that it has a reference
> pointer to what it is superseded by, and will either point to a different
> package definition of a new version of the original package.
Regardless if we change "obsolete" to "superseded" or something else,
I think making the word into a link/button that explains itself would be
a great improvement.
Stefan
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#34390; Package emacs.
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Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2019 11:42:35 -0600
Subject: Re: bug#34390: package.el says "Obsolete" when it means "No Longer
Used"
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The statement of superseded as used by Guix is that it has a reference pointer to what it is superseded by, and will either point to a different package definition of a new version of the original package.
I think as long as the terminology is clear, and what it is superseded by is iterated properly, we are in good shape.
Brett Gilio
------ Original message------From: Basil L. ContovounesiosDate: Fri, Feb 8, 2019 11:34 AMTo: Brett Gilio;Cc: 34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org;Phillip Lord;Subject:bug#34390: package.el says "Obsolete" when it means "No Longer Used"
Brett Gilio writes:
> Basil L. Contovounesios writes:
>
>> How about "shadowed" or similar?
>
> The Guix package manager uses a term "superseded." I quite find this
> term to be useful and nice.
SGTM. Though if one wanted to be really pedantic I think they could
argue that a package (either installed or uninstalled) could be
superseded by another package (again regardless of whether it's
installed), whereas shadowing can only occur if both packages/versions
are installed, IIUC.
--
Basil
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<div style="font-size: 10pt;"><div dir="auto">The statement of superseded as used by Guix is that it has a reference pointer to what it is superseded by, and will either point to a different package definition of a new version of the original package.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">I think as long as the terminology is clear, and what it is superseded by is iterated properly, we are in good shape.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Brett Gilio</div></div><div style="font-size: 10pt;"><div id="LGEmailHeader" dir="auto"><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">------ Original message------</div><div dir="auto"><b>From: </b>Basil L. Contovounesios<contovob@HIDDEN></contovob@HIDDEN></div><div dir="auto"><b>Date: </b>Fri, Feb 8, 2019 11:34 AM</div><div dir="auto"><b>To: </b>Brett Gilio;</div><div dir="auto"><b>Cc: </b><a href="mailto:34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org">34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org</a>;Phillip Lord;</div><div dir="auto"><b>Subject:</b>bug#34390: package.el say
s "Obsolete" when it means "No Longer Used"</div><div dir="auto"><br></div></div><pre>Brett Gilio <brettg@HIDDEN> writes:
> Basil L. Contovounesios writes:
>
>> How about "shadowed" or similar?
>
> The Guix package manager uses a term "superseded." I quite find this
> term to be useful and nice.
SGTM. Though if one wanted to be really pedantic I think they could
argue that a package (either installed or uninstalled) could be
superseded by another package (again regardless of whether it's
installed), whereas shadowing can only occur if both packages/versions
are installed, IIUC.
--
Basil
</brettg@HIDDEN></pre></div>
