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Subject: bug#79896: [coreutils] printf deficiencies
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--------------ZxX5BB2vTHX0H4LtWsepHuHu
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Hello,

today I noticed the following deficiencies in implementation and=20
documentation of printf:

(1)
Built-in help (/usr/bin/printf --help)

 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 entirely fails to mention the option --.
 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 This is even more surprising, as an error message explicitl=
y points=20
to the built-in help when that option is used without any additional=20
parameters:

$/usr/bin/printf --
printf: missing operand
Try '/usr/bin/printf --help' for more information.

(2)
man page=C2=A0 (commonly: /usr/share/man/man1/printf.1.gz)

 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 is missing any mention (lest description) of the option --.


(3)
Online-Documentation=20
(https://www.gnu.org/software/coreutils/manual/html_node/printf-invocation=
.html#printf-invocation)

 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 is missing any mention (lest description) of the option --.

 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Though at the end of that documentation page, it says:

 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 "The only options are a lone --help or --vers=
ion. See Common=20
options=20
<https://www.gnu.org/software/coreutils/manual/html_node/Common-options.ht=
ml>.=20
Options must precede operands."

 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Now seeing that only three "Common options" do exist, it do=
es not=20
seem to make sense that the printf page explicitly mentions only two of=20
them=C2=A0 ( --help=C2=A0, --version=C2=A0=C2=A0) but not the third=C2=A0(=
 -- ).


Obviously, these deficiencies exist in all languages/translations.

Regards,
Bernhard

--------------ZxX5BB2vTHX0H4LtWsepHuHu
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<!DOCTYPE html>
<html>
  <head>

    <meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3DUTF-=
8">
  </head>
  <body>
    <p>Hello,</p>
    <p>today I noticed the following deficiencies in implementation and
      documentation of printf:=C2=A0</p>
    <p>(1)<br>
      Built-in help (<span style=3D"font-family:monospace"><span
          style=3D"color:#000000;background-color:#ffffff;">/usr/bin/print=
f
          --help</span></span>)</p>
    <p>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 entirely fails to mention the option=C2=A0<span
        style=3D"font-family:monospace"><span
          style=3D"color:#000000;background-color:#ffffff;">--</span></spa=
n>.=C2=A0<br>
      =C2=A0 =C2=A0 This is even more surprising, as an error message expl=
icitly
      points to the built-in help when that option is used without any
      additional parameters:</p>
    <p><span style=3D"font-family:monospace"><span
style=3D"font-weight:bold;color:#54ff54;background-color:#ffffff;">$</span=
><span
          style=3D"color:#000000;background-color:#ffffff;">
          /usr/bin/printf --</span><span
          style=3D"color:#000000;background-color:#ffffff;">
        </span><br>
        <span style=3D"color:#000000;background-color:#ffffff;">printf:
          missing operand</span><span
          style=3D"color:#000000;background-color:#ffffff;">
        </span><br>
        <span style=3D"color:#000000;background-color:#ffffff;">Try
          '/usr/bin/printf --help' for more information.</span><br>
      </span>
      <br>
    </p>
    <p>(2)<br>
      man page=C2=A0 (commonly:=C2=A0=C2=A0
      <span style=3D"font-family:monospace"><span
          style=3D"color:#000000;background-color:#ffffff;">/usr/share</sp=
an><span
          style=3D"color:#000000;background-color:#ffffff;">/man/man1/prin=
tf.1.gz</span></span>)</p>
    <p>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 is missing any mention (lest description) of the opti=
on=C2=A0=C2=A0<span
        style=3D"font-family:monospace"><span
          style=3D"color:#000000;background-color:#ffffff;">--</span></spa=
n>.</p>
    <p><br>
    </p>
    <p>(3)<br>
      Online-Documentation (<span style=3D"font-family:monospace"><span
          style=3D"color:#000000;background-color:#ffffff;"><a class=3D"mo=
z-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"https://www.gnu.org/software/coreutils/manual=
/html_node/printf-invocation.html#printf-invocation">https://www.gnu.org/s=
oftware/coreutils/manual/html_node/printf-invocation.html#printf-invocatio=
n</a></span></span>)</p>
    <p>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 is missing any mention (lest description) of the opti=
on=C2=A0=C2=A0<span
        style=3D"font-family:monospace"><span
          style=3D"color:#000000;background-color:#ffffff;">--</span></spa=
n>.</p>
    <p>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Though at the end of that documentation page, it says=
:</p>
    <p>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 "The only options are a lone <samp clas=
s=3D"option">--help</samp>
      or
      <samp class=3D"option">--version</samp>. See <a class=3D"xref"
href=3D"https://www.gnu.org/software/coreutils/manual/html_node/Common-opt=
ions.html">Common
        options</a>.
      Options must precede operands."</p>
    <p>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Now seeing that only three "Common options" do exist,=
 it does
      not seem to make sense that the printf page explicitly mentions
      only two of them=C2=A0 ( <samp class=3D"option">--help</samp>=C2=A0,=
=C2=A0<samp
        class=3D"option">--version</samp>=C2=A0=C2=A0) but not the third=
=C2=A0( <samp
        class=3D"option">--</samp> ).</p>
    <p><br>
    </p>
    <p>Obviously, these deficiencies exist in all
      languages/translations.</p>
    <p>Regards,<br>
      Bernhard</p>
  </body>
</html>

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To: Bernhard Gabler <bernhard_gabler@HIDDEN>
Subject: bug#79896: Acknowledgement ([coreutils] printf deficiencies)
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Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2025 20:37:03 +0000

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Subject: bug#79896: [coreutils] printf deficiencies
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 Content preview:  Hi Bernhard, Bernhard Gabler via GNU coreutils Bug Reports
    writes: > Hello, > > today I noticed the following deficiencies in implementation
    and > documentation of printf: > > (1) > Built-in help (/usr/bin/printf --help)
    > > =?UTF-8?Q?=C2=A0_?= =?UTF-8?Q?=C2=A0?= entirely fails to mention the option [...] 