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bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#34390; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 34390) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Feb 2019 17:25:59 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Fri Feb 08 12:25:59 2019 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40107 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1gs9uZ-0003RY-Fs for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 12:25:59 -0500 Received: from mail-ed1-f54.google.com ([209.85.208.54]:33889) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <contovob@HIDDEN>) id 1gs9uX-0003RE-Bb for 34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 12:25:58 -0500 Received: by mail-ed1-f54.google.com with SMTP id b3so3474031ede.1 for <34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 09:25:57 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=tcd-ie.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version; bh=+6jMCN011UdCaoSdyZuYbmu8QOCyCS9gFnL9RRlRnkA=; b=UvHsp0gSSFZedYDyXN4VKjUJJqqm3cvJWOhQSa4VTUIWvOgytAHOCUjy39ztm1At01 TVmTeHx95t4FGsi/bjnUsClVVKSqQ8b9JrC2Ckw9I1BhcClOW8cMP8tbg1QBtfNzoKJ1 ynCbRNO+f+AInMn2f2VK9iOYwPYT4bke6SmTG6Wpih1cK+5SSkK88sKEsCDfbJ2gcgM2 XnESh7HsEE0tP9QceUHNz1dmnYrmwpk1m82Hor7WWeb0pMRhQPDrIqV5C3U7GP/9MHhW aPI9LL5KEiQAI77fT9hg/eH/WQkUq/Hx8UPUBwaRytBPbSYr8x8QfDoFWp+CI5oRv7JI Dn4Q== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to :message-id:user-agent:mime-version; bh=+6jMCN011UdCaoSdyZuYbmu8QOCyCS9gFnL9RRlRnkA=; b=nLACVI8fhi6A74jM5qF+QyrWsZ5TLNjTpSkgDsImgM3vasfHyYPDC/QqRjCAkEzsj+ GS22mzE4ygf+AHO7E0caeuouQDoEHY3rZ6FdYXkyziwAe2FbApyJT4agSEkK/zKzLkN8 iH47SMSkthq8y3yfj+bw+07IjnodtoNVugRyas91wb8kpY3uCtK/pNQKx+qI5E8rl7cw qu54+Tw51QJvU4ncSWVYWzAVuklnofpxtmEjTuBf+6vB9b4SAH/8QCz4j56qbGukFRtt RfQmFs5g159b6HMFBrUdzQD/fTQQoUknfVUbMHY0z8BZXfdj5P0Yjv5dXUGpvgsVA/RI 4Z6g== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuYbHa/LgInyztnGdvDYzcJ3CPwUdPekYbDYTz7IL45BFeyuwPNQ pMNXShtXJ4BRG1YaVez48bcdNw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3Ibs/wCr9of0+x0cavBbGT62Rf+f07hX5xmQ4nYRHKJ6yvKjYZdkb4lRPbp3bCsw2f9Ic9o64Q== X-Received: by 2002:a05:6402:788:: with SMTP id d8mr7766772edy.148.1549646750423; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 09:25:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost ([134.226.214.247]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id j16sm577246ejq.59.2019.02.08.09.25.49 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=AEAD-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256/256); Fri, 08 Feb 2019 09:25:49 -0800 (PST) From: "Basil L. Contovounesios" <contovob@HIDDEN> To: Brett Gilio <brettg@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#34390: package.el says "Obsolete" when it means "No Longer Used" References: <87pns2p6ny.fsf@HIDDEN> <87k1iajjdu.fsf@HIDDEN> <877eeap5gm.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2019 17:25:48 +0000 In-Reply-To: <877eeap5gm.fsf@HIDDEN> (Brett Gilio's message of "Fri, 08 Feb 2019 11:15:05 -0600") Message-ID: <877eeajioz.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 34390 Cc: 34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Phillip Lord <phillip.lord@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Brett Gilio <brettg@HIDDEN> writes: > Basil L. Contovounesios writes: > >> How about "shadowed" or similar? > > The Guix package manager uses a term "superseded." I quite find this > term to be useful and nice. SGTM. Though if one wanted to be really pedantic I think they could argue that a package (either installed or uninstalled) could be superseded by another package (again regardless of whether it's installed), whereas shadowing can only occur if both packages/versions are installed, IIUC. -- Basil
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#34390; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 34390) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Feb 2019 17:16:57 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Fri Feb 08 12:16:57 2019 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40092 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1gs9lp-0003Bh-E5 for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 12:16:57 -0500 Received: from mail-wm1-f47.google.com ([209.85.128.47]:55110) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <rpluim@HIDDEN>) id 1gs9lm-0003BP-UG for 34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 12:16:56 -0500 Received: by mail-wm1-f47.google.com with SMTP id a62so4221970wmh.4 for <34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 09:16:54 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:mail-copies-to:gmane-reply-to-list :date:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version; bh=93bjAXAW3SSwrEtsKj5lg+pVJhyljWGBNa6IMYrVKbM=; b=OWkFmR1aZu4phKp4G3A3C/0b8eqaIGhqLQ+a/e/rSU7xwrzHNfJvvv4FE9NhIqusnw vdzBb4yUUzc7XxL+lfNT+uXyawcrETGHEHN6pMxPe6pNEMCDAzc7Vr6dnS5NUlzqnbbI Y73gZbuKC0ql8ff0TV3cvpvOmBMV3x8PB3H78gOXdwsqoOe57KPIflWS+gVivXRWy+Ex BoHFMlcaFJqPajVZMa3ukk1ONpBk5cGLqnT5zYLYpK6nOtAjWbsG2ZDjX7W8vy+C0w9J 9yh5/amFpiYy1nuSIQgDYhoo9XHYWpRPqyJZemwYG6rkj3FfKND6MklwBUAoh4edX2Z1 vcoA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:mail-copies-to :gmane-reply-to-list:date:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version; bh=93bjAXAW3SSwrEtsKj5lg+pVJhyljWGBNa6IMYrVKbM=; b=T3qLAtDohfRU2eztHB1gLSSHcGCNpgjxP0hKAh9e/3//N3UBY+a9Ssd+Qas1NeH3kz GWrfHcpChrjl8vO9CscYHRsgg2D0a9xErC3BfPhjigl15z3c3cm48WSeUrXMu+b7BT9e 3TBGOxYCt/BR1purS9ODKZpLIgHd3BEmx6ETyh3g1JelKk189E2UaNIAmJST1UBO4Yst iSydmhUxo1k0rmKWNcOtUKOMwwV9qezYN7gYlhhLWqPF5v6ZBYWeRAsgCQW5lp+Ljz5g isQu3z8D2Cn3R5ILeN2qRSKfTomib81q95oBQdOp0oAbcjiS3/nPYbK6YfRQGUcL2LwJ LFzw== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuaX89V5XBTgOhm8xWz9N68EYGtJnytVp3BVIv/OxJJ+7d4dywts e+zE9EipUtT8D1fZA+YIalS6cuxwe3Y= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IaRtO+lznmcDKsfP4q6mMslyvFVBROFASrdIugSgigrz69+aDLihOmxLMKH1SjUnZ73Enaafg== X-Received: by 2002:adf:8224:: with SMTP id 33mr5814832wrb.264.1549646207671; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 09:16:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from rpluim-mac ([2a01:e34:ecfc:a860:508e:f5c1:5162:8e85]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id n9sm1629093wrx.80.2019.02.08.09.16.46 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=AEAD-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256/256); Fri, 08 Feb 2019 09:16:46 -0800 (PST) From: Robert Pluim <rpluim@HIDDEN> To: "Basil L. Contovounesios" <contovob@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#34390: package.el says "Obsolete" when it means "No Longer Used" References: <87pns2p6ny.fsf@HIDDEN> <87k1iajjdu.fsf@HIDDEN> X-Debbugs-No-Ack: yes Mail-Copies-To: never Gmane-Reply-To-List: yes Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2019 18:16:45 +0100 In-Reply-To: <87k1iajjdu.fsf@HIDDEN> (Basil L. Contovounesios's message of "Fri, 08 Feb 2019 17:10:53 +0000") Message-ID: <m2r2cimc8y.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 34390 Cc: 34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Phillip Lord <phillip.lord@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) "Basil L. Contovounesios" <contovob@HIDDEN> writes: > > How about "shadowed" or similar? "superseded"?