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Hi Bernhard,

Bernhard Gabler via GNU coreutils Bug Reports <bug-coreutils@HIDDEN>
writes:

> Hello,
>
> today I noticed the following deficiencies in implementation and
> documentation of printf:
>
> (1)
> Built-in help (/usr/bin/printf --help)
>
> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 entirely fails to mention the option --.
> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 This is even more surprising, as an error message explicitly
> points to the built-in help when that option is used without any
> additional parameters:
>
> $/usr/bin/printf --
> printf: missing operand
> Try '/usr/bin/printf --help' for more information.
>
> (2)
> man page=C2=A0 (commonly: /usr/share/man/man1/printf.1.gz)
>
> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 is missing any mention (lest description) of the option --.
>
>
> (3)
> Online-Documentation
> (https://www.gnu.org/software/coreutils/manual/html_node/printf-invocatio=
n.html#printf-invocation)
>
> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 is missing any mention (lest description) of the option --.
>
> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Though at the end of that documentation page, it says:
>
> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 "The only options are a lone --help or --vers=
ion. See Common
> options
> <https://www.gnu.org/software/coreutils/manual/html_node/Common-options.h=
tml>.
> Options must precede operands."
>
> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Now seeing that only three "Common options" do exist, it do=
es not
> seem to make sense that the printf page explicitly mentions only two
> of them=C2=A0 ( --help=C2=A0, --version=C2=A0=C2=A0) but not the third=C2=
=A0( -- ).
>
>
> Obviously, these deficiencies exist in all languages/translations.

This is a POSIX requirement for programs. Copying their words here [1]:

    Guideline 10:
        The first -- argument that is not an option-argument should be
        accepted as a delimiter indicating the end of options. Any
        following arguments should be treated as operands, even if they
        begin with the '-' character.

A common use of this is to delete file names that start with the "-"
character. We have an example like this in the manual under the 'rm'
command:

    $ ls -- -f
    -f
    $ rm -f
    $ ls -- -f
    -f
    $ rm -- -f
    $ ls -- -f
    ls: cannot access '-f': No such file or directory

Collin

[1] https://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9799919799/basedefs/V1_chap12.htm=
l#tag_12_02

Message sent to bug-coreutils@HIDDEN:

Subject: bug#79896: [coreutils] printf deficiencies
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To: 79896 <at> debbugs.gnu.org
Cc: bernhard_gabler@HIDDEN
From: Collin Funk <collin.funk1@HIDDEN>
In-Reply-To: <6c35ea05-8c81-404e-8a2a-d9bc4fdc1cda@HIDDEN>
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Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2025 12:57:08 -0800
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Hi Bernhard,

Bernhard Gabler via GNU coreutils Bug Reports <bug-coreutils@HIDDEN>
writes:

> Hello,
>
> today I noticed the following deficiencies in implementation and
> documentation of printf:
>
> (1)
> Built-in help (/usr/bin/printf --help)
>
> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 entirely fails to mention the option --.
> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 This is even more surprising, as an error message explicitly
> points to the built-in help when that option is used without any
> additional parameters:
>
> $/usr/bin/printf --
> printf: missing operand
> Try '/usr/bin/printf --help' for more information.
>
> (2)
> man page=C2=A0 (commonly: /usr/share/man/man1/printf.1.gz)
>
> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 is missing any mention (lest description) of the option --.
>
>
> (3)
> Online-Documentation
> (https://www.gnu.org/software/coreutils/manual/html_node/printf-invocatio=
n.html#printf-invocation)
>
> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 is missing any mention (lest description) of the option --.
>
> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Though at the end of that documentation page, it says:
>
> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 "The only options are a lone --help or --vers=
ion. See Common
> options
> <https://www.gnu.org/software/coreutils/manual/html_node/Common-options.h=
tml>.
> Options must precede operands."
>
> =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Now seeing that only three "Common options" do exist, it do=
es not
> seem to make sense that the printf page explicitly mentions only two
> of them=C2=A0 ( --help=C2=A0, --version=C2=A0=C2=A0) but not the third=C2=
=A0( -- ).
>
>
> Obviously, these deficiencies exist in all languages/translations.

This is a POSIX requirement for programs. Copying their words here [1]:

    Guideline 10:
        The first -- argument that is not an option-argument should be
        accepted as a delimiter indicating the end of options. Any
        following arguments should be treated as operands, even if they
        begin with the '-' character.

A common use of this is to delete file names that start with the "-"
character. We have an example like this in the manual under the 'rm'
command:

    $ ls -- -f
    -f
    $ rm -f
    $ ls -- -f
    -f
    $ rm -- -f
    $ ls -- -f
    ls: cannot access '-f': No such file or directory

Collin

[1] https://pubs.opengroup.org/onlinepubs/9799919799/basedefs/V1_chap12.htm=
l#tag_12_02

Last modified: Tue, 25 Nov 2025 21:00:02 UTC

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