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#34390; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 34390) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Feb 2019 17:15:20 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Fri Feb 08 12:15:20 2019 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40088 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1gs9kG-00038o-0B for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 12:15:20 -0500 Received: from mout01.posteo.de ([185.67.36.65]:59230) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <brettg@HIDDEN>) id 1gs9kB-00038S-BJ for 34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 12:15:16 -0500 Received: from submission (posteo.de [89.146.220.130]) by mout01.posteo.de (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CFD16160060 for <34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Fri, 8 Feb 2019 18:15:08 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=posteo.net; s=2017; t=1549646108; bh=qCq9Hz9ri6Ewov7T2y0iY47SJ6ginsDlMT7zoo1oyIE=; h=From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:From; b=AQhdQqecBcYINrL1kBBhW95MU04rXHRix0RmUGUV1QyuA6oI1m2PkWmdoIEapUHxs UUFdNhUzNcAmkGrdgFG4DIufcHBBnLqTkP+BPUw312KPTE4Dn0gUBeSbb0ic7f0xOd lwaFh6LIPkyuOT0ulGZrhkrJNiGCWbjlziWwiXJJJti+kXr2sozIkPs3XSG2DVj9LM MOCocyfpNnRIcmpcYJAO8jcqVnJn9CHDTYMTb/kRDssm9WPqC0mTiB6jMJ3Ch4FIAO yHBymLN5l5yBdBq8c0+3TsHMvTFlVK/jG0Zk7SrYNVPjq3uKBLLhYu6SW+/CC9O3YA UUAJjdbc6DOBQ== Received: from customer (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by submission (posteo.de) with ESMTPSA id 43x1yg0wDZz6tm9; Fri, 8 Feb 2019 18:15:06 +0100 (CET) References: <87pns2p6ny.fsf@HIDDEN> <87k1iajjdu.fsf@HIDDEN> User-agent: mu4e 1.0; emacs 26.1 From: Brett Gilio <brettg@HIDDEN> To: "Basil L. Contovounesios" <contovob@HIDDEN> Subject: Re: bug#34390: package.el says "Obsolete" when it means "No Longer Used" In-reply-to: <87k1iajjdu.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2019 11:15:05 -0600 Message-ID: <877eeap5gm.fsf@HIDDEN> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: -2.3 (--) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 34390 Cc: 34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org, Phillip Lord <phillip.lord@HIDDEN> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -3.3 (---) Basil L. Contovounesios writes: > phillip.lord@HIDDEN (Phillip Lord) writes: > >> Currently package.el reports packages as "Obsolete" when this is >> probably not a good choice of word, as it is being interpreted as "no >> longer in active development". >> >> http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2019-02/msg00070.html >> >> It happens when several versions of a package are installed. Consider >> this report from M-x package-list-packages >> >> dash 2.12.0 obsolete A modern list library for Emacs >> eglot 1.4 incompat gnu Client for Language Server Protocol (LSP) servers >> kiwix 0.4.0 incompat melpa-s... Kiwix interface and support. >> >> >> Dash is showing here are obsolete because in my installation 2.15.0 is installed. >> >> >> company 0.9.9 dependency Modular text completion framework >> dash 2.15.0 dependency A modern list library for Emacs >> dash-functional 2.15.0 dependency Collection of useful combinators for Emacs >> Lisp >> direnv 1.4.0 dependency direnv support for emacs >> >> >> The problem is "obsolete" line appears quite some distance away from >> other line which shows dash is installed. >> >> I would suggested "installed but outdated" perhaps. Or "More Recent >> Version Installed". Both a bit long. > > How about "shadowed" or similar? The Guix package manager uses a term "superseded." I quite find this term to be useful and nice.
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#34390; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at 34390) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Feb 2019 17:11:04 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Fri Feb 08 12:11:04 2019 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40084 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1gs9g8-00031s-9g for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 12:11:04 -0500 Received: from mail-ed1-f66.google.com ([209.85.208.66]:40499) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <contovob@HIDDEN>) id 1gs9g6-00031L-7X for 34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 12:11:03 -0500 Received: by mail-ed1-f66.google.com with SMTP id g22so3383073edr.7 for <34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org>; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 09:11:02 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=tcd-ie.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to:message-id :user-agent:mime-version; bh=y/Y4jKYxDfi0KnMh229fdvK1BSqeIS59tAdiGPg8Vbw=; b=FviVycVzOBhgZOhMi7H11ihe6cp53dbfPNc7ASJThiwTICFkfFss5T2t+/vQlXLCRK 23ct+3NVNt04ym70JJlD8KHB6tq/C/882hSkg6kDbq1Jh/ySvlT5vuzEOLpm24XYxPHm KNFq1GYSwr4ei05JGGACY7ckSg8Fyi3SkOg0oeYZNSVI9ARtvZR8+P+sYmgbPRid2e1u Q6Um2PK4TL3T+3lrOq1o4ihkfQbPd7ErmQp7fUdAU+VjELJBM2CepVuVhpKXM+OFW15F ymqMHcOLPdfnrZQFSZquXN3sDwhuhgzOZDBQ9idizDSeCHn1LOKun8B/qeOzibuSinLf 0Buw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:references:date:in-reply-to :message-id:user-agent:mime-version; bh=y/Y4jKYxDfi0KnMh229fdvK1BSqeIS59tAdiGPg8Vbw=; b=pW24wYH9iLfn4diTY1x8oy1Z7CqCzRJw6rQrDJY//9c72M1/gRwxj1+dR8NhHrJm5j oUQzqnq8jZldBGSXbUyXJbvRwVWkKGTu64sFiqaChX9LttLUqTu26EcaqXXTacyMgAIh xH1htplihgQP6nY1MM+aLcKs13A0UjquJ28IYEaGUYElEQYhrypjG3qEK5EkQUgwU2CA Ff/zNROEgHgIaRQVtUn210yT1hOOA/8zl3zLY8CVqUHD3hQ6khfjRzfEB8RIbDmD7oTd lWltZh4DlLM31ZmVvCNGvZTA/c4G470nQAf94B9GY9e+R7+7sDoz7Zw6psXrIO+AL3Bc rmpw== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAuYPJVFZBA4T+N70iXFCQCK0C84Uv9BHJ6lqav7mgDiXHyr180ns 39MczRyYkx4w8B2i71Vk+PtseA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IYLRoYudzbK23g2ATP8aQA82HKf1b8m0FR+8ok87C+hFj2kRocLNt5pmL21sB555aqBLYlALQ== X-Received: by 2002:a50:fc07:: with SMTP id i7mr17641782edr.153.1549645856319; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 09:10:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost ([134.226.214.248]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 53sm749324eds.77.2019.02.08.09.10.55 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=AEAD-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256/256); Fri, 08 Feb 2019 09:10:55 -0800 (PST) From: "Basil L. Contovounesios" <contovob@HIDDEN> To: phillip.lord@HIDDEN (Phillip Lord) Subject: Re: bug#34390: package.el says "Obsolete" when it means "No Longer Used" References: <87pns2p6ny.fsf@HIDDEN> Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2019 17:10:53 +0000 In-Reply-To: <87pns2p6ny.fsf@HIDDEN> (Phillip Lord's message of "Fri, 08 Feb 2019 16:49:05 +0000") Message-ID: <87k1iajjdu.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.0.50 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: 34390 Cc: 34390 <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) phillip.lord@HIDDEN (Phillip Lord) writes: > Currently package.el reports packages as "Obsolete" when this is > probably not a good choice of word, as it is being interpreted as "no > longer in active development". > > http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2019-02/msg00070.html > > It happens when several versions of a package are installed. Consider > this report from M-x package-list-packages > > dash 2.12.0 obsolete A modern list library for Emacs > eglot 1.4 incompat gnu Client for Language Server Protocol (LSP) servers > kiwix 0.4.0 incompat melpa-s... Kiwix interface and support. > > > Dash is showing here are obsolete because in my installation 2.15.0 is installed. > > > company 0.9.9 dependency Modular text completion framework > dash 2.15.0 dependency A modern list library for Emacs > dash-functional 2.15.0 dependency Collection of useful combinators for Emacs > Lisp > direnv 1.4.0 dependency direnv support for emacs > > > The problem is "obsolete" line appears quite some distance away from > other line which shows dash is installed. > > I would suggested "installed but outdated" perhaps. Or "More Recent > Version Installed". Both a bit long. How about "shadowed" or similar? -- Basil
bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#34390; Package emacs.
Full text available.Received: (at submit) by debbugs.gnu.org; 8 Feb 2019 16:49:58 +0000 From debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Fri Feb 08 11:49:58 2019 Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:40076 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1gs9Li-0002Tu-HO for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 11:49:58 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:57119) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from <phillip.lord@HIDDEN>) id 1gs9Lg-0002Tf-OG for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 11:49:57 -0500 Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]:35489) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from <phillip.lord@HIDDEN>) id 1gs9Lb-0000Tc-Ib for submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 11:49:51 -0500 Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:43258) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from <phillip.lord@HIDDEN>) id 1gs9La-00069D-N3 for bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 11:49:51 -0500 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on eggs.gnu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.8 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_50,URIBL_BLOCKED autolearn=disabled version=3.3.2 Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from <phillip.lord@HIDDEN>) id 1gs9LZ-0000RT-JR for bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 11:49:50 -0500 Received: from cloud103.planethippo.com ([78.129.138.110]:52564) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from <phillip.lord@HIDDEN>) id 1gs9LZ-0008Oi-4f for bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 11:49:49 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=russet.org.uk; s=default; h=Content-Type:MIME-Version:Message-ID:Date: Subject:To:From:Sender:Reply-To:Cc:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID: Content-Description:Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc :Resent-Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References:List-Id:List-Help:List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=1jzhP/fjPYEhauELcLiQ++eGyQQU+yZ2EjI7EIgqvEI=; b=f2KXyuY/68EUOHqsVIEOZnByoQ OaLKzTnpn3yO9I7bUix+wGCAFf1cI1y/sf8qzVUipGSiZUeDNHOv5ByCghxkxPXdgCUku+xfKjkGI gtLJCYireRaiEtsZy8HDpv0jQQyEsPT6IZp1Yrv3cAUsdZPhaC2ntA4mqZ9orAEyJYas5kPTsVTpH r0Fu4DtoqUblcu07Zcqnn6PLo+ipfOAJLDpKrdVdLUi161JUN6AJMFTSkrSAWIy8J/TZQAlFeHc8a jKkUtJEql2blivVvQD7TOjVHbRosjifM057tdDsV59m1KdgPD/0255HEcduyymPMrT0kFM6PSXnCU luwpC5Ig==; Received: from janus-nat-128-240-225-124.ncl.ac.uk ([128.240.225.124]:36204 helo=russet.org.uk) by cloud103.planethippo.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) (Exim 4.91) (envelope-from <phillip.lord@HIDDEN>) id 1gs9Kr-0007UQ-Kp for bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN; Fri, 08 Feb 2019 16:49:05 +0000 From: phillip.lord@HIDDEN (Phillip Lord) To: bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN Subject: package.el says "Obsolete" when it means "No Longer Used" Date: Fri, 08 Feb 2019 16:49:05 +0000 Message-ID: <87pns2p6ny.fsf@HIDDEN> User-Agent: Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/26.1.91 (gnu/linux) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - cloud103.planethippo.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - gnu.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - russet.org.uk X-Get-Message-Sender-Via: cloud103.planethippo.com: authenticated_id: phillip.lord@HIDDEN X-Authenticated-Sender: cloud103.planethippo.com: phillip.lord@HIDDEN X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 78.129.138.110 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6.x X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Debbugs-Envelope-To: submit X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18 Precedence: list List-Id: <debbugs-submit.debbugs.gnu.org> List-Unsubscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/options/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe> List-Archive: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/private/debbugs-submit/> List-Post: <mailto:debbugs-submit <at> debbugs.gnu.org> List-Help: <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=help> List-Subscribe: <https://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/debbugs-submit>, <mailto:debbugs-submit-request <at> debbugs.gnu.org?subject=subscribe> Errors-To: debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces <at> debbugs.gnu.org> X-Spam-Score: -1.0 (-) Currently package.el reports packages as "Obsolete" when this is probably not a good choice of word, as it is being interpreted as "no longer in active development". http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/help-gnu-emacs/2019-02/msg00070.html It happens when several versions of a package are installed. Consider this report from M-x package-list-packages dash 2.12.0 obsolete A modern list library for Emacs eglot 1.4 incompat gnu Client for Language Server Protocol (LSP) servers kiwix 0.4.0 incompat melpa-s... Kiwix interface and support. Dash is showing here are obsolete because in my installation 2.15.0 is installed. company 0.9.9 dependency Modular text completion framework dash 2.15.0 dependency A modern list library for Emacs dash-functional 2.15.0 dependency Collection of useful combinators for Emacs Lisp direnv 1.4.0 dependency direnv support for emacs The problem is "obsolete" line appears quite some distance away from other line which shows dash is installed. I would suggested "installed but outdated" perhaps. Or "More Recent Version Installed". Both a bit long.
phillip.lord@HIDDEN (Phillip Lord):bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN.
Full text available.bug-gnu-emacs@HIDDEN:bug#34390; Package emacs.
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